Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager

[Sarni]

Plenty of questions around this.

For those adamant staying was right would you take us finishing say 12th and winning a cup and keeping him next summer?

A few years ago missing top 4 was a guarantee of the sack, with or without a cup. Now 8th keeps you there.

Yes injuries etc etc but what if we have injuries to the likes of Bruno, Garnacho and Hojlund next year? Is 12th or 13th OK? How far do you make this allowance?

Or is it solely about who is available? Even though there only seem to be about 3 names everyone thinks is a guarantee of success, with 2 being impossibilities due to being links with rivals and one being an aging Italian who barely did much with Everton?

I'm not gutted we've kept him by the way, just interested in the above.

I think the bar is either top 5 or winning a cup, ie if we are lower than 5th but win one of the cups he’s going to stay but if we finish lower than 5th and win nothing he will be reassessed at the end of year.

If we have serious injuries (ie any of the key players missing 10+ games is serious) then expectations should be of course lower than they normally are.

I don’t think he is expected to challenge for the league or CL in any of the next 3 seasons. Beyond that it depends on what investment he can get.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

Its quite clear from all the reports voming out about other managers turning us down that we've only kept him as none of the available replacements wanted the job.

The only thing we can do now is get behind the team and hope he doesnt continues with his useless tactics tgat see us conceed 20-30 shots per game, I cant see Erik being heavilly backed in the transfer window if they dont really want him as manager so he has a tough job ahead of him.

Agree with this
we've only kept him as none of the available replacements wanted the job.

 

[Atheist]

Plenty of questions around this.

For those adamant staying was right would you take us finishing say 12th and winning a cup and keeping him next summer?

A few years ago missing top 4 was a guarantee of the sack, with or without a cup. Now 8th keeps you there.

Yes injuries etc etc but what if we have injuries to the likes of Bruno, Garnacho and Hojlund next year? Is 12th or 13th OK? How far do you make this allowance?

Or is it solely about who is available? Even though there only seem to be about 3 names everyone thinks is a guarantee of success, with 2 being impossibilities due to being links with rivals and one being an aging Italian who barely did much with Everton?

I'm not gutted we've kept him by the way, just interested in the above.

Going by the views here and perhaps INEOS too, seems like that’d be considered acceptable as long as there’s no “better” candidate available in the market.

 

[Andy_Cole]

Plenty of questions around this.

For those adamant staying was right would you take us finishing say 12th and winning a cup and keeping him next summer?

A few years ago missing top 4 was a guarantee of the sack, with or without a cup. Now 8th keeps you there.

Yes injuries etc etc but what if we have injuries to the likes of Bruno, Garnacho and Hojlund next year? Is 12th or 13th OK? How far do you make this allowance?

Or is it solely about who is available? Even though there only seem to be about 3 names everyone thinks is a guarantee of success, with 2 being impossibilities due to being links with rivals and one being an aging Italian who barely did much with Everton?

I'm not gutted we've kept him by the way, just interested in the above.

I think this season just gets a pass as it was a year of the club sale etc. if we did it 2 years in a row then that’s unacceptable.

Standards should stay high but yeh this last season was probably the strangest we’ve had.

 

[DJW]

Going by the views here and perhaps INEOS too, seems like that’d be considered acceptable as long as there’s no “better” candidate available in the market.

None of this screams, he’s our first pick, he’s clearly been kept out of necessity and not out of choice.
Plan A, B, C didn’t work over reported financial differences, Plan D Erik.
Feels like he’s a stop gap until Ashworth is fully in post and their preferred candidate(s) become free, once Ten Hag tanks downwards again.

 

[NLunited]

I think everyone knows Antony isnt good enough. Name me 1 manager that gets 100% of signings right?

He has the ability physically, it’s a shame he hasn’t been able to kick into gear.

 

[steffyr2]

Plenty of questions around this.

For those adamant staying was right would you take us finishing say 12th and winning a cup and keeping him next summer?

A few years ago missing top 4 was a guarantee of the sack, with or without a cup. Now 8th keeps you there.

Yes injuries etc etc but what if we have injuries to the likes of Bruno, Garnacho and Hojlund next year? Is 12th or 13th OK? How far do you make this allowance?

Or is it solely about who is available? Even though there only seem to be about 3 names everyone thinks is a guarantee of success, with 2 being impossibilities due to being links with rivals and one being an aging Italian who barely did much with Everton?

I'm not gutted we've kept him by the way, just interested in the above.

There's a thread on the front page about a possible player transfer to either Liverpool, Madrid or United. I'm thinking that if Liverpool and Madrid are interested, United is out of the running.

Same thing may be true of managers. It's been so many years since Utd has looked competent, would top level managers want to come? And risk tanking their reputation.

 

[Sandikan]

There's a thread on the front page about a possible player transfer to either Liverpool, Madrid or United. I'm thinking that if Liverpool and Madrid are interested, United is out of the running.

Same thing may be true of managers. It's been so many years since Utd has looked competent, would top level managers want to come? And risk tanking their reputation.

On the other hand it'd be a brilliant time to come in - 30 year low position, on verge of a new era, be the manager to lead us back to glory.

 

[steffyr2]

On the other hand it'd be a brilliant time to come in - 30 year low position, on verge of a new era, be the manager to lead us back to glory.

Yeah, but...the problem is that the club itself is a known mess. Utd wound up in 8th place, presumably they'd get an 8th place quality manager and 8th place quality players if they add anyone. (or the players will be looking at money rather than success, not a good thing.)

Plus, your comment is how fans think. Professionals would be looking at the quality of the recruiting, the medical, etc.

 

[NLunited]

I think our entire midfield mess would have been prevented by just signing De Jong when ETH requested him. Instead we spent millions on Casemiro and Mount, both of whom don't look like they are going to have much of a role going forward for different reasons (Casemiro's decline, Mount's positional fit).

He wanted Casemiro and De Jong to play together. It is in an interview.

Let’s also not forget Cashmere was awesome in his first season.

 

[Big Ben Foster]

He wanted Casemiro and De Jong to play together. It is in an interview.

Let’s also not forget Cashmere was awesome in his first season.

He truly was the goat that year

 

[Sandikan]

He wanted Casemiro and De Jong to play together. It is in an interview.

Let’s also not forget Cashmere was awesome in his first season.

How can you post this gub and not even double check it

 

[Newstyle]

What justifies offering a new contract in light of poor performance?

 

[The holy trinity 68]

What justifies offering a new contract in light of poor performance?

A trophy? Isn't that what football is all about at the end of the day.

 

[Bright_Eyes]

Your point makes no sense, Ten Hag would be sacked if we finished 4th for the third time in a row, 5 years into the job.

So Fergie should have been sacked for finishing 11th, 2nd, 12th, 13th, 6th then by that logic.

This is why it makes no sense to look solely at league position in a vacuum, whether you're ETH in or ETH out. That's the point I was responding to and the point I was making.

 

[Bright_Eyes]

Was Ron as successful as fergie? No. So my point stands.

I'm not a ETH fan, but we should give him time.

Ron did better in the league in his first 5 seasons than Fergie. So if we were in 1986 right now you'd be arguing for Ron to stay.

 

[RedC]

So Fergie should have been sacked for finishing 11th, 2nd, 12th, 13th, 6th then by that logic.

This is why it makes no sense to look solely at league position in a vacuum, whether you're ETH in or ETH out. That's the point I was responding to and the point I was making.

There is no logic to what you're saying, along with most other things in this thread. These things aren't comparable.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

There is no logic to what you're saying, along with most other things in this thread. These things aren't comparable.

They are not but the club has had 5 permanent managers since Sir Alex and the 4 before ETH have not even made it through their 3rd season. Sacking every manager after 2 seasons because of an underachieving season has not worked. It is difficult for any manager to keep a continuous improvement and build a team if they only get 2 seasons and are sacked.

Sometimes a team goes back first before moving forward. Sir Alex himself said to back the manager and give him time. It takes more than 2 seasons to get things right.

 

[RedC]

They are not but the club has had 5 permanent managers since Sir Alex and the 4 before ETH have not even made it through their 3rd season. Sacking every manager after 2 seasons because of an underachieving season has not worked. It is difficult for any manager to keep a continuous improvement and build a team if they only get 2 seasons and are sacked.

Sometimes a team goes back first before moving forward. Sir Alex himself said to back the manager and give him time. It takes more than 2 seasons to get things right.

I wanted Ten Hag to stay, I agree that he should be given another season, given the circumstances around last season. I was simply saying that the comparisons and gotcha logic that poster was trying to use made zero sense.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

I wanted Ten Hag to stay, I agree that he should be given another season, given the circumstances around last season. I was simply saying that the comparisons and gotcha logic that poster was trying to use made zero sense.

I wasn't criticising your post, I was just pointing out that the club needs to give a manager more than 2 years and give them a good set up to try and build something.

 

[Newstyle]

A trophy? Isn't that what football is all about at the end of the day.

At what cost? Would you be satisfied with finishing 12th in the league for an FA Cup win? Your perspective seems biased. The idealization of managers at this club needs to end.

 

[Wumminator]

Would those of you who want Ten Hag to stay be happy to keep him if you walked in on him satisfying your wife? She climaxes for the first time ever (you thought it was a myth) and orders a takeaway that night.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

At what cost? Would you be satisfied with finishing 12th in the league for an FA Cup win? Your perspective seems biased. The idealization of managers at this club needs to end.

If the possibility of getting top 4 was out of the window, then 6th and an FA Cup win is not all that different to 12th and an FA Cup win as they both grant the same things for the most part.

 

[Cantonagotmehere]

He truly was the goat that year

How can you have a memory longer than a week?!

 

[RedRocket9908]

If the possibility of getting top 4 was out of the window, then 6th and an FA Cup win is not all that different to 12th and an FA Cup win as they both grant the same things for the most part.

There is a difference of £12m quid between finishing 6th and finishing 12th which with ffp can have a huge affect on what you can spend.

 

[United492]

For me it now boils down to this:

The managerial situation has been decided, like it or not;
Close this thread and support the club and team you claim to support;
Let's look for positives rather than whataboutery.

 

[Semper Fudge]

I hope not, no reason to discuss what's long gone.

It’s zinger after zinger with you isn’t it?

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

If the possibility of getting top 4 was out of the window, then 6th and an FA Cup win is not all that different to 12th and an FA Cup win as they both grant the same things for the most part.

This level of binary thinking does my head in.

 

[RedC]

Would those of you who want Ten Hag to stay be happy to keep him if you walked in on him satisfying your wife? She climaxes for the first time ever (you thought it was a myth) and orders a takeaway that night.

Would you be happy with Ten Hag if he won the league, but came 8th in the Championship? Standards are a disgrace at this club.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

Would those of you who want Ten Hag to stay be happy to keep him if you walked in on him satisfying your wife? She climaxes for the first time ever (you thought it was a myth) and orders a takeaway that night.

You try to open the door but there's too much jizz on the knob...

My question is about the transfer budget, sir.

 

[Herschel Krustofsky]

The only way I'd see Tuchel and De Zerbi rejecting us is if they've been told this summer we're not going to spend.

Bald has the biggest balls.

is clear

 

[Sarni]

He wanted Casemiro and De Jong to play together. It is in an interview.

Let’s also not forget Cashmere was awesome in his first season.

Casemiro was still the wrong signing. At best we were going to get 3-4 good seasons out of him and were not going to be competitive near the top anyway.

 

[USREDEVIL]

He truly was the goat that year

Reply of the year so far.

 

[RedRocket9908]

Casemiro was still the wrong signing. At best we were going to get 3-4 good seasons out of him and were not going to be competitive near the top anyway.

That was simply down to the incompetency of those in charge of transfers, we finished the season knowing we desperately needed a DM and a Striker but somehow started the next one without signing either and as a result had to sign Casemiro who wasnt one of Eriks preferred choices.

 

[MiceOnMeth]

We're the only "big club" in Europe who wouldn't have sacked this guy after the season he just had.

 

[Ollie Derbyshire]

We're the only "big club" in Europe who wouldn't have sacked this guy after the season he just had.

Agreed, personally I think it’s the lack of real top quality managers available that saved him. I wanted him sacked after the performances we’ showed last season as they simply weren’t good enough BUT he’s our manager still and it’s a new season so I’ll back him and hope the performances improve.

 

[Bright_Eyes]

There is no logic to what you're saying, along with most other things in this thread. These things aren't comparable.

I just disagree that "Fergie did badly in his first five years so we should give ETH more time regardless of anything else" is good logic.

I'm fine with the decision INEOS made as I'm hopeful until proven otherwise that they've done a proper assessment on things that we aren't privy to. But I highly doubt that their sole reasoning was "Fergie did bad then good though" like some people on this thread keep reducing their reasoning to. The decision should be based on a whole bunch of factors involving various measures of progression and the wider environment. People who keep bringing up Fergie's early years as a reason to keep ETH are doing exactly as you say - comparing things that are pointless to compare.

That's all I'm saying and you seem to either disagree or have missed my point.

 

[vivaronaldo]

We're the only "big club" in Europe who wouldn't have sacked this guy after the season he just had.

100% agree...we have now accepted mediocrity as the norm

 

[TrivelaDeBruno]

We're the only "big club" in Europe who wouldn't have sacked this guy after the season he just had.

We’re also the only big club in Europe that have been intricately and purposefully destroyed from within by its owners for over a decade. This has infected every area of the club and it makes those kind of side by side comparisons a little problematic imo

 

[RedOrange]

I just disagree that "Fergie did badly in his first five years so we should give ETH more time regardless of anything else" is good logic.

I'm fine with the decision INEOS made as I'm hopeful until proven otherwise that they've done a proper assessment on things that we aren't privy to. But I highly doubt that their sole reasoning was "Fergie did bad then good though" like some people on this thread keep reducing their reasoning to. The decision should be based on a whole bunch of factors involving various measures of progression and the wider environment. People who keep bringing up Fergie's early years as a reason to keep ETH are doing exactly as you say - comparing things that are pointless to compare.

That's all I'm saying and you seem to either disagree or have missed my point.

Fergie's early years aren't being brought up as evidence that Ten Hag will come good. They're brought up as an example of someone who struggled early and figured things out later. The fact that Ten Hag struggled this season is no guarantee he'll continue to struggle given more time and support.

Plus the fact that he kept going and managed to keep most of the squad motivated through the season despite a raft of injuries, frequent player drama, constant speculation about his role under the new ownership and a bafflingly hostile media environment is a point in his favour, IMO. Mourinho, Conte and Tuchel tend to create drama bombs to extract themselves from these kinds of situations early instead of toughing them out.