Frenkie de Jong | The last muppeting lap

Frenkie to United?

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VP89 said:
The base fee isnt always the most complicated part of the deal. Yes its advanced but so were our talks for Sancho.
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This is a lie. After the "deadline" Dortmund outrightly refused to negotiate with us.
We're close to agreeing a full fee with Barca on the other hand.
 
EtH said:
It’s called inference. Experience also enters the equation. You know like watching us waste previous windows chasing unattainable targets.

Either way you can choose to live and love but don’t cry to me when it all comes crashing down.
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Exactly the same isn’t it. Except for having an entirely new structure of people in the club.
 
EtH said:
It’s called inference. Experience also enters the equation. You know like watching us waste previous windows chasing unattainable targets.

Either way you can choose to live and love but don’t cry to me when it all comes crashing down.
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I'm under no illusions that transfers can end in a blink of an eye, but i'm also aware that United are very good at briefing when they've ended interest.
Theres absolutely no proof that de Jong is an unobtainable target. Barca want to sell and will make de Jong take a substantial pay cut to remain at the club. They know he won't take it so in essence they're telling him he's not wanted. He could refuse to leave and refuse to take a pay cut, but they'll make him public enemy number 1, and he'd likely single handidly destroy the club, not something you'd want to do to a club you supposedly love is it.
 
RkkMan said:
This is a lie. After the "deadline" Dortmund outrightly refused to negotiate with us.
We're close to agreeing a full fee with Barca on the other hand.
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We aren't just close to agreeing a full fee we have agreed with Barca this deal would be a total of €65m guaranteed and €20m in add ons, according to various top sources such as BBC, Romano and all. The issue is the terms of the add ons
 
Herman Toothrot said:
I think you make some good points. I am very bored by the 'transfer saga' though I am excited about the prospect of having De Jong in the side. Like you, my faith in this coming through is based entirely on Ten Hag's relationship with the player. I find it unfathomable that he'd not have spoken with De Jong and got an unofficial go-ahead before persuing a lengthy negotiation. If it does fall apart, I'll not be calling for Ten Hag's head, but it wouldn't reflect well on him.

The window has been underwhelming so far, but if we do end up with De Jong, Eriksen, Martinez and Malacia (we'll need another if reports of Ronaldo's tantrum are as they seem) then I'll welcome our move away from behaving like The Trafford Globetrotters. It won't be enough to elevate us to champions, but it speaks to us having a plan and a long-term vision for the football team. Signing 36-year-olds to stop them from going to your rivals is not a plan. It was the same with Schweinsteiger, Sanchez and to a lesser extent Cavani and Di Maria.

It's not easy to admit, but we should be looking at how Liverpool rebuilt under Klopp and it will likely take time, patience and some less exciting transfer windows.
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Yeah I could live with less exciting transfer windows if we are addressing the main issues in the first XI, yes I wish we were doing more in that aspect this summer.
 
Brownie85 said:
Didn't we also have a strict deadline for Sancho, which we didn't take seriously and when it passed, Dortmund basically told us to do one and stuck to it?
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From what I recall the deadline thing was just bollocks.
Trex said:
Was it, from what I remember it was speculations....Dortmund wanted of fee in 100+, United didn't want to go that high and that was it, we switched targets and that's it. The two cases aren't even comparable.
Sancho case was more like Maguire under Jose.
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It wasnt speculations. The Athletic and others did a whole rundown on the failed saga. We refused to meet their valuation by something like 20m.

Maguire and Jose wasnt comparable to Sancho. We never even consider a bid for Maguire under Jose (?!).

Sancho we were pushing very hard all window with constant dialogues, we were refusing to meet their difference and thought if we wait till the end of the window theyd panic and cash in.

FdJ is a game of poker. Basic fee agreed but the president is playing his own game. The structure is still complicated to handle so no agreement on full deal. Also not even an agreement on personal terms.
 
Trex said:
We aren't just close to agreeing a full fee we have agreed with Barca this deal would be a total of €65m guaranteed and €20m in add ons, according to various top sources such as BBC, Romano and all. The issue is the terms of the add ons
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What makes you think the full deal is close? Weve agreed a figure not the structure, which is the complicated bit. If im not mistaken Stone or similar said there was still a way to go for frenkie. Whitwell on the latest talk of the devils podcast said the same.
 
Trex said:
All this is you speculating, you're taking Laporta words seriously when he's known to be a liar.
You don't try to sign a Barca player unless they want to sell, if there wasn't a deal to be done we'll have moved on a while back.
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Unless they continue negotiations as a fall back option like I said. You don't know, I don't know. It's all guesswork but there are bits of info that lend credibility to this being possible.
 
Berbaclass said:
See Eriksen recently.
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Precisely.

There is a lot of white noise and politicking, especially during the negotiations. And I think more so when clubs are fan-owned as in Barca, Madrid etc.

When you have singular owners, it's quicker since the implications are just basically financial. With fan-owned ones, a lot of the 'negotiations' are for optics and the next election.
 
pocco said:
Unless they continue negotiations as a fall back option like I said. You don't know, I don't know. It's all guesswork but there are bits of info that lend credibility to this being possible.
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This is our priority position and this transfer has been done very publicly with the entire fan base invested in it, the day United feel there isn't a deal to be done two things will happen going by previous experience.
1. A brief about how we tried to get a deal done and how it wasn't possible from a United point of view.
2. A new alternative would pop and and quickly we'll move on to it.
Nothing of that note have occurred suggesting United still see this as a deal to be done.
 
Trex said:
This is our priority position and this transfer has been done very publicly with the entire fan base invested in it, the day United feel there isn't a deal to be done two things will happen going by previous experience.
1. A brief about how we tried to get a deal done and how it wasn't possible from a United point of view.
2. A new alternative would pop and and quickly we'll move on to it.
Nothing of that note have occurred suggesting United still see this as a deal to be done.
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Exactly what happened when we realised that Timber wasn't all too interested in coming. We moved on quickly and it went dead on the Timber front.
From past experience, we usually brief when a target becomes all but impossible to get. If we get a brief regarding FdJ, either:

1) He's decided that the pay cut is worth it and he's happy to do that and stay (very unlikely)
2) Someone else has jumped in at the last moment and made him a much better offer that he's more attracted too (also unlikely at this point)
3) We've had enough of Barca taking the piss and we're just moving on regardless (would depend on EtH, but also unlikely)
4) We've found someone else who we believe can do as good a job and EtH is happy to go along with them (most likely scenario, but at this point no sign of it)

Thats my opinion on it and the most likely scenarios when United would pull out of negotiations and end all communication.
 
Godfather said:
Big day today?
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Nah, this will go on. People think because we want him on tour that it will happen this week, but Barca will drag this out. I hope it happens before the start of the season. Cant see it happening in July, takes too much time. A week and nothing has happened and we still have quite a lot to sort out with Barca and FdJ. Not sure what is holding it up, but i assume it is on Barca's side.
 
Brownie85 said:
Exactly what happened when we realised that Timber wasn't all too interested in coming. We moved on quickly and it went dead on the Timber front.
From past experience, we usually brief when a target becomes all but impossible to get. If we get a brief regarding FdJ, either:

1) He's decided that the pay cut is worth it and he's happy to do that and stay (very unlikely)
2) Someone else has jumped in at the last moment and made him a much better offer that he's more attracted too (also unlikely at this point)
3) We've had enough of Barca taking the piss and we're just moving on regardless (would depend on EtH, but also unlikely)
4) We've found someone else who we believe can do as good a job and EtH is happy to go along with them (most likely scenario, but at this point no sign of it)

Thats my opinion on it and the most likely scenarios when United would pull out of negotiations and end all communication.
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Exactly at this point its dragging on but the club still see it getting done eventually.
And I don't think ETH is such a De Jong fan boy that he wouldn't have assurances that if/when we come to all agreement with Barca he would sign on the doted lines.
 
izec said:
Nah, this will go on. People think because we want him on tour that it will happen this week, but Barca will drag this out. I hope it happens before the start of the season. Cant see it happening in July, takes too much time. A week and nothing has happened and we still have quite a lot to sort out with Barca and FdJ. Not sure what is holding it up, but i assume it is on Barca's side.
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Think this is it, Barcas own struggles are going to make it difficult, but reckon we get there still.
 
Herman Toothrot said:
I think you make some good points. I am very bored by the 'transfer saga' though I am excited about the prospect of having De Jong in the side. Like you, my faith in this coming through is based entirely on Ten Hag's relationship with the player. I find it unfathomable that he'd not have spoken with De Jong and got an unofficial go-ahead before persuing a lengthy negotiation. If it does fall apart, I'll not be calling for Ten Hag's head, but it wouldn't reflect well on him.

The window has been underwhelming so far, but if we do end up with De Jong, Eriksen, Martinez and Malacia (we'll need another if reports of Ronaldo's tantrum are as they seem) then I'll welcome our move away from behaving like The Trafford Globetrotters. It won't be enough to elevate us to champions, but it speaks to us having a plan and a long-term vision for the football team. Signing 36-year-olds to stop them from going to your rivals is not a plan. It was the same with Schweinsteiger, Sanchez and to a lesser extent Cavani and Di Maria.

It's not easy to admit, but we should be looking at how Liverpool rebuilt under Klopp and it will likely take time, patience and some less exciting transfer windows.
Click to expand...

Definitely, I’m more than happy to avoid those type of transfers also and maybe the likes of Malacia and Martinez will walk into the first team and impress from the start. I’m just dreading starting the season with McFred, Maguire, Rashford and an already wanting out Martial. Plus the others who have mostly failed us for years now. It just says to me the season will be similarly disappointing although I’m going with the majority on here and hoping ETH can work some wonders on the training ground.

Still feel we will be very lucky to get 4th at best but more likely we’ll be outside of it. I can also see us dropping several points before this window even shuts and we’ll be playing catch up for the off and most of this squad fold under any pressure.

Just need to get my head around us hopefully going in a new direction (more than happy to take tips from Liverpools rebuild) and also have the limited players we clearly have starting week in week out, at least improving on the basics. Squad wise though we don’t have a team full of match winners like when looking at the best sides, especially with Ronaldo likely to leave and not even Cavani to call on. Another issue I see is with height, the amount of times Matic, Pogba and Ronaldo win defensive headers from corners will also be missed.

Let’s hope we do get FDJ before season starts and he is as good as many perceive because our midfield sucks.
 
izec said:
Nah, this will go on. People think because we want him on tour that it will happen this week, but Barca will drag this out. I hope it happens before the start of the season. Cant see it happening in July, takes too much time. A week and nothing has happened and we still have quite a lot to sort out with Barca and FdJ. Not sure what is holding it up, but i assume it is on Barca's side.
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Yeah I have wrote off him going on tour because there is still too much of this deal to sort out
 
Every year we think something "must" be done pre tour, and it doesn't happen.
There's always a transfer that stretches on late on with the new signing turning up about 2 or 3 days before the first game.
 
izec said:
Nah, this will go on. People think because we want him on tour that it will happen this week, but Barca will drag this out. I hope it happens before the start of the season. Cant see it happening in July, takes too much time. A week and nothing has happened and we still have quite a lot to sort out with Barca and FdJ. Not sure what is holding it up, but i assume it is on Barca's side.
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Wouldn't surprise me if they want to see FdJ face to face where they can tell him how it is.
Not over the phone, or over some video call, but to his face. In my opinion, they'll literally sit him in a room and say (for example) "this is how it is, you stay and slash your wages by 50% and give up 75% of your deferred pay". They know he won't accept that, hell, thats probably why they'd suggest it. It'll be a firm and final offer i bet, no room for compromise as the financial situation is dire etc. From there onwards, it's plain sailing for Barca. He's a mercenary who wants the cash and doesn't love the club as much as he professes too
 
If he’s negotiating with Barcelona how much/when they pay him his deferred wages it makes sense for him to publicly declare he wants to stay - he knows they need shot of him so he’s in a strong position. It’s the right negotiation strategy.
 
What happened to we must only sign player who really want to play for the club?

FDJ priority is to stay at Barca. He is still fighting to stay in Barca even though the club is forcing him out.
 
If this drags on much longer, it really makes me think we should just shit the bed
 
Trex said:
This is our priority position and this transfer has been done very publicly with the entire fan base invested in it, the day United feel there isn't a deal to be done two things will happen going by previous experience.
1. A brief about how we tried to get a deal done and how it wasn't possible from a United point of view.
2. A new alternative would pop and and quickly we'll move on to it.
Nothing of that note have occurred suggesting United still see this as a deal to be done.
Click to expand...

I don't deny any of that, but it doesn't mean that the possibility that I have mention isn't true. Take Laporte's words at your own accord, but there is enough smoke from him, FdJ & Spanish journalists to say that there is a possibility he will stay.
 
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