The main problem is Mourinho brought prime players for immediate success (Sanchez, Matic, Micky, Zlatan). But I can’t see we will success on league next 2 years which he still doesn’t know what formation and players are the best of the squad after one and half year.
Jose Mourinho | 2017/18 Assessments | Poll Added
- Thread starter Suedesi
- Start date
- Status
Jose is not done as a manager thats outrageous to suggest that but i will admit there is a certain change in his ruthlessness as a manager compared to what he was like before. He has got to share the blame for some obvious flaws.
This is the current scenario of our team:
2 central defenders starting (jones smalling) when they shouldn't given their flaws
2 wingers turned fullbacks who are hit and miss
A flair player called pogba starting as a cm who is never a cm
A special talent (martial) getting shifted into a position where he isn't special at all
A phenomenal player (sanchez) too needlessly moved around as the match goes on
A striker who isn't world class but good enough to get 25 goals in pl is isolated and starved of service
Result:
No building from the back
Clumsy at defending
Shite in possession, just press us a bit and watch us giving the ball within 5 seconds and chasing shadows thereafter.
A proper dm left alone to do the dirty work because of no partner in the middle. Why? Because the other cm lacks discipline and tactical nous to impose himself there in the middle as a cm due to him not being a cm at all. Never have been a cm, never will be proper cm. So not only that leaves us wide open in the middle but also stifles our only player who can run with the ball and beat players through the middle, link up with the attack and bring much needed creativity in the final third Result? Getting overpowered in midfield and teams running rings around.
No midfield also means no transitioning from defence to attack so attacks breakdown before they even start.
Going forward? Clueless. Why? Lack of movement, lack of link up play, lack of maturity overall in picking the right options, players not being played in their best positions where they are most effective.
Also, stubborn manager who for some reason is hellbent to prove that he can turn an attack minded creative mf into a cm and playing our left winger as a right winger who isn't even half effective there to accomodate our new no. 7 who by the way is more than capable of playing on the right wing. Hilarious.
These are obvious flaws and can be rectified easily. I still believe jose is not done yet so I will still give him this summer to sort most of these issues out if not all. But man, it is so infuriating to watch us now given the talent we have especially going forward.
This is the current scenario of our team:
2 central defenders starting (jones smalling) when they shouldn't given their flaws
2 wingers turned fullbacks who are hit and miss
A flair player called pogba starting as a cm who is never a cm
A special talent (martial) getting shifted into a position where he isn't special at all
A phenomenal player (sanchez) too needlessly moved around as the match goes on
A striker who isn't world class but good enough to get 25 goals in pl is isolated and starved of service
Result:
No building from the back
Clumsy at defending
Shite in possession, just press us a bit and watch us giving the ball within 5 seconds and chasing shadows thereafter.
A proper dm left alone to do the dirty work because of no partner in the middle. Why? Because the other cm lacks discipline and tactical nous to impose himself there in the middle as a cm due to him not being a cm at all. Never have been a cm, never will be proper cm. So not only that leaves us wide open in the middle but also stifles our only player who can run with the ball and beat players through the middle, link up with the attack and bring much needed creativity in the final third Result? Getting overpowered in midfield and teams running rings around.
No midfield also means no transitioning from defence to attack so attacks breakdown before they even start.
Going forward? Clueless. Why? Lack of movement, lack of link up play, lack of maturity overall in picking the right options, players not being played in their best positions where they are most effective.
Also, stubborn manager who for some reason is hellbent to prove that he can turn an attack minded creative mf into a cm and playing our left winger as a right winger who isn't even half effective there to accomodate our new no. 7 who by the way is more than capable of playing on the right wing. Hilarious.
These are obvious flaws and can be rectified easily. I still believe jose is not done yet so I will still give him this summer to sort most of these issues out if not all. But man, it is so infuriating to watch us now given the talent we have especially going forward.
Wow, the anti-Mourinho brigade in full blown meltdown. Where were you when we were scoring 4 goals every game? In hiding I guess, waiting for things to go wrong. Cause, we are all great managers behind a keyboard, right?
I support Jose 100% and I think he is the best manager to take us forward, and I am confident he will. I saw 4 clear chances one - on- one yesterday and we did not score. Now, if thats Jose's fault that our players cant score easy chances, then you are clueless about football.
I m also happy we retained his services and we are paying an extra £3m per year. I also think that we should give him more money to bring world class players cause most of the ones we have are just rubbish.
The board clearly does not share your point of view on Jose and I don't think they really care what you think about him. He has been very successful with us, giving us 2 trophies last year and I think more will come this season.
I support Jose 100% and I think he is the best manager to take us forward, and I am confident he will. I saw 4 clear chances one - on- one yesterday and we did not score. Now, if thats Jose's fault that our players cant score easy chances, then you are clueless about football.
I m also happy we retained his services and we are paying an extra £3m per year. I also think that we should give him more money to bring world class players cause most of the ones we have are just rubbish.
The board clearly does not share your point of view on Jose and I don't think they really care what you think about him. He has been very successful with us, giving us 2 trophies last year and I think more will come this season.
I love Jose, but I didn't think we were great even we were scoring 4 goals. But I attributed it to the fact that we did not have any world class attackers and the likes of Martial, Rashford, Mata and Lingard were inconsistent.
But now, Mourinho has Sanchez, a player with genuine moments of world class abilities. There is no excuse for the disjointed show we saw at Newcastle, the attackers were all over the shop. Shoehorning Martial on the right was also a major blunder.
Also, we never seem to be able to recover from deficits. Forget trailing 1-0, even 2-0 shouldn't be a problem, as a team like ours should win 3-2 with some effort, but we rarely, if ever, do that. Is the problem mental or tactical? Jose hasn't addressed this at all.
And the chances. Time and again, our players miss easy one-on-one's with the keeper. I have not seen another team do this so consistently. Shouldn't there be some coaching to improve that?
Like you, I believe Jose will get it right and more trophies will follow. But we have to point out his errors as well. At the moment, our attack looks a lot like Chelsea's in the past 2 games of theirs - completely toothless bar Sanchez/Hazard who try to do something. As it stands, we may well be competing with Chelsea for 4th if this continues.
We have been dragged into a battle for a top 4 spot now. If he fails to finish top 4 for two seasons in a row with the money spent then he will deserve to go. The pressure is on.
If true fair enough, only shows how short we are in some departments though. Need two midfielders in the summer then or 1+Pereira
Guys like you would be a effing big fail as part of the board. So glad you’ re just a fan. That would never take us forward.
So far I think the board has done well. Firing Moyes was spot on, hiring A strict manager with philosophy Van Gaal at the time seemed like a very good deciaion considering the options, sacking him at the right time when it was clear hes taking us nowhere.
Now hiring Mourinho to sort us out, again great decision by the board. U know what you get with Mourinho. Always a chance to win a trophy. And he did fairly well in his first season. But we were really lucky for the draw in EL and in some of the games too and not winning it would mean a poor season. We are always laughing at the team celebrating Mickey mouse cups arent we?
So the question is what can we win this season, the chances are slim of a decent trophy. He spent a lot of money and brought us forward from where we were but we really couldnt drop much deeper from under Moyesiah and LVG, I like how he stabilized us but I am nit sure if he can takes us forward after what weve seen so far. Im not the one who would sack him now hes bringing in good players but at their peak so the mou effect should take place soon as soon valencia, young, matic, sanchez will need replacimg and we start rebuolding again. So big task for him to keep the squad motivated for another season and a half. Hopefully for him he wont fail miserably this season to have a nice push next season for the league which should really be the aim this season too but some managers handles the second season better than others I guess speakinch of that hes the one whos always strong in second season.
And Im not talking about replacimg him because there seem to be no managers to quickly replace him but hes underperforming with the squad he has. He cant get the best out of so many players while improving only few. Not certain style of play. As always his teams attacking play is dependend on motivation and form not based on things like good pressing and movement like every top team does. We always seem to create chances lil bit out of nothing on individual level which is worrying when players are not performing but he should be the one picking the right ones in their best form and motivation.
And sorry I domt get your argument winning 4:0at the beginninng od the season against the relegation fighting teams when the motivation is high is a one thing but maintaining the form ober the course of the whole season is another so lets see if he can surprise a bit because his teams tend to die early as the season progress despite running way less then other teams.
So keep Mourinho till the summer use him to get few world class players, if he doesnt fail miserably give him another season and snatch Pochettino before Real in the meanwhile
I'm anti Mourinho, always have been. So my judgement is heavily biased when I say I'd prefer anyone but him at the club.
I can't stand his anti football philosophy, general negative attitude and his man management is shocking.
I can't stand his anti football philosophy, general negative attitude and his man management is shocking.
Oh the irony.
His failure to learn from his mistakes or try something different is the biggest issue for me. He persists with a system that blatantly doesn't work in tough away games. Hell, it barely even works in home games that look easy on paper. This same issue was Van Gaal's downfall. How can experienced managers be so blinkered and stubborn? Try something different ffs! We just keep banging our heads against the wall, and the only result is it's giving me a headache.
His system has served him countless of trophies all over europe.
Why should we care what worked well for him at other teams, with different players, if it isn't working here?
So had van Gaal’s system. What’s your point?
Why? Because we're not first? In that case any other manager not named pep is shit?
Name a manager or any system that can win the league 10 out of 10.
I'm perfectly fine with not being first in a season like this. It's the quality of our football and our tactically inept displays I take issue with.
If Martial or Sanchez converted one of their chances yesterday, we'd be all happy with an away performance. How can we blame Mourinho when Sanchez decided to pause prior to shooting, or Martial for unusually missing a 1v1, or the two blocked shots he had? Was another frustrating day in which we didn't play well but created enough chances to win the game but we didnt take them.
The injection of Sanchez in the team needs time to gel with the existing crop and that should be Mourinho's top priority as we are going to a tough fixtures list, forget about Newcastle, any other day and we would have torn them apart but shit just hit the fan yesterday.
The injection of Sanchez in the team needs time to gel with the existing crop and that should be Mourinho's top priority as we are going to a tough fixtures list, forget about Newcastle, any other day and we would have torn them apart but shit just hit the fan yesterday.
Yes and they have. A lot of those games weren’t as the scoreline suggested anyway. The Everton and Swansea games were still 1-0 until 80mins. The fact we are getting worse is hardly a good indicator either. We have completely slipped out the title race then and could easily lose second any week now. Jose just isn’t delivering the goods.
We're 2nd. That means we're tactically better than the other 17.
Why? I didn’t make that claim.
Hehe, have you seen the table? This could change to 4th in a few weeks.
In three matches time we might also be 11 points clear of second. Pretty pointless discussion, no?
If you consider having the better players due to our superior financial resources a tactical victory, then sure.
Given our downward spiral and our performance last two games I'd say this is never gonna happen
Last 5 Games for 2nd to 5th:
If the form stays the same for the next five matches (and assuming we give Chelsea a win for their game in hand).... we will be... 2nd.
He still has lots to prove at United.
So far 2nd place is a decent outcome from the league campaign. But he broke the transfer record for pogba and isn't getting enough out of him. Our attack still looks like a bunch of individuals rather than a team. Our midfield is just off. And there's still questuon marks over Lukaku and our RW.
So far 2nd place is a decent outcome from the league campaign. But he broke the transfer record for pogba and isn't getting enough out of him. Our attack still looks like a bunch of individuals rather than a team. Our midfield is just off. And there's still questuon marks over Lukaku and our RW.
My assessment:
Done some good things, still with lots of issues.
Overall a bit underachieved.
Done some good things, still with lots of issues.
Overall a bit underachieved.
Last 5 Games for 2nd to 5th:
If the form stays the same for the next five matches (and assuming we give Chelsea a win for their game in hand).... we will be... 2nd.
Or we might lose our next game while Liverpool win and be third by next week
Yeah so as I said, it’s a completely pointless discussion.
I think any of the managers at the other top 7 clubs would get a lot more out of the talent Jose has at his disposal. It seems he hasn't adapted with the times and this game he is playing with Pogba will only end with Pogba winning once Pogba decides he's had enough.
I think it's a shame that a club with such a tradition for entertaining attacking football has now had three managers since Fergie that have been boring. I used to enjoy watching united play and I find myself asking why I bothered to tune in these days despite the exciting names on the team sheet.
I think it's a shame that a club with such a tradition for entertaining attacking football has now had three managers since Fergie that have been boring. I used to enjoy watching united play and I find myself asking why I bothered to tune in these days despite the exciting names on the team sheet.
Wasn't really discussing it, it's just my opinion that based on how we've been playing we'll drop from 2nd
We
He tried something different yesterday: he played Pogba on the left of a 4-3-3 which loads of people are obsessed about.
Yeap,only game I thought we might get something was Burnley, surprisingly enough which we did.
That was not different, we've been there before many times and I'd struggle to call that a 4-3-3. We once again played a single disciplined midfielder in Matic and 2 who could basically do whatever they pleased in Pogba and Lingard. It was identical to our midfield against Spurs, down to the subs even: we made a double sub of Pogba and Lingard coming off for Mata and Carrick in the 66th minute against Newcastle and for Mata and Fellaini in the 63rd minute against Spurs.
Exactly this!! Great post from a calm mind
Yeah it was a 4-3-3.
Sanchez on the left, Martial on the right. How more different could that be from the rest of the season. And we were comfortable most of the game.
This is getting beyond silly now.
It was the same setup as against Spurs, how is that different? Call it whatever you want, that's just semantics, though if we're going down that road I'd call that abomination a 4-1-4-1 long before I'd call it a 4-3-3. It's a dysfunctional midfield either way.
Jose will definitely look for specialists to make his formation work. It is not just him who can change the team. I also feel this is an attitude issue with this team. Our back line is not trustworthy at all and the 2 CBs he brought in the 2 summer windows are not in games because of either injuries or being less effective. Smalling has to go but Jones can improve his game. Wing-backs except Shaw on the left is completely useless. Our midfield (regardless of the players we choose) is apparently worthless because we always try to by-pass it.
Our forward players are all played out of position except Lukaku and that is not what Jose likes to do but has no options because of Van Gaal and himself (selling Depay was a mistake). A lot has to change at the club for us to see an improvement in terms of performance and positioning and of course goals and wins come after.
So he never tries anything different to 4-2-3-1 but has played 4-3-3 in these two games...
Comparing our current points after 27 games to other seasons, where we would be:
2018 - 2nd, -15 points off 1st.
2017 - 2nd, -10 points off 1st.
2016 - 2nd, -1 point off 1st.
2015 - 2nd, -4 points off 1st. (with 1st having a game in hand)
2014 - 4th, -4 points off 1st.
2013 - 5th, -7 points off 1st (with a game in hand)
Only seasons that stand out are City's unbelievable season at the moment and Chelsea running away with the league when everyone was shite last season. We're not as bad as people make us out to be. Far from great, though.
2018 - 2nd, -15 points off 1st.
2017 - 2nd, -10 points off 1st.
2016 - 2nd, -1 point off 1st.
2015 - 2nd, -4 points off 1st. (with 1st having a game in hand)
2014 - 4th, -4 points off 1st.
2013 - 5th, -7 points off 1st (with a game in hand)
Only seasons that stand out are City's unbelievable season at the moment and Chelsea running away with the league when everyone was shite last season. We're not as bad as people make us out to be. Far from great, though.
- Status