Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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I know it's preseason but our build up from the back is still suspect. The pressing and high line also have lots of work to do.
Onana has definitely improved it but yeah we still don't play out with the confidence of a City

we don't play out as well as City simply b/c we aren't as comfortable doing so with DeGea, Maguire and Lindelof as they aren't nearly as good on the ball as the counterparts at City.

Our midfield isn't as good on the ball as City either especially in terms of dealing with pressure when receiving with pressure on their back

you can see the structure is in place and the patterns are in place however the execution fails....where i think it will take a massive upturn is having Onana in goal simply b/c he's 100x's better with his feet than DeGea

the area of most concern for me is the pressing and high line....first off you have to have two CB's with Pace and two CB's who don't mind playing 1v1. also...you have to all be on the same page which sometimes it doesn't look that way. the front 6 have to be together so they cut off passing lanes, the press with their triggers and more importantly they stop the switching from side to side. we saw evidence of that last night against dortmund where at times the press was brilliant and other times they didn't press as a unit so they easily were broken down.
 

Erik ten Hag says Manchester United have no right to be considered title contenders heading into the new Premier League season.​
The United manager has told his stars they must first prove they are good enough to get themselves in the mix and that only Manchester City – champions in five of the past six seasons – should be discussed as potential winners.​
United finished 35 points behind City in the season before Ten Hag arrived but closed that gap to 14 points under the Dutchman last term.​
But Ten Hag – who has left the door open to more signings before the close of the window after United agreed a £72 million deal with Atalanta for Denmark striker Rasmus Hojlund – wants his players to focus only on hitting the ground running rather than any title talk.​
“I think in pre-season we shouldn’t talk about that [the title] – I think no one in the Premier League can do that, [except] maybe City,” said Ten Hag, whose side kick off their season at home to Wolves on Aug 14.​
“They can do that because for the last six years they won the title five times. So they can talk about that but any other club must first compete for the first four positions and make sure you are getting in the first four. And then, after, the first two and then maybe you can see about getting yourself in such a position. But don’t talk about that achievement.”​
After being crushed 6-3 by City in the league last October, United won the return game at Old Trafford 2-1 in January before losing the FA Cup final to their bitter rivals as Pep Guardiola’s side went on to win an extraordinary Treble.​
Ten Hag believes United have shown they can compete with City in one-off games but that they must strive to match the champions’ relentless consistency.​
Speaking on United’s preseason tour of the US, he said: “I think we have proven we can beat them but you have to do it every day and in this moment we have a way to go.​
“City are also winning their games much more easily than we did so I see the facts. But I actually don’t want to talk about them because it sounds negative and it’s not the way I meant it. I want to talk about our project. I want to talk about how we improve and I think the improvements last year and the results were quite obvious but also in the performance.​
“It was quite obvious that we could beat the big opponents, and also City. In the three games you saw absolutely that we increased the levels against them.​
“We are looking at ourselves and not looking at other teams. We have a competition with seven, eight clubs in the Premier League, across Europe even more teams, so we have to work on our way of play and improve our performance. It has to be optimum.”​
Ten Hag defends £400m spent on signings​
United have agreed deals for Hojlund, goalkeeper Andre Onana and midfielder Mason Mount this summer to take their spending under Ten Hag past £400 million.​
But the manager insists United are no different to any of their immediate rivals in terms of investing heavily and he does not rule out more incomings.​
Ten Hag likes the Fiorentina and Morocco midfielder Sofyan Amrabat but United would have to sell to make another signing.​
Asked if United’s spending increased the pressure on him and the team next season, Ten Hag said: “It can’t be because all the teams are investing huge money, such huge amounts.​
“In comparison with the others we are not doing more or less. They all invested a lot in their teams. I’m not focusing on this issue because it’s totally, for me, unattractive.​
“I have to think about my way of play and how I improve my team. I will fight for players who I want to have in and I will demand from the club to get the right players in and when we have that, we have to get results.”​
On the prospect of more arrivals, Ten Hag added: “We are always looking for better quality. So if you want to be at United you have to match a really high standard and when we find the opportunities to get better we have to do it because everyone is expecting the best from us.​
“So we also have to raise the bar there but it’s also very important that the players understand we believe in them - believe in their potential, believe in their personalities because team spirit, togetherness, the social connection, the relationships have to be really good among footballers. It’s a team sport and when we are unified we are stronger.”​
‘I believe in the potential of Harry Maguire’​
One player facing an uncertain future at Old Trafford is Harry Maguire, who lost his place in the team under Ten Hag last season and has since been stripped of the captaincy. West Ham had a £20 million bid for the England defender rejected last week and Ten Hag said it was up to the player to decide if he wants to fight for his place or leave.​
“When you are at Man United you have to fight for your position and bring your skills in and prove you are the best for the team and contribute the most,” he said.​
“It’s [stripping Maguire of the captaincy] nothing against Harry, it was in advantage of the team. Then you make the decision. But I will not say that Harry isn’t part of this group.​
“He has to fight for his position. He is a very good centre-back, and I believe in the potential of Harry Maguire. It’s just that he has to prove himself and fight his way into the team. It’s up to him, and I think he can do it.”​
When it was suggested his treatment of Maguire did not point to him believing in the defender, Ten Hag added: “Didn’t I play him? See his competition. It’s tough when you’re competing with Rapha Varane and Victor Lindelof. It’s huge competition. That has nothing to do with the belief.​
“I have often chosen a player ahead of Harry, that’s true. But that says nothing about me not believing in him. He has to show he is better for the team than Rapha or Victor. I think that’s a normal situation in top football.”​
‘Sancho has to show he can contribute’​
Ten Hag has also challenged Jadon Sancho to show far greater consistency next season. The England forward faces something of a make-or-break campaign after two difficult years that included him working on his physical and mental condition away from the squad for three months last season.​
“He has to show consistently that he can make a huge contribution,” he said. “When you are a front player that end product is the key. So make sure you are making the key actions, the final pass and get your goals in, because that’s why he is here.​
“The rest has to be good as well. That is your foundation and then you meet all the other standards that we expect from a player - on a high level every third or fourth day.”​
Ten Hag has been experimenting with Sancho as a false nine in preseason and believes the winger is in a good place mentally.​
Ten Hag also offered a stark reminder to his squad that it was imperative they live their lives in the right way. The Dutchman has made a number of references to Marcus Rashford ensuring his “attitude is right” but said that message applies to every member of his squad.​
“For all the players, you have to live the right life,” he said. “Professional football is tough, so in general our players can’t match the sensational life [while] playing top football.​
“Top football is tough nowadays, 60 games a year in club football, 10 international games. Seventy games means that every third or fourth day you have to match the highest physical levels. When you’re not living the right life, you get killed. What is important? Sleep, recovery, nutrition.​
“Three key areas and when you don’t do this right, you have a problem. You can’t perform. So when you ask me about Rashford, the same counts for Rapha Varane and every player. You will not reach the levels when you don’t do the things right.”​
Ten Hag added: “I think in general when I came in at Man United, the standards were not right. That’s true. I demand the highest standards in sleep, recovery and nutrition because that makes the difference if you can perform every third or fourth day. That is the demand for every top football player, so at Man United we are demanding the highest standards.”​
 
we don't play out as well as City simply b/c we aren't as comfortable doing so with DeGea, Maguire and Lindelof as they aren't nearly as good on the ball as the counterparts at City.

Our midfield isn't as good on the ball as City either especially in terms of dealing with pressure when receiving with pressure on their back

you can see the structure is in place and the patterns are in place however the execution fails....where i think it will take a massive upturn is having Onana in goal simply b/c he's 100x's better with his feet than DeGea

the area of most concern for me is the pressing and high line....first off you have to have two CB's with Pace and two CB's who don't mind playing 1v1. also...you have to all be on the same page which sometimes it doesn't look that way. the front 6 have to be together so they cut off passing lanes, the press with their triggers and more importantly they stop the switching from side to side. we saw evidence of that last night against dortmund where at times the press was brilliant and other times they didn't press as a unit so they easily were broken down.

Our press should improve this season hopefully with Mount and Hojlund, but also Onana. All 3 seem to have been recruited with 1 eye on being a front foot side.

Onana takes up a higher starting position than DDG, meaning the CBs can go higher and not leave as big a gap behind them.

Mount compared to Eriksen is night and day with regards to mobility and fitness levels.

Finally you have Hojlund compared to Ronaldo/Martial/Weghorst who strangely all had decent pressing stats, but Hojlund beats out even Nunez in this respect as a true work horse up top.
 
I'm not convinced City will have things their own way this season. Their squad is slightly weaker now.

They may still win the league but you'd have to argue that anyone can beat anyone in the "big 7" (now including the Geordies).

It might be a season where 80 - 85 points can win the title. The key to our potential success will be not dropping too many points against the bottom half teams.

In a one-off match, absolutely. But their experience in putting together 10-15 match winning runs is priceless. That is what I'm most concerned about.

If City're 9 points behind the leader at the half-way mark, they'll probably still be favorites. Even Liverpool needed a monster season, dropping 2 points in the first 25 games, to be sure of the title.
 
I am confident Erik will improve this

I'm confident we will start to demolish teams and genuinely surprise rivals second half of the season

We will see glimpses first half but our "spine" has been playing together a season now
 
Ten Hag the alpha Chad asserting dominance over the beta Avram

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“He has to show consistently that he can make a huge contribution,” he said. “When you are a front player that end product is the key. So make sure you are making the key actions, the final pass and get your goals in, because that’s why he is here.​
So no "press resistant", "ball carrying", "defending" excuse bullshit, according to our own manager.​
 
He's spent 200m last summer, then 170-180m already this summer (and counting). You'd hope that his "re-building" should be close to being done.
I do think we are close. We also have to gradually replace aging players and prices will remain high.

Significant investment each year will continue to be needed to keep up with the other teams. They are investing heavily as well.
 
So no "press resistant", "ball carrying", "defending" excuse bullshit, according to our own manager.​
Came here to say exactly the same. I love that ETH keeps it simple and says what is most important. An attacking player should be about end product and/or creativity (if goals are lacking then he needs to make it up by assists or by being extremely creative). Defending/pressing by your most attacking players/forwards is not unimportant but nowhere as important as attacking output and end product. Otherwise we could as well have played Elanga regularly.
 
Came here to say exactly the same. I love that ETH keeps it simple and says what is most important. An attacking player should be about end product and/or creativity (if goals are lacking then he needs to make it up by assists or by being extremely creative). Defending/pressing by your most attacking players/forwards is not unimportant but nowhere as important as attacking output and end product. Otherwise we could as well have played Elanga regularly.

Agreed with EtH. We should expect more from our best XI in terms of output. And like you said, it doesn't necessarily need to be goals and assists. The pressing and defending should be just the bare minimum requirements for every player (unless they've proven in Messi or Ronaldo level).

@NLunited @rpitroda
Yes. I pin down within 3 years, we should be ready to mount serious title challenge. More than that, we will need to re-do another "building process" as some of our best players are catching up with their age.
 
He's spent 200m last summer, then 170-180m already this summer (and counting). You'd hope that his "re-building" should be close to being done.
Wan-Bissaka will be on the chopping block next window, for sure. He's trying to get rid of all the players who are a liability when we're in possession.
 
Wan-Bissaka will be on the chopping block next window, for sure. He's trying to get rid of all the players who are a liability when we're in possession.
Most sensible fans knew it takes us 3 windows with this shitty owners… but this season, we should see more and more improvements but we still have too much deadwood that no one wants
 
Wan-Bissaka will be on the chopping block next window, for sure. He's trying to get rid of all the players who are a liability when we're in possession.
I don't know, mate. I'm in two minds about AWB. I'd love it if we can upgrade the RB, but also keep him in the squad.
Probably it's not the most sensible take, financial wise.
 
So no "press resistant", "ball carrying", "defending" excuse bullshit, according to our own manager.​
Came here to say exactly the same. I love that ETH keeps it simple and says what is most important. An attacking player should be about end product and/or creativity (if goals are lacking then he needs to make it up by assists or by being extremely creative). Defending/pressing by your most attacking players/forwards is not unimportant but nowhere as important as attacking output and end product. Otherwise we could as well have played Elanga regularly.
100%

Ole was the same in interviews.

Sometimes the players just have to do the job they've been told to do. The tactics will automatically fall into place once that happens.
 
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I don't know, mate. I'm in two minds about AWB. I'd love it if we can upgrade the RB, but also keep him in the squad.
I'm in the same boat as you. For me it comes down to this question:

  • Is it better to have a player like Dalot who's 6 out of 10 across the board?
  • Or a player like AWB who's 4 or 5 out of 10 in some areas, 6 out of 10 in other areas, but 11 out of 10 in one particular area?

I think for a first XI option, they need to be all-rounder with at least a 7 or 8 out of 10 in every category. Dalot fits the template, without actually being at the required level in any area.

Then, for a bench option, it's okay to have a specialist who can be untouchable at just one thing. This at least gives the manager more tactical flexibility. And when they play, it makes it easier for their teammates to know how play around their deficiencies. Obviously, AWB is this kind of player.

Imo, Dalot should be sold next season. AWB can stay, but only if he's happy to be a sub. This season is just about getting through and hoping neither of them makes too many mistakes that cost us games.
 
I was hoping we would go for Mazarui. He has a good understanding with Antony and used to be able to drop in as the extra midfielder, which ETH is looking for with AWb and Dalot
 
Spot on about AWB and Dalot, @Devil You Know . Shaw is that 7 or 8 out of 10 all rounder. I'm hoping the RB will be attacking-wise more penetrating (even with lesser defending ability). That Frimpong link got me excited, but there's not much traction on that rumor.
 
If ETH can the players to cut out the individual mistakes, that will be the biggest improvement he could make on the output. Now I understand that this partly is down to tactical awareness, technical ability and intensity but some of the unforced errors our players make are just down to lack of concentration. For that the players are wholly responsible.
 
I'm in the same boat as you. For me it comes down to this question:

  • Is it better to have a player like Dalot who's 6 out of 10 across the board?
  • Or a player like AWB who's 4 or 5 out of 10 in some areas, 6 out of 10 in other areas, but 11 out of 10 in one particular area?

I think for a first XI option, they need to be all-rounder with at least a 7 or 8 out of 10 in every category. Dalot fits the template, without actually being at the required level in any area.

Then, for a bench option, it's okay to have a specialist who can be untouchable at just one thing. This at least gives the manager more tactical flexibility. And when they play, it makes it easier for their teammates to know how play around their deficiencies. Obviously, AWB is this kind of player.

Imo, Dalot should be sold next season. AWB can stay, but only if he's happy to be a sub. This season is just about getting through and hoping neither of them makes too many mistakes that cost us games.
AWB needs to improve his shooting/finishing if he is going to get into the box, Dalot is better in that respect.

Both could be better on the ball, but Dalot is slightly better.

Depending on the opposition, one is a better option than the other. Against lively wingers, use AWB. Otherwise play Dalot because he can shoot and finish.

Upgrading Dalot with a world class RB and keeping AWB is a good plan. We need someone who is excellent on the ball and contributes assists and goals.
 
I won't be surprised if we are near the top. The core players are there, Shaw, Varane, Martinez, Casemiro, Bruno, Rashford. Hopefully, Antony steps up is 2nd season and we know Dalot and AWB can do what is needed. Now we have Mount, Onana and Hoijund where Hoijund would be a question mark. We are definitely a good XI side at least ask some questions. City lost a few players Mahez and Gundogan will definitely hurt them maybe Walker is leaving as well. Haaland would have a difficult 2nd season.
 
I won't be surprised if we are near the top. The core players are there, Shaw, Varane, Martinez, Casemiro, Bruno, Rashford. Hopefully, Antony steps up is 2nd season and we know Dalot and AWB can do what is needed. Now we have Mount, Onana and Hoijund where Hoijund would be a question mark. We are definitely a good XI side at least ask some questions. City lost a few players Mahez and Gundogan will definitely hurt them maybe Walker is leaving as well. Haaland would have a difficult 2nd season.
Ye it’s all about who city are gonna sign to replace them. They’re getting a very good defender from Leipzig. Mahrez didn’t play enough anyway so they’ll be fine with our him. Walker would be a big miss, especially against sides with rapid wingers.
 
His analysis of the Dortmund game was withering in its criticism. He was right saying the last half hour was 11 individuals out there not following [directions]. Bringing EtH on board has been a masterstroke. He knows what he wants, he holds everyone to a high standard, he's ruthless, he's tactically astute, and doesn't take any shit. Love him.
 
I said the United side which finished under Rangnick would not exist in 18 months under Ten Hag. He's making changes as quickly as he can. I still feel, aside from the obvious, some players are living on borrowed time, just Ten Hag is trying to keep them ticking, for now
 
His analysis of the Dortmund game was withering in its criticism. He was right saying the last half hour was 11 individuals out there not following [directions]. Bringing EtH on board has been a masterstroke. He knows what he wants, he holds everyone to a high standard, he's ruthless, he's tactically astute, and doesn't take any shit. Love him.

Exactly this.
 


The Italians used to do the ''slow, slow... fast'' approach too.


seems he's got confused between being good in transitions and counter-attacking football

they are not the same thing, so there is no contradiction between wanting to control the football and being good in transitions like he is suggesting
 
Finally a manager with technical authority and not just vibes fc. I love Ole but his reign didn't help any player grow technically. If eth has the right setup and the players follow him blindly, we will be successful. I am sure of it.

I trust him but not the players.
 
We could finish the season on 85 points and still be nowhere near the title. That’s the sort of machine we are competing with.
For me, what I want to see:
  • Advancements in our play still and far more consistent with it I want to see us dominate more games, more territory, keep the ball better and score more goals.
  • Circa 85 points season. 10 more points that last season is certainly achievable
  • QF in CL and deep runs in both cups.

I’d be happy enough with:
- Big improvement in our style of play especially our possession football; (same as your first)
- 80 plus points;
- A trophy, any fecking trophy will do
- New signings mostly working
 
I still remember all the preseason PR about Moyes revolutionizing the training ground with his iPads and data collection, and then LVG's attention to detail demonstrated by him having trees planted at Carrington to limit the impact of wind. I'm a bit jaded by it as well. :lol:
And Ole with the cultural reset…
 
Really interested to see how Erik approaches this season. Last season he near enough had a free pass from the media as there were clear and obvious deficiencies in our squad, the Ronaldo issue etc. Overall consensus was that this wasnt his team and he had done a decent job to acheive top 4.

This season the dogs will be unleashed the minute things start to go off track, I wonder if he can keep his cool through it all and remain dominant in controlling the narrative as he has done so far.
 
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Really interested to see how Erik approaches this season. Last season he near enough had a free pass from the media as there were clear and obvious deficiencies in our squad, the Ronaldo issue etc. Overall consensus was that this wasnt his team and he had done a decent job to acheive top 4.

This season the dogs will be unleashed the minute things start to go off track, I wonder if he can keep his cool through it all and remain dominant in controlling the narrative as he has done so far.
Free pass? He got a lot of crap for leaving Ronaldo out
 
AC Milan in their dominant time. I remember them suddenly speeding up their passing.
Watch Antony debut goal vs Arsenal, its a perfect illustration of the slow slow fast principle. You would think its a counter attacking goal watching the last 5 seconds but every player got on the ball and it only speeds up when we found Bruno in between the line. Antony vs Arsenal
 
Free pass? He got a lot of crap for leaving Ronaldo out
I don't think he had that much stick for it overall to be honest. The vast majority could clearly see the negative effect Ronaldo was having on the style of play and the squsad overall.
 
His analysis of the Dortmund game was withering in its criticism. He was right saying the last half hour was 11 individuals out there not following [directions]. Bringing EtH on board has been a masterstroke. He knows what he wants, he holds everyone to a high standard, he's ruthless, he's tactically astute, and doesn't take any shit. Love him.

My fav thing about him. Ultimately he may not succeed but at least his approach is the right one.
 
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