Terrible take.
Football is boring and lacks real superstars
- Thread starter Scottynaldinho
- Start date
Pretty much.
I’m surprised at the amount of people who talk about football not being entertaining “anymore”. It’s never been particularly great to watch for a neutral, which is why so many people hate football. Take the passion away and there’s not much to get excited about.
The “greatest World Cup match ever” last year was dull for 80 minutes and only livened up at the end. The game was made more interesting because lots of people wanted to see Messi win a WC (and lots of people didn’t).
I love watching football, I am still full of passion and emotion for United, but I am not expecting - and never have - 90 minutes of pure entertainment. We need to accept it for what it is, and embrace it.
For those who think football has lost its way, go to YouTube and watch 90 minutes of a league match from the past.
If football was the great as a spectator sport, we wouldn’t have to gamble on it to make it interesting when it’s not our team
Fred is my idol
About to say this, Spain got more boring over time because they became too reliant on possession until their tactics no longer worked but the early teams were far from boring. Senna in midfield in fact was not a possession player and you had F. Torres and David Villa upfront who were exciting strikers.
The individual players who stand out, are a bit different get called arrogant and are chastised these days.
90% true but couple of things that are incorrect.
Capa was a positional player - it's exactly how computers play. Tal was always seen as crazy even in the 60s. and one of the best young prospects today didn't use a computer till he was 16.. Younger players are now more adventorous as otherwise it's just a draw.
Hopefully that happens in football too
I can hardly remember a time when I found international football all that enthralling, it rewards the kind of football which you can never be a fan of unless you're from that nation. I've never seen Switzerland for eg and ever been impressed or entertained by any of their games so that I will ever look forward to seeing them play and international tournaments seem to have many such teams.
I was also thinking that there is no charisma in any of the current crop of players. If you see their interviews their banter is about beating each other on FIFA. I don't see anyone with any personality whatsoever.
I don't know if football has got more boring exactly, I think I've just got older. My memory of football as a child is probably skewed and I only remember Liverpool 4-3 Newcastle and not the boring 0-0 both teams probably played out the season before.
It's also so easy now to watch players live or on Youtube. There is no mystery anymore and rarely a surprise player that you didn't already know about having a great tournament.
It's also so easy now to watch players live or on Youtube. There is no mystery anymore and rarely a surprise player that you didn't already know about having a great tournament.
The introduction of sex toys has really livened up the chess scene, perhaps it should be considered for football.
football is more boring, but it's nothing to do with the calibre of players.
The game is far more compressed and positional, which means individual duels against your direct opponent matter less, in all areas of the pitch. Wingers taking on a man, midfielder winning his battles, striker centreback.
it gains advantage still, but it's far more reliant on team play to utilise the advantage. It's well and truly a team game now.
The game is far more compressed and positional, which means individual duels against your direct opponent matter less, in all areas of the pitch. Wingers taking on a man, midfielder winning his battles, striker centreback.
it gains advantage still, but it's far more reliant on team play to utilise the advantage. It's well and truly a team game now.
What the hell is that
Neymar had enough talent to be indisputably included in GOAT debates, he just never maximized it and made some poor career choices. He's still in a different stratosphere to Vinícius, though, and I'd argue still one of the best players of all time.
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I honestly haven’t bothered watching most of the Euro’s. I normally can’t watch football anymore if UTD aren’t involved. At least not on tv. I watched Austria vs Netherlands in a pub in Vienna. That was fun, as a neutral.
Maybe it has to do with age. But then again I recently discovered competitive Counter-Strike and the games are so much more entertaining. With actual drama, with amazing casters that build on that drama. I’d rather watch a CS tournament now than a football match tournament.
Maybe it has to do with age. But then again I recently discovered competitive Counter-Strike and the games are so much more entertaining. With actual drama, with amazing casters that build on that drama. I’d rather watch a CS tournament now than a football match tournament.
Alexander Arnold would’ve been a midfielder akin to David Beckham if he came through years ago. It doesn’t make the game not just more technical now but ‘light years’ ahead like you claimed. I doubt you saw much of Irwin at his peak by the way if you think anyone in the Premier League today comes close on a technical level. Look at the goal he scored against Wimbledon and tell me what full back in the Premier League can do that.
What other full backs are so much more technical? Walker has been considered the best around for years. His technical level doesn’t get close to Neville. Or a player like Stuart Pearce.
I'm similar to you.
Been following pro CS since early 2018 and it's awesome, although it was way better pre-COVID IMO. Football on the other hand interests me way less than it used to in the past, but that's also partly down to the number of false dawns in the past 11 years where I thought real change was finally coming at United, and it ended in tears.
With Capa, why I mentioned "possibly" is that he was positional but also deeply intuitive with a super developed tactical game, and did not rely on memorization - for eg, the way he broke down the Marshall attack with no preparation and time constraint could not have relied on entirely on the square by square approach. For young players, I feel developing this intuition is critical rather than making them spend hours on end in memorizing opening variations. It happens only in a few chess schools in my city at least. Carlsen, who is a genius tactician when he prefers to play that way, often does not and instead likes to play a machine with 0 risk to ensure a win. Winning has taken priority over the art form.
Chess and video games.
Bunch of nerds!
Bunch of nerds!
International level fullbacks being able to play well in midfield goes back to players like Junior and Bessonov in the '80s.
Football is less individualistic.
Its hard to see someone like Zidane play at his own slow but sexy tempo or Ronaldinho gliding across the pitch.
Ever since Guardiola, every team and fan wants to play possesion football, whether that team can or not is a different matter.
Football is more like Chess now.
Its hard to see someone like Zidane play at his own slow but sexy tempo or Ronaldinho gliding across the pitch.
Ever since Guardiola, every team and fan wants to play possesion football, whether that team can or not is a different matter.
Football is more like Chess now.
This would be an apt reply if the initial claim was that there has never been a full back capable of that. That was not the claim.
Whoever watched Inter Milan in the Serie A last season, or Man United's Cup win v Liverpool would not say football is boring.
There are still plenty of quality sides and players and the game has never been as popular.
It will take a few years to get some new superstars in the mould of Messi and CR7 but that time will come too.
There are still plenty of quality sides and players and the game has never been as popular.
It will take a few years to get some new superstars in the mould of Messi and CR7 but that time will come too.
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Some people forget what Barcelona Neymar was like, hell even what first couple years PSG Neymar could be like. And he wasn't even a good pro most of the time. Vini is excellent but he could only dream of having the level of talent Neymar had. And he's never had and probably never will have a season like Neymar did in 14/15.What the hell is that
Neymar had enough talent to be indisputably included in GOAT debates, he just never maximized it and made some poor career choices. He's still in a different stratosphere to Vinícius, though, and I'd argue still one of the best players of all time.
Fair enough. It looked like you were suggesting Lahm was the first or that no one was technical enough to do it at all even just 20 years ago.
We are coming down from the Cristiano and Messi era, some time has to pass before others have a chance to shine.
Salah and Son are not entertaining to watch in 2024 in my opinion, a few years back and they for sure make the list. Kvara was an omission. Rafa Leao is another big one, he’s a good watch.
It’s not an age comparison I’m merely mentioning the best attackers in the world that have the entertainment factor in all lists. In 2004 the only players past their best were Ronaldo and Zidane and they were still up there with the best in their positions. No player in there is a reach.
I'll do you one better and make a 22 and under list in 2004 and you’ll see the talent pool there was to choose from;
Ronaldo, Robben, Reyes, Ibrahimovic, Kaka, Rooney, Quaresma, Cassano, Van der Vaart, Joaquin, Adriano. There was also the young phenom Robinho at the time whose highlight reels in Brazil were being watched everywhere at the time.
Footballers these day do not have an individual identity/playstyle. In the past when you thought of players like R9, Zidane, Ronaldinho, Becks, Kaka etc you knew exactly the type of individual quality they bring. These days there are only a handful of players who you can say that about. Everyone else is just part of a functioning system.
For me tiki taka isn't boring, it's the teams they play against that are boring not the team trying to attack. ten men behind the ball etc to try and counter the tiki taka. Tiki taka is exciting as feck and great to watch.
Footballers are fitter and technically better.
in terms of style though there are far fewer genius players. Far fewer with personality or something special.
I think its really prominent when you consider strikers
mid to late 90s in the league you had Cantona, Andy Cole, Sparky, Shearer, Fowler, Owen, Ferdinand, Le Tissier, Bergkamp, Wright, Anelka, Klinnsman, Suker, Hasselbaink, Viduka, Phillips, Zola and Yorke
all amazing talents and some real genius in there especially when you compare to the Premier League strikers of the last few years.
in terms of style though there are far fewer genius players. Far fewer with personality or something special.
I think its really prominent when you consider strikers
mid to late 90s in the league you had Cantona, Andy Cole, Sparky, Shearer, Fowler, Owen, Ferdinand, Le Tissier, Bergkamp, Wright, Anelka, Klinnsman, Suker, Hasselbaink, Viduka, Phillips, Zola and Yorke
all amazing talents and some real genius in there especially when you compare to the Premier League strikers of the last few years.
Not really. "Those types of players" means about 15 guys across football history. They were always the anomaly.
And we don't know what Musiala will turn out to be in a few years yet.
Skill issue. Watch more football
Leao, Kvara, Barcola, Dembele, Luis Diaz, Isak, Foden, Olise, Sane, Wirtz, Saka, Rodrygo, Bruno Fernandes, Bernardo Silva, Di Maria, Messi, Zirkzee, Soulé, Savinho...
It's the other way around. Winning individual duels matters more than ever now because the coaching has improved so much that it has become pretty much the only reliable way teams can gain advantages anymore
In 2004 Mourinho "revolutionized" the PL with a masterstroke tactical move nobody could figure out how to counter which was....playing 3 CMs....
If you kept reading the thread you’ll see that I mentioned Leao and Kvara as omissions. They are true entertainers.Skill issue. Watch more football
Leao, Kvara, Barcola, Dembele, Luis Diaz, Isak, Foden, Olise, Sane, Wirtz, Saka, Rodrygo, Bruno Fernandes, Bernardo Silva, Di Maria, Messi, Zirkzee, Soulé, Savinho...
The aim of what I was doing was to name the most entertaining 10-15 players in those years and compare which had the most entertainment factor.
Plus many of the players you’ve listed here aren’t actually that entertaining to watch. They are just wingers that can beat players with effective but pretty basic skills.
Notice my list for 2004 didn’t include Wright-Phillips, Simao, Malouda, Pires, Juninho, Saviola, Eto’o, Giggs, Rui Costa and many many others. I was specifically trying to list the most entertaining players. You won’t be able to make a list of the 15 most entertaining for 2024 and it be better than 2004.
My first World Cup was Argentina '78. If anyone thinks this tournament is lacking in star quality and entertaining technical football, they should try watching that. Almost every team were either not as good as they had recently been, or not as good as they were about to become (or in the case of Brazil, both of those things). Which allowed a largely unheralded Argentina side without any real stars on it to win.
Or Spain '82, a tournament won by a team consisting mostly of grizzled fighters and a striker pretty much no one rated but who found the form of his life for the tournament, after beating a German side no one in their right mind would compare to the title-winning '74 side for quality.
We remember the great stuff, like Brazil's work of art football in 82, or France and Maradona in 86, but the truth is the football was generally pretty drab, and there weren't a lot of entertaining players. I vividly recall widespread complaints about boring football at both tournaments. '90 was a bit better, but '94 again hardly a great tournament. '98 was good though.
The need for technical skill is generalised today, it didn't use to be. You could be a quality defensive midfielder or CB barely being able to pass the ball. In club football, tactical organisation and technical and physical proficiency has evolved greatly and interconnectedly - so much so that national sides are no longer able to fully employ the available tactical means, as they require more common practice than there is time for. But they still get the full benefit of all that individual technical and physical skill.
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We could use some of that. The only thing that screams Man United there is the explanation of how Antony ends up on the pitch hogging balls and killing counters.
I once read that now players are so fit and trained compared to 30-50 years ago that the field size is no more adequate for 11 fit players, as they cover too much the ground making the games too blocked and without "flair".
So they suggested playing with 10 man from now on to counter this "issue"...
So they suggested playing with 10 man from now on to counter this "issue"...
Spot on.
That's absurd. If your idea of Mbappe is "dull as dishwater", you're living in a fantasy world.
Pep Guardiola has managed to kill off individuality.
Everybody's a 'system player' now
Everybody's a 'system player' now
The invention of the system has killed any individual brilliance, it's all about the team now. Any form of special ability like 30 yard screamers, edge of the box volleys, excellent crosses, 40 yard cross field passes etc is coached out of players now in favour of discipline, reading the game and positioning. This is what stats have done to the game, there's less chance of the above things paying off if you don't have excellent players, and even when you do they can't do it every game. It's all about fine margins and doing what gives you statistically the best chance of winning the game.
You'd also wonder what the likes of Shearer, Cantona, fat Ronaldo etc would be able to do in today's game where defenders can't kick you or jump with their arms. I know Ronaldo and Messi are brilliant but I feel they've also benefited from the game changing. Drop them into any of the European giants circa 1999 and I doubt they've have the same impact they have today.
You'd also wonder what the likes of Shearer, Cantona, fat Ronaldo etc would be able to do in today's game where defenders can't kick you or jump with their arms. I know Ronaldo and Messi are brilliant but I feel they've also benefited from the game changing. Drop them into any of the European giants circa 1999 and I doubt they've have the same impact they have today.
I'm pretty sure I saw something like this recently. Sounds like something Wenger would want to implement
definitely. Wenger gives me Stewart Pearson from The Thick of It vibes