India tour to Australia

Kohli is more than just his antics. Plus he always plays fair. Even end of the game when asked about the handscomb catch he replied that they lost because Aussies played the better cricket and wouldn’t want to pin it down to one decision that didn’t go their way

Plus he answers his critics with the bat. His whole ‘failed in England thing’ could easily have affected him but he scored nearly twice the runs any other batsman scored in the series. The guy is just unbelievable when it comes to cricket. He was also seen as not good enough for tests but even turned that around with stellar performances everywhere. Frankly I wouldn’t have smith over him, especially considering smith is more of a home bully when it comes to LOI.

As for ponting, the guy did much worse and it’s laughable to suggest that he was second only to Sachin in his era. A certain Brian Charles Lara may disagree with that.
 
jungledrums said:
@Kush read the above. Yet another obviously spiteful individual. Why the feck would any Aussie that wants to genuinely discuss cricket (and it’s shortcomings) engage in a fecking discussion with you? Watch what you fecking type. Who are you to call me gullible, when your only available evdidence is your misinterpretation of my innocuous initial comment?
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First and foremost, calm down and take a deep breath. It's only a game of Cricket we are talking about. If your takeaway from my post is that I'm a spiteful individual because of my opinion on Smith and Sandpaper gate. Then you won't find many to engage in a Cricketing discussion about Australia. It's an opinion shared by fans around the world, Steve Smith was no rookie to that role. He'd been successfully leading the Aussie Test side for 4 years before the incident happened, now you can choose to bury your head in the sand and think this was the first instance any wrong had been done by Smith's Australia or believe he was coerced and bullied by 'scumbags' Lehmann and Warner but logical conclusion to any of it is, if Smith's moral compass was strong, he would've put an end to it in an instant.

Never did I say the punishments were justified for either of the trio, it was always too harsh and to some extent those three were the scapegoats when in all likelihood bowlers were involved in the mess as well. Anyways, it set a strong precedent for the future. For all his batting exploits, he dragged the reputation of your country through the mud and I just find it perplexing how many are willing to absolve him large portions of the blame and lay it on Warner and Co.

Also, if you're this thin skinned then perhaps you won't find anything meaningful discussion here or on any other cricketing forum for that matter. I've been a regular poster on subreddit Cricket and had lot of interesting discussions with Aussies, Kiwi, Poms, etc. over last 3 years. You take rough with the smooth, the poster above you whom I quoted summed up the worst facets of what the world has come to hate about Australian Cricket and their fans. Your post contained a line of thread which has been shared by few of your fans over the last few months that Smith has been hard done by. You talk about prior history, but even in Indian tour he was involved in DRS controversy. He was no different to previous captain like Clarke and Ponting, doing anything and everything to win a game of Cricket. The committee assigned by Cricket Australia seemed to say the same.

I just think a lot are blinded by the fact it was Steve Smith, probably their greatest Test batsman of modern era. Had it been Tim Paine, no one would give a feck.
 
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Kush said:
First and foremost, calm down and take a deep breath. It's only a game of Cricket we are talking about. If your takeaway from my post is that I'm a spiteful individual because of my opinion on Smith and Sandpaper gate. Then you won't find many to engage in a Cricketing discussion about Australia. It's an opinion shared by fans around the world, Steve Smith was no rookie to that role. He'd been successfully leading the Aussie Test side for 4 years before the incident happened, now you can choose to bury your head in the sand and think this was the first instance any wrong had been done by Smith's Australia or believe he was coerced and bullied by 'scumbags' Lehmann and Warner but logical conclusion to any of that if Smith's moral compass was strong, he would've put an end to it in an instant.

Never did I say the punishments were justified for either of the trio, it was always too harsh and to some extent those three were the scapegoats when in all likelihood bowlers were involved in the mess as well. Anyways, it set a strong precedent for the future. For all his batting exploits, he dragged the reputation of your country through the mud and I just find it perplexing how many are willing to absolve him large portions of the blame and lay it on Warner and Co.

Also, if you're this thin skinned then perhaps you won't find anything meaningful discussion here or on any other cricketing forum for that matter. I've been a regular poster on subreddit Cricket and had lot of interesting discussions with Aussies, Kiwi, Poms, etc. over last 3 years. You take rough with the smooth, the poster above you whom I quoted summed up the worst facets of what the world has come to hate about Australian Cricket and their fans. Your post contained a line of thread which has been shared by few of your fans over the last few months that Smith has been hard done by. You talk about prior history, but even in Indian tour he was involved in DRS controversy. He was no different to previous captain like Clarke and Ponting, doing anything and everything to win a game of Cricket. I just think if it wasn't Steve Smith and someone like Shaun/Mitch Marsh, no one would give a feck.
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Yet again you’ve conveniently avoided a crucial conpontent of my reply. Had the incident regarding Smith been a one off, and no precedent existed, I’d agree with you. Yet India, South Africa and Pakistan (I’m sure I’ve missed some too) have all been embroiled in some form of ball tampering scandal. I’d like you to find a quote of me ever suggesting Smith was bullied into submission. I’ve not changed my stance since the details emerged: Smith was aware and made a mistake, yet I’m willing to look past his one big mistake, assuming he doesn’t do something else to tarnish his image. Who the feck among us are so perfect as to judge the bloke for this mistake when it’s virtually his first notable offence? Furthermore, do you consider the other offenders from different nations to be as morally questionable as Smith? This has been my biggest issue since the beginning: the faux outrage over Smith - yet some form of cognitive dissonance regarding every other international offender. Hate the bloke, sure, but be transparent: you likely hate him because he’s fecking good (OR, conversely, you take issue with ALL instances of ball tampering... that would also be a valid stance).

If it was the Marsh boys I’d say exactly the same, as they seem like decent blokes. You’re missing the central point of my argument: Warner, Lehmann (even Warne and McGrath) have had broadly negative reputations long before this business. Generally speaking, I’d argue they seem like tossers most of the time. Smith, in contrast, hasn’t really put forth a negative public image. Okay, yes, the DRS thing, but that’s rather small yet gets brought up to hilarious degrees when discussing Smith’s apparent rottenness.

Again, don’t group me with other fans. I don’t particularly like Ponting as a bloke, and there are plenty of names in Aus cricket that I’m none too fond of. We are a nation that has always played hard in cricket. Let’s not kid ourselves any longer: Smith is quite bloody good, Australia historically are quite bloody good (and fierce competitors to boot); THAT is why this issue blew up; THAT is why the carrying-on exists within, for example, this forum and other micro-discussions of the issue.

I’d like to think I’m rational enough to note a good argument when I see one. You do raise some valid and accurate points, sure, but I also think you’re wilfully ignoring certain other points that I’ve raised. I don’t believe anything I’ve said is wrong or even exaggerated - happy to have my mind changed if you’d like to respond explicitly to my central points. So far I’ve not read anything to prove otherwise - a lot of ad hom attacks on Smith, though.
 
jungledrums said:
Yet again you’ve conveniently avoided a crucial conpontent of my reply. Had the incident regarding Smith been a one off, and no precedent existed, I’d agree with you. Yet India, South Africa and Pakistan (I’m sure I’ve missed some too) have all been embroiled in some form of ball tampering scandal. I’d like you to find a quote of me ever suggesting Smith was bullied into submission. I’ve not changed my stance since the details emerged: Smith was aware and made a mistake, yet I’m willing to look past his one big mistake, assuming he doesn’t do something else to tarnish his image. Who the feck among us are so perfect as to judge the bloke for this mistake when it’s virtually his first notable offence? Furthermore, do you consider the other offenders from different nations to be as morally questionable as Smith? This has been my biggest issue since the beginning: the faux outrage over Smith - yet some form of cognitive dissonance regarding every other international offender. Hate the bloke, sure, but be transparent: you likely hate him because he’s fecking good (OR, conversely, you take issue with ALL instances of ball tampering... that would also be a valid stance).

If it was the Marsh boys I’d say exactly the same, as they seem like decent blokes. You’re missing the central point of my argument: Warner, Lehmann (even Warne and McGrath) have had broadly negative reputations long before this business. Generally speaking, I’d argue they seem like tossers most of the time. Smith, in contrast, hasn’t really put forth a negative public image. Okay, yes, the DRS thing, but that’s rather small yet gets brought up to hilarious degrees when discussing Smith’s apparent rottenness.

Again, don’t group me with other fans. I don’t particularly like Ponting as a bloke, and there are plenty of names in Aus cricket that I’m none too fond of. We are a nation that has always played hard in cricket. Let’s not kid ourselves any longer: Smith is quite bloody good, Australia historically are quite bloody good (and fierce competitors to boot); THAT is why this issue blew up; THAT is why the carrying-on exists within, for example, this forum and other micro-discussions of the issue.

I’d like to think I’m rational enough to note a good argument when I see one. You do raise some valid and accurate points, sure, but I also think you’re wilfully ignoring certain other points that I’ve raised. I don’t believe anything I’ve said is wrong or even exaggerated - happy to have my mind changed if you’d like to respond explicitly to my central points. So far I’ve not read anything to prove otherwise - a lot of ad hom attacks on Smith, though.
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Ball-tampering has been happening for a long time and it still does, I'm not living in a deluded world where I think likes of England, NZ or India never engaged in it. The key point which you seem to brush over is the fact how all of this was planned and concocted, Lehmann on walky-talkies. Bancroft stuffing the paper down in his pants, when called up by umpires both him and Smith lying about it being a cloth to clean sunglasses.

Bancroft was a youngster in the side and he was asked by the leadership group to take up the responsibility. It wasn't the use of mint or use of small stones on the field to rough a side up. He brought a full fledged sandpaper to do it. Once again why on earth would a youngster do it if he wasn't asked or coerced by the senior players? The reason it blew up is Australia have always played tough and hard cricket but taken pride in the fact of towing the line while doing it, this was the first instance where everything they were up to was brought into light for the world to see.

Also this isn't the first time he had made a mistake, I'd argue Australia have been doing this for a long time and Smith saw no wrong in it. DRS controversy is also an offence in my book. Sure, you might see it as a small issue or as Smith termed it 'brainfade' but once again he tried to game the system by looking at dressing room to make a decision. There is a term for it which I know you won't like if I use.

Besides, did you watch his press-conference straight after the game? There was no remorse, he was speaking on the same lines as you are. So what we were involved in ball tampering, everyone does it. He didn't perceive it as a big issue, why do you think that is? I have my own theory for it.

You also seem to be implying people are taking pleasure from the fact it's Smith who is involved in all of this, he is the reason why this blew up. The profile of the player has surely made an impact but there are small instances throughout the course of Australian history where they have ventured into grey areas, this is the first time the cricketing world saw them getting their comeuppance and hence everything is put into micro-scope. I don't see why anyone would hate Smith, he's harmless on the field like Root. So once again, you're making assumptions of me hating him which is simply not true.
 
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Kush said:
Ball-tampering has been happening for a long time and it still does, I'm not living in a deluded world where I think likes of England, NZ or India never engaged in it. The key point which you seem to brush over is the fact how all of this was planned and concocted, Lehmann on walky-talkies. Bancroft stuffing the paper down in his pants, when called up by umpires both him and Smith lying about it being a cloth to clean sunglasses.

Bancroft was a youngster in the side and he was asked by the leadership group to take up the responsibility. It wasn't the use of mint or use of small stones on the field to rough a side up. He brought a full fledged sandpaper to do it. Once again why on earth would a youngster do it if he wasn't asked or coerced by the senior players? The reason it blew up is Australia have always played tough and hard cricket but taken pride in the fact of towing the line while doing it, this was the first instance where everything they were up to was brought into light for the world to see.

Also this isn't the first time he had made a mistake, I'd argue Australia have been doing this for a long time and Smith saw no wrong in it. DRS controversy is also an offence in my book. Sure, you might see it as a small issue or as Smith termed it 'brainfade' but once again he tried to game the system by looking at dressing room to make a decision. There is a term for it which I know you won't like if I use.

Besides, did you watch his press-conference straight after the game? There was no remorse, he was speaking on the same lines as you are. So what we were involved in ball tampering, everyone does it. He didn't perceive it as a big issue, why do you think that is? I have my own theory for it.

You also seem to be implying people are taking pleasure from the fact it's Smith who is involved in all of this, he is the reason why this blew up. The profile of the player has surely made an impact but there are small instances throughout the course of Australian history where they have ventured into grey areas, this is the first time the cricketing world saw them getting their comeuppance and hence everything is put into micro-scope. I don't see why anyone would hate Smith, he's harmless on the field like Root. So once again, you're making assumptions of me hating him which is simply not true.
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I think you’ll agree that this is a largely disingenuous post. The vast majority of what you claimed differs to the findings in the official report: Lehmann was not involved according to the report; Bancroft was not asked by seniors to tamper with the ball; and Smith did not concoct the plan or indeed tamper with the ball himself. His main crime was seemingly brushing it under the rug and trying to play it off as inconsequential. Whether you choose to believe the official report or not is neither here nor there. It’s misleading and dishonest to claim certain things in your post as fact when they are, at best, speculation. You’re peddling a convenient narrative - convenient in the sense that it suits you to push the above in pursuit of the “Australia are cheats” narrative that is alive and well on this thread. It’s all getting a little tiresome.

Furthermore, I’d like some corroborating evidence to support your claim that “everything they [Australia] were up to was brought into the light for the world to see”. This is the sort of statement I really take issue with - if this statement had any weight, we’d be able to find numerous examples of cheating by the Aus team, and furthermore, numerous examples of cheating exclusively by Aus and no other nation. Yet all I can find is examples of cheating/tampering by numerous other nations (as well as Aus, regrettably) - hardly an epidemic of Australian cheating. Perhaps you’re being selective in your judgement? Perhaps test cricket has a problem with cheating?

The fact that you claim different degrees of cheating is a little hypocritical: if you tamper with the ball, it’s cheating is it not? I agree that bringing sandpaper on the field creates a jarring visual image, but it nonetheless falls into the same category of ball tampering as all the other acts do. What you’re also suggesting is that, because Australia (apparently?) promotes the hard but fair attitude towards the game, that therefore makes this example of cheating WORSE than teams that never claim to play hard but fair? Is that why you can apparently brush aside the other examples of cheating?

I’m not sure if there’s any point in continuing this if we can’t find common ground, so I’ll end my little essay by saying that at no point have I justified what Aus did. At no point have I claimed Smith was an innocent victim. What I do believe is that the scathing criticism directed toward Smith and Aus cricket more broadly is over the top, if not hypocritical. It’s fair to say the Aus team has never been popular - I truly feel that is the reason behind the many excessively hostile reactions that I’ve seen.
 
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Oh come off it, you think after years of 'we play 'ard but it's all good fun as long you have a Fosters mate' line, of course people are going to rightly call out hypocrisy when they see it. I say this as someone who liked Aussies in general.
 
jungledrums said:
I think you’ll agree that this is a largely disingenuous post. The vast majority of what you claimed differs to the findings in the official report: Lehmann was not involved according to the report
Click to expand...

My post is disingenuous because it doesn't follow the laughable story of the incident peddled by Cricket Australia in their report? Oh please. I followed that series ball by ball and saw the events unfold in front of my eyes. Bancroft rubbed the ball with sandpaper and that was picked up by television crew and camera. Minutes later we see Darren Lehmann giving some instructions to Handscomb on the bench via walky-talkie, during next drink break Handscomb enters the field. After that we see Bancroft taking the sandpaper out of his pocket and chucking it in front of his trousers. Later, umpires call him and Smith for it and both lie as it to being some sort microfiber cloth meant to clean the sunglasses (Bancroft wasn't even wearing one :lol:) At the end of days play, both lie again in the presser and say it was just an adhesive tape.

Bancroft was not asked by seniors to tamper with the ball; and Smith did not concoct the plan or indeed tamper with the ball himself. His main crime was seemingly brushing it under the rug and trying to play it off as inconsequential. Whether you choose to believe the official report or not is neither here nor there. It’s misleading and dishonest to claim certain things in your post as fact when they are, at best, speculation. You’re peddling a convenient narrative - convenient in the sense that it suits you to push the above in pursuit of the “Australia are cheats” narrative that is alive and well on this thread. It’s all getting a little tiresome.
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I have no idea what you are on about. Just to be clear who do you think was actually involved in it? Going from your posts, all I seem to gather is Warner was the cnut in all of this and for some strange reason a rookie like Bancroft seemed to follow suit. He decided to rough the ball on his own accord and Smith was like meh ok, lets get on with it.

I am interested to hear your version of the events.

Furthermore, I’d like some corroborating evidence to support your claim that “everything they [Australia] were up to was brought into the light for the world to see”. This is the sort of statement I really take issue with - if this statement had any weight, we’d be able to find numerous examples of cheating by the Aus team, and furthermore, numerous examples of cheating exclusively by Aus and no other nation. Yet all I can find is examples of cheating/tampering by numerous other nations (as well as Aus, regrettably) - hardly an epidemic of Australian cheating. Perhaps you’re being selective in your judgement? Perhaps test cricket has a problem with cheating?
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You can have problem with that statement for all I care. It is unbelievably naive to think this was the first instance where Australia were cheating in Test Cricket. Do you realise how absurd it is to bring a frickin sandpaper on the field just to mess with the ball? Why did you think that happened? Because Warner was caught on his bullshit a Test earlier?

I am going to draw an analogy here which maybe some can relate with, at an early stage when you want to cheat in an exam. You do something lowkey as to writing something on the box, or an an eraser. Later, when you're not caught you start to take more risks, as to writing more shit on the stuff you carry with yourself. If still nothing happens, perhaps you're carrying a full blown paper chit.

Australia kept pushing the envelope as how much they can get away with before this incident bit them in the arse.

The fact that you claim different degrees of cheating is a little hypocritical: if you tamper with the ball, it’s cheating is it not? I agree that bringing sandpaper on the field creates a jarring visual image, but it nonetheless falls into the same category of ball tampering as all the other acts do. What you’re also suggesting is that, because Australia (apparently?) promotes the hard but fair attitude towards the game, that therefore makes this example of cheating WORSE than teams that never claim to play hard but fair? Is that why you can apparently brush aside the other examples of cheating?
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In none of my posts have I tried to insinuate if others are cheating it's fine but Australia should be punished. Cheating is cheating, it doesn't matter who does it. It can be good boys of cricket in Kiwi, and I'll still call them for it. Just because we are discussing an incident where Australia were involved in the mess doesn't imply I am ok with others doing it.

I’m not sure if there’s any point in continuing this if we can’t find common ground, so I’ll end my little essay by saying that at no point have I justified what Aus did. At no point have I claimed Smith was an innocent victim. What I do believe is that the scathing criticism directed toward Smith and Aus cricket more broadly is over the top, if not hypocritical. It’s fair to say the Aus team has never been popular - I truly feel that is the reason behind the many excessively hostile reactions that I’ve seen.
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We won't find a common ground until you stop pretending that Australia is a victim in all of this. Australia's tremendous success in the past has had some role on it, but at the end of the day they still fecked up. Offence was still ball tampering, but in the manner everything was planned was something I certainly have never seen and that's the reason they are drawing so much ire.

Also, the reason why trio were fecked so hard with the punishment is because it was an easier option for Cricket Australia to take. Last thing they could've said to the public is, oh well the team you guys love? All of them are cheats. It's easier to pin it on two parties who had been caught by cameras along with the skipper. I don't believe it for a second there were only 3 guilty parties in it, at the end of day ball is reversing inside 30 overs and none of your pacers think anything dodgy is going on?
 
This is going off topic. Please take Aussies are cheats discussion to the general cricket thread.
 
Kush said:
My post is disingenuous because it doesn't follow the laughable story of the incident peddled by Cricket Australia in their report? Oh please. I followed that series ball by ball and saw the events unfold in front of my eyes. Bancroft rubbed the ball with sandpaper and that was picked up by television crew and camera. Minutes later we see Darren Lehmann giving some instructions to Handscomb on the bench via walky-talkie, during next drink break Handscomb enters the field. After that we see Bancroft taking the sandpaper out of his pocket and chucking it in front of his trousers. Later, umpires call him and Smith for it and both lie as it to being some sort microfiber cloth meant to clean the sunglasses (Bancroft wasn't even wearing one :lol:) At the end of days play, both lie again in the presser and say it was just an adhesive tape.



I have no idea what you are on about. Just to be clear who do you think was actually involved in it? Going from your posts, all I seem to gather is Warner was the cnut in all of this and for some strange reason a rookie like Bancroft seemed to follow suit. He decided to rough the ball on his own accord and Smith was like meh ok, lets get on with it.

I am interested to hear your version of the events.



You can have problem with that statement for all I care. It is unbelievably naive to think this was the first instance where Australia were cheating in Test Cricket. Do you realise how absurd it is to bring a frickin sandpaper on the field just to mess with the ball? Why did you think that happened? Because Warner was caught on his bullshit a Test earlier?

I am going to draw an analogy here which maybe some can relate with, at an early stage when you want to cheat in an exam. You do something lowkey as to writing something on the box, or an an eraser. Later, when you're not caught you start to take more risks, as to writing more shit on the stuff you carry with yourself. If still nothing happens, perhaps you're carrying a full blown paper chit.

Australia kept pushing the envelope as how much they can get away with before this incident bit them in the arse.



In none of my posts have I tried to insinuate if others are cheating it's fine but Australia should be punished. Cheating is cheating, it doesn't matter who does it. It can be good boys of cricket in Kiwi, and I'll still call them for it. Just because we are discussing an incident where Australia were involved in the mess doesn't imply I am ok with others doing it.



We won't find a common ground until you stop pretending that Australia is a victim in all of this. Australia's tremendous success in the past has had some role on it, but at the end of the day they still fecked up. Offence was still ball tampering, but in the manner everything was planned was something I certainly have never seen and that's the reason they are drawing so much ire.

Also, the reason why trio were fecked so hard with the punishment is because it was an easier option for Cricket Australia to take. Last thing they could've said to the public is, oh well the team you guys love? All of them are cheats. It's easier to pin it on two parties who had been caught by cameras along with the skipper. I don't believe it for a second there were only 3 guilty parties in it, at the end of day ball is reversing inside 30 overs and none of your pacers think anything dodgy is going on?
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So you’re going to choose not to believe the official report - a report done by the very same association that handed down the HARSHEST punishment in cricketing history for this offence (so you can’t claim the Aus association has inherent biases or is trying to avoid blame/pass the buck) - and instead attach your own interpretation to it, including apparently lip reading a conversation that occurred over the two way? He could have been asking what the bloke had for lunch for all we know*... the point is, you and I have no idea. I’m not claiming to know without question what occurred... you seemingly are.

*I don’t believe this, I’m just highlighting the fact that we don’t know that the two way conversation was about the incident.

How many times do I need to explicitly state my POV: of course Smith was involved. We likely won’t find a common ground yet it has nothing to do with me “pretending Aus is a victim” - I’ve never done that. When did I ever implicitly or explicitly state that Aus is a poor, undeserving victim? I’m merely commenting on the laughably hypocritical stance some are taking towards Australia when other nations receive a fraction of the scrutiny. Just to reiterate: we were bastards (just as so many other nations have been), and Smith’s failure was in noticing some wrongdoings and not stepping in. That’s what I believe anyway, call me naive but his recent press comments would corroborate this claim.

I also find it odd that you immediately assume some nefarious team-wide involvement in this scandal, yet don’t feel the same way of other scandals (South Africa etc). You are apparently privy to details behind the scene regarding this case..?

Happy to continue over pm if you’d like.
 
jungledrums said:
So you’re going to choose not to believe the official report - a report done by the very same association that handed down the HARSHEST punishment in cricketing history for this offence (so you can’t claim the Aus association has inherent biases or is trying to avoid blame/pass the buck) - and instead attach your own interpretation to it, including apparently lip reading a conversation that occurred over the two way? He could have been asking what the bloke had for lunch for all we know*... the point is, you and I have no idea. I’m not claiming to know without question what occurred... you seemingly are.
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I mentioned in my post as to why they handed out such harsh punishments. Option was to either tell the whole world that everything in Australian setup is rotten, or to throw the trio under the bus. They chose the easier option. I watched everything unfold before me, there were lot of inconsistencies in Smith's statement. He mentioned that 'leadership group' knew about the tampering, but later redacted it. Lehmann was also absolved of all the blame and so were the bowlers in the report. He along with Bancroft and Warner were used as scapegoats in this controversy and no amount of dressing by CA is going to change that. There is footage available on YouTube, you can see for yourself and form your own opinion instead of relying on CA

How many times do I need to explicitly state my POV: of course Smith was involved. We likely won’t find a common ground yet it has nothing to do with me “pretending Aus is a victim” - I’ve never done that. When did I ever implicitly or explicitly state that Aus is a poor, undeserving victim? I’m merely commenting on the laughably hypocritical stance some are taking towards Australia when other nations receive a fraction of the scrutiny. Just to reiterate: we were bastards (just as so many other nations have been), and Smith’s failure was in noticing some wrongdoings and not stepping in. That’s what I believe anyway, call me naive but his recent press comments would corroborate this claim.
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My only problem in all of this has been many people (not you) absolving Smith large chunks of blame. He's already served the punishment, just own up to your mistakes and move on. All this recent PR about Smith saying 'I knew but not really knew the details' doesn't help his case, there is no need to rewrite history.

I also find it odd that you immediately assume some nefarious team-wide involvement in this scandal, yet don’t feel the same way of other scandals (South Africa etc). You are apparently privy to details behind the scene regarding this case..?

Happy to continue over pm if you’d like.
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The reason why I think that way is because all of this was premeditated by Australia. Earlier, Warner had been doing the tampering but SA made a huge deal about it in 2nd Test so they passed the responsibility to Bancroft so he wouldn't draw too much attention. Once they were caught, they lied at multiple stages and gave inconsistent statements. Its only when the evidence became irrefutable did they own up to it. Teams have cheated before sure, but I cannot recall anyone bringing a foreign object on the field to do it and once caught try and spin it.

Anyways, we have really taken this thread off-topic. I suggest you register on subreddit Cricket, there are lot of fans from different countries and we can engage in discussion over there.
 
So three changes for the next match for India.

Rahul, Vijay and Umesh go out. Aggarwal, Rohit and Jadeja(Ashwin still injured) in for them.

Vihari to open apparently. Good team imo considering the circumstances.
 
Best team we've picked. Would have asked Rohit to open though and vihari remains where he is. Vihari should be first choice middle order and Rohit the guy you're trying to find a place for.

Still, I am excited about this. First selection I've liked under Kohli/Shastri.
 
Good team selection this:

India 1 Mayank Agarwal, 2 Hanuma Vihari, 3 Cheteshwar Pujara, 4 Virat Kohli (capt.), 5 Ajinkya Rahane, 6 Rohit Sharma, 7 Rishabh Pant (wk), 8 Ravindra Jadeja, 9 Mohammed Shami, 10 Ishant Sharma, 11 Jasprit Bumrah
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I think it's a tough call on who should open with Mayank. Rohit's weakness is his lack of footwork and up against a decent and well rested Aussie new ball bowling attack, it might get a bit difficult for him.

On the other hand, Mayank may do well to have someone with a lot of international cricket experience at the other end.
 
zing said:
Best team we've picked. Would have asked Rohit to open though and vihari remains where he is. Vihari should be first choice middle order and Rohit the guy you're trying to find a place for.

Still, I am excited about this. First selection I've liked under Kohli/Shastri.
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Yeah same. Don't feck around with Vihari. Let Rohit open. If it works then Rohit can take away the game in the first session, if it doesn't then well he isn't a test match player anyway.
 
I'd have picked Bhuvi ahead of Rohit, especially when he wasn't going to open batting.

Otherwise, it's the only sensible team that was possible.
 
I’m all for Rohit not opening. He doesn’t have the game to handle a moving ball early in his innings. Bhuvneshwar over Rohit would be my choice too, but we haven’t gotten enough runs in this series so it’s a fair call to play an extra batsman. Now we have solid batting all the way up to Jadeja.
 
Six Indian players have scored triple centuries in tomorrow's lineup. That is a pretty cool stat.
 
zing said:
Six Indian players have scored triple centuries in tomorrow's lineup. That is a pretty cool stat.
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I think Virat and Rahane hasn't. Rest of the batting lineup has.
 
It's great to have a Boxing day test where the series is evenly poised. We haven't had that for a while.
 
It's astonishing that one of our best test performers can't get into the side. I'd have left Rohit out for Bhuvi.
 
Vihari doesn't have a plan on how to play short balls, this was clear against Stokes in the one test he played in England and is clear again today.
 
ArmchairCritic said:
Vihari doesn't have a plan on how to play short balls, this was clear against Stokes in the one test he played in England and is clear again today.
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You have to feel a bit sorry for him though. His role in the team is being made up as we go.
 
Saw about ten overs. He looked fine but hard to judge on this pitch. This looks like Rajkot or something at the moment..
 
What kind of pitch is this? Staying low on the first day.
 
I have no idea what to make of the pitch. You have overs together which makes it look like a batting paradise and then you have these random balls which do absolutely unexpected things off it.
 
On course to score about 230 today, which I don't think is good enough. New ball around the corner too.
 
Skills said:
Pujara just scores too slow. If he doesn't make a huge 100 here he's a total waste man.
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Yea alternatively, he has to stick around to see off the second new ball.

jungledrums said:
Genuinely think the MCG will be stripped of the ability to host international cricket, if this day is anything to go by.
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Which is a shame cuz even today there's a huge crowd that's come in.
 
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