I actually think Ndidi and Rice are far from what we need. It is essential that who we sign is a true DLP that is press resistant.
Jack Grealish / signs new 5 year contract
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Yes but imagine if we didn’t have Bruno, and Pogba is leaving in summer. We could have pay near to Villa asking price for Gealish.
100% agree. We need someone who can break lines and get the ball quickly into the creative players. Last thing we need is some destroyer who can only pass it square.
McTominay can do anything Rice and Ndidi can do.
Reece doesn't have an Ultimate team card though. Must have googled something else
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Why would you compare him to players who play nothing like him in EDV?
What on earth is your argument?
The fact that Chelsea paid £75m for a goalkeeper affects the price of subsequent transfers.
Ultimately, what a player is worth depends on lots of factors.
Chelsea were desperate for a keeper last summer. They need a new goalkeeper this season, but don’t have the same desperation, that is clearly going to affect a transfer fee.
The only time you ever actually know what A player is ‘worth’ is when there is a transfer between 2 clubs.
I pointed to other guys who are getting primary minutes at CM/CDM if someones going to argue against him using a WhoScored rating, without looking at much past the rating. If someone's primary argument is he ranks 14th in the Eredivisie, it is excluding a lot of info. One where he ranks among other CM's, and who does rank above him.
You've still not answered my question. You got involved in my argument that because Fred was £50m doesn't mean Grealish is correctly priced at £80m. I explained that Fred is an international who has CL experience whilst Grealish has neither.
If you disagree with that then I'm asking if Henderson would be worth more than Kepa?
Ultimately there's no hard and fast rule for transfers and my point to @The Oracle was you can't just use comparisons like that to justify a price.
If the rumours are to be believed on the fee for DVB of €40m and Partey for €50m. We could get both for the same amount reported £80m that Grealish is being valued at!
I dont think Grealish will go for £80m. In fact, I think its media made up bullshit. More likely £55m. Which I would be happy to pay. I personally believe Grealish is the real deal and is the perfect squad strengthener.
I dont think Grealish will go for £80m. In fact, I think its media made up bullshit. More likely £55m. Which I would be happy to pay. I personally believe Grealish is the real deal and is the perfect squad strengthener.
Then we largely agree!
When you consider covid, and the only club who would pay big money for Henderson is Chelsea, then no I don’t think Henderson would attract a fee bigger than Kepa.
If we sold him this summer to Chelsea, I think the fee would be around £50m.
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Well then we’re in agreement it’s a stupid attempt to make him look worse than he is.
Who scored metrics are heavily weighted towards forwards who get goals and assists.
It’s a stupid measure of a player In isolation that being said Koopmeiners being a DM/CM/CB for the season out performing him shows his quality.
DVB is the best AM in the Eredivise for me.
Doesn't it make some sense to go for Benrahma to be depth? The only difference is that Grealish got a chance to play in the PL this past season, while Benrahma hasn't gotten that chance. They're the same age, and Benrahma statistically outperformed in when both Grealish and he were in the Championship at the same age (23). And that's despite Grealish playing in a better attacking side in the Championship.
If you think the 1 season Grealish got to play in the PL is enough to warrent an extra dozen or so millions, then fair enough. However, Benrahma could make the same step up Grealish did if given the chance. It's not like we're talking about a Daniel James here. Both were technical players.
Championship 2018/19
-Villa = 82 goals scored, 76 points
-Brentford = 72 goals scored, 61 points
-Grealish (age 23) = 6 goals, 8 assists in 3031 minutes
-Benrahma (age 23) = 11 goals, 17 assists in 2853 minutes
-Grealish (age 22) = 3 goals, 6 assists in 2138 minutes
-Benrahma (age 22) = 10 goals, 5 assists in 2462 minutes in French 2nd division (2 pens)
For added context
-Benrahma (age 24) = 17 goals, 9 assists in 3632 minutes (4 pens)
Dribbling
-Grealish (age 23) = 1.8 dribbles/2.8 attempts per 90 min. Is fouled 4.9 per 90 min.
-Benrahma (age 23) = 3.3 dribbles/6.5 attempts per 90 min. Is fouled 1.3 per 90 min.
Key passes
-Grealish (age 23) = 2.3 per 90 min (0.2 from corners, and 0.2 from freekicks)
-Benrahma (age 23) = 3.3 per 90 min (0.7 from corners and 0.2 from freekicks)
I would be fine with Grealish too btw. I'm just saying it's worth looking at. This isn't meant to paint one player as inferior to the other. They're a little different from one another which is why I've included stats that paint Grealish in a better light than Benrahma and vice versa.
If you think the 1 season Grealish got to play in the PL is enough to warrent an extra dozen or so millions, then fair enough. However, Benrahma could make the same step up Grealish did if given the chance. It's not like we're talking about a Daniel James here. Both were technical players.
Championship 2018/19
-Villa = 82 goals scored, 76 points
-Brentford = 72 goals scored, 61 points
-Grealish (age 23) = 6 goals, 8 assists in 3031 minutes
-Benrahma (age 23) = 11 goals, 17 assists in 2853 minutes
-Grealish (age 22) = 3 goals, 6 assists in 2138 minutes
-Benrahma (age 22) = 10 goals, 5 assists in 2462 minutes in French 2nd division (2 pens)
For added context
-Benrahma (age 24) = 17 goals, 9 assists in 3632 minutes (4 pens)
Dribbling
-Grealish (age 23) = 1.8 dribbles/2.8 attempts per 90 min. Is fouled 4.9 per 90 min.
-Benrahma (age 23) = 3.3 dribbles/6.5 attempts per 90 min. Is fouled 1.3 per 90 min.
Key passes
-Grealish (age 23) = 2.3 per 90 min (0.2 from corners, and 0.2 from freekicks)
-Benrahma (age 23) = 3.3 per 90 min (0.7 from corners and 0.2 from freekicks)
I would be fine with Grealish too btw. I'm just saying it's worth looking at. This isn't meant to paint one player as inferior to the other. They're a little different from one another which is why I've included stats that paint Grealish in a better light than Benrahma and vice versa.
I don't particularly expect anything from a full back - any 'kind' can add value to a team if they have the requisite quality.
Being adept at, and extremely partial to, tackling doesn't make Wan Bissaka a first class defender - when I said he doesn't know what he's doing aside from defending one on one, I wasnt talking about his attacking play.
Wan Bissaka has only came into the discussion because of a rumoured £80m asking price for Grealish. Many seem perplexed at the potential valuation and I don't really see why - he's the best player, captain, talisman of the club, is under contract and had an excellent season with Villa only just surviving and with very ambitious owners. They obviously won't want to sell. And reluctant sellers will obviously set a high price. Then look at the general state of the transfer market. Look at how expensive it is buying from other Premier League teams. And yes, look at what United pay for players. £80m on Maguire, £50m for Fernandes, £50m for Fred, £20m for Dalot, £75m for Lukaku, £40m for Matic. It wouldn't be at all surprising if Villa want £80m for Grealish, and even less so if we have shown an interest.
Have you even seen him play? All there is in this post is rather basic numbers.
Stats are for losers. Do you not have an opinion of your own?
Yeah, my main point was showing how faulty using statistics (especially a catch-all like WhoScored ratings) without context isn't exactly insightful or useful. I just pointed to the other guys above him who are at least considered CM's or CDM's and how they rated when used as CM/CDM in comparison to DVB, as that is the closest you can get comparison-wise (and even that is riddled with flaws).
At the right price, I'd be in on Grealish. But, I have a hard time reconciling what we would have to pay if we are already adding Sancho, as he only really adds cover for Bruno (or as a 10 in a 4-2-3-1) or for Rashford/Sancho/Greenwood. With what is left of the transfer budget after that, I'd prefer adding someone who has a level of comfort playing further back than Grealish, but can also play Bruno's role. That doesn't have to be DVB. Now, as stated, if the Sancho deal doesn't come to fruition, adding Grealish who can play as an 11, 10, or 7 in our current system would be a wise move. But, I don't see spending 55m to 60m on a guy who would likely be replacing Bruno, when we hope to have Greenwood/Sancho/Martial/Rashford in rotation for the 3 attacking spots. If we are trying to add someone who can spell Bruno and on the wings, that we could probably find someone at a much better price, who improves the squad, but it doesn't cost the EPL English-premium for a likely squad player. I get paying the English/EPL tax for locked-in starters even if its rich like in the case of Maguire and AWB. But, I don't get paying it for someone who isn't expected to walk into our first XI.
So we can’t compare any players in different leagues? Didn’t realise he had signed for Madrid either.
Nice strawman.
People are not complaining about number of crosses at all. They're complaining about how awkward he's on the ball, how he needs multiple touches to get the ball under control and how he's always stumbling whenever he's trying to run with the ball. We never get any attacking momentum going with him on the ball because he can't receive it at pace and keep running with it to launch a quick attack. In the last game he was missing easy ten yard passes to teammates to give the opposition a counter-attacking opportunity.
Can you not see this at all? Do you think he's good enough on the ball to be an attacking outlet? Do you not think that the right back for a club with aspirations to challenge for honours needs to be part of the attacking unit?
Erm because he is a defender?
Surely a defender who is exemplary in one on one situations and tackling in general is the prerequisite quality you look for in any type of defender. Current fashionable tactics deem attacking fullbacks a preference, but if they can't defend for sh*t then that becomes the primary problem over how well the player is going forward.
As for the bolded part, that's all well and good but when our squad is all fit he doesn't get into our starting 11, so that's all ultimately irrelevant because something is only worth what a person is willing to pay.
He could be made of liquid gold, if it doesn't ad appeal to the buying party then it means little.
He won't move for £80 million. Because he's not worth £80 million to any buying club.
Personally I see Villa selling for close to £55 million and I'd be very surprised if they didn't sell him at all. He wants a move and they need to add depth and strengthen in multiple areas.
Yeah that was a good point to be fair.
...I was valuing Grealish at more than Fred's £50m because Fred has underwhelmed since he's been here (I really do want him to live up to expectations).
You're right, for the £50m we were signing a Brazilian international with Champions League experience. So the £50m at the time was a fair fee.
If we're being honest Grealish should be a similar price, but with Villa staying up, the fact that he's English, and is Villa's star man, then I think we're going to be looking at circa £60m... anything more and we will well and truly be getting ripped off.
I'd be pissed over being priced out of a move if I were him after everything he's done for them from the Championship to helping drag them out of relegation. He's earned the right to explore new opportunities on his own terms
Grealish has a chance to be in Euros. However it will be difficult if he is playing for AV and thinking of survival in Premier League.
For Euro purposes it’s better to be a big fish in a small pond rather than a small fish in a big pond. At Villa he will start every game. If he comes to United he isn’t going to start every game. He will be important but won’t start every week.
Villa have priced him out. Ain’t no way we are paying 80m for bloody Grealish. While VDB may not be better he is close to Grealish’s level and has played on the biggest stage in the world. Probably can get him for 30m and if he turns out that he’s good enough we won’t even need Grealish and his dreams of playing for a top club would be ruined 
Good decision if true. While Sancho is the first xi player we need desperately, grealish is not. Plus we now have both Bruno and Pogba unlike the start of the season where there was no playmaker whenever Pogba was injured. This probably means lingard will stay though. Probably cb will be the next priority after Sancho.
There’s a simple solution to this, sign Donny van de Beek instead.
Yeah, Villa being dicks here denying the player the move he deserves after what he's done for them. Also taking the piss at that price. Van de Beek is a more logical option, but would prefer Grealish if possible.
VDB is available for one third of that price. Just sign him.
We could get Buendia and Brooks for that price.
Shouldn't we be prioritising the Sancho deal ahead of Greasy-Grealish anyway ?
They've got billionaire owners but a shit club
We won’t pay that, not a hope. And rightfully so.
I'd rather that than spunk our load on Grealish
I can’t see us paying over the top for him and even originally it looked like an unlikely deal – he wasn’t going to get a starting place anyway (not from the beginning at least) and surely a 24 years old player of his stature (rightly) wants a more prominent role? With Villa staying up, the price would rise up from over the top to borderline insane for someone who you won’t going to build your team around.
I wouldn't mind him coming to us at all, but I certainly don't want to be blowing £80million on him and then risk not having the funds for players in positions where we're desperate for improvements.
We’ve cooled our interest and baulked at the price
What's the bet one of the other top 5/6 come in for him and he goes for around 50?
Just because it's Utd, they'll up the fee
Not fussed. Let’s settle Sancho first and look at what our options are after selling some deadwood of ours
Thought it was the other way round
This. I have nightmares of Matic turning on the ball in his own defensive third and being set upon by a high pressing midfield/attack.
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