Agree with this. All I have a problem with is calling him excellent in games where he is making mistakes. Especially when at the same time a player like Rojo who is new to the league / plays out of position is called average after one mistake. Rojo at least has had a solid world cup out of position, Shaw failed to deliver in the same competition against Costa Rica. It's just very much double standard for my liking when it comes to Shaw since we have signed him.
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Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 20
- Clean sheets
- 4
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 3
- Red cards
- 1
- Status
I dont think either of his recent mistakes were a lack of understanding or childish mistakes as much as him being slightly slow to react in a split second situation due to a lack of match sharpness which is unsurprising since he's only returning from injury
1. Yes u did...Notice how you wrote quite definitively and also in past tense:
2. That's the whole point ffs, you're the one jumping to conclusions so start following your own advice!!!!!!!!!!!
3. He was the best left-back in the Premier League last year (fact) at only 18 years of age, if that doesn't justify us going after a player then I just don't know...Being English is obviously also a big thing but saying that's the only reason we went after him is just stupid.
4. You're completely disregarding the positives from his performances, he's made 2 or 3 errors yes but that can be accounted to being inexperienced, being in new surroundings or to the fact that the entire team has looked really unbalanced and unstable. The really good things he's done while also looking impressive in his overall game you've completely ignored.
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Hey man. I know you've probably got a lot of alerts for this post; I just want you to know that I also think it's quite a silly post.
We have overpaid for him. It might come out in some years that he was a bargain, which doesn't mean that for now I am of the opinion we have overpaid.
Oh and I couldn't care less if he was the best LB in the PL (fact? Azpi was better imo when played there last season), as football for me exists outside of PL as well. And it's not like the PL was the best league in Europe last season.
Anyway I will call Shaw's performances excellent when I think they have been that and not when he is costing his team goals. After all I don't call our other defenders' performances excellent either when they make mistakes.
Thanks for giving your opinion. You'll get the alert in exchange.
what were you expecting him to do?Also, a striker can have a good game but miss a sitter, just as a striker can have a poor game yet get on the score sheet.
To defend well?
Also, a striker can have a good game but miss a sitter, just as a striker can have a poor game yet get on the score sheet.
Both Smalling and especially Jones were also very impressive early on. They've got the talent as well.
Eh? I seem to rememember that Shaw had a very solid game against Costa Rica. He's a left back, what did you expect him to do, score a hat trick?
I don't recall him having any defensive issues in that game.
If only he'd kept a clean sheet or somethingHe played well that game. It ended 0-0. What did you expect the lad to do? No offence but you've had a shocker in this thread. Better off leaving it for a while before you dig an even bigger hole for yourself.
I seem to remember he was all over the place just like Baines was in the first two games.
From what I recall, people were calling Shaw a stand out player against Costa Rica.
Again Shaw was out of position a lot and didn't have a good game at all. And thanks for the advice but not needed.
If a 19 year-old Shaw is no worse than a 28 year-old Baines, I'll take that for now.
Just did a quick Google search of match ratings against Costa Rica for Shaw.
Goal - 6/10; The 18-year-old is reportedly the subject of major interest from Manchester United and, while he hardly starred, he will not have put the Old Trafford club off. He was tough with his defending, but lacked a bit of spark in attack.
BBC - 7/10; Always wanted the ball and showed pace to snuff out occasional Costa Rican attacks.
Independent - 6/10; As secure as any 18-year-old full-back on World Cup debut has a right to be, storming up and down the line, solid on and off the ball.
Mirror - 6/10; Looks physically strong, not overawed, clearly has a huge future in front of him.
MEN - 5/10; Didn't get to play his natural game due to a lack of bodies in the box, meaning his impact was largely stunted.
Hardly representing @united_99 's views.
Goal - 6/10; The 18-year-old is reportedly the subject of major interest from Manchester United and, while he hardly starred, he will not have put the Old Trafford club off. He was tough with his defending, but lacked a bit of spark in attack.
BBC - 7/10; Always wanted the ball and showed pace to snuff out occasional Costa Rican attacks.
Independent - 6/10; As secure as any 18-year-old full-back on World Cup debut has a right to be, storming up and down the line, solid on and off the ball.
Mirror - 6/10; Looks physically strong, not overawed, clearly has a huge future in front of him.
MEN - 5/10; Didn't get to play his natural game due to a lack of bodies in the box, meaning his impact was largely stunted.
Hardly representing @united_99 's views.
Well thats just nonsense.
I don't understand why you insist..You can say that you believe that we've overpaid for him, but you can't say definitively that we have, so don't.
He was named in the PFA team of the year, perhaps also subjective but i'd trust their judgment over yours especially as your methods haven't exactly convinced me. Wether the PL is the best League in europe or not is debatable, but for a player to perform like he has (at 18 years of age) in any of the 2 or 3 best leagues in the world means alot, and of course it matters that the league that he performed so in is the same league that the club competes in.
I've already explained to you that I don't care about wether you think that his performances for us have been excellent or not, that's not what i'm taking issue with. My problem with you is your willingness to write a young player off for making a few mistakes at 19 years of age, add to that the "mistakes" he's made aren't even that serious to begin with, Another of our record signins; De Gea made alot, ALOT, of mistakes at his start here that were far more concerning than the ones Shaw's made. Were you as quick to judge him as you've Shaw?
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/day-13-costa-rica-vs-england.392644/page-15
Not much about Shaw, was mentioned just about 5 times, from what ppl have written here Costa Rica didn't attack much, Shaw started being average, disappeared at times, but improved in the 2nd half.
Not much about Shaw, was mentioned just about 5 times, from what ppl have written here Costa Rica didn't attack much, Shaw started being average, disappeared at times, but improved in the 2nd half.
Again, I am not writing him off, all I am saying is he has NOT been excellent.
DDG by the way played at a higher level with Atletico before he joined us and was nowhere physically as ready when he came to us than Shaw is now. DDG looked like 17 whereas Shaw looks like 24, not physically weak at all.
And while I have always rated DDG I wasn't calling his performances as excellent in games he had made mistakes.
So not "all over the place" and "out of position a lot" then?
Be honest, you didn't watch the game did you?
Be honest, you didn't watch the game did you?
I did! I recorded it!
I don't think the majority are saying he's excellent in all fairness, but like another poster said, to judge Shaw at this early stage of the season you need a larger sample size than the amount of games he's played thus far. I'm especially not going to draw conclusions off of his performances so far, as he's performed better offensively than defensively so far, but going off the basis of his Southampton performances he's actually a better defender than he is an attacker.
I'm starting to understand how you got your tag. Claiming that we've overpaid for him after 2 games is writing him off.
De Gea was not playing at a significantly higher level than Shaw at the time that we signed him. Atletico ended up 7th in La liga the season before we bought him, and 9th the season before that. Southampton ended up 8th behind us last year, both were midtable teams in major leagues. The only difference is that De Gea had some international experience that Shaw hasn't had. Far from all of the mistakes he made in his debut season for us can be accounted to lack of physicality, there was alot more to it than that.
Since you didn't seem to get it the second time either, i'll post this one last time...
Did you or did you not think that De Gea, at a similar time in his United career as Shaw now, was overpriced and that we should have gone with another player?
Nope, DDG wasn't overpriced, also cost around 10 mil less than Shaw and as you figured out yourself was experienced in Europe. Plus apart from Neuer who didn't want to come, there was no better option than DDG to go for. DDG also was very successful with the Spanish youth teams.
Apart from that I won't go into the "excellence" part again, as I have already mentioned it more than once.
How many fullbacks were at Shaw's level when they were 19? That's one question we have to ask. He is one of the top teenage defenders in the world, no doubt. It's all good and well comparing him to Coentrao, but what was he doing at 17/18? Shaw was playing PL football and put in performances which earned him a £30 million move.
? What's so funny?
Youre having a 'mare mate.
For a goalkeeper it was obviously a large sum since it was the highest fee that had been paid for any goalkeeper at the time.
A few games in the europa league doesn't seem so meriting when you consider that it consists largely of teams who'd struggle in bottom the premier league.
Shaw has played for every England team from the u-16s and up. Even though that spain team won alot you don't grade an individual player by the success of the team.
There were plenty of "safer" options to go after at the time than De Gea, apart from Neuer there was also Lloris, Adler and many other talented goalkeepers around who had more merit than De Gea did. But De Gea was an exceptional talent just like Shaw is.
at United_99Coentrao is defensively quite poor, whereas Shaw is defensively brilliant. For a club that's absolutely loaded with money like ours, buying English talent like Shaw is an absolute no brainer.
Ah that's good. Watch it again and come back to us. Easy on the Crystal Meth this time though.
Probably that's why Shaws were, literally, all over the place.
I'd rather watch Chelsea bore me to death than watch an Englang game twice consisting of current useless and overrated players. The only reason I even bothered watching it was because of Jones' and Smallings' world cup debut and not because of a guy who didn't impress me and somehow managed to be unfit, but never mind, apparently he is still excellent while Coentrao who has been defending at the highest level and against the best attackers apparently is poor defensively.
So far all I have is an unproven potential who both his club and country manager deemed unfit and who has not acchieved anything yet.
But excuse me for asking how he has been excellent.
Is it because he wears tight pants? Is that why you dislike him? Is it?
If that's the case you could blame DDG too for not coming to claim. It was Luke's man and he fell asleep really to let Naismith in. Shaw is an excellent talent and I'm completely comfortable with the fee we paid, but people have to be realistic and he has made some bad mistakes - 2 in one game against Everton for example.
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