I hope you are never in the jury if I was in the dock. Carrick never coached before and the other has only experience in coaching young players? Again, who are these credible sources? Managers rarely comment on any signings other than when asked in pressers by the very people making up the rumours anyway...
Maguire | NOT McGuire or MacGuire
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I hope you are never in the jury if I was in the dock. Carrick never coached before and the other has only experience in coaching young players? Again, who are these credible sources? Managers rarely comment on any signings other than when asked in pressers by the very people making up the rumours anyway...
Excellent summary. He's the type of player SAF always tried to buy when available.
Annnnddd? He's known as an attacking coach. I suggest you need to do a little research into him if you don't think he had a reputation prior to his appointment.
Erm Simon Stone of the BBC? But yeah, it's all bullshit rumours from rags.
Your stubbornness is astounding on this mate. It's clear to everyone and their dog we were in for those players. I can't believe I'm even having this conversation.
when did he say this?
So he's known as an attacking coach but you have linked this to us signing a ball carrying CB? Also where did I say anything about his reputation? Im not bothered who link us with him, if we were looking for a ball playing CB why did it take after the WC for us to be linked with one? We seem to sort Fred out before he went to WC? Did Simon predict that too? If we were thinking we so needed this type of CB wouldn't you thought the club would have sorted it before pre season. Not saying we didn't try to sign a CB but I'm not convinced it needed to be a ball playing one....
Watching MOTD and even in the highlights you see some of the defensive issues in his game. Poor, twice, on the Bertand goal, slow and leaden footed off the mark. You also see his ability to step forward and confidence on the ball in the goal he scored. Strange player.
So if you weren't commentating on the type of coach he is, what does him being a youth coach have to do with anything we are discussing? What point were you trying to make exactly?
Really? You really can't see the vital role defenders and even goalkeepers now have in how a team attacks, how a team approaches a game? REALLY!?
And now you're mocking the credibility of Simon Stone
No. It's like you've never seen a transfer window before. You can apply that same logic to every single team in every window. How many teams had all their transfer dealings wrapped up before pre season?
It doesn't matter what YOU think. You're trying to tell me there's no credible evidence we were looking for one. That we aren't trying to change our approach, even though there's buckets of evidence to suggest otherwise. But you're happy to ignore all of it as conjecture.
The only example remotely similar is Rio and we believed he was one of the best CBs in the world.
Maguire isnt one of the best CBs in the league let alone world.
He sort of sums up what a lot of posters seem to want from defense
...Attack.
Defense is irrelevant to them.
He sort of reminds me of Vermaelen at Arsenal that season where he would bomb forward from CB and scored some great goals. Going forward he was obviously a useful weapon.
But at the back he always gave away some chances so we were always confident of getting chances against Arsenal.
Shame he's not a bit more mobile or he'd probably make an outstanding DM. Still like him as a centre back though and he'd have been great at United, though I think that ship has sailed
He gives the ball away a huge amount with his passing so I don't think he would at all. More than Nani, slightly more than Martial and comparable to Rashford's passing %.
Sanchez and Lukaku are the only ones who give the ball away more with their passing than Maguire did for Leicester last season.
So if theres an alternative universe version of Maguire playing in a different position but with his same ability he'd be best suited to an attacking position. Maybe another Fellaini as a #10
Yes ball playing defenders do help the building from the back but I don't think Mourinho's has never preached building from the back like LvG did or Guardiola and Klopp do. Even against bang average opposition I saw our central defenders hoofing the ball under zero pressure in Mourinhos tenure so many times, that is definitely not down to our players because under LvG Smalling actually did pretty well.
Baily's feet are worse than Smalling's. They're horrible, but nobody should really care as long as any of them can defend in a pair and stay fit. Weird trying to paint Bailly as positive on the ball at the very least.
Bailly is far better than Smalling with the ball at his feet.
Agree with this, defensively he’s massively overrated following the World Cup. He’d have been found out playing for us as the spotlight would have been on him and these defensive issues would have been highlighted.
He’s no better than what we currently have in my view and Leicester is his level.
So if you weren't commentating on the type of coach he is, what does him being a youth coach have to do with anything we are discussing? What point were you trying to make exactly?
Really? You really can't see the vital role defenders and even goalkeepers now have in how a team attacks, how a team approaches a game? REALLY!?
And now you're mocking the credibility of Simon Stone
No. It's like you've never seen a transfer window before. You can apply that same logic to every single team in every window. How many teams had all their transfer dealings wrapped up before pre season?
It doesn't matter what YOU think. You're trying to tell me there's no credible evidence we were looking for one. That we aren't trying to change our approach, even though there's buckets of evidence to suggest otherwise. But you're happy to ignore all of it as conjecture.
This is what happens on here. Not even gonna bother with the stupid comment previous that the new coaches were brought in some way is related to looking for a so called type of CB for starters.
Again completely taken out of context, if you hold up a reporter that what he's says is correct, what happens when he's not? Is he always right when it suits your argument as without sitting in that board room, we are all guessing, some more informed than others but at times even the manager or the player doesn't know till it happens.
Not quite sure what the point of whether it matters what I think or not given it's a public forum purely based on opinion. None of this is a science and there is absolutely zero evidence other than speculation and opinion. You seem to change your argument to make it fit each time.
Never mentioned anything about that they wasn't trying to change their approach, I just said there was zero evidence that that equated to a ball playing CB. Zero.
I am not having it that if that was the case, and it was that significant to the way we were going to play this season that we would have waited till after the wc to sign someone. I say again, why weren't we linked to Harry before the wc?
The Spurs player I understand cause he's available and potentially could have been done less than the market value because of his contract situation.
I don't ignore anything, I just don't get on the merry go round of the crap the press want us to believe. Jose actually stated it was one player it came down to. My money is the Spurs lad, cause it makes sense. I wouldn't describe him as a ball playing CB either....more comfortable on the ball.
Absolutely agree with this. I think the bigger issue is more dealing with the 'press'. Jose prefers to go long than try to play through it. I think theres a big difference between the long ball and the hoff, and often we hit and hope rather than anything else. I think he wants a CB that can hit the long pass as when it works we've seen in big games players running of Rom to score goals.
How long is his current contract with Leicester ?
Agree, we should be looking at the French VB Maguiré or the Santos prospect Maguirinho.
Ive made this joke around 5 times over the course of the summer, I need to stop
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That was actually a great finish. I thought slabhead the donkey only scored headers ?!.
I love this guy.
Edit : keeper should have done better but was unsighted
Yes, majority of the buzz around him is about his ball playing and ability to attack set pieces aerially. Purely as a defender in other facets he looks vulnerable. City get away with having ball playing defenders first in Stones and Laporte because as a team they look to dominate the ball.
Chicken and Egg, so many are convinced that Utd can not attack freely because of erratic defenders, but trying to attack and dominate games instead of playing reactive football can take pressure off the defenders, allow them to play on the front foot and then they look much better.
Maguire will be in for a much more analysis and scrutiny when he gets a big move, the problems that are ignored right now will be highlighted.
Even more forensically in a Utd shirt. I still think he's better than what's here but not sure how much of that statement is a compliment. Never fails to amaze me how very good players end up looking worst than average with the pressure of the shirt. It's rare like Yorke, they just look from the get go like they've always worn it....
Oh yeah it's completely stupid. You think the signing of coaches is in way related to what specific style or strengths they bring to the coaching staff? If Jose wasn't looking for a change, why didn't he bring in coaches similar to Rui Faria? I suppose thats just coincidence too...
Well done for missing the point entirely. The point I was making was Jose is trying to change his approach from last season. At no point did I say the coaches were the reason why he looked to bring in a ball playing centreback. All the evidence I have so far provided points to it, and despite your vehment denial you've provided the grand sum of sod all to support anything to the contrary.
What a ridiculous argument. You can apply that to anything in life. So I assume we should never believe anything, because there's a chance, one day, it could be proven wrong. I'm happy for you to provide evidence of when Simon Stone has made something up, particularly when what he says is entirely in line with the responses and behaviours we've seen from the players and managers of their respective clubs. At some point, you need to accept that on the balance of probability, the weight of evidence is sound. Again, at this point, you just sound like you're arguing for the hell of it. You've offered up no evidence yourself. You questioned the lack of credidible sources, I've provided you with one of the best, and you are now openly questioning him - based on nothing but cynicism. I am certainly reserved when believing the press, but they aren't all bullshitters. When SS or Di Mazio say something, and it's supported by circumstancial evidence, chances are it's right.
We don't know whether we were looking to sign a defender prior to the WC or not. A lack of information doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Great though, how you fly off the rail for someone making assumptions, when you come out with this.
Alderweireld isn't a ball playing defender?
True, his defending in the Bertrand goal wouldnt have looked out of place from Bailly and Lindelof this season. Poor and half hearted
After reading this I was expecting some awful mistake. He was sold by a terrible pass from his teammate and got dragged out of position trying to stop the Soton player getting it. He got back in and should have cut out the cross, it was weird that he didn’t as he could have but the big mistake was the awful pass from his team mate which caused the situation.
In the highlights we also saw him play a brilliant pass to Chilwell to put him through on the keeper and score the winning goal.
It’s weird because so many on here now cite VVD as the best defender in the league but he makes worse defensive slip up than that on a semi regular basis. That said, the perfect defender doesn’t exist. The unrealistic expectations projected on defenders by fans through access to media and statistics results in bogus narratives such as ‘there are no great centre backs anymore’.
There isn’t a centre back going that doesn’t make errors in every game. Watch Real Madrid and you’ll see Varane and making many yet most on here would be happy to spend £100m on him.
Oh yeah it's completely stupid. You think the signing of coaches is in way related to what specific style or strengths they bring to the coaching staff? If Jose wasn't looking for a change, why didn't he bring in coaches similar to Rui Faria? I suppose thats just coincidence too...
Well done for missing the point entirely. The point I was making was Jose is trying to change his approach from last season. At no point did I say the coaches were the reason why he looked to bring in a ball playing centreback. All the evidence I have so far provided points to it, and despite your vehment denial you've provided the grand sum of sod all to support anything to the contrary.
What a ridiculous argument. You can apply that to anything in life. So I assume we should never believe anything, because there's a chance, one day, it could be proven wrong. I'm happy for you to provide evidence of when Simon Stone has made something up, particularly when what he says is entirely in line with the responses and behaviours we've seen from the players and managers of their respective clubs. At some point, you need to accept that on the balance of probability, the weight of evidence is sound. Again, at this point, you just sound like you're arguing for the hell of it. You've offered up no evidence yourself. You questioned the lack of credidible sources, I've provided you with one of the best, and you are now openly questioning him - based on nothing but cynicism. I am certainly reserved when believing the press, but they aren't all bullshitters. When SS or Di Mazio say something, and it's supported by circumstancial evidence, chances are it's right.
We don't know whether we were looking to sign a defender prior to the WC or not. A lack of information doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Great though, how you fly off the rail for someone making assumptions, when you come out with this.
Alderweireld isn't a ball playing defender?
You make broad brush statements like they are facts. Can you tell me what Faria qualities are to be able to say these coaches appointments to make things different? Please tell me where the feck you have read or even any indication that Jose playing anyway different than last season. Pre-season? The last two games? Pressers? What evidence are you referring to? The evidence you are pointing to are the same that links us to over 100 players each transfer window. I think I got to 50 years, 30 years married with children and a job protecting children to be able to make choices. What you want to believe is subjective, and rather than trying to sell it to me like it's fact, the only fact is no CB was signed. At no point did I say we weren't looking to sign a CB, just not necessarily just a ball playing one. Yes I'd consider Alderwerield comfortable on the ball than ball playing CB as my definition is that would be a player that would be as comfortable playing in midfield as in defence. Don't see him in the Dier or Stone kind of player....
What evidence am I referring to? I've just listed it, several times! It's mind boggling how to continue to ramble through your point, ignoring everything that's laid before you. If you haven't been reading what I wrote, then what on Earth have you been doing? I'm not doing it again.
I see now that I've pointed out that your stance on "they might be wrong in the future" is ridiculous, you've moved on from it. I've provided you with quotes from managers and you've told me that "sometimes managers lie," shown that Jose himself has spoken about needing time to change tactics, I've given you the name of the most credible journalists in the business, and you've strugged them off as "the media." Regardless of whats given to you, you refuse to believe any of it. I think at this point if Jose released his 18 page dossier on the implementation of his new style, you'd pass it off as mind games.
No it isn't the same evidence that's linked us to 100 players every window. While you continue to lump in rags like The Daily Star with credible sources such as Di Marzio and Simon Stone, you're not going to see the wood for the trees.
Smalling doesn't make these mistakes every game. He still gets scalded though
Why the feck is this thread even still open? 
Why the feck is this thread even still open?
Because knobheads keep posting in it. Feck.
Having a real shocker in the first half vs Liverpool. If this was any of our own defenders they would have been slaughtered. 75 million, laughable. I’m with Woodward on this one.
He looked good against us...
How did he have a shocker? He was at fault for the first chance only where he was sleeping. On the goal he cut out the cross and it fortuitously rebounded off Mane into his path. After that he's been decent, got in front of Salah and Firminho a couple of times and out muscled them. He been good on the ball too. His pass was the one that led to the Gray chance.
If you want to post about Maguire, post in the Football Forum, not here. Thread closed.
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