Well he was my first pick to replace SAF. Better late then never. The man has won the CL a good few times. We need that type of manager.
Jose Mourinho | 2017/18 Assessments | Poll Added
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Wasn't making an excuse for LVG, just saying that in my opinion, Jose's biggest problem is different from LVG's biggest problem. Could well be wrong.
We would have probably seen a meltdown over the players instead of over the manager. I think it happened a few times when we created plenty but just failed to score.
Incidentally, what happened to that stretch of football last season when chance creation wasn't a problem? Was it down to Zlatan's individual genius? A different approach from Jose? Or were we just playing against extraordinarily shit teams?
The answer is definitely yes. Similar meltdowns were happening last season.
Don't have any problem with meltdown happened yesterday. Completely deserved but your point is false and last season was a proof.
You'll always get a "meltdown" of sorts (not a fan of the word myself...I don't think complaining about a loss is always a meltdown) but I think the problem for a lot of fans is the enjoyment of the game rather than the fact we're not winning. If Foster had the game of his life and we lost yesterday then that happens. We played Burnley at home a while back and Heaton had a mint game that happens from time to time. If it happens to much it does become a problem as it's evident the players can't finish. That isn't the problem at United though this season, we've just not created a load of chances and that's cos of the quality of football.
So has Jose, heck LVG made back to back CL finals even winning one. It doesn't matter, football has moved on and the managers of yesteryear are irrelevant.
We need a young manager with new ideas and a contemporary approach to the game, not some old timer stuck in their ways. We'll probably be in a similar situation with Ancelotti.
Not a chance. He's just extended his contract and the board are happy with Jose at the helm.
Just get second and win the FA Cup please. I am easily content .
2nd and the FA Cup would be a great season.
Ancelotti has won the CL three times, Jose has won it twice. We have 'that type of manager', it's just not working at the moment for a number of reasons.
How the mighty have fallen.
...however I agree. We were never winning the CL and were never getting close to the league winners given that they're on course to break the point total.
How I feel, agreed.
The argument that he needs to build would make sense if his signings were doing bits.
Touché...
Like it or not, football has moved on. Wining FA Cups, League Cups and Europa Leagues are thing of the past for all top European clubs. Prime example is Wenger, if he wins the Europa League, that would be 4 trophies in 5 years, but their fans still want him out. (And there football is much more entertaining than ours).
Finishing second is definitely papering over the cracks. I would rather finish 3rd, still being with a shout of the title with a couple of games to go, than finish 2nd and the title being over in March.
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Personally wouldn’t want Ancelotti, the others are good options though.
Great?! 2nd and FA cup would make a great season?! We're talking about Manchester fecking United here, not Liverpool.
Some people here are defending themselves for not having a knee jerk reactions.
For feck sake, during Ferguson's era, did he have entertaining games like 10 out of 10 games per season?
I don't think so, I remember it from time to time, there were games that was boring as feck. The only difference is we won those games by 1-0.
We are on course to finish 2nd after a while and Jose deserves to be the manager next season .
For feck sake, during Ferguson's era, did he have entertaining games like 10 out of 10 games per season?
I don't think so, I remember it from time to time, there were games that was boring as feck. The only difference is we won those games by 1-0.
We are on course to finish 2nd after a while and Jose deserves to be the manager next season .
There was a plenty of stinkers over a 26 year period course there was.
I'm sure not everyone thinks every game has to be a classic but Mourinho's tenure in terms of actual enjoyment of football has been massively underwhelming for me.
Going to the game now has turned into some what of a way for me to catch up with my mate as it's the best chance I get to see him now. I can't remember to many times we sat there and really enjoyed one of the games especially this season and it's a shame really.
I just find this whole situation utterly tiresome.
We went through this with Moyes, and then Van Gaal and now Mourinho where the forum universally decided that the manager being shit house was the only explanation for the players not playing well and that the only solution was to change manager. When the performances didn't come the players, who supposedly were all excellent and just needed some perceived 'X' to unlock their potential, suddenly were shit as well and the manager was now in charge of a 'rebuild', and then when that didn't happen quickly enough to satisfy people suddenly the new bunch were all much better than was being argued 6 months ago and the manager was the only issue again.
I'm not saying that there's an easy answer to the problem, and maybe Mourinho is the issue – or part of it, as I fully agree Moyes and Van Gaal were – but the depressing circularity of the post-Ferguson era surely warns against assuming that changing the manger is guaranteed to bring the instant success so many are clamouring for. Are the crowd who are demanding Mourinho out because our squad is supposedly better than what we're getting going to be demanding personnel changes if and when a new manager doesn't instantly succeed? History would suggest so.
I really do think if we're going to get it right we need to have a deeper, more far reaching, review of why the club has been getting it wrong since Ferguson has retired both in terms of personnel picks, and I'm simply not certain that the fanbase has the patience for that. Instead preferring burning through managers in the elusive hunt for someone who an emulate Ferguson's skill set.
Agree with this.
We need to find our own version of Pep/Klopp/Poch.
Bayern have just given the job to a young manager in Kovac. Real gave Zidane the job, Barca gave Luis Enrique a job. If the biggest clubs can do it, while not us?
That definitely happened to me over the course of Van Gaal's reign and I think we're getting to that point again.
To be fair to Mourinho, for most of last season and the first half of this season we were creating chances and taking a lot of shots. So even though we were negative in big games, the games against the cannon fodder were usually enjoyable to watch. Over the last few months that's no longer happening. The vast majority of our games in 2018 have been shite to watch. And it's a massive worry to me that we're finishing the season looking worse than we started it.
All I ask under any manager is evidence of progression. We might finish the league with more points than last season but watching the team play we sure as shit don't look like we're heading towards a bright future. And that's a damning indictment of the manager, after almost two years in charge.
Totally with you on that but it's definitely possible the problem has been down to three consecutive bad choices as managers. I mean, Moyes and Van Gaal both look 100% like bad choices with the benefit of hindsight. There's been biggish doubts about whether Mourinho still has it ever since his last stint at Chelsea. Isn't it possible that those doubts are valid and he is - just like Van Gaal - yesterday's man?
Was saying in the other thread.
Not a single Liverpool midfielder would get into our side...not a single one.
I can guarantee you, have Klopp and Pep this same set of players and we'd see much better football.
He can feck of with his excuses.
I was like "who gives a feck" yesterday but I've become angry.
The football is not acceptable and I sick of the excuses people are giving.
Our players are not dogshite.
Not a single Liverpool midfielder would get into our side...not a single one.
I can guarantee you, have Klopp and Pep this same set of players and we'd see much better football.
He can feck of with his excuses.
I was like "who gives a feck" yesterday but I've become angry.
The football is not acceptable and I sick of the excuses people are giving.
Our players are not dogshite.
People are allowed to have their doubts of course, but comparisons to LVG make less sense when Mourinho has won the PL just 3 years ago.
Sure. That’s a good point.
Someone mentioned elsewhere that SAF used to change his coaching staff or Assistant Manager, so there was a fresh voice and fresh ideas for the players to hear. This coaching staff have followed Jose around all over the place. That might actually be a problem. Do they tell him if they think he should be doing something differently or they want to keep their jobs, so just keep things as they are even if they are wrong?
That is fair enough, but the fallout at Chelsea after that may have taken it's toll on him. This was not just his usual fallout with the players.
Not really seeing how Mourinho is past it as a manager. It's not as if we have become worse in his 2nd season.
Mourinho has never been a man to play expansive football. The last team to play expansive football regularly under him was arguably Chelsea 2004-07. Inter Milan were a very defensive team, and Real Madrid fans will tell you that he played too defensively for their liking as well. Chelsea 2013-16 only had small periods of expansive play.
I think there is a compelling argument for Mourinho not being the right profile of manager for Man Utd. However, it would not surprise me one bit if he went back to Italy and became a world beater again. Italian football has a lot of time for his style of football, and I think that environment is what suits him the best.
Mourinho has never been a man to play expansive football. The last team to play expansive football regularly under him was arguably Chelsea 2004-07. Inter Milan were a very defensive team, and Real Madrid fans will tell you that he played too defensively for their liking as well. Chelsea 2013-16 only had small periods of expansive play.
I think there is a compelling argument for Mourinho not being the right profile of manager for Man Utd. However, it would not surprise me one bit if he went back to Italy and became a world beater again. Italian football has a lot of time for his style of football, and I think that environment is what suits him the best.
I may be remembering it wrong but I think the change came back when we beat Tottenham at home in October/November.
Before then we were winning games 3/4-0 at times and battering them. We were lucky to get a win vs. Spurs and since then it seems we've been far more conservative. I think the problem he has which has been echoed is he sets us up a lot of times to not lose rather than to win. Obviously he wants to win I'm sure but that just seems the way he's set up for me. I think something similar happened at Chelsea with him but I can't remember, they started the season (I think it was when they won the league last under him) playing some decent stuff then got turned over one game and went to how we play now, they just won a league doing it. I might of made that up but I'm sure it happened.
I agree with the last point as well. I know we might get a big haul of points but it seems people use that stat to suit them as well, they say City had no competition etc and it's a valid point but we are in a similar position and didn't do much for half a season at least.
I'm not ruling out that possibility at all, but if we're assuming that the club has managed to get three managerial appointments in a row wrong what is the basis for assuming that they're going to get the fourth one right? Especially if the expectation is that they deliver the league title next season, as it will be for Mourinho.
If Mourinho isn't the right man then that raises far more serious questions about the governance of the club than some people seem willing to admit, and I'm just not convinced that sacking the manager is going to fix those.
I can completely see why people feel otherwise, but I think the fact that we're on for – comfortably – our best league campaign since Ferguson retired and that there is enough to suggest Mourinho himself is unhappy with how we've played this season, suggests our best chance of having a successful season next season under his management. That might only be papering over the cracks that run deeper at the club, and I could be wrong, but I just don't have any faith at this point that us sacking our manager will instantly improve us, because I just do not think that there is any sort of plan or roadmap to success in place.
That's definitely what happened. Started off like a house on fire, finished flat as a pancake. They managed to keep grinding out results but performances were generally grim.
Weirdly, if we win our last few games (and, on paper, we should win them all) then we'll have had an incredibly similar season in terms of points/goals etc. to the Chelsea team he last steered to the title. Suffice is to say, that Chelsea team would have also been left in the dust by this season's City.
Chelsea (C) 38 26 9 3 73 32 +41 87
MUFC 33 22 5 6 63 26 +37 71
Depressingly, there's not much basis at all!
That doesn't mean Mourinho is the right manager for us, though. And we will never succeed until we get the right manager on board. He might turn things round next season. I certainly hope he does because I'd say it's very unlikely he'll be sacked between now and the summer. I'm just not very hopeful that will happen. I'm not seeing the signs of progress you'd expect from a team that will go on to win the league next season. Not compared to the other teams with similar ambitions, that's for sure.
Who do the 381 people want in?
Ancelotti would have been great following on from SAF, he's always appeared to be someone who can drop in and continue others work, but we need a coach who can build a coherent structure of attack over a couple of seasons. If Mourinho does move on, which I don't think will happen unless Psg come calling, I would appoint a coach and a director of football at the same time.
A club that we are on the level of (Bayern) just appointed Kovac, of great fame and victory such as Salzburg and the Croatia national team, but posters on here will fight to the death “WHO IS AVAILABLE?!?! WE NEED A PROVEN HISTORY OF TROPHIES!!!”
And it’s been alluded to before in this thread, but our two primary midfielders are Matic and Pogba, both precious league winners and very important cogs in their teams, backed up by our previous player of the year, Herrera, who performed so well Barcelona were interested in him, but all of a sudden this midfield is not good enough? Do you people read what you’re posting?
I loathe to make this comparison, but there is no way a midfield of Can, Henderson, Ox and Wijnaldum can possibly be made to look like a more fluent midfield unit than our own based on anything but coaching and instructions.
The topic of the attack has been done to death and doesn’t even need repeating at this point.
And it’s been alluded to before in this thread, but our two primary midfielders are Matic and Pogba, both precious league winners and very important cogs in their teams, backed up by our previous player of the year, Herrera, who performed so well Barcelona were interested in him, but all of a sudden this midfield is not good enough? Do you people read what you’re posting?
I loathe to make this comparison, but there is no way a midfield of Can, Henderson, Ox and Wijnaldum can possibly be made to look like a more fluent midfield unit than our own based on anything but coaching and instructions.
The topic of the attack has been done to death and doesn’t even need repeating at this point.
Exactly how I feel too. I don't even wanna imagine what it is for the match going fans to go and not know if they'll enjoy the game or not when it is frustrating for me, in the comfort of my living room. I don't care about silverware to an extent because I feel like I've been blessed to watch this team win so much under the greatest manager in history. I just wanna enjoy watching the games and if trophies can be obtained then fecking great.
If there is a chance to get Pochettino. I'd get rid.
I'm convinced Pochettino wouldn't be any worse, results wise while playing a much better brand of football with the same players and the resources available at this club.
I know some will disagree.
I'm convinced Pochettino wouldn't be any worse, results wise while playing a much better brand of football with the same players and the resources available at this club.
I know some will disagree.
Watching us now is very nearly as much of a chore as during LVG 2016. 
That's mostly down to Mourinho.
That's mostly down to Mourinho.Perhaps not, but we saw those 'signs of progress' at the end of Van Gaals last season and then look what happened.
I guess I just think that there enough signs that Mourinho isn't all to blame (and many of the areas I'm thinking of I know you agree with too based on previous discussions) to hope that the other areas will improve under his management.
Maybe that's based on naive optimism, but I guess time will tell.
Yeah I thought it was like that. I think to his credit this City team would beat a lot of the modern day winners but I think even taking them out of it he's really not covered himself in any glory the last few months. It's hugely frustrating cos it's obvious we have the players to do it. We could of put up some what of a fight but overall we just went out on a whimper. It's even more frustrating cos of the talk from the players after the City game. The whole "we'll have your feckin tables" etc stuff.
I don't normally get hugely pissed off after the game I normally just come home and forget it but last night wasn't like that really. I just can't see how much more people would be willing to take. It's a huge risk for me to back him in another transfer window and for another season as like you've said there's not really been huge progression.
I'm not sure to be honest. It's not really our job to decide though? I just think for the way we play and how we're used to playing he isn't right for the team or the club. There's plenty of managers who, for me, could get better out of this team and play in a way that makes you enjoy going to games and not just feel you're going cos you have to.
Yeah exactly. I think people forget at times that football (and all sport) is watched cos you enjoy watching it, for me it's a release from work etc and an entertainment. I of course like winning but first and foremost I want to be enjoying what I'm watching. We've lost games in the past where I've enjoyed it and we've won games in the past where it's been a bit dull but over the course of a season I'd say pretty much the majority of them it's been good. This one (and the LVG/Moyes ones) I can't say the same. It's not cos we don't win all the time, we win plenty under Mourinho and have still won trophies in that period. Its just cos it's dull.
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