Exactly this. Come the 3rd season, the players are no better individually or collectively, tactically or technically. It's like both the manager and players are spent after the 2nd season, no fresh ideas after that. Short term stuff
Jose Mourinho | 2017/18 Assessments | Poll Added
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I dont think anyone doubts his CV as a winner. Its the condition or let say, atmosphere his character
We're talking about trusting a young player. When you should and shouldn't throw them in. You're seriously telling me one player being 23 the other 18 has little bearing on that decision? That there's no difference.
Come on you're rewriting the rules of football here to defend the manager.
Yeah there is a very good explanation which is ignored by posters with bs agenda. Jose was in charge of Chelsea for 3 years, Inter 2 years, Madrid 3 years, Chelsea 2 and half seasons. That puts him as longest serving manager at those clubs which answers every question. Only Zidane has good chance of beating that record at Madrid.
Does not in the slightest mean "he wasn't backed up financially." He has had more to spend than most clubs across Europe.
And the only club that had (significantly not slightly) more is the team currently ahead of us.
They also sold players better where as we kept onto lots of dead weight. Why is Shaw still here? Blind? These players could fetch a fair quid and perhaps we could've got a quality LB for the money? just a thought.
Fergie didn't always sell the dead weight immediately, so it's ok for Mourinho to do the same.
No, Mourinho can give his attacking players the freedom to express themselves without any real tactical underpinning or he gives the defensive instruction to park the bus.
it's clear as day from night.
No they aren't and no they aren't. Glad we didn't sign Perisic. Jose should target better players. I bet the owners would have paid 70 million plus for Grizemann. So much for this false 'Jose is skint' argument.
Same. I don't know why people are turning against the board. Fans taking sides is going to be very toxic for the club's internal workings in the long run. The fans and the manager need to be wary of turning the club into a circus
There were good reasons for not wanting to spend that much on a position we have our two brightest talents. You would expect some flexibility on the manager's part to opt for an alternative target more in line with the club's transfer policies.
So it has nothing to do with his character and his methos, it's down only to the clubs? Isn't this wishful thinking though. Why would they fire him given that he won them titles and the team was playing well? Didn't Chelsea and Madrid fire/release him because significant problems appeared and the team wasn't playing so well anymore?
What would have happened with Martial had Woodward signed Perisic? Maybe he was reluctant to sign him because of Martial?
Perisic currently has 4 goals and 5 assists from 12 games in the league. Put him in the LWB position against Chelsea and we win the game. Glad we didn't sign him.
If the Glazers are only going to sanction money on marquee names, then we are in trouble. Of course, even that is a myth considering we brought in the likes of Schneiderlin and Darmian during van Gaal's tenure, who aren't exactly marquee.
We can buy functional players who are not as bad as Young or Lingard, but actually contribute to a decent level. There may be better players than Perisic, but for now, if he had been available, we should have gotten him. Would ease the pressure on Martial, allowing him to develop as well.
The budget is only 150 million roundabouts. Jose is not allowed to go above that, it is clear as day.
The short term/long term discussion is pointless imo. No top class manager is a long term one. Mourinho, Pep, Carlo and Conte are all managers for max 4 years, leave and get a new manager instead of them, and so. We were just lucky to have a manager like SAF as our manager for all these years so we didn't sense that, but from now on we need to get used to having a new manager every 4 years if we're going for one of the top 5 managers in the world. We should stop our obsession with long term managers.
He has issues, don't think anyone can deny that but you also should consider what clubs he worked at and how much was the longest serving manager stayed there.
I cant believe that people think that Perisic for 55M or 60M would have turned our fortunes massively.
Anyways, the best player in our team is always the one we didn't buy or is on bench or not able to get into the team. So its hardly surprising
Not really. We are lacking some good old fashioned wingplay and so not signing a winger is seen as crucial. Nobody says our back-up for Matic is a better player than Matic when the back-up is on the bench, and nobody is also claiming that Fabinho, whom we didn't buy, would have been better than Matic, so it is a bit of an exaggeration.
I hardly see anyone moaning about not buying Griezmann anyway.
Telling how?? They needed time to get used to playing again and possessing match rhythm, it's the same nonsensical argument that gets dragged out every time a player that some fans want to stay leaves a club and initially does poorly at another club which is then used as justification by other fans for his sale.
No matter how talented you are, you need to play regularly to iron out flaws and improve your game constantly. You miss out, you stagnate and the margins are so thin at the top level.
So yes they did need time but these were talented young players in there early 20s not teenagers. It didn't require that much boldness to play them. In hindsight it was probably a good for the development of their careers though.
I'm guessing board would not allow for Shaw sale in summer plus he was injured.
Blind is a sqaud players who provides depth
In a much weaker. What are Martial and Rashford's stats in a stronger one?Perisic currently has 4 goals and 5 assists from 12 games in the league. Put him in the LWB position against Chelsea and we win the game. Glad we didn't sign him.
If the Glazers are only going to sanction money on marquee names, then we are in trouble. Of course, even that is a myth considering we brought in the likes of Schneiderlin and Darmian during van Gaal's tenure, who aren't exactly marquee.
We can buy functional players who are not as bad as Young or Lingard, but actually contribute to a decent level. There may be better players than Perisic, but for now, if he had been available, we should have gotten him. Would ease the pressure on Martial, allowing him to develop as well.
The budget is only 150 million roundabouts. Jose is not allowed to go above that, it is clear as day.
Rashford should be a back-up striker to Lukaku. Martial would be able to compete with Perisic on the LW, as he has a higher ceiling than the latter and eventually replace him. That's the idea.
Myth that Serie A is a weaker league. I don't see Salah particularly struggling after making the move, in a system that suits him. Mourinho's system would get the best out of Perisic.
Got to laugh at this bit. Martial needs to start more often rather than more players 'taking pressure of him'.Perisic currently has 4 goals and 5 assists from 12 games in the league. Put him in the LWB position against Chelsea and we win the game. Glad we didn't sign him.
If the Glazers are only going to sanction money on marquee names, then we are in trouble. Of course, even that is a myth considering we brought in the likes of Schneiderlin and Darmian during van Gaal's tenure, who aren't exactly marquee.
We can buy functional players who are not as bad as Young or Lingard, but actually contribute to a decent level. There may be better players than Perisic, but for now, if he had been available, we should have gotten him. Would ease the pressure on Martial, allowing him to develop as well.
The budget is only 150 million roundabouts. Jose is not allowed to go above that, it is clear as day.
Can't depend on Martial alone to start with only Rashford as competition. He's still young.
Perisic currently has 4 goals and 5 assists from 12 games in the league. Put him in the LWB position against Chelsea and we win the game. Glad we didn't sign him.
If the Glazers are only going to sanction money on marquee names, then we are in trouble. Of course, even that is a myth considering we brought in the likes of Schneiderlin and Darmian during van Gaal's tenure, who aren't exactly marquee.
We can buy functional players who are not as bad as Young or Lingard, but actually contribute to a decent level. There may be better players than Perisic, but for now, if he had been available, we should have gotten him. Would ease the pressure on Martial, allowing him to develop as well.
The budget is only 150 million roundabouts. Jose is not allowed to go above that, it is clear as day.
Lets stop such talk.Salah had 19 goals with Roma last season in this week league, now he has 12 in EPL and we're still in November. This debate doesn't make sense.
Perisic can play on the right, and can play as a wingback with one of Martial or Rashford up top beside Lukaku as we saw against Spurs and Chelsea. He wouldn't have affected both but would have given us better and more valuable choices on the flanks.
Not saying that us not signing him leads to our poor current form but I find it odd some're still persist on him being not good enough while he's one of the best players in Inter ( who're having a great season so far ) and definitely one of the top wingers in Serie A, which is also very strong this season.
But is Perisic really a 55M guy?? Leave alone that there is no guarantee that he will do well in more physical league like PL. Miki came in with a lot of reputation from Bundesliga. But he is neither able to seal his place on the right or in the middle.
So when we want to sign a player by paying over the odds, he should be really that better than our options. Rashford and Martial are not doing an awful job to suggest that we need a serious upgrade in that area. That is where the transfer cost will come into picture.
Not all deals are off because we don't have the money. But because we don't want to throw away money.
Tomorrow when we are selling Shaw, we can ask people to pay 40M or 50M, but no one will buy him for that.
Perisic currently has 4 goals and 5 assists from 12 games in the league. Put him in the LWB position against Chelsea and we win the game. Glad we didn't sign him.
If the Glazers are only going to sanction money on marquee names, then we are in trouble. Of course, even that is a myth considering we brought in the likes of Schneiderlin and Darmian during van Gaal's tenure, who aren't exactly marquee.
We can buy functional players who are not as bad as Young or Lingard, but actually contribute to a decent level. There may be better players than Perisic, but for now, if he had been available, we should have gotten him. Would ease the pressure on Martial, allowing him to develop as well.
The budget is only 150 million roundabouts. Jose is not allowed to go above that, it is clear as day.
Whose goals and assists will we lose in order to drop the player who makes way for Perisic?
Perisic is definitely not worth 55 million. But our squad is not at the level of City that we gloss over overpriced players. Market's gone crazy, nowadays we get average players for 30-40, decent players for 50-70 million. Nothing to be done about it.
The board should have realized our deficiencies and allowed Jose to buy Perisic.
Play him on the right, he can be decent there and I can do with "losing" the almost non-existent goals and assists from the RW. Play him at LWB in big games, and at LW when Martial is off color. Simple.
Regarding Perisic price, we could have gotten him for less than 40m if Ed didn't try to prove his genius abilities in negotiating by waiting for Inter to be forced to sell due to FFP. That was a dirty trick by him and when Inter got past it with no problems they decided to get greedy, raised the price and asked for Martial.
We could have finished this deal in June by paying 40-45m and yes, it's a good price for him.
We could have finished this deal in June by paying 40-45m and yes, it's a good price for him.
That's stretching it.
If we're pointing to stats to prove his supposed greatness then Martial and Rashford are producing better numbers in a much better league. And Serie is not on the same level as the PL.
So yeah I'm not bothered about us being unable to sign someone who isn't a huge upgrade over players who are younger than him and not far off and who will go on to be twice or thrice the player he is.
Can play on the right? As far as I know that's not his preferred position. Would be another case of shoehorning players for no reason. Let's sign someone who can operate centrally and someone for the right. Left wing is actually a strength of ours as things stand. Hopefully we have better ideas than Perisic in the future.
We played Ashley Young, mate. Nothing's a given, but I think he would have had far more influence and perhaps lobbed in a cross for Lukaku to break his drought.
Oh well, we didn't sign him, so no point crying over spilt milk, I guess. Hope we get some attacking player in January if possible.
I haven't seen too much of him but does he ever play on the right? The stats you quoted as a reason to sign him, were they from the right?
A lot of money to then play the guy out of position. Surely we just buy a proper right winger.
I don't remember me saying he'll play on Martial and Rashford. Perisic's ability to play with both his feet would have given us thousands of options on left, right and as a wingback. His transition of the ball from defense to offense and his ability to cross the ball directly is severely missed in our side, hence you see the need of him.
And regarding the league, I find Perisic exactly made for the kind of EPL and would have thriven here imo. Salah is much weaker and depends on his pace to pass through players and he thrived here. Perisic is even stronger physically than Salah.
Two good players for one position is fine. How about we focus on areas of actual weakness? Like right wing and the 10 role where we have the lesser performers like Mata, Lingard and Jose's own signings - the terrible (this season) Mkhitarian. But nah, we didn't get a left winger when we already have good players there so we're skint. Bollocks argument (not yours but the guy that made it).
Myth? More like fact.
That not Jose's idea, though. He plays lukaku every single game. Going by your logic, Rashford would basically never play. Like, ever.
Rashford ain't good on the left. He's got the goals from sub appearances, but long term, he is a striker and should play there. Martial has the technique for a left winger.
Perisic is 29, buying him to play on both wings doesn't mean we won't get a younger RW. All good squads have attacking depth. Look at City, Bernardo Silva on the bench.
It's a fact? The example of Salah was already cited, while you glossed over it.
Rashford for his age will do fine getting the cup games and being subbed on. I see no compulsion to start him every game just for the sake of it. He's shown potential to be a decent PL player, but not yet top level.
If he does better than Lukaku, he will earn a starting place.
Agreed.
Salah will go to be remembered as a far better football I reckon because he's a lot more gifted.
In fact I'd argue that we should have gone for Salah instead. Roma didn't seem as fussy as Inter who kept raising the price, and he actually plays in a position we need.
Thousands of options being those three? That makes sense.
Look, he seems to be a decent player but not one to lose your sleep over trying to sign or moaning about not being able. I'm more than happy with the options we have in his best position.
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