Israel - Iran and regional players | Please post respectfully
- Thread starter Raoul
- Start date
The strategy here makes little to no sense
1) Fire rockets at US base - 99% of the time intercepted or missed.
2) Rocket lands, minor damage
3) Rocket lands - someone dies
4) US retaliates by blowing up 100 militia assets in a series of airstrikes and missile launches.
5) ?????
6) Iran profits?
Biden and the US are ramping up for war. Lockheed Martin stocks avoided the crash and are up over 20% the last month and we were warned Trump would start a war with Iran.
The world seemed a lot safer 3 or 4 years ago personally speaking
This is what has been happening throughout much of the latter half of the Iraq war and occasionally in the present. Iranian proxies like Asa'ib al-Haq or Kata'ib Hezbollah (or similar) would pop off rockets, mortars when ever they can (or EFPs when troops were still driving around outside). Its the easiest and way for the Iranians to hit US targets whilst maintaining plausible deniability.
To what end, though? What does Iran hope to achieve?
Depends on the context. Right now? They're obliged to retaliate following Israel's assassination of Ismail Haniyeh in Tehran, so this is their flaccid response to show face. In the grand scheme of things they want the US locked into a perpetual insurgency campaign in countries like Iraq. Better their neighbours than inviting a direct confrontation within their borders. They know they can't win a conventional war against the US or Israel, since inevitably the Gulf Arab states would also work on squeezing them. So proxy insurgencies are their means to destabilise the US and its regional allies.
Its a proxy war between Iran and the US and/or Iran and Israel. The regime have a fairly vast network of proxy groups who they control/fund/arm/train throughout the region for the explicit purpose of advancing the regime's foreign policy objectives. Beyond destroying Israel by way of Hamas and Hezbollah, they have also used the Yemenis against Saudi, and a variety of Iraqi Shi'a paramilitary groups against Saddam, various Sunni insurgent groups throughout the Iraq war, as well as the US. The regime know they can't get into a protracted shooting war with any of these countries, so they instead use proxy groups to do their dirty work. In addition to all of this, they also utilize Syria as a staging and logistics point to arm some of their groups inside Syria, as well as to get weapons to Hezbollah.
Then they're using these groups as cannon fodder because they have little to no chance of inflicting meaningful damage on the US military
We're talking about a regime that sent boys as young as 12 to fight during the Iran/Iraq war. So naturally, they're not going to care how many foreign paramilitary guys die on their behalf.
But at some point don't the groups themselves care? Don't you think Hamas is regretting Oct 7th?
A lot of these groups benefit from the infusion of money, weapons, and other resources in their respective countries, which in turn makes them alternative centers of power alongside the governments running their respective countries. That's certainly been the case for Hezbollah and the Houthis, as well as a lot of Iraqi militia groups who have for the past 20 years been funded by Iran.
So in the end these groups are putting Iran's money, and the power they derive from it, ahead of their people's needs and safety?
It depends on the group. Hamas haven't come out of this very well, but Hezbollah have amassed a pretty substantial alternative power center in Lebanon and likewise for the Houthis in Yemen. In Iraq, the Iranian backed militia groups are now deeply mired in Iraqi politics, so its worked it very well for them.
Beelzebub Smotrich
Top post.
Antisemite!
That's a beautiful fairytale you're talking about there.
If this was 1945 he would be at Nuremberg.
As usual, the criminal fascist regime in Tehran takes revenge of public global humiliation by killing Iranians. In aftermath of Suleimani murder, they killed 176 civilians on the airliner, and now today they've executed a political prisoner from the 2022 protests. Eternal damn and shame for anyone here on this forum or anywhere that whitewashes this regime, makes any excuse for them or see them for anything but pure evil.
We are the largest occupied nation on earth. Foreign language on our "flag", resources all spent on Ummah, and a small religious minority ruling 90 million people, 75% of the population weren't even born when these monsters came to power. But our plight doesn't matter, because of MWAH ANTI-IMPERIALISM ! SHUT UP AND GIVE ALL YOUR MONEY TO RESISTENCE AXIS !!!!
The tweet below is exactly why we also get absolutely zero support from anyone. You see, Arabs have each other (Back in 2001, Bahrain players danced with Saudi flags after beating Iran in the last game, helping Saudis qualify to WC instead of Iran) , The Muslim ummah have each other (see the Palestine cause just as one example), Despite the regime's nearly half-century try to market us as the home of Islam and Ummah, nearly all our neighbours (from Arabs, to Turks, to Pakistani and Afghans) know majority of us aren't part of their religious cause and see us as a disgrace to Islam, hence secretly enjoying our misery and plight under the regime, no matter what they claim publicly.
@Spoony , Sounds like a nice girl. We all had great lives back then before BBC, France and UK promoted and sent Khomeini to destroy the nation. But in history, what goes around, comes around...so we'll see what history has next in store for UK and Iran
)
We are the largest occupied nation on earth. Foreign language on our "flag", resources all spent on Ummah, and a small religious minority ruling 90 million people, 75% of the population weren't even born when these monsters came to power. But our plight doesn't matter, because of MWAH ANTI-IMPERIALISM ! SHUT UP AND GIVE ALL YOUR MONEY TO RESISTENCE AXIS !!!!
The tweet below is exactly why we also get absolutely zero support from anyone. You see, Arabs have each other (Back in 2001, Bahrain players danced with Saudi flags after beating Iran in the last game, helping Saudis qualify to WC instead of Iran) , The Muslim ummah have each other (see the Palestine cause just as one example), Despite the regime's nearly half-century try to market us as the home of Islam and Ummah, nearly all our neighbours (from Arabs, to Turks, to Pakistani and Afghans) know majority of us aren't part of their religious cause and see us as a disgrace to Islam, hence secretly enjoying our misery and plight under the regime, no matter what they claim publicly.
@Spoony , Sounds like a nice girl. We all had great lives back then before BBC, France and UK promoted and sent Khomeini to destroy the nation. But in history, what goes around, comes around...so we'll see what history has next in store for UK and Iran
)I'm well aware of that and know that my posts can be perceived as such, but the truth is that I'm simply exasperated and appalled by the overall reigning duplicity, the abject hypocrisy, the willful ignorance and the abandonment of any kind of human decency.
When I read disingenuous sophisms from posters whom I deem to be well enough versed to know that they're deliberately being obtuse and constantly moving the goalposts to support their perceived moral and ideological superiority, it's hard for me, or anyone truly believing in democratic values and the rule of law, to not blow a gasket. Now is not the time for this kind of shit.
I utterly despise their mental gymnastics and moral splits, such as fully (and rightly) supporting Ukraine whilst simultaneously taking a royal dump on the 80 years old, immense suffering of the Palestinians and reducing Iran to a cartoon villain to fit their world view, even if I have absolutely no love for the horrendous Ayatollahs regime. The latter's fate is up to the Iranians to deal with and the day of reckoning will definitely come at some point. Maybe sooner than we think.
I do ignore indoctrinated psychopaths like the one who's been freely roaming in the last pages of this thread though, so there's that.
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As usual, the criminal fascist regime in Tehran takes revenge of public global humiliation by killing Iranians. In aftermath of Suleimani murder, they killed 176 civilians on the airliner, and now today they've executed a political prisoner from the 2022 protests. Eternal damn and shame for anyone here on this forum or anywhere that whitewashes this regime, makes any excuse for them or see them for anything but pure evil.
We are the largest occupied nation on earth. Foreign language on our "flag", resources all spent on Ummah, and a small religious minority ruling 90 million people, 75% of the population weren't even born when these monsters came to power. But our plight doesn't matter, because of MWAH ANTI-IMPERIALISM ! SHUT UP AND GIVE ALL YOUR MONEY TO RESISTENCE AXIS !!!!
The tweet below is exactly why we also get absolutely zero support from anyone. You see, Arabs have each other (Back in 2001, Bahrain players danced with Saudi flags after beating Iran in the last game, helping Saudis qualify to WC instead of Iran) , The Muslim ummah have each other (see the Palestine cause just as one example), Despite the regime's nearly half-century try to market us as the home of Islam and Ummah, nearly all our neighbours (from Arabs, to Turks, to Pakistani and Afghans) know majority of us aren't part of their religious cause and see us as a disgrace to Islam, hence secretly enjoying our misery and plight under the regime, no matter what they claim publicly.
@Spoony , Sounds like a nice girl. We all had great lives back then before BBC, France and UK promoted and sent Khomeini to destroy the nation. But in history, what goes around, comes around...so we'll see what history has next in store for UK and Iran
Don't think you'll find much love for the Iranian regime here mate, I think pretty much all of us want Iran to be rid of them and for the Iranian people to be rid of tyranny, heck I'm longing for the day they indefinitely feck off out of Iraq.
But please don't conflate the concerns and exasperation many of us have towards the US and Israel's sheer destructive footprint in the region as some form of endorsement for the IRGC. A world does exist where we can all dream off a Middle East free from US hegemonic intervention, an ethno-Fascist Israel subjugating, colonising and murdering swathes of people as well as Iran returning to a prosperous and secular democratic way of life.
Dear Sir, you missed out the bit in the middle when all the arab states declared war and tried to wipe out the Israelis. And they lost. Just like they always do and then complain about the outcome.
The folk around here would do well to remember there are two points of view on Gaza, and dismissing one as madness and fairy tales is the very essence of echo chamber thinking. It might make you feel good but out in the real world you will remain ignored.
We are talking about cause and effect here. You are implying that the war was started by the events of October 7th, when in fact it goes back decades. The Arab-Israeli war wasn’t the start either. It was the theft of Palestinian land by the Zionists through political leverage and terrorist groups like the Irgun.
Dear Sir, my point was that expecting Hamas to leave Gaza which would result in peace there is indeed a fairy tale. And that kind of fairy tales will be ignored in the real world, as you say.
Your view on the whole story is very Israel minded, not to mention you have big holes in your knowledge about the history of events. Google up a term called nakba for a start.
Or better yet, whats your view on Isreal finance minister saying it would be justified to let 2 million people starve to death but they cant do that for now?
But as I've seen from your posts you're justifying killing about 40.000 Palestinians and bombing them daily with - well its Hamas fault cause they're among the population so you're probably agreeing with that kind of stance.
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If Israel feel they have a legitimate war aim, then the Palestinians definitely do!
And to suggest that simply giving back the hostages will end the war in Gaza will end the war tomorrow is just not true, especially when Netanyahu and his extremist ministers have stated that already.
The aim of the Zionists is to annex Gaza, the West Bank, Jordanc
This simply isn’t true. The war will not stop simply by handing back hostages, Netanyahu and his extremist ministers have stated that already. The Zionist aim here is annex Gaza and the West Bank and to engineer a wider conflict whereby they can land grab from Syria, Jordan and Lebanon as well.
They’ve already started holding auctions in Brooklyn and LA selling off plots in Gaza for beach front properties.
You can go back as far as you like. Was the land stolen by the Romans? Are the Philistines of the Old Testament the Palestinians of today (it's the same word in Arabic and Hebrew.) I would suggest people pick their start point based on their politics, not the other way around. But let's take yours.
Palestine was part of the Ottoman Empire for hundreds of years, where Jews were second class citizens. That ended when the Ottomans decided to join World War I on the side of the Germans, and of course and as usual, lost. After that Jews were able to purchase land, the political leverage you refer to. The xenophobic arabs of Palestine, used to thinking in Ottoman terms, responded with massacres such as Hebron, and the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem aligned himself with Hitler, once again choosing the losing side (you see the pattern.)
In 1948 the United Nations agreed a partition that created a Jewish state with indefensible borders, the intention being that the two ethnicities would live together in peace. The Arabs immediately rejected it, declared war and lost. Modern Israel prioritises defensible borders.
Now Hamas are aligning themselves with Iran. Guess what will happen?
Ah yes, Jews just wanted to live in peace in 1948.
As I said gaping holes in knowledge.
As I said gaping holes in knowledge.
Yeah uh, way to reduce "Britain seized all of Ottomans most valuable naval assets for no given cause" and "The Entente spent the past century carving up the Ottomans," as "The Ottomans just arbitarily decided to ally themselves with the central powers"
This is ignorance at best, wilful purposeful misinformation at worst.
I despise people like you who talk so callously of war having never experienced it and never will.
I love the Ottomans as usual lost part. Its not that they conquered vast amounts of territory in the past. I guess they did that by losing as usual.
Ahh yes, the notoriously inept Ottoman empire who's reign only lasted a measly 600 years.
But but they picked sides and guess what happened.
I do not understand the need of engaging with him. He truly is by any metric an awful poster. A paranoid, pathological liar with no regards for historical facts or any shred of human decency.
Do not feed this troll.
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It's the armchair general shite that really irks - describing war so callously as if he knows exactly how it works and just says, "yeah massacres, well it happens that's just war," so offhand and without any shred of decency and empathy.
I will put him on the ignore list. Its really awful.
It's like talking to a kid. A kid who is justifying ethnic cleansing and genocide.
Israel - goood
Arabs - baaad.
It's just the mirror image of every post in the Palestine echo chamber thread. It doesn't promote any kind of reasoned discussion. Of course if you think everything Israel does is evil you will come to the absurd conclusions that they secretly want to conquer the Middle East and that October 7 was their own fault. But reasonable onlookers will judge accordingly.
I feel you, I truly do.
I am as infuriated as you are but this guy is just not worth it. He's the very definition of an armchair fanatic and you won't make a single dent in his nuclear proof (false) beliefs, no matter how hard you try.
This kind of people who know nothing about the sheer insanity that war is and casually deal death and judgment are beneath you and your time.
Best ignore them.
reasoned discussion with someone who doesnt have a problem with genocide (because from up there on that zionist moral high ground, the lives of palestenians have no worth), and talks about world politics like its a game of football.
Your echo chamber cannot cope with a different point of view which is why you hide in this corner of the internet where everyone agrees with you and disagreement is stifled. If your opinions were grounded in reason and fact it would not be threatened in such a way.