Luckhurst: United prepared to move for a holding midfielder in January

Gandalf said:
So good they let him back up Fred in Brazil.
Click to expand...

Ffs :lol: if that’s your argument for a Fred > Fabinho debate let’s just end our discussion here and go about our day,

You put Fabinho behind Pogba & Bruno and you have the best midfield in world football, you put Fred behind Bruno & Pogba and you still need to add McTominay and you’re still far off from a functional Midfield
 
I don't see that 3rd signing happening once the season has started. Unless there is a serious injury straight away. Our business is done until the January transfer window. Which is when I think we'll sign someone.
 
Jaxa said:
Ffs :lol: if that’s your argument for a Fred > Fabinho debate let’s just end our discussion here and go about our day,

You put Fabinho behind Pogba & Bruno and you have the best midfield in world football, you put Fred behind Bruno & Pogba and you still need to add McTominay and you’re still far off from a functional Midfield
Click to expand...

Stop saying positive things about Liverpool players, there might be kids reading this :lol:
 
bosskeano said:
It's never the outcomes against the top 4 teams that decides the league but not dropping dumb ass points like we did last season. We've got to put teams to bed especially at home. We drop too many points when we shouldn't.
Click to expand...

Dropping points against teams you should should beat clearly derails any title challenge, but if you assume that whoever's top (City, I suspect) are unlikely to drop those points, games against the top six are just as vital. Winning the games you should puts you in the mix, not 15-20 points behind the leaders. Taking points from the top sides might be what gets you over the line.
 
VanDeBank said:
Because I pointed out how silly it is to price Lingard at 30m because he's "a good international footballer"?



Haaland is 75m + tens of millions for Raiola. I don't see us spending big again for a MF without sales next year either (with a window like this preceding it).

Might as well sell Lingard/James/Martial now that their value is high.
Click to expand...

No because you don't know what you're talking about and it's a waste of my time.
 
Ikon said:
You just answered the problem yourself...
That's not happening with the ponderous duo of McFred in a double pivot.
It was United's failing last season, and with the same duo this season, I don't understand how you could reach a different conclusion.

McFred are just not going to take this team where you want it to be.
Click to expand...

We will not start McFred against Burnley .. that was my whole argument. Pogba will start these games and

---------------- Cavani ------------------
--- Rashford -- Bruno -- Sancho
------------ Pogba -- McT -------------

is enough to beat basically every single team that's not Liverpool / City / Chelsea.
 
Alemar said:
Fred now plays in the starting XI for Brazil on a regular basis. Chances are, the cornerstone of our “McFred” problem is not Fred…
Click to expand...

Kleberson was Brazil's main CM when winning WC.
 
Pickle85 said:
According to PL's own stats lingard has ten premier league assists for United in his whole time at the club. That's a pathetic stat for someone playing in the position he's often found himself.
Click to expand...

I think people misunderstand what Lingard brings. His running and shooting are his best attributes. That’s what West Ham got out of him. He isn’t a provider and that’s also fine.

Clearly, Buendia is more of an assist merchant than Lingard. Similarly, Sancho is a better Buendia and Rashford a better Lingard.

Players are different and it’s about how they fit in your team. Clearly, Lingard with his off the ball running and counter attacking skills is not well suited to United playing with 60% of the ball in front of packed defences. Sancho with his quick feet and quality delivery is.

Lingards best form has been under Mourinho and Moyes. He clearly suits defensive teams who need work rate and transition running and the ability to score on the break.
 
Teja said:
I see your viewpoint but I still disagree, so lets see how it plays out this season. For context:

City: 10G - 5W - 2D - 3L
Utd : 10G - 2W - 5D - 3L

City have a +6 point advantage in big games. I don't think that's huge or is what will decide the title this year.
Click to expand...

Big 6 results ebb and flow. I’m fairly sure we were top or 2nd best against the big 6 two seasons ago. Everyone was lauding Ole for winning home and away against City or whatever or was that last season?

Last season was far too cautious in those big games. You may as well win 2-3 by chancing it rather than taking draws. Out of our 5 draws if one more was a win and we’d lost two more we’d be better off in terms of points. The lack of ambition to attack was very disappointing.
 
RedRover said:
Dropping points against teams you should should beat clearly derails any title challenge, but if you assume that whoever's top (City, I suspect) are unlikely to drop those points, games against the top six are just as vital. Winning the games you should puts you in the mix, not 15-20 points behind the leaders. Taking points from the top sides might be what gets you over the line.
Click to expand...

Also, 6 point swings. If you finish 6pts behind the winners and you lost both games to them then only one win for makes it level on points.
 
choccy77 said:
Guys, we can't even give Jones away for nothing.

How do you expect us to get crazy money for our reject Players?

This summer has proven that outside a special few, like Arsenal.

No one has money to through around on average players.
Click to expand...

The Glazers have money to throw around - just like the City owners but they won't.

After taking over a billion out of the club, reinvesting a few hundred million wouldn't be much. But their philosophy is clear. like a drowning swimmer, just keep the club's nose above water until they can sell it for billions.
 
Red_toad said:
We play possession football, some players aren't suited to such a system. You don't see that then that's your issue. I didn't say he was good enough for United, not sure where you got them from? Ibra wasn't a poor player as he failed at Barca, he didn't suit their system. Veron wasn't a bad player when he joined United, ditto Kagawa, etc, etc, etc (not saying Jesse is anywhere near as good as any of those players by the way). Players work differently at different clubs, there are many variables between success and failure.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't really say we play a game that's particularly based around keeping the ball. Sure, we played that way under Van Gaal but under Ole we've looked to hit on the break quite a bit which is why we've been known to struggle against sides that sit back and defend. I'd say that teams like City play possession football but I wouldn't say that's our MO. Sure, we often have the lion's share of the ball but that's because we're usually, man for man, better than the opposition.
I think we'll have to agree to disagree...I think lingard will be a perfectly adequate player for a side like West Ham but I think his recent form has been another purple patch and he'll revert to type soon enough. I also can't see anyone rushing to pay 30 mill for him, which was really the point I took issue with initially in this thread.
 
032Devil said:
The Glazers have money to throw around - just like the City owners but they won't.

After taking over a billion out of the club, reinvesting a few hundred million wouldn't be much. But their philosophy is clear. like a drowning swimmer, just keep the club's nose above water until they can sell it for billions.
Click to expand...
I honestly don’t get posts like these. Twitter and this forum is full of them. We spend fecking fortunes - we don’t spend just enough to keep our nose above water at all - we’ve spent the second most on the planet the last 8 years - only beaten by a gulf oil state. We’re prepared to let Pogba who cost 90m quid walk on a free rather than take a 50m fee for him. We spent 80m on a sodding CB. We’ve just spent 110m following a pandemic season with no training sponsor and we are refusing to sell Martial, James and Lingard. Our issues have feck all to do with spending - our issues are we’ve been incompetent on what we spend it on. Until Ole oddly enough. Who some muppets want sacked. The Glazers are cnuts BUT we still spend. Those two things aren’t mutually exclusive.
 
sparx99 said:
I think people misunderstand what Lingard brings. His running and shooting are his best attributes. That’s what West Ham got out of him. He isn’t a provider and that’s also fine.

Clearly, Buendia is more of an assist merchant than Lingard. Similarly, Sancho is a better Buendia and Rashford a better Lingard.

Players are different and it’s about how they fit in your team. Clearly, Lingard with his off the ball running and counter attacking skills is not well suited to United playing with 60% of the ball in front of packed defences. Sancho with his quick feet and quality delivery is.

Lingards best form has been under Mourinho and Moyes. He clearly suits defensive teams who need work rate and transition running and the ability to score on the break.
Click to expand...
This is the issue I have with him though...is he a defensive attacking midfielder, useful for his pressing? Because his goals stats don't back up the idea of him as a particularly good finisher. I also can't forget the amount of time he's spent hiding and, as soon as he gets the ball, popping it off to the nearest person like he's terrified.
 
Teja said:
I see your viewpoint but I still disagree, so lets see how it plays out this season. For context:

City: 10G - 5W - 2D - 3L
Utd : 10G - 2W - 5D - 3L

City have a +6 point advantage in big games. I don't think that's huge or is what will decide the title this year.
Click to expand...

That is what is forgotten about McFred, they have often done well in the big games. But you dont win titls just doing well in big games and its many other games outside of these they simply havent been good enoughor even suitable for
 
bosskeano said:
Bissouma or Ndidi was the main shout at hte beginning of the summer as the most reasonable holding mids we should be targeting
Click to expand...

Funny nobody seems to be mentioning Bissouma as a signing for almost any of the big sides now, 3months without exposure and shiny new toys. Not THE signing for me, but he wasnt 3months ago either, but certainly one of the viable options, or he hsould be for several sides
 
jesperjaap said:
Funny nobody seems to be mentioning Bissouma as a signing for almost any of the big sides now, 3months without exposure and shiny new toys. Not THE signing for me, but he wasnt 3months ago either, but certainly one of the viable options, or he hsould be for several sides
Click to expand...
Bissouma has always struck me as an all action Fred type rather than a 6. It is weird he hasn’t gone anywhere though - felt he was perfect for Liverpool.
 
More and more infor saying we might be fine for the summer.

What's our plan? To have an incomplete Midfield again? And then what? Have an incomplete Midfield next season too when we need to replace Pogba?

Bit if forward planning would be good. We won't sign 2 CMS next summer so we need once now
 
Jaxa said:
Ffs :lol: if that’s your argument for a Fred > Fabinho debate let’s just end our discussion here and go about our day,

You put Fabinho behind Pogba & Bruno and you have the best midfield in world football, you put Fred behind Bruno & Pogba and you still need to add McTominay and you’re still far off from a functional Midfield
Click to expand...
You don't get close to the best in the world.
 
Matthew84! said:
I don't see that 3rd signing happening once the season has started. Unless there is a serious injury straight away. Our business is done until the January transfer window. Which is when I think we'll sign someone.
Click to expand...
We signed Telles, Cavani, Pellistri and Amad after the season started last year. If the right outgoings happen then we'll make a signing.
 
Pickle85 said:
This is the issue I have with him though...is he a defensive attacking midfielder, useful for his pressing? Because his goals stats don't back up the idea of him as a particularly good finisher. I also can't forget the amount of time he's spent hiding and, as soon as he gets the ball, popping it off to the nearest person like he's terrified.
Click to expand...

To my mind he’s most suitable as the attacking midfielder who operates off of a target man. So for a mid table side he is maybe the biggest goal threat in the way that say Tim Cahill played for Everton (Lingard would score more with his feet than head obviously).

Again though, all of Lingards flaws are particularly highlighted when playing for a ‘better’ side. The simplicity of his passing and directness are good attributes in lesser teams. They are not good attributes when breaking down low blocks.

Also, judging Lingard by his stats is tricky. He was a late bloomer and so only really came with into the side at 22-23 and he has never been a guaranteed starter. Going by the eye test he seems to be a good striker of the ball which you can see by the number of long range goals he has scored (out of the goals he has scored).

One of Ole’s biggest achievements has been identifying early which players don’t really suit his vision. Fellaini, Smalling & Lukaku all were moved on due to their poor technique. Lingard has stuck around longer in part because he was younger and seemed happy to play a bit part role but it does seem Ole recognised he needed a more technically proficient no 10 to play that role for us.
 
bosskeano said:
Bissouma or Ndidi was the main shout at hte beginning of the summer as the most reasonable holding mids we should be targeting
Click to expand...
It is surprising that no one has seriously gone in for Bissouma, at the end of last season it felt like almost everyone was going to be after him. I think he'd be a good signing.
 
sparx99 said:
I think people misunderstand what Lingard brings. His running and shooting are his best attributes. That’s what West Ham got out of him. He isn’t a provider and that’s also fine.

Clearly, Buendia is more of an assist merchant than Lingard. Similarly, Sancho is a better Buendia and Rashford a better Lingard.

Players are different and it’s about how they fit in your team. Clearly, Lingard with his off the ball running and counter attacking skills is not well suited to United playing with 60% of the ball in front of packed defences. Sancho with his quick feet and quality delivery is.

Lingards best form has been under Mourinho and Moyes. He clearly suits defensive teams who need work rate and transition running and the ability to score on the break.
Click to expand...
I think his loan form, not just at west ham but also his loans to the likes of Birmingham, confirms this as well. Ive personally wondered whether we'd be wiser using him as a back up striker at United rather than as a CAM.
 
Mr Smith said:
It is surprising that no one has seriously gone in for Bissouma, at the end of last season it felt like almost everyone was going to be after him. I think he'd be a good signing.
Click to expand...
Is Bissouma really that good? There is a bit too much hype in here but then I have not really watched much of his.

in general, I dont think our MF signing will be significant. It is most likely Neves for 30m if at all
 
You must log in or register to reply here.