Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less

Spark said:
Well in the same way Hamas doesn’t refer to itself as a terrorist organisation, can’t expect Haaretz to refer to Israeli’s as terrorists.
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BBC calls them protesters and CNN calls them settler activists.
 
Spark said:
Well in the same way Hamas doesn’t refer to itself as a terrorist organisation, can’t expect Haaretz to refer to Israeli’s as terrorists.
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I don't expect Haaretz to call them terrorists, it's the activist label I have an issue with. You see it also in Western media, and sometimes they just call them Jewish activists.
 
Idxomer said:
I don't expect Haaretz to call them terrorists, it's the activist label I have an issue with. You see it also in Western media, and sometimes they just call them Jewish activists.
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They should be labelled as terrorists in a similar mold of early Irgun/Stern Gang/ Haganah attacks a century ago.
 
Spark said:
Well in the same way Hamas doesn’t refer to itself as a terrorist organisation, can’t expect Haaretz to refer to Israeli’s as terrorists.
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I did not know Hamas has a newspaper. Haarretz ment to be a lefty free speech newspaper, but I guess no real free speech in Israel as we thought.
 
please stop this "who is a terrorist" discourse. it always goes in circles and never leads to anything productive. happens with every single mass killing in a non-american context too. the only value of this discourse is that the word "terrorist" is massively negative, while "militant" etc are not so we're always trying to put our side into the nicer box.
 
berbatrick said:
please stop this "who is a terrorist" discourse. it always goes in circles and never leads to anything productive. happens with every single mass killing in a non-american context too. the only value of this discourse is that the word "terrorist" is massively negative, while "militant" etc are not so we're always trying to put our side into the nicer box.
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I blame the US.
 
Unmasking counterprotesters who attacked UCLA’s pro-Palestine encampment

American citizens are being abused by pro-Israel people for expressing their constitutional right to assemble. This is happening on U.S. soil, and nothing is being done. This reminds me of what's the settlers are doing in the West Bank: abuse others, without being stopped by the Israeli army/law enforcement. Biden is a big big disappointment.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/16/us/ucla-student-protests-counterprotesters-invs/index.html
 
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ManUtd1999 said:
Unmasking counterprotesters who attacked UCLA’s pro-Palestine encampment

American citizens are being abused by pro-Israel people for expressing their constitutional right to assemble. This is happening on U.S. soil, and nothing is being done. This reminds me of what's the settlers are doing in the West Bank: abuse others, without being stopped by the Israeli army/law enforcement. Biden is a big big disappointment.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/16/us/ucla-student-protests-counterprotesters-invs/index.html
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Imagine a liberal state like California, the police watches the far right mob attack and terrorise peaceful protesters, just like the IDF watches the settlers kill and terrorise Palestanians.
 
Giggsyking said:
Imagine a liberal state like California, the police watches the far right mob attack and terrorise peaceful protesters, just like the IDF watches the settlers kill and terrorise Palestanians.
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This is why I mentioned Biden. He doesn't control the LAPD, but he's a Democrat president, and he sets the tone. Had he chosen to speak against this, I believe Newsom and other local officials would have acted differently. No one wants to undercut a sitting president from their party, particularly during an election year.

They may just regret all of this come November. The Dems could lose many minority and young voters, and not just in 2024. Not to mention of course the moral failure, which is big in itself.
 
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Giggsyking said:
So they tried to reach out to Jay-z to convince him condemn the pro Palestine protests. Because Jay-z is an expert in international politics?
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They are trying to silence people who dare to protest policies of a foreign country... a country that equals 1/4 of California. They are trying to intimidate everyone.
 
ManUtd1999 said:
They are trying to silence people who dare to protest policies of a foreign country... a country that equals 1/4 of California. They are trying to intimidate everyone.
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Seriously, I think this will only make things worse.
 


Building a port with the rubble of the buildings they destroyed, mixed with the bodies of the people they killed. How sick is that?
 
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Giggsyking said:


Building a port with the rubble of the buildings they destroyed, mixed with the bodies of the people they killed. How sick is that?
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Does anyone have any actual information on this, other than the tweet? I'll be honest, I didn't know there were vast oil reseves in Gaza.
 
Beachryan said:
Does anyone have any actual information on this, other than the tweet? I'll be honest, I didn't know there were vast oil reseves in Gaza.
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There's massive gas reserves in the Gaza shores discovered by BG Group (a British company) in 2000 which are legally under the jurisdiction of the PA, according to the Oslo Accords. More than enough to power the Palestinian territories and allow exportation.

Israel currently prevents Palestinians the physical access to these fields.
 
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Beachryan said:
Does anyone have any actual information on this, other than the tweet? I'll be honest, I didn't know there were vast oil reseves in Gaza.
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Gas. Yes, Google Gaza gas. Off Gaza's coast (maritime area G) Israel granted 6 companies including BP and an Italian company license to extract. It's a grave violation of international law.

"Under international law, Israel is prohibited from using the limited non-renewable resources of the occupied territories for commercial gain and for the benefit of the occupying power, in accordance with the usufruct rules referred to in Article 55 of the Hague Regulations"
 
Thanks all, that's so interesting, makes you think of a Norway-like economic possibility.
 


But he and his colleagues have insisted they not leave unless the IDF allows in a new rotation, otherwise the patients will all die and the IDF will overrun the hospital and leave it in ruins as they have done to every other hospital in Gaza. Five staff were evacuated today but Hamawy refused to go, leaving his body on the line to defend and to treat his patients. He is effectively saying, if they are going to kill everyone in the hospital, they'll have to kill him too.
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Israeli army finds bodies of 3 hostages in Gaza killed at Oct. 7 music festival

JERUSALEM (AP) — The Israeli military said Friday its troops in Gaza found the bodies of three Israeli hostages killed by Hamas during its Oct. 7 attack, including German-Israeli Shani Louk.

A photo of 22-year-old Louk’s twisted body in the back of a pickup truck ricocheted around the world and brought to light the scale of the militants’ attack on communities in southern Israel. The military identified the other two bodies as those of a 28-year-old woman, Amit Buskila, and a 56-year-old man, Itzhak Gelerenter.
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https://apnews.com/article/israel-h...s-shani-louk-a37e4fd656b46be36c4c659a9c2aac7d
 


I've posted a bunch of stuff like this for 2 reasons:
1. I don't think Bibi is the fundamental barrier
2. "PA and Hamas schools teach kids hate"
 
It just occurred to me. Everyone in the world can now barge into their neighbour's house and take it over, and when they naturally come under attack, they have the right to defend themselves
 
No one I have talked to in the IDF wants anything to do with this plan. They see it as something to be done only if there is absolutely no choice.
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berbatrick said:


I've posted a bunch of stuff like this for 2 reasons:
1. I don't think Bibi is the fundamental barrier
2. "PA and Hamas schools teach kids hate"
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Israelis are heavily indoctrinated from kindergarten on.

For example any talk of the Nakba is strictly forbidden in schools. Add to that the systematic militarization of the society, decades of occupation and dehumanization of the Palestininans and you'll get what what you actually see.

Israel is an anachronistic colonial society, operating within rules and laws that are at least a hundred years outdated. By all means and intent, it would have been stopped dead in its tracks decades ago by the very same powers that currently support it, if not for what happened during WWII.

The tragic farce will eventually come to an end at some point.
 
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