No one is going to campaign on that for at least 20 years. It’s going to take a party coming into power to start the conversation when power and begin to change the narrative. This is something I fully expect this Labour government… not to do.
Keir Starmer Labour Leader
- Thread starter Damien
- Start date
No one is going to campaign on that for at least 20 years. It’s going to take a party coming into power to start the conversation when power and begin to change the narrative. This is something I fully expect this Labour government… not to do.
The Lib Dems are campaigning to go back into the single market.
Ok I mean no party with a shot at a majority.
I do not think I am an arbiter of the correct way to protest vote, I am giving an opinion, just like you.
You are part of the people; most who can vote, will vote, some are ineligible to vote, some are too lazy to vote as you say, some don't care about politics, some don't understand what to do, some want to make a protest but don't know how, some just deface ballots because they think that is a protest because the party they support isn't represented on the ballot.... unfortunately no one is listening, to any of the above, except those who do vote through the required process.
The ballot is the gateway and the process
Voting is about making a choice of those arrayed before you, in your constituency to serve the community they represent in Parliament. If your party or candidate is not standing in your constituency surely the person/party to ask why not, is them?
I do understand the frustration, I have faced it myself over the years. Sometimes I have voted 'negatively' to try to stop a particular candidate, sometimes I have not voted at all, but I have never defaced a ballot paper, because that is the only chance the individual ever gets to officially.... 'make their mark' ...and to disrespect the right to vote in that way is not, to me at least, acceptable.
Whatever they come up with that deepens the ties with Europe and removes barriers to trade will basically be the common/single market repackaged, as it’s impossible to achieve what they’ve spelled out any other way.
Labour spads probably wanked themselves silly thinking how genius this plan is. “Win the 52% now, the 48% later”.
They’ll then just do nothing, ignoring Brexit altogether.
What do you expect? The EU doesn't really want or need us back and we wont get back in without accepting the Euro. It was a massive mistake to leave but trying to beg our way back in now would be equally disastrous.
I doubt we would need to accept the Euro. We could still join the single market and customs union (which many Brexiteers said we wouldn’t be leaving anyway!).
You would, but joining the Single Market and the Customs Union is the same as being in the EU, but without any votes or say in how the EU is run. Just like the UK is set to become a member of the CPTPP without a say or a vote but also no benefits on top. They haven't told the Brexiters that yet.
'Wealth Creation' , 'Make It Work' etc etc... It's just vacuous soundbite nonsense. Meanwhile, back in the real world...
Dutch lorry drivers could stop bringing goods to UK if post-Brexit delays not cut
Dutch hauliers say facilities at border posts where some trucks are held for up to 20 hours are inadequate
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-drivers-uk-post-brexit-delays-dutch-hauliers
Dutch lorry drivers could stop bringing goods to UK if post-Brexit delays not cut
Dutch hauliers say facilities at border posts where some trucks are held for up to 20 hours are inadequate
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-drivers-uk-post-brexit-delays-dutch-hauliers
That's a lot of words to say 'nothing'
Started reading the Labour manifesto.
First thing that hit me was
Labour will support first time buyers who struggle to save for a large desposit,
These despots trying to buy houses....
First thing that hit me was
Labour will support first time buyers who struggle to save for a large desposit,
These despots trying to buy houses....
Looks like they must have hired a proofreader from the Guardian. Probably about the only left wing element that hasn't been purged yet.
Vibes first, policy later.
Sir Kid Starver, the enemy of the environment.
Nothing new in the manifesto. GB energy makes no sense. There are dozens of windfarms already in the pipeline which have already been delayed.
Where are all these hundreds of thousands of people who are going to be trained to do all sorts of jobs, whether they like it or not?, how long will it take and how much will it cost.
EU relationship plan is ridiculous.
Immigration and Asylum seekers, same old nonsense.
Damp squib and depressing.
Open goal missed.
Where are all these hundreds of thousands of people who are going to be trained to do all sorts of jobs, whether they like it or not?, how long will it take and how much will it cost.
EU relationship plan is ridiculous.
Immigration and Asylum seekers, same old nonsense.
Damp squib and depressing.
Open goal missed.
Take it you are not voting Labour in the UK GE then? @Paul the Wolf
What about Marine Le Pen in France perhaps???
By the way what is Macron playing at? It's hard to judge over here, sounds as if the right has rattled it's sabre and he's ditched his government.... perhaps they have heard he was had secret meetings with Starmer, trying to put Humpty UK back together again
Elections on both sides of the channel at the same time, who'd have thought it?
Take it you are not voting Labour in the UK GE then? @Paul the Wolf
What about Marine Le Pen in France perhaps???
By the way what is Macron playing at? It's hard to judge over here, sounds as if the right has rattled it's sabre and he's ditched his government.... perhaps they have heard he was had secret meetings with Starmer, trying to put Humpty UK back together again
Elections on both sides of the channel at the same time, who'd have thought it?
I could still register to vote in the UK in the constituency where I last lived in the UK but I never voted there even when I lived in that constituency. It was pointless with a huge Conservative majority. Probably will still stay Tory even at this election. Haven't voted in the UK since the 97 GE. But no I wouldn't vote for Labour. Probably Lib-Dem if I could have voted in another constituency.
Le Pen is a hopeless waste of space like Farage. She's promoted Bardella to appeal to the younger element.
Macron is frustrated with plans being held up by the political games of the left and right in parliament. Whether it works is dubious.
Macron is still president until 2027 whatever happens but he may have to have an even smaller representation in parliament and even have a Prime Minister from another party.
I thought she was about to protest the VAT on private school fees until she pulled out her banner.
You can see what's happening here. Trying to be everything to everybody.
Some chat about immigration and asylum for on the fence Tories. Talk about the EU for the Brexiteers. A few poorly designed taxes on 'the rich' for the gems. Nothing too adventurous and nothing that's going to change people to voting for Labour as opposed to voting against the Tories.
Reality is he's a figurehead trying to appease the devolved governments and regional leaders. Wheel simpletons like Angela Rayner out to keep the far left happy but make sure they don't get enough power to do any damage. It's the Reeves and Burnhams that will get him, intelligent and single-minded, I wonder if he'll see a full term before they come gunning for him.
I forecast a while back that he would be lucky to last three years, nothing he's done since has changed my mind.
Looks like Labour is going to get a large majority, but not the wild estimates some are coming up with.
For Starmer to have a chance to do anything to significantly move the dial, he is going to need 2 terms at least, possibly 3 and his majority will get whittled down each time.
So, if he starts off with say +100 seat majority this time around, that will drop to say 50/60 at the next GE assuming he is keeping to the levels/targets he will have to set sooner or later and the Tories have re-discovered how they use to be the 'natural party of government' (don't hold out much hope on that score).
By the third term he will need at least 15-20 seat majority to push for the last part on the dial to be moved
Must admit at first I wasn't impressed, but now Starmer is beginning to circle the wagons and discipline the troops and will be able to see off any 'mavericks of the left' that have escaped the cull at the selection stage and are still lurking on the back-benches . The big worry for him is whether the Unions keep faith and be prepared to wait, at least he until he gets the ship out of port, before demanding an extra rum ration for the crew.
Your comparison of Farage and Le Pen is interesting. Farage is only going to add to the woes of Sunak, presumable you think Le Pen may have the same affect in France?
Will be one of the most interesting summers for years, both politically and in terms of the football.
Get stocked up with your favourite 'tipple' and a selection of snacks, put your feet up and follow everything on the telly.
Best wishes have a good summer.
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Looks like Labour is going to get a large majority, but not the wild estimates some are coming up with.
For Starmer to have a chance to do anything to significantly move the dial, he is going to need 2 terms at least, possibly 3 and his majority will get whittled down each time.
So, if he starts off with say +100 seat majority this time around, that will drop to say 50/60 at the next GE assuming he is keeping to the levels/targets he will have to set sooner or later and the Tories have re-discovered how they use to be the 'natural party of government' (don't hold out much hope on that score).
By the third term he will need at least 15-20 seat majority to push for the last part on the dial to be moved
Must admit at first I wasn't impressed, but now Starmer is beginning to circle the wagons and discipline the troops and will be able to see off any 'mavericks of the left' that have escaped the cull at the selection stage and are still lurking on the back-benches . The big worry for him is whether the Unions keep faith and be prepared to wait, at least he until he gets the ship out of port, before demanding and extra rum ration for the crew.
Your comparison of Farage and Le Pen is interesting. Farage is only going to add to the woes of Sunak, presumable you think Le Pen may have the same affect in France?
Will be one of the most interesting summers for years, both politically and in terms of the football.
Get stocked up with your favourite 'tipple' and a selection of snacks, put your feet up and follow everything on the telly.
Best wishes have a good summer.
I don't see Starmer doing a lot that will make people notice a lot of difference , other than not having a load of nutcase ministers in prominent position as the Tories have. He has to be a lot bolder earlier because if he waits too long, it could be too long and people will grow impatient. He's got a very difficult few years ahead, which is why I don't think the Tories will be too upset and to enable them to regroup.
Le Pen is more advanced politically than Farage and it wouldn't surprise me if he reverts back to sniping on the sidelines if Reform don't get many seats and he doesn't get elected. It would be funny though if he was the only Reform MP.
Apart from her racism and xenophobia which she has tried to hide more recently, Le Pen is dim and would be a disaster for France if she ever gained more power. All the parties hate each other including those on the same side of the fence. Depends on who finally agrees to work with who but although the far-right have done better , the overall feeling at the end of the day is that the majority of French people don't want a far-right government.
Let's hope for a good summer and some good football and a rebirth of United as a force again. Best wishes.
Sir Kid Starver just added this racist back to the party.
Jesus Christ! I'm so fecking sick of this cnut. Horrible prick.
I don't suppose he would make that comparison, that would mean he has some form of self awareness and shame. The simple fact of the matter is that this version of labour would rather line the pockets of the rich than keep poor kids alive. Anyone who supports the direction in which the labour party is going is treating this like sport when there are people's lives at risk. Sociopaths.
It's pragmatism plain and simple.
Bonuses for bankers, means a bigger tax income for government, child benefit beyond two children is a bigger expenditure... one of those really hard-nosed decisions that a new Labour government will have to make, and there will be many of them.
Not commenting on the policy, but on the divide between the blue check replies (dozens at the top, all mad about spending, "where is the money for this", and suggesting Farage as the alternative), and the other replies (mad that he wants these people to work even when it's potentially dangerous for them).
He has all the dynamism and personality of a damp sock
I wonder how many of the pro-Farage accounts can have their IP addresses tracked to St.Petersburg
Harsh on @esmufc07
Old interview but an interesting insight into the guy who apparently doesn't talk about his dad much.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54946046
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has spoken of his regret at not being close to his late father, who he described as a "difficult" and "complicated" man.
He told Lauren Laverne on BBC Radio 4's Desert Island Discs, that he was "determined that my relationship with my own children will be different".
In the interview, Sir Keir also talked about how his political beliefs had shifted, and his aim to unite Labour.
And he spoke about his love of football, saying he plays every week.
Among the songs that Sir Keir chose were the England football anthem Three Lions by The Lightning Seeds, and Jim Reeves' Welcome To My World, which was his mother's favourite song.
He also picked a Northern Soul record - Dobie Gray's Out On The Floor - saying it reminded him of his "early days in London with a group of friends in a really grotty flat above a sauna and massage parlour that kept interesting hours".
Listen: Keir Starmer on Desert Island Discs
Who is Sir Keir Starmer?
Asked by presenter Lauren Laverne about his parents and upbringing in Oxted, Surrey, Sir Keir, 58, said: "I don't often talk about my dad."
"He was a difficult man, a complicated man, he kept himself to himself, he didn't particularly like to socialise, so wouldn't really go out very much. But he was incredibly hard-working."
Sir Keir said his father worked as a toolmaker in a factory and would work 14-hour days, coming home for an hour at 17:00 "for his tea" before returning to work again in the evening.
"But he had this utter devotion and commitment to my mum," said Sir Keir. "My mum was very, very ill all of her life and my dad knew exactly the symptoms of everything that might possibly go wrong with my mum, he knew exactly what drugs or combination of drugs or injection would be needed.
"He stopped drinking completely just in case he ever needed to get to the hospital with her. On the many occasions she was in hospital he would stay with her the whole time, he wouldn't leave the hospital, he would sleep on any chair or whatever was available."
But Sir Keir adds: "I wouldn't say we were close. I understood who he was and what he was but we weren't close and I regret that."
Keir Starmer QC, then the Director of public prosecution attends the CPS
IMAGE SOURCE,GETTY IMAGES
Image caption,
Ten years ago, pre-politics, Sir Keir was the Director of Public Prosecutions
Sir Keir grew emotional when speaking about his mother - who had lived with the autoimmune condition Still's Disease since she was 11 - as he recalled when his father had phoned from the hospital to say: "I don't think your mum's going to make it."
He said his mother died just a few weeks before he was elected into Parliament as an MP in 2015, and his father died a couple of years ago.
'Started off as the radical'
Sir Keir's parents were "Labour through and through" but he said they did not have discussions about politics around the kitchen table.
Sir Keir said his politics had changed over the years but he still considered himself to be a socialist, adding: "Like most people, I started off as the radical who knew everything. I'm now much more open to ideas."
The former human rights lawyer and Director of Public Prosecutions also spoke about his aim for a "united Labour Party" and also addressed the recent decision to suspend former leader Jeremy Corbyn from the party.
"I didn't want that day to end in the way it did," he said, of the day the report into anti-Semitism in Labour was published. "I had no intention of purging anyone. I have no intention of purging anyone. I want the Labour Party to be a broad church."
He added being named Keir - after Keir Hardie, founder of the Labour Party - earned him "plenty of nicknames at school".
"I have to say at school, I was saying 'why on earth did you have to call me Keir? Why couldn't you have called me Pete or Dave or something like everybody else'," he said.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54946046
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has spoken of his regret at not being close to his late father, who he described as a "difficult" and "complicated" man.
He told Lauren Laverne on BBC Radio 4's Desert Island Discs, that he was "determined that my relationship with my own children will be different".
In the interview, Sir Keir also talked about how his political beliefs had shifted, and his aim to unite Labour.
And he spoke about his love of football, saying he plays every week.
Among the songs that Sir Keir chose were the England football anthem Three Lions by The Lightning Seeds, and Jim Reeves' Welcome To My World, which was his mother's favourite song.
He also picked a Northern Soul record - Dobie Gray's Out On The Floor - saying it reminded him of his "early days in London with a group of friends in a really grotty flat above a sauna and massage parlour that kept interesting hours".
Listen: Keir Starmer on Desert Island Discs
Who is Sir Keir Starmer?
Asked by presenter Lauren Laverne about his parents and upbringing in Oxted, Surrey, Sir Keir, 58, said: "I don't often talk about my dad."
"He was a difficult man, a complicated man, he kept himself to himself, he didn't particularly like to socialise, so wouldn't really go out very much. But he was incredibly hard-working."
Sir Keir said his father worked as a toolmaker in a factory and would work 14-hour days, coming home for an hour at 17:00 "for his tea" before returning to work again in the evening.
"But he had this utter devotion and commitment to my mum," said Sir Keir. "My mum was very, very ill all of her life and my dad knew exactly the symptoms of everything that might possibly go wrong with my mum, he knew exactly what drugs or combination of drugs or injection would be needed.
"He stopped drinking completely just in case he ever needed to get to the hospital with her. On the many occasions she was in hospital he would stay with her the whole time, he wouldn't leave the hospital, he would sleep on any chair or whatever was available."
But Sir Keir adds: "I wouldn't say we were close. I understood who he was and what he was but we weren't close and I regret that."
Keir Starmer QC, then the Director of public prosecution attends the CPS
IMAGE SOURCE,GETTY IMAGES
Image caption,
Ten years ago, pre-politics, Sir Keir was the Director of Public Prosecutions
Sir Keir grew emotional when speaking about his mother - who had lived with the autoimmune condition Still's Disease since she was 11 - as he recalled when his father had phoned from the hospital to say: "I don't think your mum's going to make it."
He said his mother died just a few weeks before he was elected into Parliament as an MP in 2015, and his father died a couple of years ago.
'Started off as the radical'
Sir Keir's parents were "Labour through and through" but he said they did not have discussions about politics around the kitchen table.
Sir Keir said his politics had changed over the years but he still considered himself to be a socialist, adding: "Like most people, I started off as the radical who knew everything. I'm now much more open to ideas."
The former human rights lawyer and Director of Public Prosecutions also spoke about his aim for a "united Labour Party" and also addressed the recent decision to suspend former leader Jeremy Corbyn from the party.
"I didn't want that day to end in the way it did," he said, of the day the report into anti-Semitism in Labour was published. "I had no intention of purging anyone. I have no intention of purging anyone. I want the Labour Party to be a broad church."
He added being named Keir - after Keir Hardie, founder of the Labour Party - earned him "plenty of nicknames at school".
"I have to say at school, I was saying 'why on earth did you have to call me Keir? Why couldn't you have called me Pete or Dave or something like everybody else'," he said.
Harsh on socks