They're not doing much to prove it wrong.
Let's "Correct The Record"
- Thread starter Americano
- Start date
Finally someone who said what I am trying to say, but clearly for more eloquently than I!
ps. this stands for other movements (Brexit, France, Netherlands, etc too) IMO.
Have you been to where I live in South Carolina?
It took someone who is anti-Trump to say it for you... I think the joke there is obvious.
Just going to throw it out there the 'Facebook posts' from Trump supporters are not exactly the best way to educate yourself on an issue.
Hmm. Glad to see you've finally seen sense on this one.
The problem is, any decent human being wouldn't vote for someone with such vile views. You may not hold them yourself (not you specifically, speaking broadly) but by voting for it, you are legitimising it.
So no, every Trump supporter isn't a racist, bigot or ignorant. But every Trump supporter tolerates it.
People act like its a one way street, but I've heard far more vitriol from the right than anywhere else this past year.
Sort of goes agains this whole idea of a rejection of 'PC outrage culture' when people get so butthurt that others think they've been dumb.
It's so difficult when so few Brexiters are able to say why else they voted for it.
He also tried to embrace bipartisanship and bring people together but assholes like the one now in office just kept saying his birth certificate was fake.
The "backlash" that people talk about when talking about the impact of left leaning politics (and that's US left, which is pretty centrist really) is because quite frankly there are a lot of illinformed bigots who can't stand the fact that gays, women, blacks etc etc are being afforded the same rights as the good old straight white man.
Trump has stood up and lied to people in coal mining regions (for example) saying he's going to bring the industry back and give them back their jobs. He isn't, because they simply don't exist anymore, but that lie is easier to feed than the honest truth that those jobs aren't coming back but that we need to work towards the future and bringing alternatives.
Is America going to be "great again" for those people? Is it feck, it'll get worse and worse.
If Obama had been in a position to push through all the things he wanted to America would be in a much much better place, but 1/3 of the population would still go on about the "good old days", by which they mean when the women stayed at home, minorities knew their place and gays only existed in Europe.
I'm sure Paz will be along shortly to either accuse me of unfairly labeling people or pointing to something Hillary did that wasn't great. Whataboutism and denial being the only available retorts.
Someone had asked earlier in the thread what people meant by "make America great again" and "I want my country back"... This is what many of them are talking about. Spot on.
That was my bar too, to be honest, and will be every day. Ridiculous I know, but if this guy gets riled like that about numbers at his inauguration, I think he's capable of flying right off the handle in an actually meaningful situation.
I think part of the issue is that racism doesn't really affect white people. They hear him say something terrible and because it doesn't really affect their lives, they're a lot more able to look past it to other aspects that they are concerned with.
Oh yeah it definitely exists on both sides. People love to portray Trump voters as idiots and Hilary voters as soft, liberal snowflakes who'd have us dancing hand in hand with ISIS. The reality is real people are way more complex.
I think there's a lot of ignorance, but also a lot of genuine people concerned for the welfare of Britain. When the referendum was near last June, I originally did not intend to vote. I didn't know enough about the case on either side, but the people i spoke to made it clear to me that they clearly didn't either. They were voting leave for narrow reasons such as it would make sense for their particular business, or as you say for immigration. They were so concerned with just one tiny aspect that affects them, that they didn't see the big picture.
As I said above, the one thing that tracks for people is what affects them. My business would benefit, or i want to see us regain control from Brussels. Xenophobia is another aspect of that, but not the only one.
At least CNN seems to have grown a pair
http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/21/media/sean-spicer-press-secretary-statement/
White House press secretary attacks media for accurately reporting inauguration crowds
http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/21/media/sean-spicer-press-secretary-statement/
White House press secretary attacks media for accurately reporting inauguration crowds
Glad someone else noticed the hypocrisy of the 'right'. Apparently only 'leftists' (whatever the hell they are these days) are intolerant.
But that makes it worse doesn't it? They're able to tolerate racism et all as long as it's not directed towards them.
Therefore I have no qualms about associating them with the actual racists either, from my perspective both groups aren't too dissimilar.
My business would benefit or at least my competitors would financially and that is what worries me, the roll back of hard fought for workers rights, legislation and health and safety and yet if I asked the people in my company who voted for Brexit it would be the staff and not the directors!
They don't see it as racism though, I think a lot of it is either subconscious or they just put it aside in favour of something more important to them. It's like when I asked leave voters what they thought about the racist accusations from others. "Well, obviously I'm not in favour of that, but..." was usually the reply. Very rarely will you get someone who so clearly and deliberately engages with racism.
To them, putting up a wall makes economic sense. They've not been victims of racism, or been a poor Mexican immigrant hoping desperately to get to America and scratch a living, so why would they concern themselves with that?* As I said, to them all that matters is making America a better place for them. It's probably something more along the lines of patriotism in their eyes.
*If they had any more empathy than none at all, yes. But there's a lot of people who probably feel that 8 years of Obama didn't do enough for them, and so feel justified in being selfish.
Yeah and that probably stems from not enough reading about the subject, as I touched on. In my opinion it should never have been a vote, but that's another issue.
The problem is, that reasoning only reinforces one of two possibilities.
1 - they aren't informed about racism enough, therefore they literally cannot identify racism until someone calls someone else the N-word or whatever - that means they're ignorant.
2 - they are aware, and they simply don't care. Therefore, the difference between them being racist, and them being accepting of racism isn't too dissimilar.
The reason I say this is because you can't disassociate Trump's rhetoric from racism. From the stereotyping, to the name calling, to the flat out lies. It goes hand in hand, and if the voter can't see this, its because they either agree, or they don't care.
edit
Not many people are going to openly admit to being racist, but actions speak louder than words. And like I said - voting for Trump is an acceptance of racism, sexism et al
Yeah I agree with you. We're definitely on the same page, but my more general point was that the way to communicate with these people is not to shit all over them. If someone from the leave camp started calling me a 'refugee fellating leftie coward' and spoke to me in a condescending tone, there's no way I'd listen to another word out of his mouth.
He really did make an enemy of them over a week ago when he had that little spat with Jim Acosta, whose twitter timeline has been dedicated to exposing all of their bullshit since then. I don't know if that's consistent with the tone they had prior to that moment. If Trump and co. are going to make them out to be the 'lying media' and their dogs predictably lap it up, they might as well gain some credibility with stories like this.
Yeah I agree with that, unfortunately both sides play the same game and i'd argue that the right started the name-calling, and do it to worse effect "libtard" "snowflake" etc
Calling a racist, a racist is just identifying them.
It's as if Newsroom is becoming real and they've decided to actually hold his feet to the fire there.
They love to dish it out but cannot take it.
While needing everyone to play nice in their safe space.
Like the Conway/Todd interview. She kept saying how they want to have a "good relationship" with the press, but only if the press reports what they want them to report.
Please, don't help them figure out why they crashed and burned. Let them keep praying to their Obama shrine after he cost them power at every level of government. Let them keep taking George Soros money to march for "change", burning stuff, and crying on the internet about non-existent racism. Let Nancy Pelosi keep shaking her fist on television while CNN cheers her on with madeup stories about Trump's gold toothbrush.
The mainstream media and the Democratic establishment, which are really one entity, have gone so far into crazyland hating Trump, that they have torched any credibility they might have retained. The backlash has been spectacular and their childish attacks have actually had the opposite effect.
You're exactly what I imagine Trump supporters to be. Make of that what you will.
Your remarks are so far off the charts that I can't begin to correct you without going into several page long essays.
Your remarks are so far off the charts that I can't begin to correct you without going into several page long essays.
Right. Ok. Kellyanne Conway has said today that the press secretary yesterday presented "alternative facts".
Best of luck, Americano.
Remarkable.
I suppose we should get our information from Breitbart and Fox News? Will they provide us the alternative facts we crave?
Ironically this would be a much better description of the margins Obama won by. It must really hurt you to know, deep down, how unpopular your popular movement really is.
Trump voters are the political equivalent of City fans
Ironically this would be a much better description of the margins Obama won by. It must really hurt you to know, deep down, how unpopular your popular movement really is.
You are actually taking the piss with this one, right?
I googled it, and some Americans actually think "soccer" is a communist and socialist sport.
Mind boggled.
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I think our OP friend was hoping that this thread would get censored. I want him to stick around and defend his man going forward.
That seems a particularly odd point to make in this thread given Americano has came in here, shouted loudly, thrown around insults and discussed absolutely nothing. Your post is dripping with irony. Why are peope so obsessed with labels and division? You come in here telling people why they're wrong, and why it amuses you, and somehow you fail to see that the issue you're laughing at "the other side" about is central to your own very point.
Let's start with that one.
- When was the last time America was "great", in your view?
- What is that would make America great (past/present/future)?
- What is it that Trump's going to do to achieve that (and what was Obama not doing)?
Sheesh man, specificity is the sworn enemy of the entire campaign Trump's run.