24 out of the last 26 pts?
11 ahead of Arsenal.
6 behind Chelsea.
Clearly a crisis.
Sack everyone.
11 ahead of Arsenal.
6 behind Chelsea.
Clearly a crisis.
Sack everyone.
In a perfect world (with no Roman) we would be in pole position and favourites to win the title.
Then again, it's not a perfect world.
Then again, it's not a perfect world.
The performances on the pitch aren't convincing. The points counts for feck if we cannot win the title.
Shut the feck up.vijay said:
SecondedGiggsy PO said:
We were never in a "crisis", we had some bad games in the EPL and unfortunatly we didnt qualify for the next stage for the Champions League, which was a bit sad.
But beeing 2nd in the EPL isnt that bad, and our players and Fergie arent that bad as some moan all the time
vijay said:
Championship winning form that's what it is.
Michel04 said:
right
vijay said:
Spoony said:
I blame SAF meself
Spoony said:
I doubt that.
Irrespective of being unpredictable we always string together a good run, raise the bar in big matches and maintain a consistent position in the league table.
We still need to improve before challenging the renties for the title.
vijay said:
No you don't.
24 out of 26 is champ winning form.
Chelsea haven't exactly played amazing stufff. They've been grinding out results.
so, what are rooney and ruud on in terms of number of goals scored??
our CL form was a crisis, our league form is not but still, we should have finished off everton and other matches easily
Reflectorboy said:
Agreed. It was really annoying how we can play pretty well in the league and then in the CL we inexplicably bottle it.
vijay said:
Vijay, that performance was as convincing as they come....
good stuff from United. just 2 points off Liverpool's pace for best form in the Premiership. Let's hope Chelski lose tommorow!
it is a mystery why our finishing is so poor in europe.it still baffles me, perhaps it got to do with the midfieldPronewbie said:
Giggsy PO said:
Thirded. +infinity. +1.
Home form has been a bit patchy. I think away from home we've got the best record in the league. I wonder, if the home crowd got behind as much as our away supporters do, would it make a difference?
Bizare. Our performances since the Chelsea game have been as good as they have been since, well, ever. We had a simular spell at about this time last yearvijay said:
noodlehair said:
Bizzare, even.
Merry Christmas, Noodles.
Yes
Merry Christmas Spoony, you hairy cow
Merry Christmas Spoony, you hairy cow
Smelly cow apparently.
I've been told I smell of BO.
I've been told I smell of BO.
Do you?
Not at the moment.
Spoony said:
out of 26? what does that mean? and didn't we lose at Boro 6 or seven games ago?
Anyway, great to see some consistency. Today I felt for the first time in quite a while that we played a side that had lost before the game even started.
Reflectorboy said:
our form is superb, but having said this we should be disapointed with our league performance at times this season (blackburn, city, everton and spurs all at OT should have been wins.)
Spoony said:
Yes
But, I don't think we usually had more points by this stage when we used to win the league. As you say, championship-winning form...all season. Scousers too. It's just the freak element of Chelsea that's making us look bad.
Having said that, we're not the team we were...but we're still pretty good.
vijay said:
Why kind of stupid, cnut toff, glory hunter, bollocks statement is that? Some people are under some sort of illusion that we used to cream every team convincingly when we used to actually win titles, but this is simply not the case. We used to play many a game where we couldn't string a pass together, leaked stupid goals or played utterly shit for 3/4 of a match and still won or got a result.
The bar has been raised. I doubt we can raise with it, we simply don't have the resources Chelsea do. They can spend 24 million on a player and not be accountable for it, if that piece of shit doesn't work out they can simply bring in aanother player for another 24 mill in the next transfer window. No team in the history of football has ever had that kind of backing. It's highly unlikely that Chelsea drop a premiership in the next 10 years - Deal with it.
Other than the points, our game play has improved a lot, hasn't it??
i mean the rooney-ruud link up play finally happened, and our midfield is not so bad anymore, and with mickey benched, we're looking solid at the back...
There still is hope, we can win the title
i mean the rooney-ruud link up play finally happened, and our midfield is not so bad anymore, and with mickey benched, we're looking solid at the back...
There still is hope, we can win the title
Spoony said:
24 out of 26? It couldn't have possibly been 26. 27 maybe.
Not sure the league run can be interpreted as a Championship winning form or not but the overall confidence of the team has improved. I don’t wanna mess up the thread by raising some negative points but after the fiasco in the CL, the recent league performances were a relief more than anything else.
Suedesi said:
19 from the last 21.
Blame that Bitter on Century. Owen I think.
Still not bad. Should be 22 from 24 after we beat WBA.
Ok so the bar had been raised. If Roman hasnt bought Chelsea we would still be first in the EPL (+ we would be the richest club in England, with enough dosh to cover any of our mistakes, a luxury which was exclusive for us during the early 90s and which exclusive for Chelsea now) etc. etc. On the other hand who care about second best anyway? I cannot recall anyone of us praising Kevin Keegan for ending up second best with his Newcastle a few years ago am I right? Quite contrary we ridiculed them as we did with many other managers would couldnt keep up with our pace no matter what they did.
Now I will ask you a question. Should this "prestigeous" position (which for about a month was filled by the mighty Wigan Athletic) justify the fact that there is a big chance of ending up trophyless (or with some 3rd rate trophy like the FA or the Mickey Mouse cup) and 4th in one of the easiest CL groups ever? Do you think that Keano and Schmeichel are wrong in stating that we are just the shadow of what we used to be and that radical changes need to be done?
Mind you Hairdryer has a point, its difficult (if not almost impossible) to compete with the richest club in the world, a club who is able to buy the players you want + many other more. I mean just ask Houllier, Keegan, Wenger (ok he did won many important honors despite having a budget which was considered ridiculous to the one usually given by SAF) how frustrating this can be! On the other hand, lets face it while we arent at Chelsea's level we should have at least passed the CL qualifications (I mean we were facing clubs which work under ridiculous budgets) + beat teams like Middlesbrough (who demolished us), Blackburn etc am i right? These clubs are financially and talently wise weaker then us and yet were able to give us a lesson or two, compensating talent with heart, character and teamwork. I bet that they wouldnt have managed to do that to the treble winning team! But there again at that time we had Irwin, Keano, Schmeichel and Stam and not OShea, Fletcher, Silvestre and Wes Brown
Now I will ask you a question. Should this "prestigeous" position (which for about a month was filled by the mighty Wigan Athletic) justify the fact that there is a big chance of ending up trophyless (or with some 3rd rate trophy like the FA or the Mickey Mouse cup) and 4th in one of the easiest CL groups ever? Do you think that Keano and Schmeichel are wrong in stating that we are just the shadow of what we used to be and that radical changes need to be done?
Mind you Hairdryer has a point, its difficult (if not almost impossible) to compete with the richest club in the world, a club who is able to buy the players you want + many other more. I mean just ask Houllier, Keegan, Wenger (ok he did won many important honors despite having a budget which was considered ridiculous to the one usually given by SAF) how frustrating this can be! On the other hand, lets face it while we arent at Chelsea's level we should have at least passed the CL qualifications (I mean we were facing clubs which work under ridiculous budgets) + beat teams like Middlesbrough (who demolished us), Blackburn etc am i right? These clubs are financially and talently wise weaker then us and yet were able to give us a lesson or two, compensating talent with heart, character and teamwork. I bet that they wouldnt have managed to do that to the treble winning team! But there again at that time we had Irwin, Keano, Schmeichel and Stam and not OShea, Fletcher, Silvestre and Wes Brown
devilish said:
There's so much wrong with that post I don't even no where to start. We used to get beaten by teams like Middlesborough and Blackburn when we were winning Premierships. We used to lose up to six games a season and then draw some as well.
We also only really started spending post 2001. Before that we didn't have a huge budget. Ferguson was astute in the transfer market and relied heavily on the Clubs youth system. Even when we did, we were accountable for what we spent. If Rio didn't work out we couldn't just go replace him in the next transfer window, if RVN didn't work out we didn't have another 20 odd million sitting around to just get another quality striker. Look at Veron, we paid for not getting that transfer right.
We can't compete with Chelsea, it's impossible. No one in the history of football has ever had those sorts of resources. Players agents are thowing their players in front of them because they know they'll get paid triple than what they will get elsewhere. If player comes on the market everyone has to wait until Chelsea decide whether or not to move for them. It's stupid to compare us to Chelsea, we were never in that sort of financial position.
As for this:
Did they actually say this or are you misquoting and sensationalising again? Quotes please.
While I agree with you that its going to be tough to compete with Chelsea, this cannot be used as an excuse for our unimpressive run in the CL throughout the last few years + our incapability of finding good talent to replace key players like Schmeichel. Keano, Giggs etc. I mean just look at Juventus. They work on budgets which we consider ridiculous and yet were able to win the CL in 95/96, reaching the finals in 96/97 and 02/03 and the semis in a couple of other occasions . When you compare this to our track record in Europe bearing in mind that SAF had been given much more money than Lippi and Capello had in their disposal, then its easy to understand better why our record is somehow disappointing.
The truth is that despite having the budgets and the structures that other BIG clubs envied us for years, we were unable to convert this potential into success. We had been spending 30m nearly year in year out and to end up with a team who pride of a 36 yr old keeper (after trying out nothing less then 8 keepers) and play an average midfielder alongside a striker in central midfield is simply not good enough.
I believe that Chelsea were not the cause of our problem, I mean we had been in decline long before Roman bought the Blues. Chelsea's emergance had only contributed in accelerated the process of this sharp decline. Thats all.
The truth is that despite having the budgets and the structures that other BIG clubs envied us for years, we were unable to convert this potential into success. We had been spending 30m nearly year in year out and to end up with a team who pride of a 36 yr old keeper (after trying out nothing less then 8 keepers) and play an average midfielder alongside a striker in central midfield is simply not good enough.
I believe that Chelsea were not the cause of our problem, I mean we had been in decline long before Roman bought the Blues. Chelsea's emergance had only contributed in accelerated the process of this sharp decline. Thats all.
devilish said:
Middlesbrough did beat us during the 1998/99 season
devilish said:
We won the league title a couple of weeks before Abramovich bought Chelsea. I take that kind of "decline2 any day of the week.
Recent results in the league have been great but we are deluding ourselves if we think that everything is now hunk dory and the only thing between us and glory is Abramovich's millions. Losing to Benfica, Lille etc etc has nothing to do with Chelsea. We have been way off the pace in Europe for some time now and that should still be the ultimate test for us. Although I did not agree with the way Keane went about making his feelings known, cognisance has to be taken of what he said. Schmeicel has now come out with similar comments - all of which add to the concerns about the current United set up.
Julian Denny said:
I don't think anyone are saying all is now hunky dory.
Schmeichel is talking lots of rubbish though.