Lionel Messi

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uae said:
It's the lack of structure and organization. Real were all over the place, and there wasn't anywhere near enough pressure on players in the final third.
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Well, yes... which again would detract from the fact that Messi is pissing on teams left and right... There's a chance that Ronaldo's feats are more impressive, by that line of reasoning.

Not that I'd care to solidify a stance, of course... It's riddled with ifs and buts... but it's well worth considering.
 
Instant Karma said:
Barca will beat Madrid, Messi will score a hat trick against a poor defence and be hailed once again as the greatest since Maradona.

He is a fantastic talent but comparing him to Maradona is spastic. Based on the games against top defences so far, he hasn't even shown that he is good enough to lace Ronaldinho's boots yet, let alone warrant a comparison with one of the best ever footballers.
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:smirk: Close enough
 
I don't really get why they are compared. Their goal scoring feats mask the fact that they are completely different types of players.
 
Count Duckula said:
Messi will beat Ronaldo's forty-goals easily. He only needs something like seven more, and he's got quite a few games left to do it in.
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Barcelona will have to go qualify for the CL league final and Messi will need to score an average of 1 per game (if he needs seven that is). Not to mention that he might be rested a bit if the go to the CL final and if they win the league before it ends.

It's possible though.
 
MUFC07 said:
Barcelona will have to go qualify for the CL league final and Messi will need to score an average of 1 per game (if he needs seven that is). Not to mention that he might be rested a bit if the go to the CL final and if they win the league before it ends.

It's possible though.
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That's basically what he's done so far, so I can easily see it happening.
 
Count Duckula said:
That's basically what he's done so far, so I can easily see it happening.
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Yeah but as I mention if Barça win their next 2 games they will be champions, then they won't play Messi.
Well loads of factors, but still yeah can happen. Not easily though, will take some effort.
 
Mainoldo said:
You talking about the same guy from Lazio? But yeah the team had enough quality players but doesn't make them as good as the Barca team now, which is what he was probably tryin to say?
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Nah, he posted Ronaldo Luiz made a below par Barcelona look good, a comment way off the mark. Messi comparable with Luiz Ronaldo as their star player then, Guardiola better than Kieta, Toure or any of their current holding players. Luis Enrique as good as Xavi probably then, a young Figo and Iniesta were comparable, so were the partly crocked up stars ...Stoickov and Henry also coached by Uncle Bob and Maureen and Eto better than Popescu. De la Pena individually wasn't a great player but he gelled well in their system, complimented Ronaldo brilliantly, setting up loads for Ronaldo.
 
vijay said:
Nah, he posted Ronaldo Luiz made a below par Barcelona look good, a comment way off the mark. Luiz Ronaldo can be compared with Messi as their star player, Guardiola better than Kieta, Toure or any of their current holding players. Luis Enrique as good as Xavi probably then, a young Figo and Iniesta were comparable, so were a partly crocked up stars ...Stoickov and Henry also coached by Uncle Bob and Maureen. De la Pena individually wasn't a great player but he gelled well in their system, complimented Ronaldo brilliantly, setting up loads for Ronaldo.
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Real Madrid won the league that season.
 
Count Duckula said:
Personally I don't think it is unreasonable to say he's on the same level as Fat Ronaldo. Ronaldo Luiz was an absolute monster in his youth - he scored for fun. But by his mid-twenties he wasn't anywhere near as good, despite still being excellent. Messi now is as good as Fat Ronaldo was in his youth, and since he got worse as he got older I don't think it's ridiculous to claim that Messi is as good.

Zidane is totally different, however.
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First and foremost, pre-injury Ronaldo isn't touched by anyone but Pele and Maradona. I don't know if the sands of time have people completely forget how immense he was or what, but his ability and sheer brilliance is downplayed a hell of a lot on here.

Zidane was not on Ronaldo's level either.

You're talking about arguably the best striker who has ever played the game, certainly top 3 with Muller and Eusebio at the very least, with the likes of Van Basten and Romario not far off.

By Ronaldo's mid-twenties he was almost perpetually injured. Why is that a factor in what he was before being hurt? If Messi is unfortunate enough to have major injuries that destroy his acceleration and movement, it wouldn't detract from the player he once was.

At his current level he isn't on Ronaldo of the same ages' level at all.
 
Fortitude said:
First and foremost, pre-injury Ronaldo isn't touched by anyone but Pele and Maradona. I don't know if the sands of time have people completely forget how immense he was or what, but his ability and sheer brilliance is downplayed a hell of a lot on here.

Zidane was not on Ronaldo's level either.

You're talking about arguably the best striker who has ever played the game, certainly top 3 with Muller and Eusebio at the very least, with the likes of Van Basten and Romario not far off.

By Ronaldo's mid-twenties he was almost perpetually injured. Why is that a factor in what he was before being hurt? If Messi is unfortunate enough to have major injuries that destroy his acceleration and movement, it wouldn't detract from the player he once was.

At his current level he isn't on Ronaldo of the same ages' level at all.
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Again, people rating Luiz Ronaldo on "what could have been". The fact is Luiz Ronaldo had one brilliant season that he's perhaps on par with Cristiano 07/08, other than that, he wasn't all that amazing. So he has a great WC record, but he has also won very little at club level.
 
Cal? said:
Again, people rating Luiz Ronaldo on "what could have been". The fact is Luiz Ronaldo had one brilliant season that he's perhaps on par with Cristiano 07/08, other than that, he wasn't all that amazing. So he has a great WC record, but he has also won very little at club level.
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What an utterly stupid post. :eek:
 
Cal? said:
Again, people rating Luiz Ronaldo on "what could have been". The fact is Luiz Ronaldo had one brilliant season that he's perhaps on par with Cristiano 07/08, other than that, he wasn't all that amazing. So he has a great WC record, but he has also won very little at club level.
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How old are you Cal?
 
THe only thing missing for him is the UEFA CL Cal, so much for not winning a lot trophies for clubs ...
The way Ronaldo (9) was scoring his goals for Barca showed he was on an entire level to Cristiano best ever level of football.It's really stupid to compare them both, no matter how much football you've watched in your entire life
 
I don't know why this thread is still on going....

Cal will change whatever things he can to judge a player and make his beloved C.Ronaldo out as being the best, I remember him saying he would be on par with Maradona if he won the European championship with Portugal. Ronaldo has never even had a good tournament with Portugal and he is talking about him almost being on Maradona's level.

I seem to remember him insinuating that a player in his world is judged by what his team has won, also think he was saying if a player has single handily carried a team to a final and had a below par performance in the final he would think the guy who did better in the final would be more deserving of a player award. By his theory there is a rather long list of players better than Maradona as he didn't win a whole lot for the league teams he played for, think around 3 league titles in total and a few cups going from memory.

Cal serious question here but were you watching football back when Ronaldo played for Barca? I think it was you saying you started following around 2003 is that right? I'm not using this to put you down or anything but I'm getting the impression you are comparing the players based on their stats.
 
Havent seen anything of Eusebio or Muller but from 1990-2009 the greatest finisher ever was Romario IMO, Basten comes close, its very debatable on who was better Basten offered a more all round threat in terms of either tracking back or scoring goals out of nothing. Can remember well the Copa Americas '97 and '99 when Luiz Ronaldo had stronger legs, but still defenders handled his pace well, and also he missed chances like any other striker. Had he remained ijury free over a period of time he would've been rated on par with Pele or Maradona but it never happenned.

Ronaldo even at his best was not always unplayable in his every other match, nor hard to control for 90 minutes he had his fair share of poor matches and missed chances; Fortitude comments about Luiz Ronaldo are clearly deluded every where in this thread, made more out of the legendary small time jargon - the greatest.
 
Cal? said:
Again, people rating Luiz Ronaldo on "what could have been". The fact is Luiz Ronaldo had one brilliant season that he's perhaps on par with Cristiano 07/08, other than that, he wasn't all that amazing. So he has a great WC record, but he has also won very little at club level.
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Never seen his first season at Inter then i take it??
 
JazzG said:
I don't know why this thread is still on going....

Cal will change whatever things he can to judge a player and make his beloved C.Ronaldo out as being the best, I remember him saying he would be on par with Maradona if he won the European championship with Portugal. Ronaldo has never even had a good tournament with Portugal and he is talking about him almost being on Maradona's level.

I seem to remember him insinuating that a player in his world is judged by what his team has won, also think he was saying if a player has single handily carried a team to a final and had a below par performance in the final he would think the guy who did better in the final would be more deserving of a player award. By his theory there is a rather long list of players better than Maradona as he didn't win a whole lot for the league teams he played for, think around 3 league titles in total and a few cups going from memory.

Cal serious question here but were you watching football back when Ronaldo played for Barca? I think it was you saying you started following around 2003 is that right? I'm not using this to put you down or anything but I'm getting the impression you are comparing the players based on their stats.
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That's why I asked how old he was. I'm fairly sure Cal has not even seen the season's in question, and to say he Ronaldo was great for only one season... no-one of sane mind could say that with a straight face.

vijay said:
Havent seen anything of Eusebio or Muller but from 1990-2009 the greatest finisher ever was Romario IMO, Basten comes close, its very debatable on who was better Basten offered a more all round threat in terms of either tracking back or scoring goals out of nothing. Can remember well the Copa Americas '97 and '99 when Luiz Ronaldo had stronger legs, but still defenders handled his pace well, and also he missed chances like any other striker. Had he remained ijury free over a period of time he would've been rated on par with Pele or Maradona but it didnt happen. Ronaldo at his best was not always unplayable in his every other match, he had his fair share of poor matches and missed chances Fortitude comments about Luiz Ronaldo are clearly deluded, made more out of the legendary small time jargon - the greatest.
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Your biases are horrible and blatant. Very disappointing, tbh.

Whatever bee you have in your bonnet about the player should not hinder objective consideration of him as a player.
 
Cal? said:
Again, people rating Luiz Ronaldo on "what could have been". The fact is Luiz Ronaldo had one brilliant season that he's perhaps on par with Cristiano 07/08, other than that, he wasn't all that amazing. So he has a great WC record, but he has also won very little at club level.
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:lol:

One brilliant season?

How exactly does someone manage 324 club goals in 458 games by only having only one brilliant season? And that's not to mention his 62 goals in 97 games for Brazil.
 
Basically, anyone who saw Ronaldo play at the time will know that he was probably the most talented player to ever play the game. Just not the greatest.

No one could do what Ronaldo was doing at his peak, except Maradona of course.
 
I_live_cement said:
Basically, anyone who saw Ronaldo play at the time will know that he was probably the most talented player to ever play the game. Just not the greatest.

No one could do what Ronaldo was doing at his peak, except Maradona of course.
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feck it!! He was greater than Maradona!!! Yeah i said it... :lol:
 
Fat Ronaldo, before his injury and getting fat, was the second best player I have ever seen, just behind Maradona.
 
Eriku said:
Bollocks... His passing ability wasn't half of Maradona's
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True, interms of running ability and explosiveness Ronaldo pre ‘98 was the greatest I’ve ever seen after Maradona but Maradona was a complete package, either passing or crossing the ball, dribbling in tight spaces or free kicks he was at a different level, and was successful in an era when the football was a full contact sport with the fouls being more crude. But Fortitude and his disciples allege other wise and fluently chuck in claims Ronaldo was up there if not better than Maradona and Pele.

In terms of finishing its really a no brainer that both Romario and Basten were more clinical, as a footballer Ronaldo edges them out but not by a big margin.

After Ronaldo its Messi who is warranted such comparisons and unlike Ronaldo with injuries permitting it remains to be seen whether he would really get rated beyond a certain level.
 
vijay said:
True, interms of running ability and explosiveness Ronaldo pre ‘98 was the greatest I’ve ever seen after Maradona but Maradona was a complete package, either passing or crossing the ball, dribbling in tight spaces or free kicks he was at a different level, and was successful in an era when the football was a full contact sport with the fouls being more crude. But Fortitude and his disciples allege other wise and fluently chuck in claims Ronaldo was up there if not better than Maradona and Pele.

In terms of finishing its really a no brainer that both Romario and Basten were more clinical, as a footballer Ronaldo edges them out but not by a big margin.

After Ronaldo its Messi who is warranted such comparisons and unlike Ronaldo with injuries permitting it remains to be seen whether he would really get rated beyond a certain level.
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So where the hell is Cristiano in all this??
 
vijay said:
In terms of finishing its really a no brainer that both Romario and Basten were more clinical, as a footballer Ronaldo edges them out but not by a big margin.

.
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You'll have to back this up. Because the Ronaldo I recall watching was as clinical as any striker I've seen.
 
vijay said:
True, interms of running ability and explosiveness Ronaldo pre ‘98 was the greatest I’ve ever seen after Maradona but Maradona was a complete package, either passing or crossing the ball, dribbling in tight spaces or free kicks he was at a different level, and was successful in an era when the football was a full contact sport with the fouls being more crude. But Fortitude and his disciples allege other wise and fluently chuck in claims Ronaldo was up there if not better than Maradona and Pele.

In terms of finishing its really a no brainer that both Romario and Basten were more clinical, as a footballer Ronaldo edges them out but not by a big margin.

After Ronaldo its Messi who is warranted such comparisons and unlike Ronaldo with injuries permitting it remains to be seen whether he would really get rated beyond a certain level.
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:wenger:

Give it a rest, ffs.
 
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