Lionel Messi

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It's all a bit complicated. What I don't understand is, If Messi doesn't have any demands on wages and doesn't put any pressure on the club, then what are they arguing about?

It's a bit strange to go on a tangent and trashing your most valuable asset all by yourself?
 
It's all a bit complicated. What I don't understand is, If Messi doesn't have any demands on wages and doesn't put any pressure on the club, then what are they arguing about?

It's a bit strange to go on a tangent and trashing your most valuable asset all by yourself?

Probably it was just the media trying to force somebody to answer a question about something hypothetical once again, hoping for a headline to sell some papers, and in case they also have some hidden agenda, then hoping for something they can twist to help them out.. It's clear that Messi didn't ask for a contract extension, and if he was going the Rooney/Ronaldo way, then at least he would have shown signs of wanting to leave/being unhappy with the club, when in fact he made it clear repeatedly that he's happy in Barcelona and wants to spend the rest of his career there.

It's becoming clear that some of the media are trying to unsettle Messi for several months now.. It began with those stupid stories about him making his teammates cry, and then it escalated to some ridiculous levels by trying to suggest that Messi and Barcelona are now involved in some criminal activities (drug dealers in Columbia!)..

Having said that, Barcelona does seem to be having a few bumps here and there under Rosell, which they didn't appear to have when Laporta was in charge.

Anyway, it's a test for Messi's and Barcelona's mental strength.. Let's see how they react and fare when the real pressure is on, come the business end of the season.
 
It's all a bit complicated. What I don't understand is, If Messi doesn't have any demands on wages and doesn't put any pressure on the club, then what are they arguing about?

It's a bit strange to go on a tangent and trashing your most valuable asset all by yourself?

Some believe the writing has been on the wall since Rosell announced himself as a candidate. Even if you go back to an old documentary of when Rosell was under Laporta after the Ronaldinho signing, it revealed two things. One, that eventhough he was a big reason why Ronaldinho was successfully signed, he was also one of the first within the club to call for his sale - even before Ronnie started to implode. Two, he pushed for Rijkaard's sacking early in his first season, prematurely.

There's a sense that he's very corporate and not having been a player at the club or a footballer really, he is all about the bottom line rather than the football. You could argue that Laporta was a bit too much of the other extreme, he was all about the football and not enough about the bottom line. Would've been a great marriage had they worked out together but two egos like that with diametrically opposite directives were always going to clash I guess.

jojojo tried to paint a picture with some tabloidesque stories that Messi & his reps were angling for a pay raise, even flirting with other clubs. This has never been substantiated. However, when RM made media waves with the big raise CR got, the invariable question then became, how can you not increase the wages on the world's best player when he's making less than CR?

I have nothing to go on regarding him or his reps pushing for a pay increase in light of CR's renewal terms but would I be opposed to it? In principle, I am against it but I also think there are exceptional circumstances to consider as well. Messi is arguably the greatest player or athlete in any sport of all time. How hard would you work to keep a player like that happy and at your club? Moreover, a player who handles himself like a modest, hard working member of the group rather than a prima donna? Considering all the implosions in football, the one time I think you alter your guidelines is in this sort of specific situation. Unless his demands are unreasonable, which they've never been, then you keep the best player the best paid

As for why would Rosell then say in the press what I just did (Make the best the highest paid) yet let his VP trash Messi while today another loyalist does the same in response to Leo's response to all of this? Maybe that's why he's going on his 4th Communications Director in his short spell as President. But maybe he's also trying to play this out in the press as he did with Valdes, Iniesta, Pep et al and attempt to provoke Messi. Messi, on the other hand, maybe he's indirectly pressuring for a pay hike but not singling anyone from the club out - until he was directly implicated. On top of which, the latest anti-Messi campaign being played in the public may not have been defended vigorously enough by Rosell & his board either. Something that Pep & Laporta have complained about publicly before when it comes to Barcelona matters in the media.

It is all complicated but that hasn't been the case in several years...since Pep really. Prior to Pep, this sort of drama was RMesque in it's circus like atmosphere. I figured it was going to cycle back again but it's hard to fathom how they'd let it return after how great things had been. I imagine this sort of nonsense doesn't remotely happen in England.
 
I'd think the answer is somewhere in between your portrayal of Messi and the press reports of Messi (jojojo does report on Spanish press clippings, good or bad about both Messi and Ronaldo, although I'm happy to be corrected)

I just can't comprehend that this sort of problem exists at a club controlled by board selected by fans on a player who's the best in the world. I'm not going to call him the bestest athlete ever, or get drawn on if he's humble. I know zilch about the player.
 
The Neymar issue is potentially messy (sorry) enough that it should go in a different thread. Basically it's believed he's on €9m after tax (€20m net with Spanish tax) - which puts him at approx the right level in the Barca setup, along with players like Iniesta and comfortably behind Messi. However the rumour is strong that he (and his dad's company) was paid €40m in Brazil. That deal is now being investigated in Brazil and Spain, for different reasons.

Like I say though it's a messy enough topic that beyond the basic "it's potentially an issue in the Messi negotiation" it should be in the Neymar thread.


I'll just wait along, seeing how it all unravels!
:popcorngif: :p
 
Looking from the outside, most United fans are inspired by the idea of member owned clubs and have a fantasy about how they work. The reality is that Barcelona and Real Madrid are multi-million businesses with political influence and social kudos that spreads beyond football and they don't just attract fans they attract politicians, megalonomaniacs and people who advance their own interests using the clubs as platforms.

Barcelona have had 5 years of peace and quiet. It corresponds to a period when they've had one of the best teams, based around one of the best groups of homegrown players, ever seen and had a player who has been the best in the world. Whether the peace allowed the success to flourish or vice versa is an interesting question, but probably has no easy answer.

For Barca fans, they've been here before. Again, looking from the outside Rosell has hit the self-destruct button and Messi is collateral damage. I'm sure some Barca fans want to believe that all the negative headlines about Messi are some Madrid inspired campaign, but the tone of the catalan press has changed, from uncritical support to a more hesitant response and I've no doubt that hesitation is from somewhere inside Barca's board - the remarks by Faus and Majo just seem to confirm that.

Are the Madrid press enjoying it? Of course, and if they can add fuel to the fire they will, but there is something wrong between Messi and the club. If it's not a negotiation then it's pure wilful insanity on the board's part. Possible, of course, but a negotiation is easier to underestand and resolve.
 
With Rosell being such a corporate whore, do you think it's possible that he is trying to unstablaize the player so he could cash in now rather than see him potentially decline quite quickly with injuries thanks to the huge volume of games that he has played?
I mean, Barcelona could literally name their price and PSG and Man City would pay it. £300m? £400m? That's got to be tempting for any Club President.
 
With Rosell being such a corporate whore, do you think it's possible that he is trying to unstablaize the player so he could cash in now rather than see him potentially decline quite quickly with injuries thanks to the huge volume of games that he has played?
I mean, Barcelona could literally name their price and PSG and Man City would pay it. £300m? £400m? That's got to be tempting for any Club President.

Messi basically ensures they remain one of the top 2 or 3 teams in Europe for the next 7-8 years. Wouldn't make any sense to sell him IMO.
 
With Rosell being such a corporate whore, do you think it's possible that he is trying to unstablaize the player so he could cash in now rather than see him potentially decline quite quickly with injuries thanks to the huge volume of games that he has played?
I mean, Barcelona could literally name their price and PSG and Man City would pay it. £300m? £400m? That's got to be tempting for any Club President.

The serious conspiracy theorists think Rosell would sell Messi if he could get away with it (in a political not a football sense), they've got a new stadium to pay for and they've got some gaps to fill in the squad. It's believed the clause is €250m and Rosell's accountants would probably add the (improved) wages they don't need to pay onto that. In this scenario Rosell is sending out his minions like Faus and Majo to do his dirty work.

As I said earlier it's almost unimaginable, but only almost. If Brazil win the World Cup and Neymar becomes 2014 Ballon D'Or? And if meanwhile the drip, drip, drip of negative stories about Messi and his family continues? Would Rosell then look at an incoming bid at the release clause in 2015, and tell the press, "there's nothing we can do." Almost unimaginable, but only almost.
 
The serious conspiracy theorists think Rosell would sell Messi if he could get away with it (in a political not a football sense), they've got a new stadium to pay for and they've got some gaps to fill in the squad. It's believed the clause is €250m and Rosell's accountants would probably add the (improved) wages they don't need to pay onto that. In this scenario Rosell is sending out his minions like Faus and Majo to do his dirty work.

As I said earlier it's almost unimaginable, but only almost. If Brazil win the World Cup and Neymar becomes 2014 Ballon D'Or? And if meanwhile the drip, drip, drip of negative stories about Messi and his family continues? Would Rosell then look at an incoming bid at the release clause in 2015, and tell the press, "there's nothing we can do." Almost unimaginable, but only almost.

250m seems ridiculously low for Messi?
 
Football really has gone bonkers :(


If it carries on like this, I would have to say that by the year 2020, there will be players who will be worth at least £600million+. In this case, there will be very few, if any who would be willing to pay for a player who is expensive as a football club. It would be so much easier for those who are rich to try and give money to those smaller clubs who are in deep financial trouble in the lower leagues.
 
Do you think there's a genuine chance he could leave the club? I always thought it would be impossible for Barca to lose Messi.

Its hard to imagine but everything is possible, IMO. You bin club legends like Cruyff & Pep then it follows that even Messi could go. Lest we forget the club had terribly controversial exits for Cruyff, Maradona, Laudrup, Ronaldo,Rivaldo, Figo & Ronaldinho.

We'll see how Rosell deals with this fiasco (yet another) but the mere fact that the normally media shy Leo was so pointed in his attack along with Rosell's minions (thanks jojojo) makes it an explosive situation that requires cooler heads to prevail. Not sure this board is capable of such diplomacy as evidenced by their disastrous track record
 
If it carries on like this, I would have to say that by the year 2020, there will be players who will be worth at least £600million+. In this case, there will be very few, if any who would be willing to pay for a player who is expensive as a football club. It would be so much easier for those who are rich to try and give money to those smaller clubs who are in deep financial trouble in the lower leagues.

The intention of the FFP was to make sure this doesn't happen. It remains to be seen if it will actually work out.
 
The intention of the FFP was to make sure this doesn't happen. It remains to be seen if it will actually work out.

This was supposed to have been implemented ages ago, with Platini being in support of it because of the way Chelsea, Real Madrid or Barcelona were throwing around their money. Once PSG became a powerhouse with all their hundreds of millions, Platini has become very quiet. If it hadn't been for the arabs and PSG, FFP would have been in place a couple of seasons ago.
 
This was supposed to have been implemented ages ago, with Platini being in support of it because of the way Chelsea, Real Madrid or Barcelona were throwing around their money. Once PSG became a powerhouse with all their hundreds of millions, Platini has become very quiet. If it hadn't been for the arabs and PSG, FFP would have been in place a couple of seasons ago.

It's in effect now but being brought in gradually to give clubs a chance to fall in line. I think it's in 2 years that the books must be balanced or they face bans. Probably fines though and it'll just be used as a way of a UEFA tax. They were probably all pissed at UEFA that none of them were getting their cut of the coin.
 
If it carries on like this, I would have to say that by the year 2020, there will be players who will be worth at least £600million+. In this case, there will be very few, if any who would be willing to pay for a player who is expensive as a football club. It would be so much easier for those who are rich to try and give money to those smaller clubs who are in deep financial trouble in the lower leagues.
Yeah FFS. The growth rate of football is surely not sustainable.

There are some smaller countries who could well do with that amount of cash
 
Well, the moment we paid £30 million to Leeds for Rio Ferdinand was for me, the turning point in the Premier league, and that was back in 2002.
Yeah, we're no angels in the matter, though were yet to break the £30,75 mark, almost a decade later, whilst "average to good" players are now going for those amounts.

This is another debate were threading here but we've always spent within our means. & that was sustainable. At the rate things are going in football, it clearly isn't.
 
Yeah, we're no angels in the matter, though were yet to break the £30,75 mark, almost a decade later, whilst "average to good" players are now going for those amounts.

This is another debate were threading here but we've always spent within our means. & that was sustainable. At the rate things are going in football, it clearly isn't.


I think it is with reference to the English players in the Premier league. I can remember the thread about Carroll being sold for £45 million to Liverpool. At that time we were all scratching our heads. When we think about it, 8 or 9 years later and isn't that much of a jump in all fairness. If it had carried on ever since 2002 in the same vain then, we could have seen English players being sold for double that already.
 
But I believe we set the precedent for spending big well before other teams. £30million in 2002 was ridiculous. £28 million for Veron was ridiculous to be honest and it equates to an even bigger flop than Andy Carroll to be honest.


28m for Veron was as per norm in the transfer market at that time. It had inflated beyond belief. 54m for Zidane, 34m for Crespo, Buffon 30m, Figo for 35+, Medieata 30m.

Veron's form in Serie A even warranted that much amount, he was touted as next to Zidane in world football at that point. It's just that he did not fit in our system, just like Berba.

Caroll is out and out bad player. I said it at the time, that Pool are paying 35m for potentially Championship level player. He has done zilch to prove me wrong.
 
Nah , read me edit above


I have read it and to be honest, he didn't fit in any system, whether it was ours or Chelsea's. He was out of his depth in the Premier league and he felt uncomfortable. His total value was £43 million in his time in England and to be honest, it was too much. As for the Zidane comparisons...:lol: I don't know who was comparing him to Zidane, but they clearly got it wrong since they are chalk and cheese and Zidane was a superior footballer.
 
I have read it and to be honest, he didn't fit in any system, whether it was ours or Chelsea's. He was out of his depth in the Premier league and he felt uncomfortable. His total value was £43 million in his time in England and to be honest, it was too much. As for the Zidane comparisons...:lol: I don't know who was comparing him to Zidane, but they clearly got it wrong since they are chalk and cheese and Zidane was a superior footballer.

Easily said in hindsight, but Veron was a big player at the time.
 
I have read it and to be honest, he didn't fit in any system, whether it was ours or Chelsea's. He was out of his depth in the Premier league and he felt uncomfortable. His total value was £43 million in his time in England and to be honest, it was too much. As for the Zidane comparisons...:lol: I don't know who was comparing him to Zidane, but they clearly got it wrong since they are chalk and cheese and Zidane was a superior footballer.


I am not sure if you were watching football then but Veron was very highly rated at that time. There was no shock that he went for that much. He was very good as well but I think he needed to play in a diamond or midfield three. The role Pirlo gets now would have been perfect for him. But we or anyone else in PL at that time were never going to line up like that.
 
Veron was a World Class midfielder. His style of play was not suited to the BPL. This was the era of Viera, Keane, Speed etc. He came about a decade too early.
 
I think it is with reference to the English players in the Premier league. I can remember the thread about Carroll being sold for £45 million to Liverpool. At that time we were all scratching our heads. When we think about it, 8 or 9 years later and isn't that much of a jump in all fairness. If it had carried on ever since 2002 in the same vain then, we could have seen English players being sold for double that already.
Yeah, agreed. Sorry for the late response. Didn't log on again last night.
 
I thought voters would revolt against W or Obama after the things they did/do but that didn't happen either. I suppose it's a blueprint on how to swindle the masses although Rosell hasn't employed quite as clever propaganda or press secretaries.

Absolutely and not to mention that a certain legend in Pep is no longer at the club, I'm certain, because of this board. Embarrassing from the club but yet nothing ultimately has come of it thus far. He's also trying to push through a much more expensive new construction plan for Camp Nou along with scheduling a ridiculous friendly in Qatar sometime this Spring. Would love to see a revolt against the board but we see how hard it is for people to rise up against the establishment in the UK & US all the time

It's getting worse, now former Presidential candidate and opponent of Laporta, Jordi Majó has come out with a scathing attack on Messi for his comments. It's already getting ugly

Quite ridiculous the current situation, how long is Rosell still in for?

I think football clubs can be different, especially where there are elected people in. From the outside looking in always felt like in Spain when the fans seem to turn against the management their position becomes untenable.
 
I have read it and to be honest, he didn't fit in any system, whether it was ours or Chelsea's. He was out of his depth in the Premier league and he felt uncomfortable. His total value was £43 million in his time in England and to be honest, it was too much. As for the Zidane comparisons...:lol: I don't know who was comparing him to Zidane, but they clearly got it wrong since they are chalk and cheese and Zidane was a superior footballer.
Serie A was as good as if not better than the Premiership at that time so it's not a question of quality. And it was in Serie A that Veron performed so well with Sampdoria, Parma and Lazio, probably doing better than Zidane at the time. He obviously declined physically after his mid-20s and was never the same player (see how good he was in France '98 and how he never really replicated that thereafter for Argentina). England was never going to be as slick a fit as Italy, but £28m was a fair value for one of the very best playmakers in the world at the time.
 
I always believed we should have gone for Nedved rather than Veron. Would have been a better fit for us at the time.
 
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