Kevin De Bruyne

VorZakone said:
No way Vidal is 2nd tier there. Would always prefer David Silva over Vidal.
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I was maybe always higher on Vidal than most, but he scored goals, was better than Pogba and Marchisio at their absolute peaks in club football, made 4 teams of the year (2 Bundesliga, 2 Serie A), 3 Copa America best teams. Good tackler and defender, could play anywhere in the midfield so extremely easy to build around (they call it portability in basketball).

Silva was a great player, but I'd take Vidal for pure consistency. Though maybe you'd want Vidal in the Champions League or international tournaments and Silva for club football because he controlled games far more, whereas Vidal was better in chaos.
 
I've never doubted him being a great player, I've always found the Caf's hard-on for him fecking bizarre though. He is a tad overrated though, that's an opinion I don't think I'll ever be swayed on.
 
phelans shorts said:
I can’t go along with De Bruyne being fraudulent or average.

A fair weather player however, he definitely is.
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Agreed. He's obviously very good but he's not on the level of Iniesta, Xavi or Modric.

I've also been amazed by some of the stuff he's said. That Belgium team is a joke and I reckon they're glad to be out of it.
 
Tyrion said:
Agreed. He's obviously very good but he's not on the level of Iniesta, Xavi or Modric.

I've also been amazed by some of the stuff he's said. That Belgium team is a joke and I reckon they're glad to be out of it.
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No one has said De Bruyne is on the level of Xavi or Iniesta. Not even Modric is on their level.
 
phelans shorts said:
I can’t go along with De Bruyne being fraudulent or average.

A fair weather player however, he definitely is.
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I don't know what a fair weather player means.

That said, there are posts in the last few pages alluding that De Bruyne isn't all that, and that some magical system is responsible for making him look better at City than he actually is.

I'd love such a system at United.
 
adexkola said:
I don't know what a fair weather player means.

That said, there are posts in the last few pages alluding that De Bruyne isn't all that, and that some magical system is responsible for making him look better at City than he actually is.

I'd love such a system at United.
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Fair weather player just means that he’s not someone that can be relied on when things are going wrong.
 
gibers said:
This thread pretty much summarises my thoughts. People calling this guy the best midfielder in premier league history are jokers. Guy can't dribble, loses simple passes, spams crosses constantly and is a ball loss merchant. Every big moment he flops. City already won the hardest league challenge they faced without him.

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Summarises your throughts? It's full of absolute crap. He was good against Croatia, for example, nowhere near the worst performances in World Cup history. It's hard to take any of that seriously when it makes such a scandalous claim like that.
 
"The worst big game player of all time". Not average, underwhelming, mediocre or even bad. No, "the worst big game player of all time". And people saying such stupidity summarises their thoughts. I despise this world of hot takes we have created.
 
phelans shorts said:
Fair weather player just means that he’s not someone that can be relied on when things are going wrong.
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Ah ok

I think the fact that he plays for (and is an integral part of) a great club team limits the times he is in a situation that things are going wrong. If you have many opportunities to show your reliability when things are going wrong (ala Gerrard) it says more in a negative sense (IMO)
 
He was pretty good when City were 2-0 down on the last day of the season.
 
Do people not remember City looking a bit hopeless after Pep subbed him in the CL Semis at the Bernabeu last season. He was great in both ties and City go through if he stayed on. Also had a memorable great performance and goal vs Brazil in Quarters of WC 2018.

It's overstated how much of a big game underperformer he is. He's actually pretty good in big games but there have been some high profile no shows admittedly.

I still feel Pep should shoulder most of the blame for the 2021 final for starting Gundogan. KDB didn't even have the chance to finish that game.
 
El Jefe said:
Do people not remember City looking a bit hopeless after Pep subbed him in the CL Semis at the Bernabeu last season. He was great in both ties and City go through if he stayed on. Also had a memorable great performance and goal vs Brazil in Quarters of WC 2018.

It's overstated how much of a big game underperformer he is. He's actually pretty good in big games but there have been some high profile no shows admittedly.

I still feel Pep should shoulder most of the blame for the 2021 final for starting Gundogan. KDB didn't even have the chance to finish that game.
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Also he was dropped for the first leg against Spurs in the CL in 2019 when they lost 1-0, then ended up going out on away goals in the second, but it was the first leg that cost him. Pep is a great manager but he's had some terrible calls in the CL, that CL final was a particularly dreadful call.

As for Belgium (De Bruyne has actually created the 5th most chances in the World Cup of any player since 1966), Jonathan Wilson sums it up today in the Observer:

"As Roberto Martínez tearfully announced he would not be staying on as manager, batting away questions from the media that ranged from gently disappointed to nakedly antagonistic, the temptation for an outsider was to wonder just what people expect.

"At the 2018 World Cup, Belgium played superbly to beat Brazil in the quarter-final before losing to the eventual champions, France. At Euro 2020, with Kevin De Bruyne struggling with injury, they lost their quarter-final to the eventual champions, Italy. If that is failure, very few people in any walk of life have ever been anything else. This may have been an extraordinarily gifted generation, but other countries have good players too.

"A team can play appallingly and go deep thanks to good fortune and a kind draw. Or a team can play brilliantly, delight the world, yet be defeated early in a classic against another great side, or be undone by bad luck, or implode. Denmark of 1986, all mullets and attacking vigour, linger in the consciousness as one of the great World Cup sides; the England of 2006, a sad gloop of barely distinguishable games overshadowed by the hedonism of Baden-Baden, do not: yet that England went further in the competition."
 
El Jefe said:
Do people not remember City looking a bit hopeless after Pep subbed him in the CL Semis at the Bernabeu last season. He was great in both ties and City go through if he stayed on. Also had a memorable great performance and goal vs Brazil in Quarters of WC 2018.

It's overstated how much of a big game underperformer he is. He's actually pretty good in big games but there have been some high profile no shows admittedly.

I still feel Pep should shoulder most of the blame for the 2021 final for starting Gundogan. KDB didn't even have the chance to finish that game.
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Rodri had 2 performances against Chelsea leading up to the final where he looked more than average. If he started and fumbled it would have been the same story about Pep overthinking.
 
adexkola said:
Rodri had 2 performances against Chelsea leading up to the final where he looked more than average. If he started and fumbled it would have been the same story about Pep overthinking.
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No it wouldn't. In finals you choose your best team and City's 11 couldn't have been clearer. If they lose with Rodri there is no element of overthinking they would have just lost. Starting Gundogan will forever put a cloud of 'what if' over that game.
 
El Jefe said:
No it wouldn't. In finals you choose your best team and City's 11 couldn't have been clearer. If they lose with Rodri there is no element of overthinking they would have just lost. Starting Gundogan will forever put a cloud of 'what if' over that game.
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I meant less than average, and that putting it lightly.

Guardiola was right to react to that.
 
acnumber9 said:
That’s my memory of it. I don’t think they win it without him.
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I think he got the assist for the third but did very little before that. My memory has it Gundogan carrying them through but it is cloudly from my over the top celebrations at the time
 
cyberman said:
I think he got the assist for the third but did very little before that. My memory has it Gundogan carrying them through but it is cloudly from my over the top celebrations at the time
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The ball for the third goal was ridiculous though. Gundogan only had to be there.
 
AltiUn said:
I've never doubted him being a great player, I've always found the Caf's hard-on for him fecking bizarre though. He is a tad overrated though, that's an opinion I don't think I'll ever be swayed on.
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Indeed. De Bruyne is brilliant, but he isn’t even the best midfielder to ever play for City, never mind the Premier League (as a fair few were arguing). I’d take David Silva every day.
 
Kag said:
Indeed. De Bruyne is brilliant, but he isn’t even the best midfielder to ever play for City, never mind the Premier League (as a fair few were arguing). I’d take David Silva every day.
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Now that is an overrated midfielder. Not KDB.
 
In a ranking of the best ever PL players

-Where would he currently rank?

-Where do you expect him to end up by the time he retires?
 
I think it is a bit far fetched to not include the best player of the EPL during its strongest era in the top 10. From those I've seen, I'd say only Cristiano Ronaldo, Hazard, Henry, Hazard, Suarez and Salah have a case for being as good or better all things considered.
 
Zehner said:
I think it is a bit far fetched to not include the best player of the EPL during its strongest era in the top 10. From those I've seen, I'd say only Cristiano Ronaldo, Hazard, Henry, Hazard, Suarez and Salah have a case for being as good or better all things considered.
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Hazard was so good you had to include him twice. You sir, know your football :D
 
Zehner said:
I think it is a bit far fetched to not include the best player of the EPL during its strongest era in the top 10. From those I've seen, I'd say only Cristiano Ronaldo, Hazard, Henry, Hazard, Suarez and Salah have a case for being as good or better all things considered.
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Might be a shock to you but the league existed before 2013.
 
WeePat said:
Hazard was so good you had to include him twice. You sir, know your football :D
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I obviously meant his brother Thorgan :) His stint at Chelsea is one of the most underrated in history!
 
AltiUn said:
Might be a shock to you but the league existed before 2013.
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2 out of the 6 players I named played in the 00s. But feel free to name the players I have missed that are better than de Bruyne :)
 
Zehner said:
I think it is a bit far fetched to not include the best player of the EPL during its strongest era in the top 10. From those I've seen, I'd say only Cristiano Ronaldo, Hazard, Henry, Hazard, Suarez and Salah have a case for being as good or better all things considered.
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Whut?
 
Berbaclass said:
Wouldn’t have him over Keane, Gerrard, Viera or Lampard. Scholes is debatable too. That’s just central midfielders.
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Funny how people view midfielders, you make it sound like Scholes is worse than the 4 you listed but in my opinion he is miles ahead of all 4.

De Bruyne is also better than Lampard easily. I think Frank would admit that himself.
 
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