Some CR fans were still banging with Ronaldo defeating Messi in an hypothetical final between them.
Lionel Messi | PSG Watch
- Thread starter Samid
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Debate was over in 2011 for anyone with eyes. Messi has always been far better than Ronaldo just like he has always been far better than Pele and Maradona. Ronaldo, Pele and Maradona belong in a conversation together, Messi is so objectively better than them that to mention them in same breath is an insult to vision and intelligence. Forget trophies won, he's the best player ever by a pretty obvious distance.
Don't think it was really a serious debate for the non Ronaldo fanboys but if Ronaldo had somehow fluked this WC, you just know how the narrative would try to be shifted. That's not happening anymore.
Pretty much, Messi has shown he can perform on the world's biggest stage, the World Cup. Ronaldo has not.
The debate should be centered on their primes only.
You mean the same Messi who won the Golden Ball for best player in the 2014 tournament? We can argue for days about who else might have won that award too, but without Messi (and Di Maria) they aren't getting close to that final. This is two exceptional World Cups he's had now. Individually.
Also, you can count on one hand the number of times Messi's personality goes "a bit stupid sometimes". If anything, Messi gets criticism because he keeps his mouth too shut!
Messi is not in his prime and still delivers in a World Cup, no matter how it ends, his international career is better than Ronaldo’s
That debate ended circa 2011
What if he wins it now?
That wouldn't be fair on anybody else. 73 goals in a season. Over 100 in a calendar year. Messi was God like at his peak
goat debate over (or at least ronaldo is excluded)
To me personally it doesnt change who's been the better player. They have both played more than 1000 games. There's enough to make a call. Still want Messi to win though.
The answer is fluke ... It was a fluke.
And Messi wasn't even all about goals. Comparing peaks is not even remotely a contest (although personally I don't see it as one in general). Messi was an absolute alien at his peak. He changed what I thought was possible by a footballer (I didn't follow Maradona or R9s career except the latter's late stage) - he could drop into midfield, playmake, scored an absurd amount of goals, topped all sorts of metrics for key passes, would beat multiple defenders for fun and even worked well off the ball (back then).
I don't believe he'll win the WC. That will he France or England but his performances here dont change this comparison.
Messi: 21 goals and 17 assists in 27 matches for club and country in 22/23 season.
Ronaldo: 4 goals and 3 assists in 23 matches for club and country in 22/23.
Ronaldo won’t sniff the Ballon D’Or for this season and he will never catch Messi’s Ballon D’Or tally.
Ronaldo: 4 goals and 3 assists in 23 matches for club and country in 22/23.
Ronaldo won’t sniff the Ballon D’Or for this season and he will never catch Messi’s Ballon D’Or tally.
That is because Messi is compared with Cristiano, so he will come off as a more humble and saner person. As Cristiano is an absolute man child, while Messi is weird shy type.
It isn't like anyone actually following football, not know that Messi has been dirty at times, he is an Argentine trained with Barcelona, two lords of playacting and dark arts.
It seems like you want Messi to be scrutinized as much as Cristiano, but that will not be the case because Messi isn't an attention seeker like Cristiano. Cristiano at times does escalate things on his own to get more attention, which makes it like his antics are more criticised. But truth is, he does brings the attention to those things himself, so he can come out as victim in the eyes of his 500 million plus fan boys.
His only chance to close Messi's balón d'or gap was if he played well in this world cup and Portugal won the world cup. Instead, he stunk up the place so badly that they relegated him to the bench during the knockout stages.
He isn't going to sniff Messi's balón d'or rally or even finish in the top 10 ever again.
That record is safe. Messi locked it up after the last Copa America.
Yeah that's why they can't get close to his numbers or goalscoring rates in the same competition UCL.
Yet Lewandowski rarely scores goals when it matters, he lacks the clutch ability of the others. He stat pads.
If only the opponent played fairly against Maradona.
I genuinely think that it's his last season at the top level, so enjoy it while you can. If he wins the WC, I'll bet my house that he calls it a day this summer.
He has nothing to prove and won't be playing in Europe at 36-37. If any, Ronaldo's downfall taught him the dangers of overstaying your welcome.
Benzema also was never the primary penalty taker for Madrid until last season. He scored his first ever UCL penalty last season, if you make it non penalty goals Benzema has more. Benzema already has 28 UCL KO stage goals which is 1 more than Lewa anyway, 6 more non penalty goals.
But back on topic. Messi scoring in both knockout games so far surely adds to his resume, as there were definitely question marks regarding this. Would've been weird if both Messi and Ronaldo both failed to score knockout stage goals in the world cup, despite both being in 5 of them.
It will never be, although Messi winning it would give the fanatics who have too much time on their hands a massive argument.
That player of the tournament award was the biggest media farce in the history of the competition. Argentina's defence dragged them to the final while Messi passively pinged the ball around safe in the knowledge that his team-mates would take the wrap for his own failings. This is the first world cup where he has actually embraced the spotlight and genuinely excelled in the knockout games.
Say you didn't watch 2014 world cup games, without saying you didn't watch 2014 world cup.
Exactly, strange opinion.
Goal stats tracking generation. Probably saw "Bonsai, Iran and Nigeria" in group stages, and assumed oh crap group Argentina must have won easily with Messi stats padding.
Switzerland game, oh Di Maria scored the winner, Belgium game Higuian scored the winner, Holland draw and Germany loss, Messi stats padded in group stage against weak opponents and sh*t his pants in KO stages.
That is the thing detractors of Messi always use
All WC 2014 matches in hd. Rewatch some of the matches.
wtfYeah saw the entire tournament mate, praised Messi intensely for his group stage efforts when he took command against lesser opposition and the spotlight wasn't as severe, then saw him wilt and put his head down and miss easy chances in every knockout game. It seems to me that you saw what you wanted to see and created your own narrative rather than what actually happened.This is a tactic that Messi fanboys often use, protecting him at all costs and blaming those around him rather than actually holding him accountable for his own individual play. If I was biased against Messi by the way, I wouldn't now be praising his play and body language and general improved leadership, the fact that you think there is no real difference to this tournament and 2014 proves that you and others here are the ones with the bias.
Look at this
The truth hurts. The problem with Messi fans is that they can't stand to have any of his imperfections brought to the forefront.On every occasion when Argentina or Barcelona have come up short they immediately blame the teammates or the manager rather than holding their god accountable for anything at all. They place him a in a can't lose situation, either he's brilliant as he usually or if he plays sub-par it's the fault of someone else.
If he's passive against Croatia as in fairness he hasn't been in either knockout game so far, Messi fans won't even highlight it, they'll just talk about how some incompetent Argentine striker ruined his chances of lifting the world cup by shooting a ball over the bar or missing a sitter.
Jesus.
I know we blame the newbie system a lot for letting in utter dross here but stop for a moment and think - maybe everyone is just actually really stupid.
No (well, some of us are.)
Just look at the words you use, "biggest farce media", "Messi passively pinged the ball around safe in the knowledge that his team-mates would take the wrap for his own failings".
And than come back, without sounding like a bitter Messi hater, who uses the occassionally "I praise him when I feel like he deserves praise" to make it like you are fair and square, and we are the biased ones
oh Lord
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