Luke Shaw responds to Jose Mourinho

Tom Van Persie said:
van Gaal wasn't being malicious but I think he could've handled it better. There was no need to tell the press that Shaw was overweight. He was an 18 year old that was just bought for £30M and clearly he wasn't the most confident lad. He struggled in his first season due to a lack of confidence but he looked amazing at the start of van Gaal's second season before the horrific leg break. I can't even imagine what was going through Shaw's mind when he broke his leg. He probably thought there was a good chance his career was over. He finally recovers and returns to a manager that can't stand him and treats him like shit for no reason and people wonder why he's responding to Mourinho who is still taking digs.
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LVG was just honest - I think players respected him because he didn't use press conferences like Mou did (to basically deflect from his own failings and put pressure on individual players) and nothing he said was really that crazy. Ask LVG any question and you'll get an unfiltered reply. Mou is the opposite, he's very calculated and agenda driven which you can get away with when you're winning things but now just makes him look bitter.

Shaw was overweight and his fitness levels weren't were they needed to be when he arrived - the player acknowledged this - and LVG really rated Shaw once he got fit (he and Januzaj did a full pre season of fitness together in Dubai) and LVG said 'this would be the season of Luke Shaw'. Then the injury and, as you say, coming back under a manager that seems to hate him for no reason.
 
RUCK4444 said:
Absolutely. Shaw has kept his mouth shut throughout.

He’s a bully and one thing a bully needs is calling out. His job was to manage players not push them about, publicly embarrass them whilst trying to ruin their career.

You can just tell he’s thought to himself ‘Shaw seems a quiet lad, coming off the back of a real bad injury, I’ll pick on him.’

I hate people like that. It goes hand in hand with somebody who has an ego the size of his that needs constant massaging.
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100%. Guys like Mourinho get away with it as "character and mentality building" when all he does is gas 2/3 players up and destroy the rest. No wonder he can't last more than 2 seasons anywhere he goes.

I think the picture has become pretty clear now just how toxic the dressing room must have felt.
 
roonster09 said:
No, Jose always doesn't win. Luckily most of the journalists sees what a bitter man he is.
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See I wasted three posts to talk about Jose who talked shit on talksports. I won't get those posts again for today. :lol:

He was/is and always wins in media thankfully not on the football pitch anymore. Hope he find peace in his native and won't come back again. But you know he is gold for media and they won't let him leave from spotlight.

Now Shaw have to play under pressure if he plays well he simply say he is not like this when played for him but if he not play well everybody will say Jose is correct and all.
 
The people who were crying for Mourinho to be our manager just screams a different type of fan to me.

Just pure toxicity for a bit of success.
 
Bebestation said:
The people who were crying for Mourinho to be our manager just screams a different type of fan to me.

Just pure toxicity for a bit of success.
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It's one thing to be crying for him to be our manager before it happened, but to still be somewhat worshipping and defending him after the mess he left us in? Bizarre folk.
 
Abraxas said:
Seems a bit of a mountain made out of a molehill to me. He said his corners were bad, which England's set pieces have been as a whole. Didn't he also say he played well?

He picked Chilwell before the tournament but to be fair if you asked 50 people their pre tournament lineup you'd have pretty split opinions on that left back role.

No problem with Shaw biting back at all, just don't think what Jose came out with was particularly noteworthy on this occasion.
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Na, nobody had Chillwell starting while every football fan was calling Shaw the best FB in the country.
 
Adam-Utd said:
100%. Guys like Mourinho get away with it as "character and mentality building" when all he does is gas 2/3 players up and destroy the rest. No wonder he can't last more than 2 seasons anywhere he goes.

I think the picture has become pretty clear now just how toxic the dressing room must have felt.
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Yeah in my opinion because his rep is tarnished, he feels even more inclined to go into the dressing room and pick the ones he needs to keep happy and destroy the rest like you say. To make an impression and command some respect that his super-size ego knows has taken a bashing.

I also think he chooses a few to pick on, to make an example of. He's a complete liability for clubs now imo, the amount of upset he causes before invariably leaving is really damaging for clubs who don't have the cash to dust themselves down and go again (so to speak) relatively quickly after he leaves.
 
RUCK4444 said:
Yeah in my opinion because his rep is tarnished, he feels even more inclined to go into the dressing room and pick the ones he needs to keep happy and destroy the rest like you say. To make an impression and command some respect that his super-size ego knows has taken a bashing.

I also think he chooses a few to pick on, to make an example of. He's a complete liability for clubs now imo, the amount of upset he causes before invariably leaving is really damaging for clubs who don't have the cash to dust themselves down and go again (so to speak) relatively quickly after he leaves.
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Ndombele and Alli were the ones at Tottenham, Son and Kane the untouchables. It might work in the short term but the moment he loses momentum he's a dead man walking.

For Levy to bin Mourinho so early shows how bad it must have been.
 
He was obviously asked the question after Mourinho said 'his set pieces was drastically bad' lots of other words he could of used but does seem over the top.
Shaws response was spot on, he could of said alot more but I also think he's left himself open when England play next for Mourinho to pick on every aspect of his game.
Yet again the Journalists have started a distraction before one of our most important games in years,
 
Abraxas said:
Seems a bit of a mountain made out of a molehill to me. He said his corners were bad, which England's set pieces have been as a whole. Didn't he also say he played well?

He picked Chilwell before the tournament but to be fair if you asked 50 people their pre tournament lineup you'd have pretty split opinions on that left back role.

No problem with Shaw biting back at all, just don't think what Jose came out with was particularly noteworthy on this occasion.
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I get that what Jose said this time, in isolation, doesn't necessarily warrant the response but if you keep poking then you will get a bite back eventually.

This will have been built up over time, just look at what was said and done at the time this was going on between him and Jose, Luke has said nothing since and it's human nature to want to respond after being humiliated, never mind the mental bullying.
 
Abraxas said:
Seems a bit of a mountain made out of a molehill to me. He said his corners were bad, which England's set pieces have been as a whole. Didn't he also say he played well?

He picked Chilwell before the tournament but to be fair if you asked 50 people their pre tournament lineup you'd have pretty split opinions on that left back role.

No problem with Shaw biting back at all, just don't think what Jose came out with was particularly noteworthy on this occasion.
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The words Mou used for his corners was "dramatically bad". And that's what is the issue. I think Agbonlahor said it on Talksport today and I agree with him here - if you want to criticize the corners, you can simply say "corners weren't that good" or "Corners should have been better". Adding that adverb just shows that you have some sort of an agenda there.

Pre-tournament as well - saying Chillwell is your preferred starter is one thing, but its completely different from "Chillwell starts, and I dont want to think twice here" or something. He can simply say "Chilwell would be the better pick" or "I rate Chillwell higher" or whatever. You don't need to shit on a player to make your point
 
Luke is entitled to feel the way he does, he was treated like shit and Mourinho deserves criticism for how he behaved.

However there’s a reason players don’t go public with these sort of comments, for one it invites pressure and creates an unnecessary negative buzz around a player. It also means he’s lost the moral high ground which he certainly had until now.

I can’t imagine Ole will be thrilled about it, but it’s done now.
 
FrankDrebin said:
Jose's rubbing his hands over this.
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A chance to remain relevant.

I'm really not into Shaw responding. I know Shaw didn't exactly criticise Mourinho in the way Mourinho criticises him regularly, but I still think it would have been a bigger statement and more of a slap in the face to Jose if Shaw didn't even bother with a proper response. It's giving Mourinho's words more spotlight than they deserve.

A simple "don't care" would have been much more effective when he was asked about Mourinho's comments.

Side note, this being the big story of the day shows how quiet things are.
 
The media have probably made this a bigger deal then it actually is.
 
anant said:
The words Mou used for his corners was "dramatically bad". And that's what is the issue. I think Agbonlahor said it on Talksport today and I agree with him here - if you want to criticize the corners, you can simply say "corners weren't that good" or "Corners should have been better". Adding that adverb just shows that you have some sort of an agenda there.

Pre-tournament as well - saying Chillwell is your preferred starter is one thing, but its completely different from "Chillwell starts, and I dont want to think twice here" or something. He can simply say "Chilwell would be the better pick" or "I rate Chillwell higher" or whatever. You don't need to shit on a player to make your point
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I just don't think the terminology is all that different to what many pundits or fans would use in degree, except for the awkward use of the English language. Extremely bad, very bad, dramatically bad, or simply terrible. I think if it was totally agenda driven he wouldn't have said he played well as Shaw has been largely good but not exceptional.

Possibly there was more of a point with the Chilwell thing if that's what he said because he didn't state the justification in such terms for every position. That was probably something to get upset about more than this description of the corners. But yes, ultimately it's all about the context I suppose, it just all seems much ado about nothing to me. The real damage was how he handled the player when he was here.
 
Abraxas said:
I just don't think the terminology is all that different to what many pundits or fans would use in degree, except for the awkward use of the English language. Extremely bad, very bad, dramatically bad, or simply terrible. I think if it was totally agenda driven he wouldn't have said he played well as Shaw has been largely good but not exceptional.

Possibly there was more of a point with the Chilwell thing if that's what he said because he didn't state the justification in such terms for every position. That was probably something to get upset about more than this description of the corners. But yes, ultimately it's all about the context I suppose, it just all seems much ado about nothing to me. The real damage was how he handled the player when he was here.
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When commentators do it, they do it for every player on a consistent basis and hence gets overlooked. What I mean is if a pundit is pointing at flaws of a player after every game, despite the player having been among the better players, I'd brand that as agenda as well.

I mean England played an average game vs Czech. There were things to criticize about that performance like Kane still not being up to mark or not testing their GK enough or whatever. Commenting on a player's performance who wasn't MOTM or among the worst 3 players just sounds obsessive
 
He absolutely deserves to be called out and agree 100% with Luke Shaw....but I wish he had waitied. He could have a disaster against Germany and Jose will put the boot in on TV again
 
Andrew7582 said:
The only trophies Shaw has won in his career were under Jose so he should at least be grateful for that. He speaks as though Jose was only bad for his career but in fact, if he looks inside his trophy cabinet, he can thank Jose for those, not Ole.
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It's not always about trophies and to compare a young player with a long-time coach is pretty silly.
 
Mickeza said:
Flashback to the few hours after his removal his cult following spent claiming he was sacked because he refused to take training due to the ESL.
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Oh yeah, that was pure bs to make him look good. :lol:
 
"Even some of the lads have said ‘what’s his problem?’ and ‘why does he keep talking?’"

This is the most telling quote to me. I wonder what some of the Roma players are thinking right now.
 
Shaw fell for the media trap it feels like. Just shouldn't give air to Mourinho, everything Shaw said is basically what 90% of people thought anyway so it's not like the narrative needed correcting.

Mourinho will love it and considering he's in the middle on a big international tournament Shaw really shouldn't have got involved.
 
Tom Van Persie said:
van Gaal wasn't being malicious but I think he could've handled it better. There was no need to tell the press that Shaw was overweight. He was an 18 year old that was just bought for £30M and clearly he wasn't the most confident lad. He struggled in his first season due to a lack of confidence but he looked amazing at the start of van Gaal's second season before the horrific leg break. I can't even imagine what was going through Shaw's mind when he broke his leg. He probably thought there was a good chance his career was over. He finally recovers and returns to a manager that can't stand him and treats him like shit for no reason and people wonder why he's responding to Mourinho who is still taking digs.
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Without question, I'm on Shaw's side on this. He was lucky the leg break didn't end his career. Van Gaal was never exactly tactful, but Mourinho's behaviour towards him has been quite insidious.
 
dalriada said:
Without question, I'm on Shaw's side on this. He was lucky the leg break didn't end his career. Van Gaal was never exactly tactful, but Mourinho's behaviour towards him has been quite insidious.
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Wasn't there another manager or someone else connected with him who also commented on his weight other than LVG and Jose? There were rumors that his lifestyle at that time wasn't great and given the serious nature of his injury he was probably depressed as hell for a long time. Jose must have been the worst manager for him at that period..
 
Irwin99 said:
Wasn't there another manager or someone else connected with him who also commented on his weight other than LVG and Jose? There were rumors that his lifestyle at that time wasn't great and given the serious nature of his injury he was probably depressed as hell for a long time. Jose must have been the worst manager for him at that period..
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Before injury Poch and think maybe Hodgson commented. The rumours were he let himself go living like a student inviting his mates up from down south to hang out etc
 
How any of you are defending mourinho is ridiculous. He very regularly says stuff about Shaw and made some recent comments about him. Why do people have to be so dense.

Shaw is well within his rights to finally tell Jose about himself
 
mancan92 said:
How any of you are defending mourinho is ridiculous. He very regularly says stuff about Shaw and made some recent comments about him. Why do people have to be so dense.

Shaw is well within his rights to finally tell Jose about himself
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This has been turned into a United-hating forum for quite a while now.
 
Not sure how this has blown up - Mourinho's recent comments were made as a pundit and seem fairly innocuous.

It looks like someone from the Mirror has managed to get into Shaw's ear here, in the hope of generating a bit of a story for themselves.
 
mancan92 said:
How any of you are defending mourinho is ridiculous. He very regularly says stuff about Shaw and made some recent comments about him. Why do people have to be so dense.

Shaw is well within his rights to finally tell Jose about himself
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Its weird. Theyre defending an approach that clearly didnt work even if they agree with what Jose said.
Horrendous player management.
 
clarkydaz said:
Before injury Poch and think maybe Hodgson commented. The rumours were he let himself go living like a student inviting his mates up from down south to hang out etc
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Yep I think that was it. Football fans (including myself) have short memories but Shaw did frustrate the life out of a lot of fans for a good while before getting back on track. In fact he was bloody irritating at times. There was one season where he had about 13 bookings and nearly always for the same foul of shirt tugging when a speedy winger went past him. It was maddening to see that happen constantly.

That's he's turned it around is credit to himself and Ole and I think Jose was the worst manager for him at that time. Jose was/is a pr*ck but he came to win trophies and titles and having to get Shaw's physical and mental state back on track rather than just buying some 100 million pound full-back irritated him I think, as he states in this interview

https://metro.co.uk/2018/11/10/jose-mourinho-aims-dig-at-pep-guardiola-and-manchester-city-8126573/
 
Infra-red said:
Not sure how this has blown up - Mourinho's recent comments were made as a pundit and seem fairly innocuous.

It looks like someone from the Mirror has managed to get into Shaw's ear here, in the hope of generating a bit of a story for themselves.
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True that. And Shaw took the bait.
 
anant said:
When commentators do it, they do it for every player on a consistent basis and hence gets overlooked. What I mean is if a pundit is pointing at flaws of a player after every game, despite the player having been among the better players, I'd brand that as agenda as well.

I mean England played an average game vs Czech. There were things to criticize about that performance like Kane still not being up to mark or not testing their GK enough or whatever. Commenting on a player's performance who wasn't MOTM or among the worst 3 players just sounds obsessive
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I agree with the general notions. However, set pieces are no different to isolating other parts of the game such as Kane's play, the fullbacks reticence to get forward or anything else that has seemed apparent. If I was going to bullet point England's weaknesses thus far it would certainly feature. Not the most foremost concern, but a disappointing part of our play. Especially considering it is an area England have traditionally targeted and there are a few obvious threats in the team.

I have only read the quotes as they are printed as I do not listen to that particular show so perhaps my contextual understanding is limited but I would say if he was picking player performances out at random to criticise it would be indicative of the agenda Mourinho is accused of. However, comment in the general direction of set piece delivery and by extension Shaw seems reasonable to me. It is probably a relatively fine line. I just think this particular one is being overdone, the Chilwell one sounds more obviously targeted.
 
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