Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less




Anadolu : Turkish news agency.

This guy lives in Qatar. According to media reports, his family is some real estate tycoons and net worth is in millions. From the comfort of his place in Qatar, he has declared no migration. How come freedom fighters these days live in penthouses in a different country while their own people are dying in the streets.
 


This interview is basically a talking head saying things their enemies are doing, that they're also guilty of, as justification as to why they are OK to do what they are doing.
 
mariachi-19 said:
If that’s legit, it pretty much equates to “feck around and find out” to Israel. This has gone from an act of retribution to virtually terrorism.
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Not really. It is not like US is gonna cut off its 3.8B annual funding to Israel if they don't listen.
 
Sky1981 said:
Sanctions? Embargo? Condemnation? You really seriously believing if this is Russia or China they'd stop at "strongly urge"?
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What @tomaldinho1 said.

And, do you really see Biden sanctioning Israel at this moment in their history? That's simply not realistic. I don't think a president can unilaterally embargo, might be wrong here though. Don't see a condemnation coming any time soon directed to such a staunch ally either.

Don't think China or Russia has a current ally to either one of them in the same vein as Israel is to us. If they did, I wouldn't expect any of the possibilities you offered being undertaken by either or both of them.
 
pratyush_utd said:



Anadolu : Turkish news agency.

This guy lives in Qatar. According to media reports, his family is some real estate tycoons and net worth is in millions. From the comfort of his place in Qatar, he has declared no migration. How come freedom fighters these days live in penthouses in a different country while their own people are dying in the streets.
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From Hamas I’d guess only a very very small proportion DO live in penthouses abroad, which is why his name comes up so often.The Times of Israel says

“The head of Hamas’s political bureau is expected to live outside of Gaza, as traveling in and out of the Strip is difficult.”

So for all the possible reasons to attack him, and there are clearly a few, I wouldn’t choose this hill to die on.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Israel had agreed at some level not to target him in Qatar. Whether that commitment stays the same I’m less sure of.
 
Israel has killed officially 700 kids, newborns, infants, children. I say officially as they, right now, still pulling bodies out of the rubble.

I wonder if there’ll be wider outrage on 700 kids.
 
pratyush_utd said:



Anadolu : Turkish news agency.

This guy lives in Qatar. According to media reports, his family is some real estate tycoons and net worth is in millions. From the comfort of his place in Qatar, he has declared no migration. How come freedom fighters these days live in penthouses in a different country while their own people are dying in the streets.
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I think the bigger worry about stopping people fleeing to Egypt is the presumption that they'll never be allowed back. The fear is it'll be the like 1948 all over again, Hamas do not want to give up Gaza and the Egyptians don't want to be stuck with a million refugees who have nowhere to go.
 
Murder on Zidane's Floor said:


This interview is basically a talking head saying things their enemies are doing, that they're also guilty of, as justification as to why they are OK to do what they are doing.
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This week is the first time I've really listened to LBC and there have been a few discussions regarding Israel's response in Gaza. One of the hosts (I'm not sure of his name) was very clear on his support for Israel having the right to defend itself, even when callers were calling in saying that their response is killing innocent civilians etc his response was pretty much "What should Israel do? They have a right to defend themselves". For me, if that's your stance then that's your stance, at least come out and say you believe Israel has the right to kill innocent civilians in order to "destroy Hamas", which is effectively what he is saying without uttering the words. To me, I see Israel as the big brother to Palestine being the little brother. I hold the big brother to a higher standard. When you have the strength, money and technology that Israel have along with the backing of the entire west, I will hold you to a higher standard. They are and have been in a position it seems to end this crisis or at least reduce it, yet haven't. To me their plan of attack in Palestine isn't a strategic " what is the best and most humane way to solve this problem" plan(which based on their strength of position they should be able to take), but rather a plan of revenge that does not care how many innocent civilians get killed. For me I personally cannot support such a nonchalant attitude for innocent lives from a modern, democratic society.
 
The Corinthian said:
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Heartbreaking. The stuff I’ve seen this last week has been abhorrent.
The Boy said:
We've had our differences in the past, but this is spot on.

I have no credence for the conspiracy theory, but the original post clearly says Israeli government and that clearly does not mean "the Jews" as the response stated. The quicker people stop equating a leadership with a whole people in this thread, the better.
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Everyone must see this. Inside of Gaza. Reporting whilst risking his own life. Just 5 minutes long.

 
kaku06 said:
Everyone must see this. Inside of Gaza. Reporting whilst risking his own life. Just 5 minutes long.

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Someone posted a video here earlier of an Israeli in Ashkelon (the one who boasted that the sounds of rocket hitting Gaza brought her some much joy), claiming she was leaving temporarily for Jerusalem because the sounds of sirens going off were too loud for her. Constrast that to the situation here, where the people of Gaza are trapped through no fault of their own, with no where to go, and anywhere they could go is a dice roll away from death.

Thats the difference in this conflict. One side can relocate as they please, the other utterly trapped and hopeless with no where to go. They are essentially at the mercy of a blood-crazed military, thirsty for revenge, with the West essentially giving them a blessing to do as they please under the guise of defending themselves.

Its feckin tragic.
 
adexkola said:
Isn't this like, not kosher?
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Yep - that’s what’s so hypernorm about it.

Although you don’t have to be Jewish to serve in the IDF. It’s mandatory for Jews to serve but optional for non-Jews, so who knows.

(CC: @Pintu)
 
hasanejaz88 said:
Their ultimate aim has always been to terrorize the Palestinan population to leave Gaza so they can take over that land and complete their Zionist endeavor to make the whole land Jewish.
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This is true. The reverse is precisely the ultimate aim of Hamas. So you have two enemies determined to destroy one another. That's the situation and has been for a long time. It's impossible for one side to step back from that unless the other does and so neither will.
 
Drainy said:
To the average Palestinian, I imagine they would say it's the same thing, but the UN resolution provides legitimacy to the formation of Israel. Expansion immediately afterwards can be 'pseudo justified' as the 'spoils of war' especially as those aggressed upon, but continued annexation against occupied people who they should be trying to reach a peace agreement with isn't right to me.
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It's very similar.

The UN resolution was almost all European countries, undoubtedly horrified at what they had just seen on their continent, north and south American countries, who's people's and governments were created by centuries of European settler colonialism and ethnic cleansing and several countries elsewhere who came upon heavy pressure from the USA, in various ways, to vote for the resolution. The zionists from memory managed to filibuster the original vote date to allow the Americans to apply more pressure, as it may not have initially passed.

As I said, in reality it changes nothing now because there's no going back in time and international relations is rarely fair.

But I don't see anything fundamentally morally different between displacing a Palestinian in the 1940s and displacing a Palestinian in the 2020s. These are still the spoils of war. The Palestinians are weak. They're losing. So what's the difference?

Main people able to accept that link seem to be the settlers still displacing them.
 
Pintu said:
Meanwhile ethnic cleansing enablers in the West:

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There’s this too:



The UK is effectively a soft fascist state with the likes of Suella as our Home Secretary. She’s an evil bitch. Staggering that we could get someone worse than Priti Patel.

It’ll be a crime to wave a Palestinian flag in a week or so. They’ll go after peaceful protests next. Then they’ll go after protestors who are pro Palestinian on social media. They already have on some companies here.
 
This is how the BBC is reporting the protest that I was at in London the other day:



@africanspur @Pogue Mahone tagging you because we previously had a discussion on the one-eyed ness of BBC’s reporting on this conflict.

There was no Hamas flag at the Palestine march on Saturday and no one I met was there in support of them.
 
There is less and less doubt that as a society we are utter and complete failure. Even in this day and age, there are such horrible crimes that you can only look in disbelief and sorrow. If not for our families or more precise younger generations/kids we might as well pack it and call it a day. Extremely hard to watch this ongoing in various parts of the world on a daily basis and not wondering where we are all heading.

Hopefully, the killing and suffering will somehow stop.
 
The Corinthian said:
This is how the BBC is reporting the protest that I was at in London the other day:



@africanspur @Pogue Mahone tagging you because we previously had a discussion on the one-eyed ness of BBC’s reporting on this conflict.

There was no Hamas flag at the Palestine march on Saturday and no one I met was there in support of them.
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Is this the same one-eyed news corporation that broadcast the fears of a surgeon in Gaza to the nation? Of course you know this, as you replied to a tweet which showed his interview. A few posts above this one.
 
Jim Beam said:
There is less and less doubt that as a society we are utter and complete failure. Even in this day and age, there are such horrible crimes that you can only look in disbelief and sorrow. If not for our families or more precise younger generations/kids we might as well pack it and call it a day. Extremely hard to watch this ongoing in various parts of the world on a daily basis and not wondering where we are all heading.

Hopefully, the killing and suffering will somehow stop.
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agreed. Everytime you think the bar couldn"t be lowered any further, we as a society manage to do it.
 
adexkola said:
Meanwhile on this side of the pond...



What's the point of lying?
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The absence of any moral compass is really dystopian. It's, been there for years but lately it's not even subtle or nuanced. No sleight of hand necessary anymore. So depressing.
 
VorZakone said:
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So what happens if Hellbollah do go all in and attack israel? Can israel really hold the west bank, continue their ground offense in gaza and fight hezbollah without help?

If the americans start bombing hezbollah. then all bets are off on how wide and bad this could get.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Is this the same one-eyed news corporation that broadcast the fears of a surgeon in Gaza to the nation? Of course you know this, as you replied to a tweet which showed his interview. A few posts above this one.
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Did you watch the clip I posted?

If you did, do you think the presenter/autocue made a mistake or was it intentional?
 
The Boy said:
I think the bigger worry about stopping people fleeing to Egypt is the presumption that they'll never be allowed back. The fear is it'll be the like 1948 all over again, Hamas do not want to give up Gaza and the Egyptians don't want to be stuck with a million refugees who have nowhere to go.
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Bingo.

I also think the Palestinians are wary of this and would rather just stay even if it means they might die.
 
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