Maguire needs to be replaced

SadlerMUFC said:
I'm going to type a whole bunch of crap because the longer the argument, the better point I'm making. Blah, blah, blah, blah....sigh

Tell me how many times Maguires speed (or lack there of) has cost us. I will save you the trouble. It hasn't. Stop spouting off whatever crap Goldbridge says and think for yourself. Maguire is in bad form right now. No doubt. But the majority of central defender are big and slow. This "he's too slow" is an argument someone who hasn't played makes. At central defence it's more about power and positioning than speed. Speed is for fullbacks. If you ever played you would know this...
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You should go twitter, there is a character limit there. You wont have to read so much if reading is such an issue for you.

You might be the only person in the world, besides Harry himself, who thinks he is one of the best center backs in the world. Hardly anyone will share that opinion with you so you consider yourself an independent thinker? You think for yourself after all... Ever considered that people agreeing with other people is because they did think for themself and came to the conclusion that Maguire is slow by themselfs?

Cental defenders are usually bigger and slower than fullbacks but not many central defenders are as slow as Harry Maguire. They do require some speed. Especially when they play for a team that plays or wants to play with some space behind them. Fooball evolves, the opponent doesnt play with a big targetman forward anymore so the value of a slow but powerful central defender deminished. More is required of a central defender than big and strong these days.

And for not having cost us, it did. Look at some youtube compilations of him. You see some very clear examples. He also has been saved by DDG many times.
 
hurricane thunderclap said:
I would suggest you watch a couple of games harry has played in, any club, any moment of his career. You will see the same mistakes. He thinks he can guide past a striker , he cannot, he thinks he has the vision to build from the back, he cannot , he thinks he can hit thirty yard passes,he cannot, on and on.
Seriously, just watch him.He is a clown.
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Didnt even include that in the slow list. He is slow on the ball too...
 
RepardReece said:
Football through a season has 1-2 games every week. Do you expect every player to do feck all else all season but recover?

Stupid agenda.

Edit: also mentioned how you're not talking directly to Maguire, well sure, but your examples are literally what he's done so pointing that out is really useless
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I'm glad you accept the point you made about Maguires potential opinion on my post was useless. Considering you brought that up.

If you think professional sportsmen can go out on the lash 2 days before a game and have no ill effects on performance, then you either have no knowledge of modern sports science or are stuck in the 1980s.
 
Suedesi said:
Oh, how the standards have fallen.


“Coach Ferguson, he knew when to act, when for example to put pressure on the discipline,” said Robin Van Persie. “In my first season, we were 15 points ahead in the league, and we welcomed Manchester City to win the title [in April 2013]. If we won this match, it was 18 points ahead, but we had lost. This still left us 12 points ahead. “Most managers would not have dramatised the situation. The boss on the other hand, he went up in the towers. It was really ‘hot’.

“Two guys from the team were out after this loss. The day after the match, he had pictures of the two players posted on the dressing room walls from their night out. He said to the whole team: ‘Okay guys, if we don’t win the championship, know that it’s because of those two assholes that chose to go out’. “I have the names,” he smiles, “but I really can’t give them. They got it rotten from the coach, but it stayed in the locker room.

“It was incredible, he had pasted lots of photos, pictures of the two players hour by hour: 2 am, 3 am, 4 am, as if to emphasise the extent of their bullshit. He didn’t stop there, he warned us all: ‘Guys, listen well, if we don’t win the championship, it’s because these two decided to go out and have fun. From now on, if I see a player come out before the trophy is lifted, that player is out’.

He was ruthless: ‘I don’t care about who you are, how many trophies you’ve won so far – if you go out before the end of the season, you leave the team and I will have you transferred’. After that speech, we went to train, and it was the two hardest workouts of my life.”


https://thefootballfaithful.com/van-persie-sir-alex-ferguson-rant-2013-manchester-derby/

Fück Harry Maguire, the mediocre meathead and blame needs to go Ole for instilling some discipline into the squad
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Winners stay focused. Maguire is a prime example, unfortunately of the opposite.
 
He’s been awful this season although he‘s typically started slow in the past 2 seasons before turning into a very good calming figure in defence.

If the new manager(s) wants to play a very high defensive line then Maguire needs to be replaced. Even at his best, he’s too slow for that kind of football. Otherwise, he has all the other technical attributes required for a modern centre-back and the new manager can decide who his captain should be.

For now, it’s obvious to most fans that Maguire needs to be dropped and made to win back his place. The problem is that our alternative (Bailly) is another calamitous defender and should have been replaced this season. Yet again, we are being Charity FC by extending players contracts when even the backroom staff clearly do not have faith in the player being United quality.
 
Maguire is one of the slowest defenders in the league. It's not his fault. He was born with what he has. When facing opposition that can run the 100m at 10+ seconds, it becomes a game of men and boys. As we saw once more during the Watford game, Harry chose not to close the gap when the 2rd goal was scored. He doubts himself and then leaves the opposition open. Maguire's speed is not going to improve and as long as he is first choice, United will not be competing with the best. Same goes for England as inevitably slow defenders get caught out in those crucial, knock-out games. No club is going to pay anything near the 80 M. Cut the loses and sell him for 40. He will not agree to sit on the bench and play second fiddle. He should, but he wont. Don't take this personally Harry but the club must come first. He is a decent distributor of the ball and we know he is not influential on the pitch as captain. His body language is and it instills a feeling of vulnerability with the rest of the players, even if they will not admit this whilst he remains a United player.
 
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Fluctuation0161 said:
I'm glad you accept the point you made about Maguires potential opinion on my post was useless. Considering you brought that up.

If you think professional sportsmen can go out on the lash 2 days before a game and have no ill effects on performance, then you either have no knowledge of modern sports science or are stuck in the 1980s.
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Don't know about you, but I've never had an issue over 2 days after going out. He's had both Sunday, Monday and all of Tuesday to recover and get back into the groove. On top of this, how do you know if he's been drinking, how much, and how long he's been out?

2/3 years back I played for 2 teams, one on a Saturday and one on a Sunday, and at the age of 18 in my partying phase, I was out pretty much every week, which didn't impact me whatsoever. That includes training twice a week too. Now, I'm no professional, but fairly sure it wouldn't render me exempt from any effects.

I'm not defending Maguire in any way, he's been awful recently, but this is just silly.
 
SadlerMUFC said:
Again...not the point of the post. But if you want get hung up on that then by all means go ahead
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I know it wasn’t the point of your post. I was just making a comment, not ‘getting hung up’. You’re a little prickly, eh?
 
A real captain puts the team first, not the rush back from injury when not 100%, when others wait. Hold yourself accountable to your weaknesses and know you can do more but doing less and letting others take your charge at times.
Harry has simply been riding the I cost £80M waves. We need someone who will pull him tell him his mistakes, where he is lacking
 
GifLord said:
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I can't remember the last time we had a captain this awful. The way he got himself sent off was mind blowing. Those exact types of errors is what a captain should be scolding players for yet he's out there doing it consistently wearing the armband himself.

Varane + Lindelof for me. Harry has been a disgrace this season.
 
Utd Clem said:
A real captain puts the team first, not the rush back from injury when not 100%, when others wait. Hold yourself accountable to your weaknesses and know you can do more but doing less and letting others take your charge at times.
Harry has simply been riding the I cost £80M waves. We need someone who will pull him tell him his mistakes, where he is lacking
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This is a ridiculous post. Allowing himself to be played while clearly not fit is putting the team above himself.

To be honest this entire thread is ridiculous. He has been terrible this season but he doesn't need replacing, he probably needs some time off frankly but him & Varane will be an excellent pairing if Varane can stay fit and we finally starting playing the correct goalkeeper.
 
JB7 said:
This is a ridiculous post. Allowing himself to be played while clearly not fit is putting the team above himself.

To be honest this entire thread is ridiculous. He has been terrible this season but he doesn't need replacing, he probably needs some time off frankly but him & Varane will be an excellent pairing if Varane can stay fit and we finally starting playing the correct goalkeeper.
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Really? I truly saw that during the Leicester game with his shambolic errors.
 
He has been going through a terrible stretch recently. However, name one player in this squad who hasn't under in our system over the past couple of years? Pogba? McFred? Shaw? AWB? Bruno even. Sancho hasn't looked nearly the player we know he can be. Donny - who everyone has been clamoring for - was awful in limited opportunities last year. Greenwood and Rashford have been up and down.

I'm not the biggest Maguire fan but I think just about all of our players deserve a fresh look under a new couching staff/system.
 
BlueHaze said:
Really? I truly saw that during the Leicester game with his shambolic errors.
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Yes. It is being used as a stick to bash Maguire with because people dislike him. Most players get praised for making themselves available to play or for "playing through the pain".

At Leicester it was clear from the first minute that he shouldn't have been on the pitch but that was on the coaching staff, they should never have started him and certainly should have taken him off. But there were a number of other players in that defence (and in goal) that were no doubt delighted Maguire played as they escaped the criticism for their own performances.
 
Weird how Smalling never got any credit for playing through injuries. Instead he usually got lambasted for his errors and nothing else.

Seems like there are a few England fans here
 
mu4c_20le said:
Weird how Smalling never got any credit for playing through injuries. Instead he usually got lambasted for his errors and nothing else.

Seems like there are a few England fans here
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Yup, he never got half the leesh that Maguire gets with fans despite being twice the player for United and the latter supposedly being 'captain' standard :wenger:

Odd that.

He hasn't proven to be better than a prime Phil Jones or Smalling at any point yet gets afforded tremendous slack that they never were despite being the most expensive defender of all time
 
RepardReece said:
Don't know about you, but I've never had an issue over 2 days after going out. He's had both Sunday, Monday and all of Tuesday to recover and get back into the groove. On top of this, how do you know if he's been drinking, how much, and how long he's been out?

2/3 years back I played for 2 teams, one on a Saturday and one on a Sunday, and at the age of 18 in my partying phase, I was out pretty much every week, which didn't impact me whatsoever. That includes training twice a week too. Now, I'm no professional, but fairly sure it wouldn't render me exempt from any effects.

I'm not defending Maguire in any way, he's been awful recently, but this is just silly.
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Considering his terrible performances and disgraceful behaviour as United captain. Both on pitch and off it. He should be focused on improving his game. Being the ultimate professional like Ronaldo for example.

Maybe it was ok for you as a non professional. That is very different for a supposed professional where a small percentage dip in performance/fitness can make a big difference at the top level.

Maguire has managed to get himself arrested on previous nights out, bringing the club into disrepute. I do take your point on some level, which is, it's not his fault he does not have the right mentality to be a top level professional.
 
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mu4c_20le said:
Weird how Smalling never got any credit for playing through injuries. Instead he usually got lambasted for his errors and nothing else.

Seems like there are a few England fans here
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I never saw Smalling being hammered for being picked to play while injured, to be honest he got just a rough treatment as Maguire gets. Smalling was basically hammered because he looked a bit awkward whereas the default to slate Maguire is because he's slow, as if either of those affect their abilities.

As for the England fans comment, both players are English so quite what difference that would make I do not know.
 
Stadjer said:
You should go twitter, there is a character limit there. You wont have to read so much if reading is such an issue for you.

You might be the only person in the world, besides Harry himself, who thinks he is one of the best center backs in the world. Hardly anyone will share that opinion with you so you consider yourself an independent thinker? You think for yourself after all... Ever considered that people agreeing with other people is because they did think for themself and came to the conclusion that Maguire is slow by themselfs?

Cental defenders are usually bigger and slower than fullbacks but not many central defenders are as slow as Harry Maguire. They do require some speed. Especially when they play for a team that plays or wants to play with some space behind them. Fooball evolves, the opponent doesnt play with a big targetman forward anymore so the value of a slow but powerful central defender deminished. More is required of a central defender than big and strong these days.

And for not having cost us, it did. Look at some youtube compilations of him. You see some very clear examples. He also has been saved by DDG many times.
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Again...tell me how many times Maguires lack of speed has cost us a goal...
 
hurricane thunderclap said:
I would suggest you watch a couple of games harry has played in, any club, any moment of his career. You will see the same mistakes. He thinks he can guide past a striker , he cannot, he thinks he has the vision to build from the back, he cannot , he thinks he can hit thirty yard passes,he cannot, on and on.
Seriously, just watch him.He is a clown.
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Are you f*cking kidding me? he carries past players multiple times a game. I can count on one hand how many times he's been caught. But you with your agenda like to make sh*t up. Go on, tell me you don't have an agenda
 
hurricane thunderclap said:
I would suggest you watch a couple of games harry has played in, any club, any moment of his career. You will see the same mistakes. He thinks he can guide past a striker , he cannot, he thinks he has the vision to build from the back, he cannot , he thinks he can hit thirty yard passes,he cannot, on and on.
Seriously, just watch him.He is a clown.
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He literally did every one of those things tonight.
 
diarm said:
Chill out Rafa
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These were from 2 years ago when everyone was saying the same things as they are now. Maguire was brilliant after a shaky start last season and will be brilliant again this year after a shaky start. We just need to stand behind him, not have agendas against him. These stats are from when everyone was saying VVD was the best defender in the world. Many were even claiming Lindelof was better than Maguire. The stats don't lie, only people with agendas do

------------------Tckl----Blk---Int--Clr---HdClr----Rec---DW---DL---50/50---ABW---ABL
Maguire-------37------6-----72---157---94-------237--240--128---8---------176-----71
Virgil VD-----23------5------40--162----83------220----239--81----3---------191------60
Lindeloff----29------1------26---122---58------215----135--78----4----------96-------50

Legend: Tckl=Tackles, Blk=Blocks, Int=Interceptions, Clr=Clearances, HdClr=Headed Clearances, Rec=Recoveries, DW=Duals Won, DL=Duals Lost, ABW=Arial Battles Won, ABL=Arial Battles Lost

https://www.premierleague.com/players/9566/Harry-Maguire/stats?co=1&se=274
https://www.premierleague.com/players/5140/Virgil-van-Dijk/stats?co=1&se=274
https://www.premierleague.com/players/5066/Victor-Lindelöf/stats?co=1&se=274
 
Used to think he was alright and deserved a place in the squad.
Now. Can't stand him.
Need to get rid!
 
hurricane thunderclap said:
I would suggest you watch a couple of games harry has played in, any club, any moment of his career. You will see the same mistakes. He thinks he can guide past a striker , he cannot, he thinks he has the vision to build from the back, he cannot , he thinks he can hit thirty yard passes,he cannot, on and on.
Seriously, just watch him.He is a clown.
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jeezus wept, you clearly don't watch football. Maguire is superb taking the ball out of defense even in the very "risky situations" he's able to play out of the back in a very calm manner. Being caught once or twice in a season can happen but surely you will make it sound like it's every game, whereas it's the opposite, because of your agenda against him. Clueless couch potato who never kicked the ball I'd bet..
 
SadlerMUFC said:
So the guy standing up for our player is wumming? You new generation have sunk to a new low. But go on, keep booing our own and call me a wum.
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I’m nearly 50 and have been a Caf member for 15 years but, yeah, I’m part of a new generation.

I consider Maguire in the same category as Bebe. A complete imposter, as he likes to say himself: “Nowhere near good enough”
 
SadlerMUFC said:
I'm going to type a whole bunch of crap because the longer the argument, the better point I'm making. Blah, blah, blah, blah....sigh

Tell me how many times Maguires speed (or lack there of) has cost us. I will save you the trouble. It hasn't. Stop spouting off whatever crap Goldbridge says and think for yourself. Maguire is in bad form right now. No doubt. But the majority of central defender are big and slow. This "he's too slow" is an argument someone who hasn't played makes. At central defence it's more about power and positioning than speed. Speed is for fullbacks. If you ever played you would know this...
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I for one watched my first ever Goldbridhe stream last week, was meh - with that said I think & have always thought Harry is an overpriced oaf.
SadlerMUFC said:
These were from 2 years ago when everyone was saying the same things as they are now. Maguire was brilliant after a shaky start last season and will be brilliant again this year after a shaky start. We just need to stand behind him, not have agendas against him. These stats are from when everyone was saying VVD was the best defender in the world. Many were even claiming Lindelof was better than Maguire. The stats don't lie, only people with agendas do

------------------Tckl----Blk---Int--Clr---HdClr----Rec---DW---DL---50/50---ABW---ABL
Maguire-------37------6-----72---157---94-------237--240--128---8---------176-----71
Virgil VD-----23------5------40--162----83------220----239--81----3---------191------60
Lindeloff----29------1------26---122---58------215----135--78----4----------96-------50

Legend: Tckl=Tackles, Blk=Blocks, Int=Interceptions, Clr=Clearances, HdClr=Headed Clearances, Rec=Recoveries, DW=Duals Won, DL=Duals Lost, ABW=Arial Battles Won, ABL=Arial Battles Lost

https://www.premierleague.com/players/9566/Harry-Maguire/stats?co=1&se=274
https://www.premierleague.com/players/5140/Virgil-van-Dijk/stats?co=1&se=274
https://www.premierleague.com/players/5066/Victor-Lindelöf/stats?co=1&se=274
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As the stats don’t lie, how has our defence done statistically since he joined?

The format on these stats is horrendous, what story are you trying to tell? He has more tackles? In a defensive set up you likely would do.

Is Maguire the worst defender in the world, of course not but when you’re cherry picking stats that favour him in comparison to VvD you really are reaching. They don’t take into account the set ups & the bloody ‘eye test’, he’s done nothing tangible.

SadlerMUFC said:
So the guy standing up for our player is wumming? You new generation have sunk to a new low. But go on, keep booing our own and call me a wum.
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You’re like a Top Red Bingos greatest hits tonight.
 
SadlerMUFC said:
The stats don't lie, only people with agendas do
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Stats for defenders are almost irrelevant. You basically proved that by showing Harry fecking Maguire being in the same stratosphere as Van Dijk.

Look at Varane, Chiellini, Marquinhos and similar. None of them perform brilliantly statistically - none of them have ever been anywhere near the leaders in terms of raw numbers of tackles won, aerials won, clearances, recoveries etc....yet they're certainly among the best centre-backs in the world.

Defending is all about positioning, sensing danger, forcing attackers into bad positions, keeping a solid line. Lots more things too, none of which show up on any statsheet.
 
Man's in bad form since Euros, after he got that injury before Europa final.

Yeah he's been shite this season.

But come on now, it's obvious he lacks the confidence and form at the moment.

He is England's best CB.
 
During the Euros I learnt that a large proportion of this forum is anti english and my theory is that Maguire will never be popular amongst the Irish reds because he has been portrayed by the media as this typical English lad who causes trouble and sings god save the queen when really he is another player of Irish descent that, for all we know, has climbed Croagh Patrick barefooted.

I find this fascinating because I was born in England, yet have an Irish surname with family from Galway, Donegal etc yet I support the English football team but have views about the emerald isle that would land me into trouble in a protestant bar. Say no more.

Funnily enough he is from Sheffield which is on par as being a scouser for some people I know. Yorkshire and Lancashire have had a rivalry.
 
His confidence is shot so much that he didn't want the ball in the first half. You could see his nervousness and indecisiveness when he had the ball. He froze a couple of times when he wanted to pass it back to ddg but didn't.
 
predator said:
During the Euros I learnt that a large proportion of this forum is anti english and my theory is that Maguire will never be popular amongst the Irish reds because he has been portrayed by the media as this typical English lad who causes trouble and sings god save the queen when really he is another player of Irish descent that, for all we know, has climbed Croagh Patrick barefooted.

I find this fascinating because I was born in England, yet have an Irish surname with family from Galway, Donegal etc yet I support the English football team but have views about the emerald isle that would land me into trouble in a protestant bar. Say no more.

Funnily enough he is from Sheffield which is on par as being a scouser for some people I know. Yorkshire and Lancashire have had a rivalry.
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Nah man, people dislike Maguire cause he has been total disaster of a player. Did Irish red hate Scholes and Rio? Rooney? You have made some hilarious scenario in your head. Maguire is one of the worst United captains ever.

I hope he becomes better as we need him and we paid a lot for him.
 
VidaRed said:
His confidence is shot so much that he didn't want the ball in the first half. You could see his nervousness and indecisiveness when he had the ball. He froze a couple of times when he wanted to pass it back to ddg but didn't.
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Yes I noticed that too. I was yelling to just pass it. Second guessing himself and then getting cornered.
 
Maguire has been woeful. I'm still trying to understand what was so attractive about his play at Leicester that warranted us breaking the bank for him?
 
I'm taking a back seat with Maguire.

I'm hoping Carrick has told him to stay in his zone

And I'm hoping the next coach can get him performing
 
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