Television Game of Thrones (TV) • The watch has ended

SalfordRed18 said:
Hmmm :smirk:
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What? Given the reaction by most to Brienne I doubt your average northern soldier is going to be thrilled to have a woman leading the army. Sexism is still clearly a big deal in Westeros.

Especially since Brienne isn't a Northerner either, is she? Then again we don't know what part of the army she's leading.
 
I tend not to be negative about the show and actually thought the first episode was fairly decent, but I can't believe people seemed to like this one. I thought it was abysmal, almost the definition of a filler episode.

What actually happened? Gendry and Arya, Brienne becoming a Knight, some comic relief from Tormund, the Hound scene. It was all meaningless imo. I guess it was a period of reflection given the battle to come, a chance for us to enjoy some dialogue from fairly prominent characters one last time, a chance to see them bond and become closer so that there can be some more emotional deaths and avenges in the next episode, but it was all quite boring to me.

And the scenes that could have been pretty big were just mediocre. The Sansa & Dany scene was shit. The dialogue wasn't clever, the acting wasn't impressive. It used to be in GoT that a conversation like that would happen and you wouldn't fully understand the intentions behind the characters involved, but there was just this really obvious and blatant fakeness in this scene. Maybe it was intentional, maybe it was horrid acting, either way I thought it was so poor.

Then there was the Jaime & Bran scene which I think went exactly we all expected. Jaime wondering why he didn't tell anyone, Bran telling Jaime he wasn't Bran anymore capped off with some an ambiguous comment. I feel like if you asked us all to write that scene in advance, we'd all come out with very slight variations of it, very predictable.

Then Jon & Dany. It wasn't the worst. I like the idea of Dany not getting a chance to react through words so that she may react through action in the midst of the battle to come, but the way all of that news unfolded wasn't great. Samwell told Jon in the crypts, then Jon told Dany in the crypts. For such groundbreaking news there just wasn't that much to it but maybe I'm being harsh.

I also still find the absolute lack of interest in Bran's three eyed raven thing quite amusing. Like when he said "The things we do for love" during Jaime's trial or whatever it was, does anyone want to ask him what he's on about? When he said the Night King tried to kill him many times, does anyone want to ask him to elaborate? Does anyone want to know how he came into physical contact with him and ended up with the handprint on his arm? No? I know Tyrion sat with him but that feels like a token gesture from the writers to show that someone has some interest, but nothing will come of that and Tyrion's attitude towards everything hasn't changed off the back of it in any case.

To try and end with some enthusiasm; the next episode should be pretty dope.
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
What? Given the reaction by most to Brienne I doubt your average northern soldier is going to be thrilled to have a woman leading the army. Sexism is still clearly a big deal in Westeros.

Especially since Brienne isn't a Northerner either, is she? Then again we don't know what part of the army she's leading.
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I like to think that off screen she sparred with some of her men, smacked feck out of them and made them all think "...alright then, fair enough".
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
What? Given the reaction by most to Brienne I doubt your average northern soldier is going to be thrilled to have a woman leading the army. Sexism is still clearly a big deal in Westeros.

Especially since Brienne isn't a Northerner either, is she? Then again we don't know what part of the army she's leading.
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Reckon your common, average northern soldier would rather serve under Brienne than Jamie Lannister, all things considered.
 
I’m in an absolute minority here I can see, but I enjoyed this episode a lot. A lot of reunions and goodbyes.
I loved the scene with Brienne’s knighting and seeing Sana’a embrace Theon. The next episode will be all action all the time for those who disliked this. There will be blood and death galore
 
Cheesy said:
I also thought it was notable that Jon told her Bran told him and that Sam confirmed it. When it was Sam who said - he clearly doesn't trust her to the point where he wasn't willing to bring Sam directly into the whole thing. Which seems significant.
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Great point. Jon has made it seem as though he doesn't have any time for politics, given the circumstances, but if they are to survive this battle - then what Danaerys does in response to the truth will have consequences for the long term succession of the throne.
 
The big question at the moment is whether the Northern Alliance wins against the Snow King. I think they will/should, because that then gets rid of the whole "common enemy to unite against" theme (to a degree), and paves the way for Jon/Dany to split up etc. Whereas if the living lose the battle, then in addition to them basically all being dead, it just becomes a repeat of what we have already seen - "we have to stand together!!11" "we need Cersei1!!" etc.

As for the battle itself;
I definitely like the theory that Brienne will die and Jaime will have to step in to command the left flank.
I also like the point someone made about how the crypts were mentioned so many times as being safe. Even though they are by definition full of dead people. Against an enemy who is known for raising the dead. Hmm.

Assuming the living win, I am trying to decide how/who kills the Night King. I reckon he [Night King] will surprise them by turning up on his dragon and immediately fecking up the Ironborn. Jon and Dany will then need to mount their respective dragons and take him out. Of course, there was the line from Bran about not knowing whether dragonfire can actually kill him, which might prove to be a fun twist on things. The whole scene of Jon and Dany doing battle atop dragons will set the scene for how I strongly believe their own arc will finish - with the two of them parting ways, Jon taking Rhaegal and eventually them fighting each other in aerial combat.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
I like to think that off screen she sparred with some of her men, smacked feck out of them and made them all think "...alright then, fair enough".
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She won Renlys tournament, beating Loras Tyrrell in the final. Left the hound for dead and has always held her on. Not only that, she swore an oath to protect the stark girls and kept true to her words. Don't think Northerners would have too much concern following her into battle for that alone.
 
SalfordRed18 said:
She won Renlys tournament, beating Loras Tyrrell in the final. Left the hound for dead and has always held her on. Not only that, she swore an oath to protect the stark girls and kept true to her words. Don't think Northerners would have too much concern following her into battle for that alone.
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Yeah, but I'm still going to think that stuff happened on screen. I also like to think that Ghost has been with Jon quite a lot, just slightly below the view of the camera. D&D could have saved some money that way - just need to buy a feather duster, paint it white, and wave it upright from time to time.
 
AltiUn said:
Another decent episode, but next week is the big one :drool:
Also, anyone else think the fact that they emphasised about a million times how safe the crypts are, means the crypts aren't actually that safe?
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Can’t imagine why a place full of corpses wouldn’t be a safe place in a battle against an enemy that can raise the dead.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Yeah, but I'm still going to think that stuff happened on screen. I also like to think that Ghost has been with Jon quite a lot, just slightly below the view of the camera. D&D could have saved some money that way - just need to buy a feather duster, paint it white, and wave it upright from time to time.
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What do you mean think? That stuff did happen on screen.
 
RochaRoja said:
Can’t imagine why a place full of corpses wouldn’t be a safe place in a battle against an enemy that can raise the dead.
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it's fine, that little girl with two brothers who were soldiers is going to protect them all
 
SalfordRed18 said:
What do you mean think? That stuff did happen on screen.
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My stuff. Brienne smacking some Northern soldiers in the yard of Winterfell. Ghost chasing after rats and sneaking pieces of cheese from the kitchen. Qyburn playing patticake with the zombie hand.
 
kouroux said:
That little moment was a waste of time. I mean for real, what did it even bring to the episode ?
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I suppose it was more for Davos, since the girl looked a little like Shireen, and so he could have a moment interacting with Gilly. Maybe it'll come full circle in the next episode like a few things have this season already? Probably not.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
I suppose it was more for Davos, since the girl looked a little like Shireen, and so he could have a moment interacting with Gilly. Maybe it'll come full circle in the next episode like a few things have this season already? Probably not.
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She had a scar on her face which was supposed to make her resemble Shireen, then stir up emotions with Davos.
 
Gandalf Greyhame said:
In the earlier seasons, I thought we'd get a few episodes into the Night King himself. Who he actually was, why he is doing what he is doing, how he got his powers, some sort of BG story into his long haired companions, why this winter is all winters to go south of the wall, some hidden relation to a balance between ice and fire (dragons here) and so on.

I don't think we'll get that now
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I thought a spin off about the white walkers was confirmed.
https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-...g-we-know-george-rr-martin-jane-a8390836.html
 
kouroux said:
I have no doubt that the Night King will kill at least one of the Dragons to even the odds.
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Absolutely.
Think he might even off them both. And I think the Unsullied will be done as a fighting force after this battle
 
RoyH1 said:
Absolutely.
Think he might even off them both. And I think the Unsullied will be done as a fighting force after this battle
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I do hope the big fight will last more than episode 3, I mean we've been waiting for years, it cannot just be done in one episode right ? The rest of the plots seem so futile anyway. feck the Iron Throne
 
Classical Mechanic said:
Thought the Targs always had incestuous marriages to keep the blood of the dragon pure? Isn’t it based on how Royal families married in human history?



I’m glad about that. Prefer the internal political struggle.
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He hasn't been brought up as a Targ though.

While yes there a a few dozen noble houses in the show and nobles marry nobles so cousin marrying cousin would be the norm I think that aunt/nephew is a bit close for most people not Targaryen. I say most because Jaime/Cersei.
 
I enjoyed it again but

my bloodlust is up now after two episodes of reunions and heartwarming scenes. I kind of want a few deaths, which of course we will get in the next episode. The Theon set up is strange as I just see his character arc as incomplete if he dies fighting the undead. I expected a final battle with Euron who is kind of a substitute Ramsey. I don't think he will die next week but if he does I will be disappointed for that reason. Arya still has to meet Melisandre so she is safe, and I expect most of the big characters to live
 
Mr Pigeon said:
:lol: you're all a bunch of miserable bastards.

I thought it was a good episode, in fact it made the lovey dovey shite in the first one not seem like a waste of time now that tensions between Jon and Dany are rising (and Varys is right; nothing lasts). But I guess the show is damned if it does and damned if it's doesn't. Last season was too fast paced and now loads of you are shouting "hurry up and get to the action". Next episode is going to be all action as far as we've been told!

I feel that this season, once it's all done, will be looked back on as being good as a whole piece. It's a joined up final act split into 6 parts. Makes a good case for binge watching because we're currently giving ourselves a full week to moan about what we just saw.
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Yep. Even if some aspects of the writing are less than stellar, I have zero problem with the pacing of this season. Spending a couple of episodes setting up the geography and relationships between the characters prior to a big battle (and whatever happens afterwards) is important. Jumping straight into the action (as some people seem to want) would be poor story structure on a pretty basic level. Even an episode like Blackwater took time beforehand to set the mood and that episode was at the end of a season.

I think GOT has created a problem for itself in that its biggest successes have been in one-off watercooler moments or events (be it Ned's execution, the red wedding or various battle set piece episodes). This had led to some fans being conditioned to only want more of those meme-worthy moments and tentpole episodes, dismissing everything else that would typically be the guts of a TV show as "filler" getting in the way of the spectacle.

For example, the Brienne & Jaime stuff in this episode is massively important for both characters as characters. In a typical TV show that wouldn't get dismissed so quickly but in GOT the desire to move on the the next blockbuster moment sees some people complain that it is pointless.
 
RoyH1 said:
Absolutely.
Think he might even off them both. And I think the Unsullied will be done as a fighting force after this battle
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Absolutely
I thought Grey Worm saying what do you want to do when this is over was one of those jinxing it moments.
 
kouroux said:
I do hope the big fight will last more than episode 3, I mean we've been waiting for years, it cannot just be done in one episode right ? The rest of the plots seem so futile anyway. feck the Iron Throne
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I wouldn’t go as far as calling it futile, but it will be a bit of a underwhelming fight. A bit like beating Liverpool in the PL and then playing the final of the Carabao Cup against West Bromwich Albion.
 
Fully Fledged said:
Absolutely
I thought Grey Worm saying what do you want to do when this is over was one of those jinxing it moments.
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Oh yes.
Grey Worm, Dondarrion and Ser Friendzone are top of my “there’s no way they’re alive in episode 4” pile
 
Irwin99 said:
I enjoyed it again but

my bloodlust is up now after two episodes of reunions and heartwarming scenes. I kind of want a few deaths, which of course we will get in the next episode. The Theon set up is strange as I just see his character arc as incomplete if he dies fighting the undead. I expected a final battle with Euron who is kind of a substitute Ramsey. I don't think he will die next week but if he does I will be disappointed for that reason. Arya still has to meet Melisandre so she is safe, and I expect most of the big characters to live
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I reckon he dies defending Bran. His arc was always ultimately tied to the Starks more than anything else so seems like a fitting way for him to go. I'd have him down as closest to a goner next week, and I reckon we'll see a few go. Grey Worm strikes me as a dead cert, and we'll probably get some of Brienne, Jorah, Beric and some of the other key secondary characters.
 
kouroux said:
I have no doubt that the Night King will kill at least one of the Dragons to even the odds.
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That doesn't even the odds though does it?

Every dragon he kills is another dragon for him.
 
sullydnl said:
Yep. Even if some aspects of the writing are less than stellar, I have zero problem with the pacing of this season. Spending a couple of episodes setting up the geography and relationships between the characters prior to a big battle (and whatever happens afterwards) is important. Jumping straight into the action (as some people seem to want) would be poor story structure on a pretty basic level. Even an episode like Blackwater took time beforehand to set the mood and that episode was at the end of a season.

I think GOT has created a problem for itself in that its biggest successes have been in one-off watercooler moments or events (be it Ned's execution, the red wedding or various battle set piece episodes). This had led to some fans being conditioned to only want more of those meme-worthy moments and tentpole episodes, dismissing everything else that would typically be the guts of a TV show as "filler" getting in the way of the spectacle.

For example, the Brienne & Jaime stuff in this episode is massively important for both characters as characters. In a typical TV show that wouldn't get dismissed so quickly but in GOT the desire to move on the the next blockbuster moment sees some people complain that it is pointless.
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Totally. I just think that after next week we'll look back and be thankful that we got another moment with whichever characters end up dying.
 
I've never seen an episode of Vikings, but that's roughly how I imagine that show to be like. It is what it is at that point. I guess at least the battles will be pretty good, that should make up for quite a bit.
 
Loved last nights episode. Like the fact they slowed down the pace from last season for actual character development. People only want death and action and that is not what the series is about.
 
GDaly95 said:
I tend not to be negative about the show and actually thought the first episode was fairly decent, but I can't believe people seemed to like this one. I thought it was abysmal, almost the definition of a filler episode.

What actually happened? Gendry and Arya, Brienne becoming a Knight, some comic relief from Tormund, the Hound scene. It was all meaningless imo. I guess it was a period of reflection given the battle to come, a chance for us to enjoy some dialogue from fairly prominent characters one last time, a chance to see them bond and become closer so that there can be some more emotional deaths and avenges in the next episode, but it was all quite boring to me.

And the scenes that could have been pretty big were just mediocre. The Sansa & Dany scene was shit. The dialogue wasn't clever, the acting wasn't impressive. It used to be in GoT that a conversation like that would happen and you wouldn't fully understand the intentions behind the characters involved, but there was just this really obvious and blatant fakeness in this scene. Maybe it was intentional, maybe it was horrid acting, either way I thought it was so poor.

Then there was the Jaime & Bran scene which I think went exactly we all expected. Jaime wondering why he didn't tell anyone, Bran telling Jaime he wasn't Bran anymore capped off with some an ambiguous comment. I feel like if you asked us all to write that scene in advance, we'd all come out with very slight variations of it, very predictable.

Then Jon & Dany. It wasn't the worst. I like the idea of Dany not getting a chance to react through words so that she may react through action in the midst of the battle to come, but the way all of that news unfolded wasn't great. Samwell told Jon in the crypts, then Jon told Dany in the crypts. For such groundbreaking news there just wasn't that much to it but maybe I'm being harsh.

I also still find the absolute lack of interest in Bran's three eyed raven thing quite amusing. Like when he said "The things we do for love" during Jaime's trial or whatever it was, does anyone want to ask him what he's on about? When he said the Night King tried to kill him many times, does anyone want to ask him to elaborate? Does anyone want to know how he came into physical contact with him and ended up with the handprint on his arm? No? I know Tyrion sat with him but that feels like a token gesture from the writers to show that someone has some interest, but nothing will come of that and Tyrion's attitude towards everything hasn't changed off the back of it in any case.

To try and end with some enthusiasm; the next episode should be pretty dope.
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I feel like the Tyrion and Bran conversation wasn't a token at all and we will see Tyrion come 'out of the crypts' to save the day after all hope is lost using his intelligence to work something important out based on what Bran had told him prior in said conversation.
 
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