Well if any manager in world football has proven themselves its Mourinho. When you win the CL with Porto and a treble in Italy then you have earned the right to ask football neophyte investment banker Ed Woodward for the players you think you need to advance the club's objectives.
Ivan Perisic
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Well if any manager in world football has proven themselves its Mourinho. When you win the CL with Porto and a treble in Italy then you have earned the right to ask football neophyte investment banker Ed Woodward for the players you think you need to advance the club's objectives.
Not more than LVG to be fair. They were good, some time ago. For United, they have both massively underperformed and Mourinho winning UCL with Porto in 2004 is as relevant as LVG winning UCL with the youngest side ever in 1995. For United, Mourinho has everything to prove.
The same thing applies to LVG. It doesn't matter if it was a while back - its still on their CVs. If you go out and hire a CL winning manager who has won a boatload of trophies in multiple leagues then you have to support them when they tell you they need x and y player in order to get the job done. Otherwise don't hire them.
We had 3 managers since SAF retired. One was recommended by SAF, one was a proven manager who helped in the development of great managers like Mou and Pep, finally we've got the second best manager the EPL had ever seen, a treble winner and a proven winner in 3 major leagues (Spain, Italy, England). All of them failed. You might also say that the big man himself failed to leave behind a great side as top players like Giggs, Rio, Vidic, Ronaldo and Scholes were systematically replaced with average players in what was considered the 'value' strategy. Guess what was their common denominator?
And CV's of Trappatoni and Lippi are as good too, but if we hire them and they want to spend 100m euros on Christian Vieri, it doesn't mean that Ed needs to do so.
A bit of a pointless thought experiment since we haven't hired any of them. The manager we have hired wanted a 50m player who he felt was the final piece last summer and Ed didn't deliver. At that point, we can't blame the manager for what happened since he provided the missing player and the board opted not to support him. Therefore the problem isn't the manager its Woodward. And if it happens again this summer then we shouldn't expect any different results.
There is always going to be a tension between a manager who is focussed on delivering short-term results, and a board who have to consider the long term viability and value of the squad.
I'm surprised we haven't brought in a Director of Football to balance these two competing visions, like most other clubs.
I'm surprised we haven't brought in a Director of Football to balance these two competing visions, like most other clubs.
It's quite nice (in a depressing sort of way) that Perisic had a good World Cup so that this incredibly obvious point is no longer met with streams of responses calling you mad for thinking that Perisic might have made a difference.
I think a vast majority on here hadn't ever seen Perisic play at that point. To the transfer enthusiasts, he was merely a dull, generic name in contrast to the likes of CR7, Bale, Dembele and the others.
Woodward is right not to pay stupid money for players like Perisic and Willian, neither are top class, neither are marketable and neither have any resale value.
Then don't expect any different results if we are not prepared to buy the players the manager wants.
Indeed.
My gripe is that I don't want Jose to have any excuses for underperforming.
If we are losing or not doing as well as we should, right now, he can always say that, "I did not have the squad which I wanted". It's such an easy answer - almost like a get-out-of-jail card.
Back the manager, within reason give him what he wants and then make him do well. Put him under pressure - Jose can handle it.
I don't expect the football to improve under Mourinho no matter who we buy and I am 100% certain that neither Perisic or Willian would make a bit of difference to City walking the league again and us doing feck all in the CL.
This board consider long term value and viability?
The only thing the board looks at is the balance sheet
Exactly.
Some on here seem to believe that if we keep telling the manager "no", that somehow, we'll start doing well.
Back the manager or if you don't have any faith in him, sack him and hire someone you do have faith in.
As it should be. Hire and fully back the manager to the greatest degree possible and if he shows he's not up for it after full backing then replace him.
That's a losers attitude right there.
"No matter what I do, I can't succeed, so I may as well give up". Nobody achieves anything in life, with this attitude. You need to fight to achieve things in life and in sport, you need to take risks. Not buying players and keeping the money in your bank account won't improve our chances of success.
If he is that good, why aren't Madrid buying Perisic then? I mean they aren't getting Neymar and Hazard. Perisic could bridge the gap for Asensio and Vinicius Junior.
What's full backing? How much money is enough? Because this argument could go on indefinitely
Weren't you saying that we shouldn't sign a CB for the third summer in a row? What if Mourinho genuinely wants Alderweireld or another CB more than anything else?
Give him the players he wants - as in, don't ask him to give you a list then say you can have 3 but not 4, then magically expect him to deliver the results you want. In terms of Perisic, he's a player we could've easily bought last year.
That's my view, but I'm just a fan. If Mourinho has something else in mind then ultimately its his call.
We signed a far superior player for the same position that the manager wanted too, and nothing changed. So the problem is the manager.
He's still our manager though and the club have decided to proceed with him, in which case he should receive full backing. If we are planning on half-arsing it by only giving him one or two players when he's asked for 3 or 4 then we have no one but ourselves to blame for our results this year.
I don’t see what all the fuss is about, he has a good World Cup but we wanted him as LW and got Sanchez instead.
Signing him to play on the right for more money than we were prepared to pay last summer wouldn’t make any sense. It was similar reaction when he started last season on great form but everyone forgot about him when his form dipped.
I don’t care why we didn’t sign him as will never know for certain, cannot understand why in the last year we haven’t found an alternative other than Willian though. As with most of the issues at the club the manager and the board share the blame.
Signing him to play on the right for more money than we were prepared to pay last summer wouldn’t make any sense. It was similar reaction when he started last season on great form but everyone forgot about him when his form dipped.
I don’t care why we didn’t sign him as will never know for certain, cannot understand why in the last year we haven’t found an alternative other than Willian though. As with most of the issues at the club the manager and the board share the blame.
Perisic was pretty mediocre for Milan last season. Bullet dodged imo.
As Jose said, you cannot have all the things you want in life. He has to provide something more than shit on a stick football after spending 350m pounds in a team which finished level with City when he got it.
I think jose wants to bring a ball playing defender and perisic. So that he can field a 3-5-2 with sanchez-lukaku operating in front and perisic as a left wing back.
Its not rocket science - either support him or don't support him. But don't expect success after you are attempting to justify an argument that doesn't support him.
Very flawed logic.
No, it's just accepting reality, right now we just have to see out the Mourinho storm, I'd rather keep the powder dry for the next manager, not saddle him with £120M worth of 30 year olds on huge wages that he can't shift to bring in his own players.
Jose gonna Jose, you could give him any player in the world he fancies, if it didn’t work out he’d just throw the players he bought under the bus and say they weren’t his first choice. Currently he’s just throwing Ed under the bus, but Ed doesn’t cost us £50m so isn’t going to eat into our ability to provide investment to the inevitable next guy.
If Jose spends all the cash, what does the next guy get to work with. You can’t even use the old “sell before you buy” axiom if the team is full of old shite that nobody is going to give you cash for.
Oh my god. That’s right.
Time fliesHe's technically his boss but it's a dotted line.
The man knows fcuk all about football. If Woodward is adjudicating Joses transfers we have a monumental problem.
We can paint him as a deal maker in that he can tell Jose "Player X will cost £Y, leaving you with £Z, should we do it" but never in a million years should Woodward be making full cost/benefit decisions on player purchases.
Everyone working under him will be the owner of their own Budget. Mourinho will be no different.
A manager does not get everythong he wants, no manager does. We have supported him a lot, if he can't even get the players playing some decent football, then he can feck off. Signing average players who have not much shelf life is not going to make us win the league either, he needs to show a lot more before he can be given blind backing, especially since the players he himself has signed have not exactly been a success. Also, he is the one who said we don't need any more attacking players after signing Sanchez, who has been subpar so far.
You can't have all the things you want in life so don't expect exciting football
It is not a binary choice though. There is something on the middle between fullfill every wish of the manager and do nothing. On his first two summers, we signed 7 out of 8 players Mourinho wanted and we signed an another one (which we made the highest payed player in the league) in the winter. Mourinho did not get Perisic, but got Sanchez a few months later. Yet shit on the stick football didn't stop.
Finally, coach's main job is to coach players and do with what he has. Mourinho has miserably failed and no amounts of UCL he has won decades ago justifies it.
Really good perspective to frame things for folks that keep excusing the higher ups.
Clearly so, but adding Perisic wouldn't have changed anything. We got fecking Sanchez and nothing changed. If people think that if we got a far inferior player instead would have made us play better than shit on a stick football, then I don't know what to say.
Football is not some Shakespear poem either. Throwing ridiculous sums on average players won’t bring us closer to City, nor make us fight and take risks. Like every other successful company we need a vision and smart planning.
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