Keir Starmer Labour Leader

Feels very much like they've realised that an ex-PM who hasn't been an MP for 7 years coming out with more policy detail than the actual Labour Party makes them look bad, and they're scrambling to play catch-up.

If they had it all sorted out and Brown's intervention was a coincidence, or if Brown's intervention had been a coordinated effort to test the waters for official Labour policy before announcing it, they wouldn't be buying time by briefing that there's maybe possibly going to be a briefing next week maybe.
 
jeff_goldblum said:
Feels very much like they've realised that an ex-PM who hasn't been an MP for 7 years coming out with more policy detail than the actual Labour Party makes them look bad, and they're scrambling to play catch-up.

If they had it all sorted out and Brown's intervention was a coincidence, or if Brown's intervention had been a coordinated effort to test the waters for official Labour policy before announcing it, they wouldn't be buying time by briefing that there's maybe possibly going to be a briefing next week maybe.
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Alternatively they think Brown coming out with policy makes it look less socialist. I doubt they're that coordinated though.

As you say Brown gives his opinions and Tories are starting to sound out some options so Starmer will now follow like a good sheep.
 
Gordon Brown being the most left-wing voice we have in mainstream media was not on my bingo card.
 
villain said:
Gordon Brown being the most left-wing voice we have in mainstream media was not on my bingo card.
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It's pretty amazing how much the Overton window has shifted right. It hasn't even been subtle.
 
Mogget said:
It's pretty amazing how much the Overton window has shifted right. It hasn't even been subtle.
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Tory leadership candidates are actively campaigning for fascism and people aren't even blinking.
Meanwhile the Labour Party are Tory Shadow Ministers at this point.
 
Smores said:
Alternatively they think Brown coming out with policy makes it look less socialist. I doubt they're that coordinated though.

As you say Brown gives his opinions and Tories are starting to sound out some options so Starmer will now follow like a good sheep.
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If it's the former it's odd though because Brown is probably the person most associated with the classic tabloid narrative that Labour in government spend way too much and crash the economy.

The only way it would make sense would be as some sort of ploy where Brown advocates for a policy and then Starmer announces something less radical to show he's fiscally responsible, but assuming that level of guile and coordination from Labour is too big a stretch for me.
 
jeff_goldblum said:
Feels very much like they've realised that an ex-PM who hasn't been an MP for 7 years coming out with more policy detail than the actual Labour Party makes them look bad, and they're scrambling to play catch-up.

If they had it all sorted out and Brown's intervention was a coincidence, or if Brown's intervention had been a coordinated effort to test the waters for official Labour policy before announcing it, they wouldn't be buying time by briefing that there's maybe possibly going to be a briefing next week maybe.
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Yep really does seem like this. Next week will be a shit show.
 
Labour should bring back Gordon Brown, at least in the House of Lords, he is probably the most underrated PM
 
sun_tzu said:
Sure but how long do new storage facilities take to build... how long do new extraction sites in places that aren't Russia take to set up

I suspect the timelines for both and the investment needed is signifigant

For this winter and next it's buy Russian gas or accept anything else costs a lot more ... if the government thinks that's a price worth paying then probably they have to find a way to financially contribute to that.

Gut feel a new pm (probably truss I guess) will do something as a flagship policy to try to get people onside in September or an emergency budget ij October... probably won't be enough ij most people's eyes

But finding new gas supplies and having better storage are very much longer term options
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We have one of the lowest gas storage capacities in Europe.

The reduction in gas storage is a direct result of privatisation. They've been closed down because it's been more profitable to rely on imported gas and remove any safety buffer.

Starmer needs to think of an alternative approach asap.
 
villain said:
Gordon Brown being the most left-wing voice we have in mainstream media was not on my bingo card.
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Gordon Brown actually gave a shit about politics and serving his constituents. He actually believed in this whole democracy lark no matter whatever else you can say about him.

But he used a thick pen and smiled weirdly so he had no chance against a man who fecks pigs.
 
Drainy said:
Listening to him speak is like night and day compared to the current politicians.

How have we let the quality of people in office decline so far?
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Listening to the bank of England guys when they discussed the last interest rate rise showed it off best. Actual educated adults discussing important national issues, mind blowing.
 
I genuinely have not a clue what he is playing at.

I'd imagine there would be overwhelming support for a much more significant intervention on energy bills and the cost of living crisis. You have the Tory leadership candidates basically saying they would do next to feck all right now... it's the biggest open goal Labour will ever get. What are they afraid of?
 
Drainy said:
Listening to him speak is like night and day compared to the current politicians.

How have we let the quality of people in office decline so far?
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It's not the whole story, but the habitual use of the NEC to engage in cronyism and factional skulduggery with respect to candidate selection is a big part of it. When CLPs are choosing their candidate to run for MP, the NEC has the ability to dictate the long-list of potential candidates. This ability gets used, particularly in safe seats, to shoehorn allies of the dominant faction into contention, and to exclude candidates who might challenge them.

So you end up with a PLP full of people chosen primarily for their connections or ideological bent rather than their ability. And because the meddling occurs most commonly in safe seats, when Labour suffers electorally and is cut down to its core constituencies these cronyism/factional picks account for the bulk of the party's MPs.

The final piece of the puzzle is that for over 20 years up to 2018 the dominant faction in the NEC was the Blairites, and their efforts to recreate the party in Blair's image meant that, even by 2005, the PLP had shifted a fair deal to the right compared to where it had been in 1997 where the centre-right Blairites in the the PLP were somewhat balanced out by the centre-left (i.e - Brown's lot). Respectively, those two factions provided the style and the substance behind Labour's offer in 1997, but unfortunately it was the former who got control of the party's mechanisms.
 
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Mr Pigeon said:
Gordon Brown actually gave a shit about politics and serving his constituents. He actually believed in this whole democracy lark no matter whatever else you can say about him.

But he used a thick pen and smiled weirdly so he had no chance against a man who fecks pigs.
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Oh that statement wasn't a sleight on Brown, he's actually (imo) one of the best politicians in recent times.
 
jeff_goldblum said:
It's not the whole story, but the habitual use of the NEC to engage in cronyism and factional skulduggery with respect to candidate selection is a big part of it. When CLPs are choosing their candidate to run for MP, the NEC has the ability to dictate the long-list of potential candidates. This ability gets used, particularly in safe seats, to shoehorn allies of the dominant faction into contention, and to exclude candidates who might challenge them.

So you end up with a PLP full of people chosen primarily for their connections or ideological bent rather than their ability. And because the meddling occurs most commonly in safe seats, when Labour suffers electorally and is cut down to its core constituencies these cronyism/factional picks account for the bulk of the party's MPs.

The final piece of the puzzle is that for over 20 years up to 2018 the dominant faction in the NEC was the Blairites, and their efforts to recreate the party in Blair's image meant that, even by 2005, the PLP had shifted a fair deal to the right compared to where it had been in 1997 where the centre-right Blairites in the the PLP were somewhat balanced out by the centre-left (i.e - Brown's lot). Respectively, those two factions provided the style and the substance behind Labour's offer in 1997, but unfortunately it was the former who got control of the party's mechanisms.
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Yes, very true. There is also interference from the Party at all levels of government, all the way down to Council candidates, meaning this is a real structural issue.
 
At the same time, she set out her own view of Jewish values, saying: “So many Jewish values are Conservative values and British values too, for example seeing the importance of family and always taking steps to protect the family unit; and the value of hard work and self-starting and setting up your own business.“The British Jewish community is incredibly proud of this country and so are Conservatives.”

Previously, Truss has told the Conservative Friends of Israel that as prime minister she would review whether to move the UK’s embassy to Jerusalem from Tel Aviv – following in the footsteps of Donald Trump.A source on her campaign also accused Keir Starmer’s Labour of being a “talking shop for antisemitism and anti-Zionism” despite his efforts to stamp out the party’s problems since taking over as leader.

https://theguardian.com/politics/20...rotect-british-jews-antisemitism-woke-culture
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:lol:

The most predictable outcome of the last 7 years.
 
Frosty said:
Yes, very true. There is also interference from the Party at all levels of government, all the way down to Council candidates, meaning this is a real structural issue.
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Absolutely yeah. My last two MPs have been parachuted in, one by the Blairites in 2005 and one by the left in 2019.
 
People on twitter claiming that Labour's plans would save 17% of people a whole 18p a day.

He's beyond a joke.
 
Starmer: "If I was in charge, things would continue to be exactly as bad as they are now, but they wouldn't get worse (until January)"
 
jeff_goldblum said:
Starmer: "If I was in charge, things would continue to be exactly as bad as they are now, but they wouldn't get worse (until January)"
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That's pretty significant considering the current government appear happy to let your bills hit £5000.
 
chris123 said:
That's pretty significant considering the current government appear happy to let your bills hit £5000.
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The likes of Truss are rampaging axe murderers whereas Starmer left his axe in the pocket of his suit that's at the dry cleaners. Inspirational.
 
Probably best to wait till Monday before people pile in on him ... but its difficult to see any policy which can be delivered quickly short of sending money out to people and businesses.

Will be interesting to see if it gets much coverage / traction probably more than what the actual policies are as 100% the government is not implementing what the opposition ask for. (suspect it will be pilled on by left and right whatever Starmer suggests)

I do expect some very immediate announcement from whoever wins out of Truss / Sunak (probably Truss) very quickly after they are appointed - probably in the first month along with an emergency budget before conference in early October.
 
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