Frenkie de Jong | The last muppeting lap

Frenkie to United?

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pocco said:
I'm calling bollocks on that. Think about it, we're talking about wages he has earnt, in the very loosest of terms (contractually he is owed nothing by the looks of it). But say they're right, is FDJ expecting Barca to hand him 17m euros before he even utters the words that he will leave or agrees anything with us? If he wants a lump sum then he has to agree a move, otherwise he will get his money contractually over the next 3 or 4 years. These journalists are talking out of their backside as it's impossible to get a lump sum of money owed in the next 3 or 4 years without agreeing to a move. By which point, if these journalists were correct, he would then forfeit the money.
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From what I've gathered here and there part of his deferred wages take the form of a €20M "loyalty bonus" which is one of many loopholes Barca are clearly using around salary caps (based on weekly wage commitments).

He could in theory fall foul of the conditions of such loyalty bonus and eventually, even staying until the end of his contract, find himself €20M out of pocket.

How or why he ever agreed to get tied up in such complex mechanics to help out the club is beyond me. Never mind the levels of goatfeckery from Barca.

Newfound appreciation for that pest Mino Raiola, may he rest in peace. That would never happen under his watch.
 
devips said:
I see some of our so-called "fans" clearly has no trust in ten Hag and his insistence that FDJ is needed for his squad.

So much for supporters backing the new manager.

I hate to think what would happen if the first few matches in the league don't go to expectations.

Shame on these "fans" some of which are polluting this thread and this page as well.
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Obviously he is needed for the squad… who said he isn’t? Wether he comes or not is a different matter. Majority of the fans do trust and believe in ten Hag.
 
izak said:
Soon we'll be at panic station mode when Brighton play us off the park like they did last season, then we'll all assemble in the Mcfred thread thinking how we let a whole summer pass without addressing the Midfield, De Jong can't be the only player in the world that can fix our midfield problems surely not.
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EtH is already on record saying that if he can't get the profile or player he needs, he will develop within.

Of course, ANYTHING can happen between now and 1st September. We could win every game convincingly and have the thought of not needing any players. Or, lose badly in all games, amd panic buy in as many positions as possible.

We could also be just fine. Go along as expected and not stockpile for the sake of it and get the actual player we want down the line.
 
Castia said:
Alright so who's reporting that he actually wants to join then? other than the usual 'well he must want to join else we wouldn't be after him' excuse there's nothing to this story.
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Tier one journalists have said he'll join United but as long as the deferred wages are sorted.
 
pocco said:
It's the way you just dismiss it because it doesn't suit your agenda. Even adding your little 'groundbreaking' quip to the end like a teenage girl that thinks she's got it all sussed out. There's a mountain of sources that say he wants to stay at Barcelona, that say he hasn't agreed any personal terms with us. And yet you still can't accept that he might want to stay :lol: Honestly, it's laughable. You're a **** to a ****.
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If he wants to stay so badly, why has he not yet accepted the pay reduction?
 
red thru&thru said:
What you are forgetting is, Barca want him to choose option B, or option C.

There's also an option D...let Frenkie join another club and Barca pay him what he's owed.
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So if they want him to leave, they won't let him talk about leaving or he'll forfeit monies owed right now. In which case he will then just stay on his current deal and get the money anyway over the next few years. So how do Barca enforce anything upon him if they want him gone? There is probably a pile of documentation in Richard Arnolds office which shows Barcelona have instigated a move, so from here on forth he is probably allowed to attempt to claim all of his money.

The only stupid thing about this whole thing is that, from what we know, he isn't legally entitled to any of it right now anyway. A court would likely rule in Barca's favour as he willingly signed a new deal with reduced wages for 2 years. FDJ is apparently trying a non-legal claim to this money as he is only morally and not legally entitled to it right now.
 
pocco said:
So if they want him to leave, they won't let him talk about leaving or he'll forfeit monies owed right now. In which case he will then just stay on his current deal and get the money anyway over the next few years. So how do Barca enforce anything upon him if they want him gone? There is probably a pile of documentation in Richard Arnolds office which shows Barcelona have instigated a move, so from here on forth he is probably allowed to attempt to claim all of his money.

The only stupid thing about this whole thing is that, from what we know, he isn't legally entitled to any of it right now anyway. A court would likely rule in Barca's favour as he willingly signed a new deal with reduced wages for 2 years. FDJ is apparently trying a non-legal claim to this money as he is only morally and not legally entitled to it right now.
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Exactly. FdJ and team messed up with the deferred wages. They don't owe it him if he leaves. FdJ clearly know his team messed up, hence the hard stance of not leaving.

This is why it has dragged on for so long. And with the tactics Barcelona are using to get him out are appaling.
 
devips said:
I see some of our so-called "fans" clearly has no trust in ten Hag and his insistence that FDJ is needed for his squad.

So much for supporters backing the new manager.

I hate to think what would happen if the first few matches in the league don't go to expectations.

Shame on these "fans" some of which are polluting this thread and this page as well.
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Nothing wrong with ETH insistence he needs FDJ in the squad, it's just looking very unlikely scenario Frankie will end up here.
Ten Hag insistence plays rather insignificant role is this circus between Barca and de Jong.
Erik on the other hand will be responsible if we don't land any midfielder this summer if his insistence "it's Frankie or nobody" turns out to be true.
 
red thru&thru said:
If he wants to stay so badly, why has he not yet accepted the pay reduction?
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Until very recently there have been reports that Barcelona have never offered or spoke to him about a reduced-terms contract (reports stated his agent claimed this), if we believe reports. But obviously ESPN are today saying he's been offered one. So we will see what happens.
 
I want him here but I’m also sort of intrigued to see what sort of shitstorm happens if he stays and refuses a pay cut.
 
I voted to walk away, but also understand why the club would hang in there since I assume someone at united knows more than we do about the current situation of things, and unlike most of the Caf I don't believe Murtough or Arnold are idiots who can't see what the average fan can.

I do wonder though, how section of the fanbase who have convinced themselves that "he doesn't want to join" will react if he goes through a bad run of form during the season, maybe even drop some downright stinkers? Surely, this is not an ideal situation for him, hence why I am wondering why there have been no leaks to suggest a positive interest in joining United if the contract situation with Barca is sorted.
 
pocco said:
Until very recently there have been reports that Barcelona have never offered or spoke to him about a reduced-terms contract (reports stated his agent claimed this), if we believe reports. But obviously ESPN are today saying he's been offered one. So we will see what happens.
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Laporta mentioned it a while ago. But yeah, let's see. Shouldn't take too long either way I guess.
 
imagine offering a player who has already deferred wages for two years a salary reduction of 35-40% to have the privilege of being allowed to wear that jersey again :lol:

I don't know what is more baffling - that a club of this magnitude has the audacity, or that players still bend over backwards for them. Unbelievable.
 
This De Jong or no one stance from ETH is frankly bizzare.

De Jong might be his first choice, and the best option out there, but the idea that only he can improve our midfield is just bonkers. This isn’t like Fergie adding Veron to an already fantastic midfield, where only the genuine world class best are worth targeting. Our current midfield options are genuinely bottom half of the table level. And that’s just the two starters. After that we have absolutely no depth. Plus we’ve still not replaced Matic or Pogba. We’re desperate for reinforcements. If we had a good midfield that we could fall back on if the De Jong deal doesn’t go through then I could understand the single minded approach. But we don’t. If we have to suffer another season of McFred as our regular starting pair then we haven’t got a hope in hells chance of a successful season. Our rivals for top 4 simply have far better quality.
 
I have thought about it a bit more and i actually think he'll join us. If he had zero intention, ETH would have thrown in the towel.

I think he's in a tough spot with his scumbag club and we (United) are doing the right thing by being patient and supportive towards Frenkie .
 
Infestissumam said:
imagine offering a player who has already deferred wages for two years a salary reduction of 35-40% to have the privilege of being allowed to wear that jersey again :lol:

I don't know what is more baffling - that a club of this magnitude has the audacity, or that players still bend over backwards for them. Unbelievable.
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Exactly, a player takes initiative to help a club out to defer wages, the club use that as an opportunity to take the piss. When they have to pay the agreed wages back, they try to get rid and give an ultimatum that you cannot stay without reducing wages.

To make it better, they sign 4 players and one (Kessie) in his position.
Pre season comes and play him at Cb.

Yet, the player is keen on staying at Barcelona. I mean after all of that and he doesn't want to leave.
 
Very risky form us having all our eggs in the one basket here hoping this deal comes off , if it does't looks like we are going intro the season very weak again in midfield.

On the other hand is is oddly reassuring that we seem to finally have a manager with a vision of what he wants and very determined to stick to that plan no matter what and will not be throwing money around here and there bringing in players who do not fit that vision just to save face and appease fans etc.
 
Fridge chutney said:
I have thought about it a bit more and i actually think he'll join us. If he had zero intention, ETH would have thrown in the towel.

I think he's in a tough spot with his scumbag club and we (United) are doing the right thing by being patient and supportive towards Frenkie .
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Who says we haven't thrown in the towel?

ETH in his interview with Sky sports said we are looking at specific players in midfield, if we cannot get that, we have to use what we have.

That was 1 week ago and it was a give away that its Frenkie or no one. I suspect we will monitor Frenkie till the end of the window, because we will look like fools pulling out now.

This will just drag into a conclusion at the end of the window.
 
Fridge chutney said:
I have thought about it a bit more and i actually think he'll join us. If he had zero intention, ETH would have thrown in the towel.

I think he's in a tough spot with his scumbag club and we (United) are doing the right thing by being patient and supportive towards Frenkie .
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My thoughts as well. There’s zero chance ETH would push for this transfer if he did not believe his target was open to the move.

Panic is not warranted.
 
pocco said:
I don't get how that relates to what I'm discussing. The other poster said that FDJ can't say he is leaving or he won't get his money. I said he has to say his going if he wants his money now. Therefore I'm calling bollocks on him not being able to say anything. Not to mention the fact that he believes this is money that is owed to him already, so he should be able to say whatever he likes. The only time I've heard anything like this is in relation to loyalty bonuses, which is completely different.
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My bad, mate. Misunderstood. I stand corrected.
 
romufc said:
Who says we haven't thrown in the towel?

ETH in his interview with Sky sports said we are looking at specific players in midfield, if we cannot get that, we have to use what we have.

That was 1 week ago and it was a give away that its Frenkie or no one. I suspect we will monitor Frenkie till the end of the window, because we will look like fools pulling out now.

This will just drag into a conclusion at the end of the window.
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Exactly. ETH knows more than we do, I would assume we're monitoring but no longer pushing it. It's media circus and Barca - FDJ circus, doesn't seem like United is actively involved currently.
 
ThemanGiggsy said:
Romano just said Here we go for Kounde. something is going to have to give soon
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Honestly, nothing is surprising me anymore with that club. You'd hope that something has been agreed with frankie before pulling the trigger on Kounde, but I doubt it
 
I still think De Jong and his camp are waiting for Barca to sit down and negotiate exit terms, and the moment Barca do so, things will move quickly then, until then, nothing will happen.

Barca are just hoping that De Jong either leaves without negotiating exit terms or accepts a reduced salary, that is why they are dragging it, and at some point, they will have to accept reality and just sit down with De Jong and his camp and find a solution for the wages that were "deferred/restructured", or else, risk not being able to register new players.
 
red thru&thru said:
Exactly. FdJ and team messed up with the deferred wages. They don't owe it him if he leaves. FdJ clearly know his team messed up, hence the hard stance of not leaving.

This is why it has dragged on for so long. And with the tactics Barcelona are using to get him out are appaling.
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It's interesting for sure, because from an accounting point of view, there's no other way to have deferred those wages - other than the manner in which they did it. If FDJ was legally entitled to it, it would have been needed to be put through the books those seasons as incurred, even though no "cash" payment was made to FDJ ergo Barca's wage bill would not have been reduced by the deferred payments.

Maybe they should never have agreed to it in the first place, but then the club might have gone under/not been allowed to register enough players to play etc. and this is the kind of shit pressure they put on all their players.

At the very least, his advisors should have put some penalty clause in place to state that if FDJ were to leave Barca/if Barca were to sell him before the contract period ended, he'd have needed to be repaid a value similar to what he deferred etc.
 
Never mind Spanish fair play, at what point do FFP step in? This club is 1.9 billion in debt and are spending like they have a sugar daddy. Christ alive
 
pocco said:
So if they want him to leave, they won't let him talk about leaving or he'll forfeit monies owed right now. In which case he will then just stay on his current deal and get the money anyway over the next few years. So how do Barca enforce anything upon him if they want him gone? There is probably a pile of documentation in Richard Arnolds office which shows Barcelona have instigated a move, so from here on forth he is probably allowed to attempt to claim all of his money.

The only stupid thing about this whole thing is that, from what we know, he isn't legally entitled to any of it right now anyway. A court would likely rule in Barca's favour as he willingly signed a new deal with reduced wages for 2 years. FDJ is apparently trying a non-legal claim to this money as he is only morally and not legally entitled to it right now.
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No, his position seems quite clear. Either pay me the money I deferred then I‘ll leave, or if not I’ll just sit here on my fat new contract.
 
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