I remember when he returned to competition after his testicular cancer treatment, I thought he was amazing to get right back to the highest level of fitness.
Now I'm wondering if the cancer was caused by the substances and hormones he was taking.
Lance Armstrong to be charged with doping offences - Washington Post
- Thread starter Nick 0208 Ldn
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I remember when he returned to competition after his testicular cancer treatment, I thought he was amazing to get right back to the highest level of fitness.
Now I'm wondering if the cancer was caused by the substances and hormones he was taking.
It's quite incredible, really. Like a whole decade of american cycling wiped out. Rider after rider, all admitting their guilt.
I went on the American ESPN message boards last night. It seems that there are plenty of people who still believe that he is innocent and many others who think that it is OK for him to cheat in the light of widespread doping in cycling.
One of the lesser known but key issues with EPO doping: is that some people react significantly better to it than others. There is no such thing as 'leveling' the playing field by doping.
Armstrong has passed the point of no return in my eyes. He has persisted with his lies beyond the point of redemption.
Doping is one thing. Young competitive men and women can make bad decisions. It is the way in which Armstrong ran the culture and defended it with strong arm tactics that takes this to another level.
I read that this has been ruled out as a possibility. You would know more about the medical profession than me though, can HGH lead to cancer?
Where does this end? He was sold as the American Hero to end all American Heroes after not only his "incredible" "achievements" but also beating cancer twice. Sponsors flooded to have him on their products and he even made an appearance in a couple of movies playing exactly that American Hero.
Will he be sued by them all for fraud?
He could end up with absolutely nothing left, a real warning to would be cheats.
Will he be sued by them all for fraud?
He could end up with absolutely nothing left, a real warning to would be cheats.
He can be sued and he deserves to be sued. Lets not forget that this has been a multi million dollar fraud too. I think that has career earnings were at 17m. This simply would not have happened without Armstrong's incredibly focused team doping program.
I suspect that the main reason for his continued denial is to protect himself from the plethora of lawsuits he would face in light of a guilty verdict.
I suspect that the main reason for his continued denial is to protect himself from the plethora of lawsuits he would face in light of a guilty verdict.
There should be criminal proceedings.
They dropped the criminal proceedings - he has 'friends'. I don't think they'll start them back up.
The criminal investigation was to find out if he had used Federal funds to purchase drugs, with him being part of the the US Postal team. Personally I doubt that LA would have been stupid enough to use team funds for that. The investigation was dropped due to lack of evidence.
Am very curious to see how Nike react to this - as they have invested a huge amount in him and the Live Strong line of products.
But I don't really see how they can continue to maintain their relationship with him in all honesty.
They have severed ties with previous athletes found guilty of doping - eg Marion Jones...but never have they been as intertwined with one as they are with Lance.
The state of professional cycling - it's not breaking news...but there really aren't clean riders, it's like weightlifting
Accordingly to the Daily Mail Nike have backed him again, quote from Nike:
'We are saddened that Lance Armstrong may no longer be able to participate in certain competitions and his titles appear to be impacted.
'Lance has stated his innocence and has been unwavering on this position. Nike plans to continue to support Lance and the Lance Armstrong Foundation, a foundation that Lance created to serve cancer survivors.'
It would be interesting to know what cut Nike get off the 84m $1 Livestrong wristbands that they have sold for his charity.
This is really fecked up, not so much the doping but the facts he was manipulating his team mates some of whom were talented to do bad things for his benefit.
I think it's sad that other people we denied winning the Tour de France now his "wins" have been wiped out !
You realise that of the people who were in line had he not raced/been banned from the races he won, nearly all of them were taking drugs.
You'd need to exclude the almost the top half dozen or so to get to a clean rider in most cases.
Edit: here you go:
Just do them!
Other sports should take note really, cyclings aggressiveness in fighting cheaters has been brilliant in recent years, sure some riders have got heavily punished for minor or even accidental infringement, but the message is sent and is completely clear, you are responsible for what's in your system. The sport is relatively clean now, probably one of more cleaner "roided" sports, because others kinda pussyfoot around it more.
Pretty hysterical that every Tour post Indurain up to Evans last year that none of the 'winners' can be taken seriously. Evans 11, Wiggins 12, and depending on your stance, Contador 09 are the only real winning rides in that time frame.
Pretty hysterical that every Tour post Indurain up to Evans last year that none of the 'winners' can be taken seriously. Evans 11, Wiggins 12, and depending on your stance, Contador 09 are the only real winning rides in that time frame.
I'm not sure I entirely buy that story. I agree that it looks certain that Armstrong was a cheat, but it's easy for everyone to jump on the bandwagon and say I'm a cheat, but I only did it because Lance told me to etc.
11 of his former teammates contributed testimonies towards the case. Surely they can't all be colluding?
that's not what he's saying, it's the whole....
'We only did it because big bad lance forced us to' angle they all seem to be pushing.
Well, I'm just a bit sceptical about he's being painted as a real ogre that was forcing his team mates to cheat, yet it's taken this long for it all to come out in the wash.
I've heard rumours of him being a cheat before, but I can't say I've heard about him basically being a drug pusher. I'm probably wrong though.
You think this is just limited to American cycling?!!!! the whole fecking show is like it and has been since noah was a young bloke. It's foolish to think that everybody was clean up until lance. You will go a long way back to find riders that weren't doped to their eye balls. Difference being testing actually got ramped up in the last 10 years.
feckin hell. long suspected but this is surely the nail in the coffin.
wonder how it'll affect Le Tour and cycling in general? do you think they can move on from this or will the sponsors abandon ship?
wonder how it'll affect Le Tour and cycling in general? do you think they can move on from this or will the sponsors abandon ship?
Haven't most big sponsors already jumped ship?
I haven't watched the tour or any cycling sports during the last 4-5 years or so but I remember a lot of teams pulling out of cycling after the first big wave of doping surfaced.
Can't imagine the current developments have contributed much to them coming back or convinced others to not pull out.
The thing is I fear a bit that doping in sport these days is much more common then we would care to know about.
I haven't watched the tour or any cycling sports during the last 4-5 years or so but I remember a lot of teams pulling out of cycling after the first big wave of doping surfaced.
Can't imagine the current developments have contributed much to them coming back or convinced others to not pull out.
The thing is I fear a bit that doping in sport these days is much more common then we would care to know about.
You know what the difference is between 'Lance' and the rest? He forced his team mates to dope. That's criminal IMO. He basically told his teammates you either dope with me or you're out. He even went out of his way to bully other riders who were willing to take a stance against doping and the cheating.
Doping is one thing, but forcing others to dope with you?! That's as bad as a Jimmy Saville IMO.
From a perspective of a traditional cycling nation like Holland or Belgium, of course it will. The public overhere have known that cycling is full of doping for many a year, and yet the they still come back for more. Professional cycling has only just become popular in the Anglosaxen nations; it's booming.
Hasn't Contador just come back from a two year ban?
EDIT: just Googled it and he was stripped of the TDF title in 2010
Rightly or wrongly, even the latest winners now have their wins tainted IMO. I really hope Wiggins doesn't dope but it's quite hard to rule it out.
Times have been slowing up which suggests they're clean(er).
Yip, apparently the watt output per kilo of body mass has dropped in the top riders over the past few years, suggesting either the performance has simultaneously dropped, or the field is now clean(er).
Not at all. There are obviosly tons of other riders who used drugs. It's just that it's quite unusual to have so many from the same country admit everything at the same time. It's like England's starting 11 all making such admissions in the next few months.
Just finished Tyler Hamilton's book the secret race. Was a great read, amazing how routine the doping was.
I watched all of the Vuelta this year and I reckon that the top 3 riders' performances were suspicious, so I doubt the sport is clean, but I do think it's a lot cleaner than it has been. Thing is, you will still have 'clean' riders using blood transfusions to cope with the demands of the tougher races, and I'm not sure how detectable such practices are.
Got this from our friends on Rawk
I hope Armstrong loses everything, the dirty rotten cheating bastard.
Another blow for Armstrong as another former USPS rider, Matt White, resigns from his current position as GreenEDGE Cycling sports director after being named in the inquiry. He now admits that doping was part of the USPS team 'strategy'.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/oct/13/cycling-drugs-in-sport
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/oct/13/cycling-drugs-in-sport
BBC Sport @BBCSport
Lance Armstrong's lawyer Tim Herman tells 5 live's Sportsweek: 'We don't care whether he did or he didn't [dope], he's moved on."
What an outstanding attitude.
Lance Armstrong's lawyer Tim Herman tells 5 live's Sportsweek: 'We don't care whether he did or he didn't [dope], he's moved on."
What an outstanding attitude.
In context the quote is even more astounding
His lawyer Tim Herman said he would be keen for the 26 witnesses who testified against Armstrong to the Usada to take lie detector tests.
"A lie detector test properly administered, I'm a proponent of that frankly, just personally. I wouldn't challenge the results of a lie detector test with good equipment, properly administered by a qualified technician. That's a pretty simple answer."
Asked if Armstrong would take a lie detector test himself, Herman said: "We might do that, you never know."
He added later: "I don't know if we would or we wouldn't. We might."
Asked what reason there could be for not submitting to a test, Herman added: "Because he's moved on. His name is never going to be clear with anyone beyond what it is today. People are fans, most of the people that I've talked to, this is their opinion, it is: 'We don't care whether he did or he didn't'.
He wants the 26 to do lie detector test but started squirming when asked to commit Lance to one.As far as I understand lie detector tests are completely unreliable anyway.
feck you Armstrong.
He needs to lose everything so that other people get the message. Otherwise the lesson will be you can cheat, make millions, weather a bit of a storm and then keep all the dosh.