Lionel Messi | PSG Watch

Gehrman said:
It's really silly when you have fanboys demanding that either Messi or Cristiano has something to prove at beyond the average retirement age for footballers. Saf and Pep had Messi up there with the greatest after the 2011 CL final. Over 10 years ago. Both of them could have retired at 32 or 33 or even before that with nothing left to prove whatsoever. When they are both in the MLS or something I guess people will still be harping on about their stats there instead.
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The debate will never end, even when both of them retire. Just like Pelé and Maradona, people will run in circles, using any possible argument to prove that their preferred player is better than other. By the way:
Maradona>>> Pelé
Messi >>> C. Ronaldo.

FAct.
 
Chelsea players being asked about Messi or that other guy:

https://

twitter.com/messimx30iiii/status/1584436439743619072?s=46&t=CGZnm0HTH_PBvD96jy16Sg
 
GinobiliTheGOAT said:
Chelsea players being asked about Messi or that other guy:

https://

twitter.com/messimx30iiii/status/1584436439743619072?s=46&t=CGZnm0HTH_PBvD96jy16Sg
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I can remember a video I posted by a guy who compared all their stats and then referenced all the prolific managers, players and pundits on asked who was better. And then when he removed players who had played with or managed either of them it was still around 90% in favour of Messi. But anyway this just goes in circles.
 
Oly Francis said:
Oh, the famous "just yesterday" test. I stand corrected then.
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It is possible to overperform xG (accurate long shots) while still missing chances, and I agree with IFC that Mbappe misses a decent amount of 1v1s.
 
berbatrick said:
It is possible to overperform xG (accurate long shots) while still missing chances, and I agree with IFC that Mbappe misses a decent amount of 1v1s.
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His curled long shots are absolutely ace though, might be the best in the world currently at that.
 
It is amazing how so much ink has been spilled over who is the better player of the two while it is so clear that Ronaldo doesn't even come close to Messi. I bet 50 years from now the consensus will clearly be it is Messi, in fact I think people will look back and think how on earth were they comparable in the first place.

Think of it this way. Back in the 80s there was competition between Maradona, Platini and Zico about who the better player is. We are now almost 50 years later and nobody ever speaks of Zico or Platini anymore. The same will happen with Ronaldo. He will be seen as a great but nobody will mention him in the same breath as Messi, Pele or Maradona.

I'm willing to bet my car on it (I don't have one anyway).
 
berbatrick said:
It is possible to overperform xG (accurate long shots) while still missing chances, and I agree with IFC that Mbappe misses a decent amount of 1v1s.
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All players do. Mbappé did miss a couple of extra 1v1 since the beginning of the season but it's pretty unusual for him, his conversion rate is normally very high.

On top of that, Mbappé's long shot aren't accurate.
 
wangyu said:
It is amazing how so much ink has been spilled over who is the better player of the two while it is so clear that Ronaldo doesn't even come close to Messi. I bet 50 years from now the consensus will clearly be it is Messi, in fact I think people will look back and think how on earth were they comparable in the first place.

Think of it this way. Back in the 80s there was competition between Maradona, Platini and Zico about who the better player is. We are now almost 50 years later and nobody ever speaks of Zico or Platini anymore. The same will happen with Ronaldo. He will be seen as a great but nobody will mention him in the same breath as Messi, Pele or Maradona.

I'm willing to bet my car on it (I don't have one anyway).
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Zico and Platini are still legends, and remembered.

Maradona is just accepted as better.
 
wangyu said:
It is amazing how so much ink has been spilled over who is the better player of the two while it is so clear that Ronaldo doesn't even come close to Messi. I bet 50 years from now the consensus will clearly be it is Messi, in fact I think people will look back and think how on earth were they comparable in the first place.

Think of it this way. Back in the 80s there was competition between Maradona, Platini and Zico about who the better player is. We are now almost 50 years later and nobody ever speaks of Zico or Platini anymore. The same will happen with Ronaldo. He will be seen as a great but nobody will mention him in the same breath as Messi, Pele or Maradona.

I'm willing to bet my car on it (I don't have one anyway).
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People with little football knowledge , maybe. Any other football fan knows who they are and what they did.
 
That_Bloke said:
People with little football knowledge , maybe. Any other football fan knows who they are and what they did.
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You are misunderstanding me. Nobody directly compares them anymore with Maradona like they did in the 80s. Maradona has grown past that, Messi’s status and aura will grow past Ronaldo’s.

Young football fans know maradona and he is most likely one of the very few 80s players they know.
 
Insane form. One of the best players in the world this season.

Obviously better than Ronaldo.
 
wangyu said:
It is amazing how so much ink has been spilled over who is the better player of the two while it is so clear that Ronaldo doesn't even come close to Messi. I bet 50 years from now the consensus will clearly be it is Messi, in fact I think people will look back and think how on earth were they comparable in the first place.

Think of it this way. Back in the 80s there was competition between Maradona, Platini and Zico about who the better player is. We are now almost 50 years later and nobody ever speaks of Zico or Platini anymore. The same will happen with Ronaldo. He will be seen as a great but nobody will mention him in the same breath as Messi, Pele or Maradona.

I'm willing to bet my car on it (I don't have one anyway).
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I don't know, the other 2 are all timers and even then it was clear who the better player was, it wasn't particularly close so not at all similar with the Messi Ronaldo rivalry.
 
GOAT

Starting to hit form at the perfect time. Hopefully he can finally get that WC win and take the #1 spot from Diego once and for all.
 
699 Club goals now. 2 more and he becomes the highest goal scorer in Club football in addition to already being the greatest assister of all time.
 
RedDevilQuebecois said:
Yep, they are about the same as Sheriff for us.

I have yet to see the PSG manager let that axe fall if Messi can't perform well enough in certain nights. Poch did it a few times, but it didn't end well.
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Last season was very very different for Messi.He left Barcelona after spending 22 years? there. In addition, the manner in which he had to leave, no pre season, niggling injuries and frequent international breaks meant that for a player aged 34, it was a difficult debut season. Was way below the level we are used to from him.

Also has been consistently excellent so "the axe" has not had the chance to fall
Red the Bear said:
I don't know, the other 2 are all timers and even then it was clear who the better player was, it wasn't particularly close so not at all similar with the Messi Ronaldo rivalry.
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The difference in all round play between Messi and Ronaldo is huge and always has been.
mu4c_20le said:
Lads, it's Maccabi.
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Jealous aren't we :lol:
 
Messi has always been the greatest ever for me. Never seen a player do what he can do.

Even though I loved Ronaldo, the only reason he was even in conversation with who was the best ever out of the two was just because of the numbers he was putting up. A great goal scorer.

But in terms of footballing ability, Messi was on another planet. Ronaldo did what a lot of other footballers do. Ronaldo just did it consistently. Messi did the extraordinary that others could only dream of. He made the very best look comical.
 
13 more goals. Conceivable that he can do it next season, if Ronaldo hasn't found a CL club by then.
 
Messi will win the world cup and this will put the last doubters to rest. Martinez will get into the team and will come back with a gold medal as well.
Argentina plays like possessed, it is theirs to lose.
 
Red the Bear said:
I don't know, the other 2 are all timers and even then it was clear who the better player was, it wasn't particularly close so not at all similar with the Messi Ronaldo rivalry.
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I’m not so sure about that, it seemed very close to me until 1986. If Zico had won the world cup in 82 maybe the history books would look differently.

Here are some stats for the South American player of the year.

1976 zico 2nd
1977 zico first
1978 both not top 3
1979 both not top 3
1980 zico 2nd, Maradona 1st
1981 zico first, Maradona 2nd
1982 zico first, maradona 3rd
1983 both not top 3
1984 both not top 3
1985 both not top 3 and zico‘s career more or less finished here

So during the time they both had a career zico seemed to be seen as a better player. Statistically he was by far the better player in fact, he scored goals for fun, easily totaling yearly tallies of 30 to 60 goals for a period of 10 years.
Even in the hardest league in the world at the time Serie A he scored 19 goals in his first season, then his career got plagued by injuries. The tally of 19 goals in the serie a was never bettered by Maradona.
Other than stats he was just as Maradona an excellent playmaker and dead ball specialist.
With a bit more luck in 82 and less injuries in Italy the story light have been different.
For me the difference between the two is everything but clear cut.

I can make the same case for Platini who absolutely dominated the European championship of 1984 but for some reason this gets forgotten maybe because Platini didn’t score an outrageous solo goal…He also outscored Maradona in the serie A and was an excellent playmaker.

In retrospect Maradona would have won just 2 ballon d’ors with Platini still having won 3 so also here the difference is definitely not very clear.
 
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wangyu said:
I’m not so sure about that, it seemed very close to me until 1986. If Zico had won the world cup in 82 maybe the history books would look differently.

Here are some stats for the South American player of the year.

1976 zico 2nd
1977 zico first
1978 both not top 3
1979 both not top 3
1980 zico 2nd, Maradona 1st
1981 zico first, Maradona 2nd
1982 zico first, maradona 3rd
1983 both not top 3
1984 both not top 3
1985 both not top 3 and zico‘s career more or less finished here

So during the time they both had a career zico seemed to be seen as a better player. Statistically he was by far the better player in fact, he scored goals for fun, easily totaling yearly tallies of 30 to 60 goals for a period of 10 years.
Even in the hardest league in the world at the time Serie A he scored 19 goals in his first season, then his career got plagued by injuries. The tally of 19 goals in the serie a was never bettered by Maradona.
Other than stats he was just as Maradona an excellent playmaker and dead ball specialist.
With a bit more luck in 82 and less injuries in Italy the story light have been different.
For me the difference between the two is everything but clear cut.

I can make the same case for Platini who absolutely dominated the European championship of 1984 but for some reason this gets forgotten maybe because Platini didn’t score an outrageous solo goal…He also outscored Maradona in the serie A and was an excellent playmaker.

In retrospect Maradona would have won just 2 ballon d’ors with Platini still having won 3 so also here the difference is definitely not very clear.
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Maradona was 15 in 1976. He didn’t even make it to the 1978 WC.
 
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