Is he playing in a more advanced position this year?
Fabregas, Barcelona, & Badge Kissing.
- Thread starter Ceks
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Is he playing in a more advanced position this year?
All the wanking over assists is idiotic. Yesterday one of his assists was the pass for the first Arsenal goal. Nothing in that pass that should be revered as an attacking attribute.
Yes he is, we are playing a 4-3-3 formation now. With Fabregas, Song and yesterday Diaby making up our middle three. This has allowed Fabregas a lot more freedom to get forward. He had Arshavin and Rosicky ahead of him as well yesterday both players with good movement which made our attacking play a lot more fluid than it has been in the past.
If I look at the team yesterday stick Nasri on for Diaby and that is probably our first choice set of outfield players. Nasri last season played as a CM and he didn't get forward as much as he would of liked but still did ok. I do think he could handle the role between Fabregas and Song quite well.
Fabregas was in the team of the Tournament, after scoring and setting up several goals.
He'll be regarded (at the least) the equal of Scholes come the end of his career.
Paul Scholes has won 9 league titles, and 2 European Cups, amongst many of other medals.
So far Fabregas has done nothing at club level (maybe an FA Cup?).
Sure, by the end of his career that might be different, presumably after a move to a better club, but that's still a pretty bold statement.
Zinedine Zidane said Scholes was the best midfielder of his generation.
Fabregas would do very well to even match what Scholes has done in the game, let alone surpass it.
A victim of circumstance. And not to say he didn't contribute to the cause, because he did. But if he was player for an average side (ala Le Tissier) he'd have still been held in the same regard as a player.
Which is what we're talking about, after all.
By your logic: O'shea > Henry. LULZLOGIC.
Don't be a spazzer, it's not the same at all.
For one, Henry has quite a few league title medals, and a Champions League medal. In fact, his medal collection is better than O'Shea's I'm sure.
But let's not denigrate Scholes to the same level. He has a stockpile of medals, but in addition has been quite possibly the best midfielder of his generation, playing an integral role in most of his team's successes (only waning in recent years), whereas O'Shea has largely only been a bit-part player (1 or 2 seasons aside).
It's not poor logic to put Scholes on a pedestal, like it is with O'Shea. Paul Scholes at his best was getting double figure goals every season, even breaking the 20 goal mark, whilst running midfields, with barely a bad game across a season.
He broke the 20 goal mark playing in Berbatov's role of last season though.
He played the furthest forward of 3 midfielders. Much like the role Fabregas has for Arsenal as well.
Good point though. Scholes stats are even more remarkable because of the fact that most of them come from him operating in a 2 man midfield.
So he ran the midfield with only one partner, and scored double figure goals regularly. Genius.
I'm still gutted that Paul Scholes retired from International football at the time he did.
He had been invisible for England for a fair length of time when he did.
Not quite invisible. Was hard to miss his ginger hair on the left of England's midfield.
Being played out-of-position.
Surely not as 'invisible' as Gerrard was against Chelsea, I woke up and his face was plastered on milk cartons
Fabregas was in the team of the Tournament, after scoring and setting up several goals.
He'll be regarded (at the least) the equal of Scholes come the end of his career.
Virtually the entire Spanish team was included in that team. Xavi and Iniesta too
He had a great tournament, especially for a player who started it out of the side
But you're making silly leaps of faith to say he'll definately be regarded at least the equal of Scholes. He has a hell of a lot to live up to to even come close
What a player wins is irrelevant when comparing the quality of a player. Andy Cole won 5 league titles, a few FA cups and the CL while at Man utd does that make him a better player than Thierry Henry or Alan Shearer who won less while in this country?
Zidane's opinion is just that an opinion. He has also talked very highly of Fabregas as well. At a similar age Fabregas has already far surpassed Scholes and is well on his way to being a better player and that is our point. Of course with Scholes being highly regarded among Man utd fans some will not like that. At a similar age imo he is better than Xavi and Iniesta when they were 21/22 so I see no reason for him not to surpass them. With Barca being so keen on bringing him back they must see something in him as well.
Although this is true, his contributions for England at the time, whether centrally or on the left, were hardly something England fans could have been 'gutted' to have missed out on.
Fabregas is a fantastic talent and already a very good player indeed.
Well on his way to being a better player than Scholes? Impossible to say. If he does become better than Scholes, Fabregas will probably be the best player in the world at some point.
Whilst playing for Barca...
Yup, when the manager forces you out left in order to integrate two inferior players in Lampard and Gerrard, thereby nullifying everything great you bring to a football game, then you're not exactly going to stand out.
Before that he had been one of England's best players, and was a regular goal scorer. Unfortunately England managers have often fallen into the trap of playing the best 11 players in whatever formation necessary, so long as it includes them all. Capello would have known better.
Who cares?
England could clearly have done with Scholes at various times between his International retirement and now. Only a brainwashed Liverpool fan from Denmark would claim otherwise.
If he picks up the CL at Barca expect Arsenal fans to celebrate deliriously like when Henry won it. They really felt apart of his achievements. They petition to have the CL trophy in their Cabinet along with their two stunning Emirates trophies.
He also said he thought Gerrard was the best player in the world fairly recently, doesn't mean all that much.
Can't be arsed having a tedious argument with you, but I don't think Zidane's very far off with his assessment of Scholes.
I'd suggest when a player wins the league title 9 times, and captures 2 European trophies during his career, that's hardly an irrelevance. In fact it's extremely relevant. If you have Scholes in your side, you win. What better mark of a player is there than that?
I've never understood why people pay much attention to what players and managers say in intervuews and press conferences.
The questions are often leading, and the players and managers just want to get over with the interviews as soon as possible.
Anyone who needs Zidane to tell them what a good player Scholes has been wants their bloody eyes testing, and their judgement replacing
I guess you didn't watch Xavi much in the 1990s.
Possibly the dumbest thing ever said.
I'd love to know which fans celebrated deliriously when Barca won the CL. I know many fans were happy for Henry to complete his trophy haul but I doubt many were jumping over the moon about it.
When Scholes was at his peak there were better player around in the world, infact one played right beside him. So I'm not sure about that comment.
Probably will play for Barca at one point, just like I know how you felt deep down C.Ronaldo would leave same way I feel Fabregas will as well.
Of course it is irrelevant, first of you are comparing a 34 year old's trophy haul to someone who has just recently turned 22. And like I have pointed out just because you play in a more successful side doesn't mean you were the better player. Most of those 9 trophy wins I'd say in EVERY single one of those campaigns you had at least one better player than Paul Scholes in the side.
I've seen plenty of Xavi and when he was that age he was not putting in performances like Fabregas is now.
What a player wins is very relevant, if they were an integral part of that success. And certainly when you look back at how highly regarded a player is, what they won during their career is a big factor. All the greatest players have had highly successful careers. There's not too many on the greatest lists who had careers devoid of medals.
I'm not doubting Fabregas is a great player, so please stop it with your 'Man United fan not liking it' faggotry. All I'm saying is that he'll have done very fecking well to be regarded as highly as Paul Scholes when he finishes his career - that much is clear. As I said, Scholes ran midfields himself on a very consistent basis, regularly scoring double figures, whilst often playing with only one midfield partner for support. His stockpile of medals simply puts his talents in some context.
You are right, Scholes was never THE best player in the world, but he wasn't that far of being among the best players in the world. Hence, if Fabregas does become better than Scholes ever was, there is a good chance he will be the ebst player in the world at some point.
Nor do I, but the fact that Zidane said it shouldn't give any more credence to the claims. Footballer's aren't that smart.
"Jog on"
Ah, but I'm not comparing the two players, I'm questioning this claim that Fabregas is a shoe in to become as good as or better than Scholes. Given just how good a fecking player Paul Scholes has been, that's quite some claim
Obviously this is a judgement to make towards the end of Fabregas' career, but if he hasn't won any further notable silverware, and he's being compared to Scholes... sorry I do think that is relevant. Are you saying Fabregas is playing with a load of shite team mates here or something?
Ferguson would disagree with your last statement by the way. He's been quoted as saying Scholes is his best player. And he's right too. Bloody genius in the midfield he is. I love how you try to make out its some kind of luck that he's held a first team place down in the best side in this country for a decade and a half and had the success he has
Jazz, you are very Scouse-like in this thread....
Well done for putting it in your location then. Taking the piss out of Zidane's stupidity are you?
It's a nice quote, I still wouldn't use it in argument to prove anything.
Using someone else's opinion to prove your own isn't particularly useful.
Using someone else's opinion to prove your own isn't particularly useful.
Fabregas has all the ingredients to be as good or better then scholes. Thsts what the claim is, and you cant deny it until its played out.
He has been playing with Denilson for the past year or so..........I rest my case.
Where have I said that Scholes isn't a fantastic player, I've been on here many times talking about how highly I rate so how exactly am I trying to make it out that it is by luck he has held his place in your side? Hell I've even said Fabregas hasn't reached the level of Scholes at his peak yet, if I was putting him down why would I say that?
As for Ferguson, well I'd be more interested in what he has to say when 4 or 4 years after he has retired what he puts in his autobiography. Managers more often than not big up their players in the press. While there haven't been many who haven't stayed as long as Scholes there are a few in their short time had as great if not bigger impact than him on your side.
That is out of order mate, I've done nothing to deserve a comment like that.
The claim is that Fabregas is well on his way to being a better player than Scholes, which is both silly and pre-mature.
And very Scouse-like.
Fabregas will leave when Xavi is going decline