Who is our back up for Evra if he is injured or needs a rest via rotation?. Is Baines better than that backup. For the size of our club and the number of competitions we compete in we need at least 2 quality players for every position.
Leighton Baines
- Thread starter ::sonny::
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On a general note: If Fabio was a better RB than his brother two years ago (he started, as we all know, in the CL final, nothing less) AND he was considered the greater all-round talent of the two, it's not unreasonable to have some hopes he might turn out a cracking LB for us. Just saying. It's not an outlandish proposition at all in my opinion. The lad has struggled with injuries - worse than his brother. Finally, it's not only natural but perfectly reasonable to use Rafael's progress as an indication. Fabio was considered the greater talent, he has shown plenty for us already (starting in a CL final, to repeat that not insignificant fact yet again)...how often does one twin turn out shite when his brother turns out gold? In short, the "it's just because he's Rafael's brother" argument ain't very convincing, no matter how you look at it.
I only watched Fabio on a few occasions for QPR last season, so I'm no authority on the matter. But he did look good on those occasions, like a player who has a great deal in his locker, just waiting to be unleashed fully. A great prospect, in other words, as he has been ever since he came to us.
I only watched Fabio on a few occasions for QPR last season, so I'm no authority on the matter. But he did look good on those occasions, like a player who has a great deal in his locker, just waiting to be unleashed fully. A great prospect, in other words, as he has been ever since he came to us.
@Chesterlestreet - twins even in the same sport aren't to any degree of being almost equal. Off the top I can think of Horace and Harvey Grant - the former who was excellent on a very good Chicago Bulls team. While Harvey did so-so in his playing days in comparison.
But, when it comes to the Da Silva twins - there was a time even with us there wasn't much to give or take between the 2. So I do think Fabio has a very good shot at becoming a standout player for us but, the loss of development due to the injuries is going to make it a bit more difficult but, not incredibly just because the raw talent is quite a lot and that can still be nurtured.
Anyhoo -if Baines does come, I really hope Moyes has a plan to fit Fabio in.
But, when it comes to the Da Silva twins - there was a time even with us there wasn't much to give or take between the 2. So I do think Fabio has a very good shot at becoming a standout player for us but, the loss of development due to the injuries is going to make it a bit more difficult but, not incredibly just because the raw talent is quite a lot and that can still be nurtured.
Anyhoo -if Baines does come, I really hope Moyes has a plan to fit Fabio in.
I don't believe seriously argues that if one twin is a great fullback the other twin must also be a great fullback. What we all acknolwedge is that both fullbacks were very, very good for their age but that Fabio has struggled with injuries and is a bit behind in his development. Everyone agrees there is potential for greatness in Fabio. It's just a matter of how long do we wait or whether the opportunity to pick up Baines is too tempting to decline.
The right answer may be as easy as forgetting about Baines and letting Evra have one more season and then bring up Fabio season after next. But if Evra wants to go to Monaco now it's pretty hard to quibble with him. He's earned the right to go on his terms. So you do Baines, although I'm not sure about 18m (but it's not my money so I never get hung up on the price tag) but whatever we might pay for him we have a fantastic backup in Fabio, who I'm sure could handle right back duty too if Rafael picks up a problem.
The right answer may be as easy as forgetting about Baines and letting Evra have one more season and then bring up Fabio season after next. But if Evra wants to go to Monaco now it's pretty hard to quibble with him. He's earned the right to go on his terms. So you do Baines, although I'm not sure about 18m (but it's not my money so I never get hung up on the price tag) but whatever we might pay for him we have a fantastic backup in Fabio, who I'm sure could handle right back duty too if Rafael picks up a problem.
For all we know Sir Alex moving on could have made Evra consider moving on. We just dont know but something must be up
I wouldn't think it's the latter. This is the man who allowed David Weir to play for Everton until he was 100 years old.
I don't think there's likely to be a problem with Evra. Put simply Moyes rates Baines, and a lot of managers like to bring in former players to their new club if they think they can step up.
Yep Moyes will sign Baines and Fellaini in his quest to turn Man Utd into Everton.
Wouldn't mind Baines but don't want Fellaini. So that's one.
I think Everton will find it very difficult when United come back with improved offers in the region of £15-16 million. Would be a terrific signing, ticks all the boxes United require from a player. It is only in the last year that I have truly appreciated how fecking good Baines is, but then again he just goes about his business in a very uncomplicated manner. Amazing last season for Everton.
If Evra leaves then we can all bid him a very fond farewell. Make no mistake Baines is a definite upgrade....Buttner has no long term future at the club. He was signed to put pressure on Evra and it obviously failed to work due mainly to the fact that he is complete and utter garbage.
If Evra leaves then we can all bid him a very fond farewell. Make no mistake Baines is a definite upgrade....Buttner has no long term future at the club. He was signed to put pressure on Evra and it obviously failed to work due mainly to the fact that he is complete and utter garbage.
Me neither. Two.
Fellaini should be an option only if we fail in Thiago, Fabregas, Marchisio, Gundogan, McCarthy, Strootman, X, Y and Z.
I don't think Fellaini is really on the agenda at the minute, not with our continued pursuit of Alcantara anyway. And if we were in the hunt for two CMs you would expect the other to be of a more defensive mindset than Fellaini.
I fecking would
I can also say I don't want Fellaini anywhere near United.
Signing the best left back in the league is somehow a negative?
And the only club linked to fellaini is , ironically, arsenal.
Don't worry, Arsenals status as Uniteds feeder club is secure.
If anything goes wrong Pete, we could always go for Arteta too I suppose 
Baines would be a good signing, but keep Fellaini away from United at all costs.
Evra wants to leave for Monaco, so Moyes has gone for Baines to replace him. What's the problem?
It seems like a simple solution. I can also understand Evra for wanting a nice easy end to his career.. his playing time for the last 3 seasons has been remarkable.
No real problem other than it's pretty pricey. We got Evra for £5.5m when he was 24 and had played in a CL final, Chelsea got Cole at a similar age for a similar fee...I know prices have changed since then but this does seem to be a fair bit above the going rate. Very few fullbacks go for over £15m; the ones that do tend to be in their early 20s and despite that tend not to be worth it (Kolarov, Coentrao off the top of my head). A big part of Baines' game is his crossing/striking technique which won't deteriorate but his stamina is certainly another huge asset of his and you can expect that to start deteriorating within a couple of years. I'd say he's doing well if he's playing at a top level for 5 years. In that sense it seems like the kind of relatively expensive stop-gap signing that we very rarely do.
He's probably the best fullback in the league but that's not a huge achievement given his strongest competition is a 33 year old. He's unproven at the top level and generally hasn't looked particularly impressive in an England shirt. He's definitely an improvement on Evra defensively but again that's not saying much. He's not a great defender by any stretch. Essentially we're replacing one of the club's greatest left backs and one of the team's biggest characters with a fullback who has no hope of reaching that level and is renowned for being a bit timid and reserved. Obviously there's nothing wrong with being reserved and over time I'm sure he'd be well-liked for being down to earth but it just means we're losing a big character as well as a big player. Once he starts playing consistently well the complaints over his price and everything else will disappear completely. You get the feeling he could create a bucketload of goals for Chicharito.
He's probably the best fullback in the league but that's not a huge achievement given his strongest competition is a 33 year old. He's unproven at the top level and generally hasn't looked particularly impressive in an England shirt. He's definitely an improvement on Evra defensively but again that's not saying much. He's not a great defender by any stretch. Essentially we're replacing one of the club's greatest left backs and one of the team's biggest characters with a fullback who has no hope of reaching that level and is renowned for being a bit timid and reserved. Obviously there's nothing wrong with being reserved and over time I'm sure he'd be well-liked for being down to earth but it just means we're losing a big character as well as a big player. Once he starts playing consistently well the complaints over his price and everything else will disappear completely. You get the feeling he could create a bucketload of goals for Chicharito.
I agree with you to an extent but you have to remember what we are dealing with... We've just seen him have the best season of his life with an over-exuberant English media and new personal bias. He's going to cost nothing short of £15m even though his worth our original bid.
I have one question after reading all these thoughts about Baines transfer, how come no one brings up Fabio Coentrao?
He's a good LB but Baines is the better of the two.
Because its the Baines thread.
I started a thread about Coentrao a while back, I think most would probably take him but if it was a choice between the two I think I'd go for Baines, proven in the prem and knows our new manager.
I'd take Coentrao because he's three and a half years younger than Baines and it would make more sense, but yeah, Baines is the better of the two right now, hence that's why Moyes wants him, because he wants to win trophies immediately.
We need a LB that can beat players and dribble with attacking intent. Great delivery and set pieces is great but Evra's work down the left over the years has been fantastic. Fabio is a similar player and can replace Evra.
No, I'd rather have a fullback with a dangerous cross than one with great dribbling skills but a poor final ball.
This. Well said.
Am I being incredibly foolish in suggesting that Fabio could follow the same development as Rafael? Rafael would seem to be tailor-made for Moyes' 4-5-1 (which suggests width coming from midfield on paper but in reality, it's driven from the fullbacks). So surely having someone similar at Left Back would be a fecking dream??
Keep Evra, unless he actually wants to leave as suggested recently, and play Fabio as much as possible. He loves attacking and Baines has thrived with Moyes giving him that freedom.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record when we signed them on a professional contract (5 years ago. As far as I can recall, they came into the first team after the Moscow win. I saw them both knocking about around the Luzhniki before the game as fans), Fabio was the better player.
We don't need cross after cross, even if RvP, Rooney and Bale/Ronaldo (yeah, I'm dreaming) are good in the air.
Keep Evra, unless he actually wants to leave as suggested recently, and play Fabio as much as possible. He loves attacking and Baines has thrived with Moyes giving him that freedom.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record when we signed them on a professional contract (5 years ago. As far as I can recall, they came into the first team after the Moscow win. I saw them both knocking about around the Luzhniki before the game as fans), Fabio was the better player.
We don't need cross after cross, even if RvP, Rooney and Bale/Ronaldo (yeah, I'm dreaming) are good in the air.
Well we can hope that Fabio can make the step up but always good to have both competion and an established player there as well. We've got a lot of people who can come in for Rafael at right back in case he's injured, but if Evra does go we'd just had Fabio and Buttner, the former with potential the latter looking like he's a squad player at best.
The good thing about Baines is that he can provide the same attacking output Evra was, he's a better crosser as well and that is important particularly if we want to adapt the system. If Rooney does stay then Kagawa's next spot would be from the left and if we allowed him to drift from there, Baines is exactly the sort of full back you'd want, always pushing up the flank, keeping the width and able to provide a good ball in. He's not just good with picking someone for a header but his general use of the ball in dangerous areas is good. I think going much about 12m is too much given his age and the fact that he has hardly proven himself against the elite but if we can get him for a decent fee and Evra does want to go it would make sense.
Based on what? Curious
Baines can give United four, maybe even five seasons of great football. Very happy about the fact that we're pursuing another solid, English player but freakin hell, people... Pat is one and only. Part of me cannot imagine that we'll just let him go, especially after such a stellar season, he gave us.
Would be more than awesome to have him in the team for one or maybe two seasons. He's still one of our most important players.
Would be more than awesome to have him in the team for one or maybe two seasons. He's still one of our most important players.
A lot is made of Evra's poor final ball... but he does win us a shit load of corners - and we had a good knack of scoring from those last year. I suppose Baines cuts out the middle man a bit, but yeah... there's a point in there somewhere.
If Kagawa does play on the left next season, I can see him striking up a good partnership with Baines.
Evra didn't have a stellar season. He improved somewhat on previous years is what he did. He was awful until Vidic returned from injury.
Improved ? Definitely. I think he was absolutely fantastic, especially with the goals he scored and the few, he produced.
Anyway, deal of Baines is pretty much a matter of time, now. Everton just needs some extra millions to expand their budget and Moyes will propably be happy to make it happen.
I think Evra was very good last season, he was poor the previous two.
I thought he was very good towards the end of the season. Prior to that though a few goals caused everyone to paper over his usual deficiencies and label him as being amazing.