Liverpool benefitting from Referees

[RobinLFC]

It wasnt really true when Sir Alex was in charge though, the idea that Sir Alex had the refs in his pocket was made up by bitter rival fans who couldnt just accept that we were winning by being the best team

The irony of this post is through the roof, well done if intended.

 

[RobinLFC]

Only with Liverpool it isn’t just about results is it?

You had a player racially abuse another player and somehow managed to turn the aggressor into the victim with a campaign that included printed T-shirts his black team mates were expected to wear.

Great way of turning your own thread into something completely else. You really are one of the worst posters around when it concerns Liverpool these days, almost at TheReligion level. Unhealthy obsession with a team that you don't even support.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

It wasnt really true when Sir Alex was in charge though, the idea that Sir Alex had the refs in his pocket was made up by bitter rival fans who couldnt just accept that we were winning by being the best team

Hmmm…

 

[Pexbo]

Great way of turning your own thread into something completely else. You really are one of the worst posters around when it concerns Liverpool these days, almost at TheReligion level. Unhealthy obsession with a team that you don't even support.

“It all started when he hit me back sir”

Irony lost on you apparently

 

[RobinLFC]

“It all started when he hit me back sir”

Irony lost on you apparently

I have no clue what you are trying to say here. Enjoy the rest of your day mate.

 

[antk]

Using the victims slur in a thread that is - by its very nature - self-pitying is almost too obvious to point out.

Big subtext here: Poor United and the mean refs.

I may be missing context here as I am not English - how is "victim" a slur? Genuine question.

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

This will be a long ass thread in no time with the amount of decisions that lot getting their favour. We’ll be in mega thread territory by March.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

You could do a mail merge of this and replace it with any given set of fans. It’s so incredibly ironic in its lack of self-awareness. Every club seems to harbour large numbers of fans who basically deal with defeat like toddlers. It isn’t idiosyncratic to Liverpool fans only - obviously

Liverpool as a club seems to have a lot more of these fans than every other club though.

 

[LochGormanAbú]

When Liverpool fans live by the mantras of 'Scouse not English' and 'You'll Never Walk Alone' are you surprised?

Their entire fan base lives off playing the victim card. I have never met an unbiased and accountable Liverpool fan. The players are the best, the fans are the best, and the only reason they lose is because of Man United, City and Chelsea spending more money or ref decisions going against them, which is ironic because they have more favourable decisions than any other club. Ref decisions at Anfield have been an absolute joke for years and you can't feign ignorance by pretending it hasn't,

I don't believe Liverpool have the best squad out there, I don't believe Liverpool fans are the best, I believe most normal fans are all good and any assertion that one fan group is the best makes no sense, "the only reason they lose is because of Man United" I don't get this at all, don't know what it is meant to mean? I don't care what other teams spend, I've always said you put 11 players out on the pitch, I would personally abolish FFP, doesn't work anyway, I've always said I don't believe there is any ref conspiracy in the EPL,

Does that debunk your theory "Their entire fan base lives off playing the victim card. I have never met an unbiased and accountable Liverpool fan"

 

[LochGormanAbú]

This could be interesting, who will do the decision making/calculations? Optic stats? Ref Watch? Premier League stats?
What will the baseline be for benefiting or not against other teams, overall average etc?

BTW, using the 'Victims' line is a real lack of class, you definitely know where that originated from

@Pexbo I guess by your lack of response, you and the rest of the Caf will decide when Liverpool have benefited unfairly by a ref/var decision, ok, can't see any issue with that

 

[DJ_21]

No I fully agree. Hope refs continue their bias behaviour. Saves the team having to be any good.

You saying you’re not very good? I mean you’re top of both the league and Cl.

 

[Liver_bird]

It wasnt really true when Sir Alex was in charge though, the idea that Sir Alex had the refs in his pocket was made up by bitter rival fans who couldnt just accept that we were winning by being the best team

You do see though…how this could also be said by Liverpool fans? There are countless big decisions I could point to over the years that have impacted us at pivotal moments in title races that were decided by a point. Both in our games and rival games. I, personally, try and do my best to avoid this because the amount of headspace it takes up is insane. It’s just not a sport you can enjoy that way. I still think we have a horrendous set of refs and we should import them all from abroad. However, I know full well that won’t change the discourse and sentiment towards refereeing. Every single team thinks refs are biased against them. This thread has literally been created because a ref was caught slagging off Liverpool and comfortably hanging around with people who hate scousers, of which there is an undercurrent of in England. Yet somehow, it’s Liverpool who benefit from decisions!?

 

[Pexbo]

@Pexbo I guess by your lack of response, you and the rest of the Caf will decide when Liverpool have benefited unfairly by a ref/var decision, ok, can't see any issue with that

There’s not going to be any judgement in the records, discussion, sure.

We can record simply as:

Match Name
Contentious decisions for:

Contentious decisions against:

*Thread marks for discussiosn*

 

[LochGormanAbú]

There’s not going to be any judgement in the records, discussion, sure.

We can record simply as:

Match Name
Contentious decisions for:

Contentious decisions against:

*Thread marks for discussiosn*

Ok cool, and who decides on the 'Contentious decisions for' and the 'Contentious decisions against'

 

[Pexbo]

Ok cool, and who decides on the 'Contentious decisions for' and the 'Contentious decisions against'

The fact they are raised and discussed in here will qualify them as contentious, if there’s a consensus that it’s ridiculous to raise a particular decision it won’t be included

 

[Heinzesight]

This thread really hit some Scouse nerves.

 

[Red in STL]

It wasnt really true when Sir Alex was in charge though, the idea that Sir Alex had the refs in his pocket was made up by bitter rival fans who couldnt just accept that we were winning by being the best team

Of course it wasn't true, but United fans are no different, we're resorting to the same argument that Liverpool have the refs in their pocket because they're currently better than we are

 

[RedRocket9908]

Of course it wasn't true, but United fans are no different, we're resorting to the same argument that Liverpool have the refs in their pocket because they're currently better than we are

Its not because Liverpool are better than we are its because we see it when we watch their games, I cant remember the last time a visiting team at Anfield had a big decision go their way.

If we are going to have this thread we should have a similar one about City as well as they get away with just as much as Liverpool do.

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

This thread really hit some Scouse nerves.

It doesn’t take much, they are a very sensitive bunch after all.

 

[Red in STL]

Its not because Liverpool are better than we are its because we see it when we watch their games, I cant remember the last time a visiting team at Anfield had a big decision go their way.

Which is basically the same they all thought in SAF's time

 

[Raven]

It might be an idea to document say Liverpool's VAR decisions against our own (preferably multiple teams but that would be a lot of effort) and see how it ends up at the end of the season, otherwise we'll have no point of reference and the whole thing will be meaningless.

 

[Raven]

The irony of this post is through the roof, well done if intended.

Liverpool haven't really been winning much though? That would be the main difference I see between the examples.

 

[Pexbo]

It might be an idea to document say Liverpool's VAR decisions against our own (preferably multiple teams but that would be a lot of effort) and see how it ends up at the end of the season, otherwise we'll have no point of reference and the whole thing will be meaningless.

I was thinking of making another thread for ours

 

[Raven]

I was thinking of making another thread for ours

That makes sense, good man.

 

[RedRocket9908]

Liverpool haven't really been winning much though? That would be the main difference I see between the examples.

We have VAR now as well

 

[KirkDuyt]

Most RAWK thread of the year award is done then.

 

[NotThatSoph]

I may be missing context here as I am not English - how is "victim" a slur? Genuine question.

The "always the victims, never their fault" talking point comes from the Hillsborough disaster, where the police caused a stampede killing 97 people. The cops lied and blamed the Liverpool fans, and it stuck.

 

[Wolfbot]

You do see though…how this could also be said by Liverpool fans? There are countless big decisions I could point to over the years that have impacted us at pivotal moments in title races that were decided by a point. Both in our games and rival games. I, personally, try and do my best to avoid this because the amount of headspace it takes up is insane. It’s just not a sport you can enjoy that way. I still think we have a horrendous set of refs and we should import them all from abroad. However, I know full well that won’t change the discourse and sentiment towards refereeing. Every single team thinks refs are biased against them. This thread has literally been created because a ref was caught slagging off Liverpool and comfortably hanging around with people who hate scousers, of which there is an undercurrent of in England. Yet somehow, it’s Liverpool who benefit from decisions!?

There's no point in trying to point to poor decisions costing points, even in a title race. Obviously we don't want to see referees making mistakes, or players cheating, but it will always happen. For every time Liverpool were 'wronged' and dropped points or a title rival gained them, there will have been another game where they got a questionable decision their way and gained points.

Supporters might admit they were fortunate to win after the game, but they refuse to hold onto those moments the way they do with the errors that cost them.

You're right to give it no headspace, it's part of the game that affects every team equally (whether that be equally in a single game or over the course of a season).

 

[LochGormanAbú]

This thread really hit some Scouse nerves.

It's actually hilarious how anyone could take it serious

 

[Raven]

We have VAR now as well

That too but I was making the point, poorly, that people gave a shit about us because we were winning everything. Liverpool haven't won much so the fact that everyone is noticing it with them is even more strange.

 

[RobinLFC]

That too but I was making the point, poorly, that people gave a shit about us because we were winning everything. Liverpool haven't won much so the fact that everyone is noticing it with them is even more strange.

But not everyone is "noticing it with Liverpool" at all, that's the entire point. It's basically only the borderline lunatics on here when it concerns anything mildly Liverpool-related who go on and on about us being lucky, getting favorable treatment, all that stuff.

I can't comment on other countries but I don't even think there has been as much as one talking point about an important, blatantly wrong decision which gained Liverpool points in the Belgian media or Premier League related podcasts. People talking about referee conspiracies or getting favorable referee/VAR treatment, after we literally had a perfectly good goal ruled out last season and a PL referee was just caught on video about how he hates Liverpool, is just mind blowingly stupid.

Likewise with United back in the 90s and 00s. You won a lot because you were the best team around, and if you gained a referee advantage at Old Trafford it's because you earned it over the years, I'd say. Anyone pointing to referee decisions is just coping hard.

 

[Raven]

But not everyone is "noticing it with Liverpool" at all, that's the entire point. It's basically only the borderline lunatics on here when it concerns anything mildly Liverpool-related who go on and on about us being lucky, getting favorable treatment, all that stuff.

I can't comment on other countries but I don't even think there has been as much as one talking point about an important, blatantly wrong decision which gained Liverpool points in the Belgian media or Premier League related podcasts. People talking about referee conspiracies or getting favorable referee/VAR treatment, after we literally had a perfectly good goal ruled out last season and a PL referee was just caught on video about how he hates Liverpool, is just mind blowingly stupid.

Likewise with United back in the 90s and 00s. You won a lot because you were the best team around, and if you gained a referee advantage at Old Trafford it's because you earned it over the years, I'd say. Anyone pointing to referee decisions is just coping hard.

That's not true at all. I've had multiple conversations outside of the internet, at work, I'm the pub, at football to supporters of all the big English clubs and some of the smaller ones and there is a general notion that Klopp was getting preferential treatment from refs, haven't had the same conversations since the bald lad arrived on.

Edit: Obviously there was usually a Liverpool fan in proximity to make some of the points you're making, which is fair. This is why I suggested earlier to compare it to our decisions this year because I'm more than a little skeptical that referees are showing Liverpool preferential treatment.

 

[RobinLFC]

That's not true at all. I've had multiple conversations outside of the internet, at work, I'm the pub, at football to supporters of all the big English clubs and some of the smaller ones and there is a general notion that Klopp was getting preferential treatment from refs, haven't had the same conversations since the bald lad arrived on.

Anecdotal evidence...

And you're having the conversations on here, aren't you? Do you think it would be mentioned on the same level if Liverpool were midtable 10 points off top? It's pure envy and coping from those who can't handle the fact that we're winning games. And it would only get worse if Slot wins something.

Never noticed how Liverpool was only laughed at on here when we were still shit and you were winning things? It wasn't because we were getting less decisions in our favor, it's because no one cares or pays that much attention when you aren't winning things.

Fair enough if you disagree, no worries. But the sentiment on here regarding Liverpool has changed drastically since my lurking days in 2012-2014 (and that's with a season in there when we were this close to winning the league). We were just a laughing stock on here back then, and it has only gotten worse down the road after Klopp arrived because we started winning things.

 

[KirkDuyt]

That's not true at all. I've had multiple conversations outside of the internet, at work, I'm the pub, at football to supporters of all the big English clubs and some of the smaller ones and there is a general notion that Klopp was getting preferential treatment from refs, haven't had the same conversations since the bald lad arrived on.

Edit: Obviously there was usually a Liverpool fan in proximity to make some of the points you're making, which is fair. This is why I suggested earlier to compare it to our decisions this year because I'm more than a little skeptical that referees are showing Liverpool preferential treatment.

Give it time. When we were winning under Slot everyone moaned that we were getting preferrential treatment as well.

Wait, we actually always get it. It's called Kuipvrees (fear of De Kuip, which is the name of our ground).

 

[Klopper76]

That's not true at all. I've had multiple conversations outside of the internet, at work, I'm the pub, at football to supporters of all the big English clubs and some of the smaller ones and there is a general notion that Klopp was getting preferential treatment from refs, haven't had the same conversations since the bald lad arrived on.

There are plenty of examples of us not getting decisions, or referee's making bad calls against us. I'd argue City get a better rub of the green from referee's than we do.

There's also the problem of fan interpretation. Someone like Pexbo will see every debatable decision as "should've gone against Liverpool". That's fine, it's part of being a fan that we have our bias interpretations. But that doesn't mean it's the correct opinion. Gameweek threads during Liverpool games have some saying we should be conceding three penalties and getting multiple red cards every game.

I agree with Robin's point above. If we were having the same decisions and sitting in 9th or 10th, no one would care. This thread wouldn't exist. It's simply because we're top currently. Maybe we'll drop a few points in the coming weeks and this thread will get no traction.

 

[Wolfbot]

It's not a coincidence that it always seems like the top teams in any given period seem to be getting preferential treatment, it's an absolute myth.

There will always be poor decisions made by the refs/linos now and again.

Generally speaking though, the top teams get more penalties because they are on the attack more and have good players on the ball in the box more often. It will feel like the opposition get less because their one potential penalty shout got waved away, the better team probably had a couple as well but nobody cared because they won the game.

That goes for late goals as well, Fergie time wasn't refs adding on time just so they could score. It just appeared that way because the team attacked until the end and it became a self fulfilling prophecy to an extent. The good teams will push on more right to the death and have the quality to score late more often, it's nothing to do with the time being added on to benefit them.

 

[Dave Smith]

The "always the victims, never their fault" talking point comes from the Hillsborough disaster, where the police caused a stampede killing 97 people. The cops lied and blamed the Liverpool fans, and it stuck.

It came from Heysel. They literally had 14 people convicted of manslaughter over it and yet claimed it wasn't there fault/they were the victims of being placed in poor ground.

 

[Red in STL]

It came from Heysel. They literally had 14 people convicted of manslaughter over it and yet claimed it wasn't there fault/they were the victims of being placed in poor ground.

Hillsborough just reinforced it TBH, they've never accepted any notion that they shared any responsibility in what happened, they were blameless in their opinion and that's not really true.

I was in the Stretford End the day it happened, as the first reports came thru the immediate reaction was 'the scousers causing trouble again', this was before anyone knew people had died, many around me, including myself, had been in the same end a few weeks before when we played Sheffield Wednesday, it was just as packed that day so .....

 

[RedChisel]

Why write all that and then throw in this lazy line. By ‘entire’ you’re saying every fan (of the team you dislike the most) are all unreasonable and unhinged. Sounds a bit much, no?

That is remarkably feeble as a piece of analysis. Genuinely, you can do better than to just lean on boring stuff like this that adds nothing new.

You still here on a United forum acting all shocked and offended that United fans don't love Liverpool? Strange behaviour.

 

[antk]

The "always the victims, never their fault" talking point comes from the Hillsborough disaster, where the police caused a stampede killing 97 people. The cops lied and blamed the Liverpool fans, and it stuck.

Thank you!