Looks like a passing drill that he wasn't ready for. Clearly see he's passing just as good as everyone else once he was up to speed with the drill. I don't think he has an amazing first touch and could definitely work on it but this video is taking the piss
Lukaku's first touch
- Thread starter goldenballs
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Looks like a passing drill that he wasn't ready for. Clearly see he's passing just as good as everyone else once he was up to speed with the drill. I don't think he has an amazing first touch and could definitely work on it but this video is taking the piss
I think this is where stats can be problematic when studied in isolation (I'm not on the stat bashing bandwagon either). Anyone that watches Rooney can see his touch lets him down when it's needed most far too often. The reason I imagine it doesn't look that bad in the stats is because he drops deep quite a bit where the receiver (Rooney) has a lot more space/time to take a touch, the weight of pass is likely a lot lighter than an arrow like pass intended for a striker running onto the ball at high speed in a congested part of the pitch. This stat flatters Rooney I think because he drops so deep and takes on the types of touches that a central midfielder will take.
Berbatov's touch was impeccable, but compared to a Rio or Vida, based on stats alone it'd probably seem quite comparable, but anyone with a pair of eyes can tell you Berba's touch was amazing.
Pogba's equivalent stats were 1.8 and 2.6 with an 85.1% completion rate. (Mkhitaryan would be 1.8, 1.3 and 84.1%)
I'm starting to think we have that "unstable touch" stat back to front and the higher the number the better. That's the only way all these figures make sense. Pogba's first touch was impeccable. Much better than Rooney's (it was the 4 or or 5 touches afterwards that got often him in bother)
Whilst he wasn't the most flashiest of players, he most certainly wasn't an average or a limited player by any means outside the box. Naturally his phenomenal goalscoring exploits overshadow his overall ability and game outside the box but it was pretty instrumental for both Bayern and Germany imo.
Pigeon-holing him as a mere 'poacher' is unfair and doesnt do him justice imo.
Agreed.
Precisely. This might be veering a bit from the topic but a goalscoring centre forward doesn't have to be limited or offer nought outside the box if they aren't the most flashy or the most technical of players. There's so much they can contribute to, if they have the right mentality (instead of sulking and moping about up front, isolated and complaining about lack of service), work-rate, movement off the ball (not just off the shoulders of the penultimate defender) and the tactical nous, and of course the link up play with the corresponding requisite skills.
Will quote some of my older posts on Müller.
The match was held in Hampden Park and Scotland dominated for large periods of the match and I really can't stress the importance of Muller here. He was the difference maker, not just with his goal, but with his overall play. When your side is up against the wall and struggling to impose itself upon the match, a centre-forward who is working his socks off from the front, dropping deep and frequently faciliating play, feeding on scraps but somehow fashioning chances for himself and doing his utmost to get others involved is just as priceless as it comes.
Do notice how he frequently makes himself available for the pass (esp when his team-mates suffer from a lack of options), and his willingness to bring others into the play, one-twos etc and how selfless his general approach is. Of course, he was no Bergkamp/Hidegkuti and was fairly unaesthetic tbh, but a player who is a proven match-winner offering that much off and on the ball outside the box is pretty remarkable. He was hardly a 'poacher' playing off the shoulders of the last defender and only being goal-oriented/selfish in his movement.
Germany could leave Muller isolated, safe in the knowledge that there will always be an utterly deadly focal point who basically guaranteed you goals (somehow), and an industrious and a willing, mobile facilitative foil who frequently looked to get things moving along and get others involved. Also, it's incredible how he just switches on and lights up in the penalty box. Outside of it, he wasn't great at beating players and didn't really attempt dribbles but inside it, he somehow morphed into an unholy amalgamation of Cruyff, Laudrup and a circus contortionist- do watch the goal at 5.20 and his shot at 8.52.
Not Muller's greatest game but that goal at 7.00 (match-winner at 88th min) though, a rainbow flick that even Ronaldinho would be proud of. Glorious stuff
I believe Lukaku can potentially come leaps and bounds under Mourinho's stringent and tactical tutelage. Really do hope he improves his all round game.
So they managed to find 17 poor touches in over 15,300 minutes of professional playing time. That diabolical!! How can we put up with this!! That is a poor touch once every 10 games
People can dismiss first touch as irrelevant all they want but the fact is, it matters big time when you're playing CF for a big club because 9 times out of 10 you're up against 10 defenders in and around the 16 yard box.
I for one think he'll find it hard to score at United. He's also got many other flaws in his game as well. I hope he improves.
I for one think he'll find it hard to score at United. He's also got many other flaws in his game as well. I hope he improves.
Pogba is often quite clumsy (and Mkhitaryan is a ball loss waiting to happen). In Pogba's case I think it may be that he's thinking a little to far ahead and doesn't concentrate sufficiently on actually possessing the ball before having fun. Rooney had occasional horrible games which seemed to get seared into peoples memory. In general though he was pretty efficient which kept the averages down. Even being horribly slow for the last couple of years, his goals/assists per minute were still top class and that doesn't come from nowhere.
He won't find it hard since we will base our game around crossing the ball to his head and he will score many goals that way.
I guess we'll never know, one way or another. According to google, the only use of "unstable touch" in this context is in this thread!
That's because it's listed as "UnsTch: Bad control per game" in whoscored.
Ok, cool. At least that removes any ambiguity. Rooney's stats really are surprising.
Not really. Most Caftards seem to watch games through the lenses of whatever they've read (or written) about particular players. Watching objectively, Rooney was probably our tidiest player other than Herrera and Mata (who had the advantage of growing up in a Spanish system where maintaining ball control is paramount).
Well that's not true at all. Antonio Valencia's first touch is probably the best of all, for starters.
The negative comparison with other strikers only applies to passing stats. I didn't want to quote myself from a few pages back, so I've pasted the Dispossessed-Unst.Touch table next to the other for a better overall picture.
You're right. The discussion had been concerning forward and midfield players - I should have made clear that I was maintaining that focus.
His first touch isn't great. But it's way overplayed.
Berbatov with as sublime touch as possible in football scored 21 goals in his best season. Lukaku will breach that number in the coming season without too much hassle.
Berbatov with as sublime touch as possible in football scored 21 goals in his best season. Lukaku will breach that number in the coming season without too much hassle.
The way I read it is that unstable touch means that a player has connected with the pass, but instantly lost it because of technical mistake. So when a player screws up an attacking sequence due to his bad touch, yet manages to keep hold of the ball there is no record of it in the data. It's not there in the dispossessed bracket since he never was fully in control of it, otherwise it would be too harsh as well as misleading.
With Rooney it can be that his stats(per game) are watered down across the season. In PL Wayne's made 25 appearances, but it cumulated in only 1538 minutes on the pitch. He started 15 games with 9 subs out and 10 subs in.
Regarding also surprising Zlatan's results, I'm thinking that his very good first half of the season has balanced out the clearly worse second part.
I didn't call him just a poacher, I called him the ultimate poacher. There is a big difference you know.
Actually, you just posted a very eleborate description of what I described. He might not have been the most talented footballer ever to say the least, but he was one the greatest forwards ever to play the game. You don't need the skill set of Messi to be a great player, so there's hope for Lukaku yet!
will be a goal.
"Lukaku's first touch... will be a goal."
"Lukaku's first touch... will be a goal."
Woeful, eh lads
It's a crap stat because it's completely dependent on playing style.
Rooney would go into space hunting for the ball in all sorts of positions. He very rarely received the ball under pressure; when he did he often lost it. Players like Miki like to play in tighter spaces and are closed down much faster.
Lukaku has a heavy first touch but hes good at directing it where he wants to go, which is why he struggles when the ball comes in square on but otherwise is great at getting shots away early.
You can't have it all. We have bemoaned our lack of proper goalscorers for a few years now and yet when we seemingly get him people are worried about his link up play! Most of the time he will be the battering ram that we feed the ball into when we play the 8-man defence of WBA and the like who don't venture more than 2yards from the penalty spot all game
Actually, quite untrue. Saw him live in LA and the highlights of Salt Lake, it seems he's trying to fit into our style well, and his first touch and quick passing for build up play is actually working out very well. I hope he doesn't lose some of what makes him great doing so, but he's working out just fine on the quick 1-2's. He's going to be great
He's like Berbatov compared to what everyone was saying on here
Even Luis Ronaldo fecked up some attacking plays while dwelling on the ball, missing a touch etc.
That was when he slowed down.
Rooney never had polished technique, but when fit he could have one explosive burst after anither, which helped him dribble and hold the ball.
But both of them knew exactly what they wanted to do and had the determination to do it, week in, week out.
They always were feared even when fat.
Determination will be the key attribute for Lukaku, not the first touch.
Physical play is his best attribute though.
That was when he slowed down.
Rooney never had polished technique, but when fit he could have one explosive burst after anither, which helped him dribble and hold the ball.
But both of them knew exactly what they wanted to do and had the determination to do it, week in, week out.
They always were feared even when fat.
Determination will be the key attribute for Lukaku, not the first touch.
Physical play is his best attribute though.
First thing I saw this morning was the involvement in the first goal.
Personally thought his touch was poor against salt lake. My main concern is how he puts the ball into the net though and he did that just fine.
Agree with what a poster said earlier about the ball coming in square he does seem to struggle with which way he wants to take his touch. Also when laying the ball backwards instead of a flick on he often places it just behind the runner. (Could be due to getting used to his team mates speed of runs and direction)
Overall I think he's settling in quite well and if he can iron out a few little niggles he'll be a top player for us for
Agree with what a poster said earlier about the ball coming in square he does seem to struggle with which way he wants to take his touch. Also when laying the ball backwards instead of a flick on he often places it just behind the runner. (Could be due to getting used to his team mates speed of runs and direction)
Overall I think he's settling in quite well and if he can iron out a few little niggles he'll be a top player for us for
Sadly it's going to become a thing whereby it's scrutinised to an insane degree that nobody else's first touch is. New signing and already adding a shitload of unnecessary extra pressure and scrutiny. Fab.
Started off poor but improved as the half went on. Some good touches involved in both goals.
Spot on. It's amazing how this absolute crap can become like a science. How can someone with no first touch score so many goals?
I don't think Big Rom reads (or cares) what whingy RedCafe kids think.
You're not allowed to say that. If you want to put the words Lakaku and touch into the same sentence, then it's mandatory to put a word like 'shit' or 'poor' in there too.
Doubt he reads the caf. Not heard or seen it discussed anywhere else.
You can say what you want about lukakus touch but he has great power in his feet. Hell, he traps the ball farther than I can kick it.
I guess this is the sort or ludicrously over the top nit-picking he'll get all season because of this thread.
Another good performance from the big man today. Quality contribution to the opener and took his goal superbly. His all round game looks very good. Delighted with what he's shown so far.
There's been plenty of ludicrously over the top nit-picking for years on here but I think Lukaku and his first touch has the potential to be the biggest one!
The groundswell of stats driven narratives is the single worse thing to come out of America.
Worse than 'Cleats', 'Shut out' and 'Flop'.
They're a nation that's stats obsessed. It becomes far too reductive in football. European football seems to adopt a new one every single year.
It feels like copying off the stupidest kid in class.
Worse than 'Cleats', 'Shut out' and 'Flop'.
They're a nation that's stats obsessed. It becomes far too reductive in football. European football seems to adopt a new one every single year.
It feels like copying off the stupidest kid in class.
You would think he needs Zidane's first touch to be a successful player.
I am absolutely fine with it, his touch is ok so far for the player he is. Zlatan wasnt perfect either. More importany is goals and overall contribution. So far on tour this has been good. I expect him to bang goals in and contribute with hold up play and dragging/bullying defenders. His first touch shouldnt be the first thing you mention.
I am absolutely fine with it, his touch is ok so far for the player he is. Zlatan wasnt perfect either. More importany is goals and overall contribution. So far on tour this has been good. I expect him to bang goals in and contribute with hold up play and dragging/bullying defenders. His first touch shouldnt be the first thing you mention.
Watched him in both games so far, and obviously it's a small sample against poor opposition, but it doesn't seem that bad. In fact I've been watching these matches with the preconceived notion that his first touch is actually bad. So it's what I've been looking and expecting to see when watching him. If it wasn't highlighted as much, I might not have picked it out.
Then again let's see what it's like against the big boys that we'll be coming up against now, who will suffocate the space around him.
Then again let's see what it's like against the big boys that we'll be coming up against now, who will suffocate the space around him.