Lionel Messi

[BarcaSpurs]

Was Roma the only big game Messi played in last season? Of course it wasn't. Any claims of Messi not being a big game player should be ridiculed.

He dragged them through against chelsea scoring 3 setting up the other in a 4-2 victory whilst chelsea completely dominated both legs and barca could barely string a chance together. Apparently unless he does this game in game out all the way through to them winning the thing then hes bottled the big matches.

If he dragged them through against Roma just for them to be blitzed by Liverpool people would still be saying the exact same things about his season.

 

[adexkola]

He dragged them through against chelsea scoring 3 setting up the other in a 4-2 victory whilst chelsea completely dominated both legs and barca could barely string a chance together. Apparently unless he does this game in game out all the way through to them winning the thing then hes bottled the big matches.

If he dragged them through against Roma just for them to be blitzed by Liverpool people would still be saying the exact same things about his season.

Not to talk of the big games in the league and Copa.

 

[BusbyMalone]

Was Roma the only big game Messi played in last season? Of course it wasn't. Any claims of Messi not being a big game player should be ridiculed.

You can only laugh at the suggestion that he doesn't turn up for big games. Fecking ridiculous thing to say.

 

[Ish]

Was Roma the only big game Messi played in last season? Of course it wasn't. Any claims of Messi not being a big game player should be ridiculed.

Anyone who says or thinks this, is an idiot in my book and clearly either has an agenda or has basically never watched Messi play. It’d be the same if anyone said or thought the same of Ronaldo.

Can’t believe the level of garbage people spew to prove a point

Is it really so difficult to praise one without bringing the other into the discussion with nonsense claims and bias.

 

[Scarecrow]

He certainly showed up in the two finals against us, the (genius) cnut.

 

[Ishdalar]

You can have all that knowledge behind you but in that moment on the pitch when everything is going to shit nothing about the past matters, it's all about the present and players panicking and resorting to hoofball need one person to just say 'slow it down, calm down, start passing' and then lead by example and people will follow. We're mostly sheep at the end of the day looking for a shepherd. I know that through playing football myself and seeing the difference between players panicking and hoofballing to suddenly playing tiki-taka because they're taking a second to think about what they're doing after someone has told them.

Every time the camera focused on Messi during that Roma game it looked like he was doing nothing at all. It's similar to when everyone said Mascherano was the leader during the 2014 World Cup even though Messi got all the plaudits. Sometimes that warrior spirit is needed so that people can feel safe and secure knowing in that moment somebody is standing up proud and not just standing there looking dejected and sheepish. That visual and audible message coming from a leader can be enough to make everyone snap out of the panic and start doing things properly again.

You don't get it and that's fair enough but I've seen the evidence of it. Different times call for different leadership approaches and for many a time all it requires is for Messi to do his usual run past four/five challenges and either score or play an inch perfect pass and boom, goal and that's fine but those times come against easier opponents. When somebody actually puts pressure on you and you're seriously under the cosh, you need someone loud and proud to stand up and take the game by the scruff of the neck and everyone rallies behind them. Annoyingly Steven Gerrard was excellent at that and he's remembered the way he is because of that.

There are many, many occasions in the face of extreme pressure that Messi has wilted. Sometimes I agree that there isn't much he can do if his team mates have just lost it or they're not good enough but he so often looks like he can't be arsed in those moments and they leave a lasting impression just as much as his incredible goals, assists and dribbles do. Much like Ronaldo having a hissy fit is part and parcel of him when things go wrong, Messi turns into a shy little child.

Nobody is perfect and that is Messi's big flaw in amongst all of his amazing attributes.

Well, if you're prone to ignore that he's done all that throughout his career then sure, he lacks that.



But if you're actually fair to him, he's done it in a lot of games vs Real Madrid, Arsenal, Chelsea, Milan, Bayern, Atletico, Manchester or even finals vs 2nd fiddle teams (Sevilla or Athletic) when they tried to wipe him out of the game with fouls or Barcelona were inoperant. Nevermind the bunch of players that have tried to do the same on a weekly basis in la liga, which often end up ridiculised (special props to Espanyol here).

You're basically criticising him for not grabbing the bull by the horns in the Roma game here, no player has stepped into the pitch on every important match of his career and delivered a top performance of football and leadership, if you watch the game again (because I did, 3 times in the same week, and recorded clips that sadly I lost) you can see Messi dropping deep (as deep as to defend with the Right Back in two occassions) and try to start plays from a "5" position, things he couldn't do because our midfield sucks, we lacked mobility and he had a bunch of Roma player on him.

If you think that our players would feel more confident in watching a guy that carries a hierarchy every time he steps onto the pitch with him, a halo of him being untouchable for his teammates, losing his cool and start yelling like he's Roy Keane then that's your opinion, if I have the best player in the world in my team, he's famous for not losing his cool and suddenly I see him rattled, chances are I might become even more anxious.

 

[MalcolmTucker]

We're talking about a player with the most El Clasico goals of all time.

We're talking about a player that dribbled through half of the Real Madrid team to score in a CL semi-final.

We're talking about a player that dominated the best Man Utd defence I've ever seen regularly in CL finals and semi-finals.

A player that dribbled from the half-way line in a CDR final.

He and Barcelona haven't pulled up trees in the Champions League KO rounds for the last few years but that doesn't negate his performances in the CL prior to that, which surpass any other player's performances that I can remember

 

[BusbyMalone]

I remember watching this goal live on tv and just pissing myself laughing.

 

[Cal?]

There was already plenty of Messi threads, hence my question, but since everyone is posting here, I’m replying here.

Is that so difficult to understand?

 

[zing]

Was Roma the only big game Messi played in last season? Of course it wasn't. Any claims of Messi not being a big game player should be ridiculed.

It's the stupidest thing I've read on here by far.

 

[Scarecrow]

There was already plenty of Messi threads, hence my question, but since everyone is posting here, I’m replying here.

Is that so difficult to understand?

There is one about his contract and the last post is from almost a year ago. The rest are rubbish.

 

[Cal?]

Must be a luxury for Ronaldo to not show up at all in the semi finals and final of CL and have competent teammates who can finish the job. If Messi played as poorly as Ronaldo did in any round Barca never advances

Somehow that argument didn’t matter when Messi had the better team mates, would he even have made the CL final if it wasn’t for the incompetence of Ovebro + a moment of genius by Iniesta?

 

[Cal?]

At the end of the day, he's just one player and there's other 21 in the pitch.

What is he supposed to do when Roma bait Barcelona into playing hoofball, put 3 players covering him and suddenly Valverde's plan to counter that is to replicate the hoofball?. Game turned to a duel of Dzeko and Schick vs Pique and Umtiti in one side, and Suarez vs Fazio, Manolas and Juan Jesus on the other while Messi had 2 to 3 players covering him and the rest of our team did nothing, he's the best for a certain set of skills, but going Tony Pulis isn't one of them, and Roma aren't the first ones to lead us into a game of aerial duels to neuter what Messi can do with a ball in the ground.

The fact that someone can blame Leo for what happened that game, when the manager had every resource in the bench to turn the game around will baffle me everytime.

Put away the sitter he missed?

The fact some people think Messi doesn’t share the blame of the capitulation to Roma still baffles me.

 

[Ishdalar]

Put away the sitter he missed?

The fact some people think Messi doesn’t share the blame of the capitulation to Roma still baffles me.

A sitter (I laugh at calling that sitter) he himself fabricated out of nowhere, it's not like Maradona dribbled 6 defenders and put Messi a pass in front of the goal, only for him to miss it Abreu style.

But yeah, knowing you, that single half a chance he had to earn will be enough for you to bash him for the next decade as a culprit of how Barcelona lost a leg vs Roma.

 

[MalcolmTucker]

Somehow that argument didn’t matter when Messi had the better team mates, would he even have made the CL final if it wasn’t for the incompetence of Ovebro + a moment of genius by Iniesta?

Except Messi played far better in that game than Ronaldo played semi-final and final games last season. Both have had good luck, both have been in amazing teams, but if you actually judge their individual performances over their careers then Messi will always come out on top.

 

[Cal?]

A sitter (I laugh at calling that sitter) he himself fabricated out of nowhere, it's not like Maradona dribbled 6 defenders and put Messi a pass in front of the goal, only for him to miss it Abreu style.

But yeah, knowing you, that single half a chance he had to earn will be enough for you to bash him for the next decade as a culprit of how Barcelona lost a leg vs Roma.

He fabricated that chance? A couple of lucky bounces and a fluffed shot?

The fact is he was nowhere to be seen the whole game

 

[Cal?]

Except Messi played far better in that game than Ronaldo played semi-final and final games last season. Both have had good luck, both have been in amazing teams, but if you actually judge their individual performances over their careers then Messi will always come out on top.

He played better in that game where Chelsea should have won 4 or 5-1? Some performance...

Some people drool over Messi’s performances regardless of what happened in the game. If his team lost, somehow it’s always the team mates letting him down?

 

[SteveW]

Except Messi played far better in that game than Ronaldo played semi-final and final games last season. Both have had good luck, both have been in amazing teams, but if you actually judge their individual performances over their careers then Messi will always come out on top.

This really. I get that many people really like Ronaldo but I don't get how they can really be seen as comparable. They score a similar amount but Messi plays a much bigger part in the rest of a game. He's much more complete and rounded. Real winning the CL each year doesn't change that.

 

[Fergietime@99]

When was the last time Messi lost a game in la liga or Copa del Rey?

 

[Scarecrow]

Christ, you wankers are hopeless.

 

[Daysleeper]

When was the last time Messi lost a game in la liga or Copa del Rey?

Shhh only CL matters, remember?

 

[Ishdalar]

Somehow that argument didn’t matter when Messi had the better team mates, would he even have made the CL final if it wasn’t for the incompetence of Ovebro + a moment of genius by Iniesta?

In a career of 675 games and 570 goals you're still pining over a single game that happened 10 years ago, I'm starting to believe you're Michael Ballack.

 

[Daysleeper]

In a career of 675 games and 570 goals you're still pining over a single game that happened 10 years ago, I'm starting to believe you're Michael Ballack.

On top of which how many offside goals did Madrid get away with themselves in CL? Atletico and Bayern have a lot to be sore about

 

[Cal?]

In a career of 675 games and 570 goals you're still pining over a single game that happened 10 years ago, I'm starting to believe you're Michael Ballack.

The one very very unfair game that changed everything, United would likely have been the first team to retain the CL.

Barca not only do not win 6 trophies that season, they don't even win the biggest one.

 

[Daysleeper]

The one very very unfair game that changed everything, United would likely have been the first team to retain the CL.

Barca not only do not win 6 trophies that season, they don't even win the biggest one.

And if Ramos’s offside goal in the 2016 final against Atletico doesn’t count or Robaldo’s Offside goals again Bayern then there is no three peat for Madrid and they go trophyless

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Pretty obvious really by looking at the rest of the top teams in european football. Don't even think anyone gets close.

Might start a thread on it if people disagree though. Who would you say has a better squad than Barcelona?

Real Madrid have a better squad than Barcelona.

 

[VBI]

Messi set up Iniesta in that Chelsea game to score, btw.

 

[Daysleeper]

Real Madrid have a better squad than Barcelona.

100%

And many clubs have far better managers too

 

[Fortitude]

Why does every Messi thread have to devolve into the same, tired nonsense?

Can there never be a thread for him that just talks about his current form and performance?

 

[BusbyMalone]

 

[Zehner]

Why does every Messi thread have to devolve into the same, tired nonsense?

Can there never be a thread for him that just talks about his current form and performance?

I blame it on the Ronaldo bias in this forum. You only have to look at the top posters of these threads. Or how long it took for this thread to be brought up again although Messi started brillantly in the season in a relatively stark contrast to the Portuguese. It is only natural that you have many Cristiano supporters in here and it irks them if people prefer his biggest perceived rival. That alone is not bad thing at all but this constant downplaying of Messi to make CR7 look better annoys me. Guess that's just human nature.

 

[Fortitude]

I blame it on the Ronaldo bias in this forum. You only have to look at the top posters of these threads. Or how long it took for this thread to be brought up again although Messi started brillantly in the season in a relatively stark contrast to the Portuguese. It is only natural that you have many Cristiano supporters in here and it irks them if people prefer his biggest perceived rival. That alone is not bad thing at all but this constant downplaying of Messi to make CR7 look better annoys me. Guess that's just human nature.

A Messi thread should be made that literally prevents keywords being used and flags repeat-spammers for thread-banning, so that the repetitive dross is at least kept out of one Messi thread.

Was enjoying this one before became as generic as literally all the others.

 

[Gio]

I am (unfortunately) old enough to have seen Maradona, and he was quite honestly nowhere near Messi. He was more a mercurial player, who would produce moments of absolute brilliance. He was more like Ronaldinho than Messi.

The reasons he is compared to Messi are that he was the best player (for a much shorter period of time) in his day, he is also Argentinian, and he had a similar stature to Messi. He doesn't physically resemble Ronaldinho, so it's not such an obvious comparison, but in fact his style of play was much more like the Brazilian than Messi.

You would never see Maradona do what Messi did yesterday, and drop right back into midfield to link the play. Although he had exceptional technical ability, he wasn't really a player to make Xavi-like slide-rule passes in the final third, just as Ronaldinho wasn't. He was an attacker, he didn't combine the qualities of a midfielder and a forward as Messi does.

You really need to watch some more of Maradona.

 

[Lay]

Would love to see a Messi thread that doesn’t have the same tired old debate

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

And if Ramos’s offside goal in the 2016 final against Atletico doesn’t count or Robaldo’s Offside goals again Bayern then there is no three peat for Madrid and they go trophyless

Bingo.

 

[KirkDuyt]

This Messi guy is pretty good honestly. If he keeps this up he might become the new Frenkie de Jong.

 

[Schneckerl]

You would never see Maradona do what Messi did yesterday, and drop right back into midfield to link the play. Although he had exceptional technical ability, he wasn't really a player to make Xavi-like slide-rule passes in the final third, just as Ronaldinho wasn't. He was an attacker, he didn't combine the qualities of a midfielder and a forward as Messi does.

Maradona played as a midfielder until 1979, when he was moved to a forwards role.

 

[Daysleeper]

Bingo.

Cheers

 

[RooneyLegend]

You really need to watch some more of Maradona.

True, can't imagine Maradona being nowhere near another footballer especially citing all pitch presence as the reason. Something that he specifically was king at.

 

[totaalvoetbal]

The level of consistency he has in his game is frightening. He is on a podium by himself. Some players are close to him in dribbling, some players are close to him in passing, some players are as good at him at finishing, but no other combines all attributes with such ruthless effeciency.