LVG Out Thread | BBC: Sacked!

Do you want LVG sacked?

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sammsky1 said:
Some of the finest companies in the world always recruit from within and most often based only on potential and not prior experience for the role.

I worked for Unilever PLC for 11 years in the marketing department, regarded as one of the top 3 marketing departments in the world. I was promoted 5 times and on each occasion did not possess practical experience for the role I was promoted into, yet performed with distinction every time .... Because like you say I was always being groomed for additional responsibilities. There were/ are countless more examples like me in many other organisations.

The anti Giggs stance that he will not succeed as Manchester United manager right now is flawed. He has every chance of succeeding as as much chance as appointing an experienced pro like Moyes or LVG.

Given Mourinho's availability, I'd want the club to go for him, I'm a fan and I like him. But i'd be equally delighted if Giggs was appointed and think he has as much chance of succeeding as any of the other names being mentioned because of all the 'grooming' reasons already mentioned many times before.
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You are right but you do what people often do, you ignore the context around you. Unilever is extremely well structured while United isn't, at United the manager is the structure. Also you have been promoted 5 times, your superiors didn't had the crazy idea of promoting you from your 1st position to your 5th without making a stop to the 2nd, 3rd and 4th positions.

It's possible that Giggs is ready, it's possible that Giggs is already brilliant but for everyone even the people around him his appointment will be like flipping a coin.
 
Fully Fledged said:
They are all special and unique. All the A list teams are. The thing is that what makes them special changes from club to club.
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All teams are. Not just the A list ones.

Thats what I find most cringetworthy about this 'United way' stuff. Its said with such arrogance, like we're above every other club.

We're not. We're special to us, United fans. Just like every other club is special to their fans.
 
Sam said:
All teams are. Not just the A list ones.

Thats what I find most cringetworthy about this 'United way' stuff. Its said with such arrogance, like we're above every other club.

We're not. We're special to us, United fans. Just like every other club is special to their fans.
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True.
 
According to Manchester Evening News Woodward did not discuss Van Gaal at today's meeting.

Instead, the Mayfair rendezvous was arranged purely to discuss commercial matters and possibly congratulate each other on sealing an official supplier for branded toothpicks.

:wenger:
 
Welsh Wonder said:
United fans are getting progressively more mental with each passing week.
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Sultan said:
According to Manchester Evening News Woodward did not discuss Van Gaal at today's meeting.

Instead, the Mayfair rendezvous was arranged purely to discuss commercial matters and possibly congratulate each other on sealing an official supplier for branded toothpicks.

:wenger:
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:lol::lol:
 
Sarni said:
Why Giggs though? Why not Gary, Scholes, Beckham or Quinton Fortune? All of them have the same amount of managerial experience.
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Or as I asked in the Giggs thread jt or stevieme as they are both legends at their respective clubs and have the same amount of experience, do the pro Giggs guys think they would do a worse job just because they never played for us?
 
Offside said:
You want the same success as Arsenal have had in the last 10 years?

As for Barca, their success is the Messi era.
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Of course I want to be better than Arsenal, but now that we don't have Fergie we see that we're not exactly greater than them. The idea is that they have something than identifies them. We need to find a new 'something' and enhance it as much as possible. Just like we had an enhanced Wenger (or, to be precise, they had a lesser Fergie).

As for Barca, their cycle of success started with Ronaldinho and rolled on from there.
 
Sultan said:
Does Woody need to go with LvG?
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Nah. I think he has done a great job so far. But he does need to make this next decision perfect. None of us know what that should be and only time will tell.

Reminds me of SAF vs Forest in the FA cup with Mark Robbins.... You never know, maybe the right decision is to keep faith with LVG and convince him to stay after his contract is over.

Personally that's what I would prefer we do. LVG got his calculations right, but the world class winger and striker we desperately need right right now did not work out (Di Maria & Falcao).

We have had horrendous injuries and pathetic finishing ability in the last 5 games, else things were going ok (aside from dull football). I remain convinced that with better luck with injuries and an excellent January transfer window (Vardy , mane and recall Januzaj), we would click through the gears post January.

But it looks like the media frenzy has made Woodward lose his nerve and so we will soon become a sacking short term club just like the rest. We hire Mourinho and fail to get top 4, do we then sack him too?

I'm losing all association with the club I grew up with, barely recognise the behaviours of my club right now. If we do end up going the Madrid/Chelsea route, I doubt I'll be able to retain much intesest. I'm sure their are many like me out there too.
 
spwd said:
Or as I asked in the Giggs thread jt or stevieme as they are both legends at their respective clubs and have the same amount of experience, do the pro Giggs guys think they would do a worse job just because they never played for us?
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Can you imagine the hilarity that would ensue on here if Chelsea appointed Terry, or Liverpool Gerrard?

Heck, its been a running joke on here for years how Chelsea should just make Terry manager as he runs the team anyway.
 
I'm all for sacking Van Gaal asap and would replace him with Mourinho in a heartbeat but I've suddenly just realised how harsh I am being. It's December 22nd ffs. At least give the man until new year to end it. It would be quite heartless if he was dismissed right before Christmas and the new year. The next two games are crucial anyway. If he manages to persuade two solid winning peformances against Stoke and Chelsea then who knows how the board will react.
 
Sam said:
Going by your logic we could have replaced Fergie with any of Archie Knox, Brian Kidd, Steve Mclaren, Jimmy Ryan, Walter Smith, Carlos Quiroz or Mike Phelan, right?

If anything, a fair few of those are far more qualified to succeed as a manager then Giggs is at this stage.
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SAF has often CQ was perfect but messed it up because of his lack of loyalty buggering off to Madrid and Portugal. Some of the other possess the technical skills but lack the personality, charisma and leadership skills. I actually think Phelen contributed massively, far more than he is ever credited for and he had much longer and closer access to SAFs genius that Giggs has had. I daresay he would have performed better than Moyes!
 
Sam said:
Can you imagine the hilarity that would ensue on here if Chelsea appointed Terry, or Liverpool Gerrard?

Heck, its been a running joke on here for years how Chelsea should just make Terry manager as he runs the team anyway.
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I meant managing us Sam as they have just about as much experience as Giggs but would they do a worse job for us just because they have never played for us?
 
predator said:
I'm all for sacking Van Gaal asap and would replace him with Mourinho in a heartbeat but I've suddenly just realised how harsh I am being. It's December 22nd ffs. At least give the man until new year. It would be quite heartless if he was dismissed right before Christmas and the new year. The next two games are crucial anyway. If he manages to provide persuade two solid winning peformances against Stoke and Chelsea then who knows how the board will react.
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I'm trying not to be knee jerk too but aside from results, the football is absolutely dire whether winning or losing. I can't remember a season whether we won or lost that I just can't watch them. There is something very wrong at the club and when even Paddy C on MUTV can't find anything positive to say, that's an indication of how bad it is.....
 
sammsky1 said:
Nah. I think he has done a great job so far. But he does need to make this next decision perfect. None of us know what that should be and only time will tell.

Reminds me of SAF vs Forest in the FA cup with Mark Robbins.... You never know, maybe the right decision is to keep faith with LVG and convince him to stay after his contract is over.

Personally that's what I would prefer we do. LVG got his calculations right, but the world class winger and striker we desperately need right right now did not work out (Di Maria & Falcao).

We have had horrendous injuries and pathetic finishing ability in the last 5 games, else things were going ok (aside from dull football). I remain convinced that with better luck with injuries and an excellent January transfer window (Vardy , mane and recall Januzaj), we would click through the gears post January.

But it looks like the media frenzy has made Woodward lose his nerve and so we will soon become a sacking short term club just like the rest. We hire Mourinho and fail to get top 4, do we then sack him too?

I'm losing all association with the club I grew up with, barely recognise the behaviours of my club right now. If we do end up going the Madrid/Chelsea route, I doubt I'll be able to retain much intesest. I'm sure their are many like me out there too.
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I've been wanting LvG out a month into his appointment. He's sucked the fun out of watching United. He's had long enough to prove his credentials.
 
JPRouve said:
You are right but you do what people often do, you ignore the context around you. Unilever is extremely well structured while United isn't, at United the manager is the structure. Also you have been promoted 5 times, your superiors didn't had the crazy idea of promoting you from your 1st position to your 5th without making a stop to the 2nd, 3rd and 4th positions.

It's possible that Giggs is ready, it's possible that Giggs is already brilliant but for everyone even the people around him his appointment will be like flipping a coin.
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You make very well reasoned and accurate statements, esp about being promoted too quickly. And I agree Giggs is a risk.

But we have now also seen that experienced pro's like Moyes and LVG have not been able to deliver to expectations, perhaps because neither can grasp the DNA of what makes Manchsster United click. I believe of all the candidates out there, Giggs gets that more than most.

So do we go with another experienced pro who also does not yet get the club (and with Mourinho, also has a personality culture clash with some of our club values) or take the ultimate club hero and take a punt that he will learn as he goes along. Or stick with LVG hoping the strategy will bear fruit in year 3.

Neither decision is without huge risk and so in my opinion all involve similar level of 'flipping a coin'.
 
sammsky1 said:
SAF has often CQ was perfect but messed it up because of his lack of loyalty buggering off to Madrid and Portugal. Some of the other possess the technical skills but lack the personality, charisma and leadership skills. I actually think Phelen contributed massively, far more than he is ever credited for and he had much longer and closer access to SAFs genius that Giggs has had. I daresay he would have performed better than Moyes!
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CQ proved he was a terrible manager though, both with Madrid and Portugal.

Which kind of proves my whole point. Even someone who was considered a fantastic assistant manager, integral to our most successful period ever, went on to fail as a manager. Yet some people think giving the job to Giggs, who's now coached under two unsuccessful regimes, and only been an assistant for a year, should get the job?

Can you really not see how mental that would be?
 
Didn't I see something earlier in the thread that LVG has offered to resign? If so, the club should accept it. I don't want him humiliated any further. Lose or draw at Stoke and the fans will probably kill the old guy - that's how fecking crazy some fans have become after being wound up by the scum media.
Wish the club would let him go so he can have a peaceful Christmas with his family away from all this.
 
Sultan said:
I've been wanting LvG out a month into his appointment. He's sucked the fun out of watching United. He's had long enough to prove his credentials.
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By implication, are you admitting we are now officially a manager's merry go round club?
 
United have not approached Mourinho.

Sky Sports News

Mendes (Mourinho's agent)
 
Offside said:
You want the same success as Arsenal have had in the last 10 years?

As for Barca, their success is the Messi era.
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Lol. Wenger's first ten years yield 3 league titles and 4 FA cups. A decent haul in an era where dominance was concentrated among 2-3 clubs. His second ten years? 0 league titles and 2 FA Cups. fecking shocking to be honest.
 
sammsky1 said:
So we are now a sacking manager
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If employees are not performing they should go. Players are sold or not played. I don't why it would be any different for a coach. Just because we've had 2 great managers in the past doesn't mean we're not a sacking club.
 
Sultan said:
If employees are not performing they should go. Players are sold or not played. I don't why it would be any different for a coach. Just because we've had 2 great managers in the past doesn't mean we're not a sacking club.
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Why not sack SAF during the 3 barren Djembax2 Gibralter years ? He took his eye off the ball big time and totally underperformed.

Do you totally absolve our players this's year? Mata, BFS, Rooney, Fellaini, Depay have all had rubbish seasons so far.
 
Mourinho is not speaking to the club until LVG is gone. He wouldn't do that to a friend.
 
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