Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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mav_9me said:
All your posts. Hopefully you realize where you were wrong and apologize for abusing the other poster.
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It has been a horror few months. If that carries on, we lost top 4, the FA Cup Final, then started the next season with similar poor form he would be sacked.

this is what I said.

Thanks for misquoting me like the last user. I said if he carries on form into next season then he will get the sack, not on the last few months. I highlighted carrying on into the next few months of next season. Six months.

I would like an apology from yourself, and that other user for slander.
 
If a team is in bad form for 6 months questions will be asked of the manager you say. Hmm…here I thought that would get him a lifetime appointment. You learn new things every day :lol:
 
UDontMessWith24 said:
You mean the season we dropped points against every single bottom 10 club, including 5-6 draws at Old Trafford. How many WINS for Ten Hag compared to Solskjaer?
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I think we are at 20 wins now in the league for Ten Hag. I think Ole achieved that also twice. Mourinho once or twice? Can't tell someone can check. But sadly, 20 wins equates to 60 points only.

I'm one of the balance supporter/critic of Ten Hag and I genuinely want him here next season. So us confirming Top 4, is such a big relief to him. We need to be on his side as next season starts.
But next season it's crunch time, especially in how we control games. We need to win 26 games minimum. Even draw 6 games that would be a very big improvement in my eyes. Yes it's doable.

But ETH needs to change the team set-up and formation. We can't autopilot in to games, we need to kill the opponents and control matches through sheer tactics/plan/effort/players.

With the rumor of Rabiot starting to develop, meaning another midfielder will be his first signing next summer I'm 100% convinced he knows midfield/control is our main problem.

We can sign Kane next season and he gets injured the second week of the season with Achilles injury, what next we will do? Continue 'blaming we don't have a striker' narrative?

A striker is important, but mainly our problem is match/game control in every department. And sadly it's not solved by signing one player more so a striker.
 
Andy_Cole said:
It has been a horror few months. If that carries on, we lost top 4, the FA Cup Final, then started the next season with similar poor form he would be sacked.

this is what I said.

Thanks for misquoting me like the last user. I said if he carries on form into next season then he will get the sack, not on the last few months. I highlighted carrying on into the next few months of next season. Six months.

I would like an apology from yourself, and that other user for slander.
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Is English your 2nd language? Do you know what misquote means? I have literally quoted your post. Actually quoted.
 
mav_9me said:
Is English your 2nd language? Do you know what misquote means? I have literally quoted your post. Actually quoted.
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You quoted the first sentence where I said he’s had a bad few months. I never said he should be sacked for his last few months form. Perhaps if you were not so aggressive and would like to have a proper discussion then you wouldn’t get at me.
 
Andy_Cole said:
You quoted the first sentence where I said he’s had a bad few months. I never said he should be sacked for his last few months form. Perhaps if you were not so aggressive and would like to have a proper discussion then you wouldn’t get at me.
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That's not what I am saying you said.

I am challenging you on

Andy_Cole said:
It has been a horror few months. If that carries on, we lost top 4, the FA Cup Final, then started the next season with similar poor form he would be sacked. Hag coming round from the poor form would be evidence he is a top manager. We’ve won one game. Let’s see if it carries on and he proves himself.
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Where are the horror few months?
 
Andy_Cole said:
You quoted the first sentence where I said he’s had a bad few months. I never said he should be sacked for his last few months form. Perhaps if you were not so aggressive and would like to have a proper discussion then you wouldn’t get at me.
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You wrote:

Andy_Cole said:
There’s a difference between form and 6 months of bad results
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Which most normal people would read as you saying that we have had 6 months of bad results - but it turns out that 4 of those months that you were talking about have yet to take place :lol:

Andy_Cole said:
Perhaps if you were not so aggressive and would like to have a proper discussion then you wouldn’t get at me.
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That's rich coming from the guy who posted this:
Andy_Cole said:
Lies? feck off you cnut. I was referring to if it carried on until October. So March to October. 6 months. You cnut.
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AndySmith1990 said:
I've no problem with Yorke or anyone else being critical of Ten Hag. He's right that if we're happy to praise him when he's doing well, it's only fair to lay some blame on him when things aren't going well.
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But it has to be with context. We only started playing poorly when we got a tonne of injuries and suspensions and that’s after (although still in the middle of to make it even worse) an insanely busy period.

The team was also in its worst mental state after Ole and with Ronaldo and ETH did a brilliant job with that.

We’ve also seen an actual system and cohesiveness, for the first time in a long time, even if that still needs work, especially in terms of consistency. We need to get better at controlling games and finishing.
 
mav_9me said:
That's not what I am saying you said.

I am challenging you on



Where are the horror few months?
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Okay misunderstanding. I don’t think he should be sacked from March- now. It has been a horror though. See below:

7-0 Liverpool
3-0 Sevilla
2-0 Newcastle
1-0 Brighton
1-0 West Ham
Then blowing 2 x 2-0 leads
Drawing vs bottom place 0-0

It’s been seriously bad.
 
Watching Brighton absolutely crush Arsenal away just shows that the PL is the toughest league in the world. I have to say, tactically, ETH dealt with Brighton much more easily than Arteta. That Brighton team is absolutely excellent, Newcastle is no joke, then there are tough away fixtures like Villa, Wolves (Emery and Lopetegui field teams/ tactics that are tough to break down) not to mention the top 6 clubs with lots of talent and cash.

Ten Hag isn’t perfect, but I think given the thin squad depth, injuries and suspensions, he’s done an admirable job so far. Fingers crossed he can seal top 4.
 
If he can pull of a mastermind job on pep in the final then he's going to become an instant hero. The PL and CL are as good as in the bag now sadly.

Would be nice wouldn't it? Just can't see us laying a glove on City sadly.
 
DSG said:
Watching Brighton absolutely crush Arsenal away just shows that the PL is the toughest league in the world. I have to say, tactically, ETH dealt with Brighton much more easily than Arteta. That Brighton team is absolutely excellent, Newcastle is no joke, then there are tough away fixtures like Villa, Wolves (Emery and Lopetegui field teams/ tactics that are tough to break down) not to mention the top 6 clubs with lots of talent and cash.

Ten Hag isn’t perfect, but I think given the thin squad depth, injuries and suspensions, he’s done an admirable job so far. Fingers crossed he can seal top 4.
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Yes, all facts.
Sadly, it just tells how far the club’s standard has fallen behind over last ten years bit by bit. As a result, it transforms the supporters’ expectations as well. We all know almost every game is so hard to win.
To return back to the top, it’s a huge challenge.
 
Scottynaldinho said:
This is evident in the team's poor results in crunch games, see games where we had an opportunity to move up the table and I'm even ignoring the results against the top-half teams.
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Didn't United beat Barca over two legs, beat all of City, Arsenal, Spurs, and Liverpool, and get to two finals? Or do you only count games against top sides and crunch games that United lost?

Another thing that makes me suspect him is our inability to control the games against poor sides. You just know that we're never coming back whenever we are a goal down.
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Haven't comebacks happened regularly (until more recently) and didn't Wolves just yesterday have not even a single shot on target?

The manager had a full pre-season and was allowed to spend money on new players but he did not make the best use of the resources.
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He didn't have a full pre-season with everyone and was only given additional budget after the first two losses.

I'm not trying to argue that Ten Hag has been amazing, but these arguments don't really hold water.
 
Cheimoon said:
Didn't United beat Barca over two legs, beat all of City, Arsenal, Spurs, and Liverpool, and get to two finals? Or do you only count games against top sides and crunch games that United lost?


Haven't comebacks happened regularly (until more recently) and didn't Wolves just yesterday have not even a single shot on target?


He didn't have a full pre-season with everyone and was only given additional budget after the first two losses.

I'm not trying to argue that Ten Hag has been amazing, but these arguments don't really hold water.
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Thank you Cheimoon for saving me the trouble of countering this guy. Some of the most solid fool posts I‘ve seen.
 
Can’t wait to see what it’ll look like after one more transfer window, one season in this system under their belt, and without the criminal fixture congestion. Moaners and their “high standards” will not be forgotten. Sorry but we have higher standards for supporting the club.
 
Rusholme Ruffian said:
I said 'feck off with the lies' because you were talking about 6 months of bad form which was clearly not true.

And you think that justifies calling someone a cnut repeatedly?
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You slandered my credibility so in my opinion that made your post cnutish. I should have criticised your post. It was very high cuntishness.
 
Andy_Cole said:
You quoted the first sentence where I said he’s had a bad few months. I never said he should be sacked for his last few months form. Perhaps if you were not so aggressive and would like to have a proper discussion then you wouldn’t get at me.
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Not so aggressive?! :lol: you called the poster a cnut......twice! :lol:
 
Just 3 more wins in the league please. And then one more against city in the fa cup for this season.

Come on eth.
 
mav_9me said:
In case you didn't realize, 2 wins is enough to guarantee top 4.
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Oh yeah, lost track. Was thinking we would need to win all 3. Would be great if we won all 3. Tough ask. Just need to get top 4 and keep Liverpool out and get some respite from the fear that they might win the champions league.
 
Scottynaldinho said:
Let me say again that I am deeply disappointed with ETH this season. He has failed to get the best out of this team and his tactical decisions have been questionable. This is evident in the team's poor results in crunch games, see games where we had an opportunity to move up the table and I'm even ignoring the results against the top-half teams.

Another thing that makes me suspect him is our inability to control the games against poor sides. You just know that we're never coming back whenever we are a goal down. We have been spanked regularly in the league and were knocked out of the Europa by a very poor Sevilla side.

The manager had a full pre-season and was allowed to spend money on new players but he did not make the best use of the resources. He spent £100 million on Antony, a winger when the team needed a striker. If anyone believes that we've had a solid season, they simply have low standards and deserve everything that this fanbase has suffered in the past decade.
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"Ta Ra Fergie" eh?
 
Scottynaldinho said:
Let me say again that I am deeply disappointed with ETH this season. He has failed to get the best out of this team and his tactical decisions have been questionable. This is evident in the team's poor results in crunch games, see games where we had an opportunity to move up the table and I'm even ignoring the results against the top-half teams.

Another thing that makes me suspect him is our inability to control the games against poor sides. You just know that we're never coming back whenever we are a goal down. We have been spanked regularly in the league and were knocked out of the Europa by a very poor Sevilla side.

The manager had a full pre-season and was allowed to spend money on new players but he did not make the best use of the resources. He spent £100 million on Antony, a winger when the team needed a striker. If anyone believes that we've had a solid season, they simply have low standards and deserve everything that this fanbase has suffered in the past decade.
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Nicosia (A EL), Everton (A), Villa (H Cup), City (H), Barcelona (H), West Ham (H Cup) need I go on?
 
Scottynaldinho said:
Let me say again that I am deeply disappointed with ETH this season. He has failed to get the best out of this team and his tactical decisions have been questionable. This is evident in the team's poor results in crunch games, see games where we had an opportunity to move up the table and I'm even ignoring the results against the top-half teams.

Another thing that makes me suspect him is our inability to control the games against poor sides. You just know that we're never coming back whenever we are a goal down. We have been spanked regularly in the league and were knocked out of the Europa by a very poor Sevilla side.

The manager had a full pre-season and was allowed to spend money on new players but he did not make the best use of the resources. He spent £100 million on Antony, a winger when the team needed a striker. If anyone believes that we've had a solid season, they simply have low standards and deserve everything that this fanbase has suffered in the past decade.
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:lol:
 
Judas said:
Yes, the people saying we've had a solid season are......crazy nutters :wenger:
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Absolutely. Just don't try to paint us finishing 4th as a massive achievement/solid season while there hasn't been a real competition for the top 4 because of how poor the Pool, Spurs and Chelsea have been.

With a squad like ours we should be competing for the title from the position we were in 3 months back. Even if we stayed in slight contention that could be called a solid season, not the dross we've been served. Our football is horrible and this is a horror season once again.

Let's just agree to disagree. Some of us have just accepted mediocrity. Solid season my arse!!!!
 
In my opinion people get disappointed because they expect a new manager like ten Hag to come in and implement the same attractive playing style he was implementing at Ajax, pretty much instantly. But the reality is that the players we have at the club, don't really fit into the way he wants to develop the team in the mid to long-term. And some of you want that development to show itself straight away, when in reality it will take time. And it's important to attempt to understand where the problems lie when it comes to implementing the plan and understand what that plan is.

EtH has been asked several times about the development of the team as far as play style goes in press conferences. And he's responded by saying that the most important thing is to win first and foremost and the development of the play-style is also something that is being worked on and it's a process. That response makes so much sense to me and it was easy to see the problems he was going to encounter with the squad of players we had.

Ronaldo upfront and DDG at the back was a problem he seemed to have decided he was going to work around at the start of the season. Both of those players were a big problem as far developing a proactive attacking play style with and without the ball. And he decided to compromise on his original plan, especially after the defeats to Brighton and Brentford.

If we didn't have Ronaldo then a striker would've been bought, and then to compound matters further, Ronaldo did what he did with the interview and we were another player down. And these were problems passed down by the previous manager with all the reports at the time pointing to Solskjaer as the one who asked Woodward if a deal could be done for Ronaldo. Weghorst wouldn't have been needed if Ronaldo didn't behave like a child.

Also for me the EPL is alot stronger now than it was in 2015/16 when Klopp and Guardiola arrived. And because they arrived and implemented their playstyles, the league is a lot stronger. And both men took over from Rodgers and Pellegrini who only a few years earlier were either close to winning the league (Rodgers) or had won the league with Pellegrini, and each team scoring over a 100 goals in the league. And Guardiola was given around 500m to spend in his first two seasons at the club.

Roberto De Zerbi at Brighton inherited a team that was coached to play possession football (positional play) from Graham Potter who had been developing the playstyle in question for several years, which really helped De Zerbi to quickly get his ideas across. And Erik ten Hag was criticised for the loss to Brighton, but the reality is that he implemented a superb game plan against a Brighton team who have comfortably beaten both Liverpool and Arsenal just yesterday. And ten Hag understood the dangers and the limitations of his own team and shackled De Zerbi's plan where they were struggling to create opportunities as the graphic below illustrates. Individual mistakes cost us in both games against Brighton and West Ham.




Considering the issues he's faced, a top 4 finish and a trophy would be superb. And there's much more to come imo. We're a team that has struggled to build play against opponent's who are adept at pressing high. And hence we have resorted to kicking it long with the aim of winning second balls. And if you look at out team physically, we're not a physically strong team that is going to win aerial/ground duels in the middle or final third, hence when we come up against technically strong teams on the ball who look to defend high up the pitch, we struggle both to play out from the back and then have to resort to kicking it long which again exposes our weaknesses physically when trying to win the second ball with the exception of Casemiro.

In my opinion it's easy to see what needs to be done. And signing technically strong players with good physical attributes will help us play a variety of different ways. Even Guardiola has signed players who don't really suit his play style from the Barcelona days, but it's important to adapt to the league you're playing in and then look to dominate the ball.
 
Considering all the out of the ordinary circumstances he’s been thrown this season, he’s done well.

It‘s not every season your star player decides to go rogue publicly to the point you have to sack him.
It’s not every season the club ownership is up for sale and means you can’t spend money to replace said star player.
It’s not every season the international tournament of the season lands at the mid point of the season (somethings that never ever happened).

And that’s without even going into the Frankenstein monster of a squad he inherited. An expensive rabble of players who are not suited to the modern way of playing and a lot of them who are on way too much money for what they provide, courtesy of Woodward and his ridiculous ‘maintain player value’ practices by throwing out contract extensions as if it was confetti at a wedding.
 
city-puma said:
Yes, all facts.
Sadly, it just tells how far the club’s standard has fallen behind over last ten years bit by bit. As a result, it transforms the supporters’ expectations as well. We all know almost every game is so hard to win.
To return back to the top, it’s a huge challenge.
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I agree with you, our standards have fallen. I do think, however, that this is not SAF’s premier league. He never had to contend with nation states owning teams, various hedge funds with unlimited spending power, tv money that has enriched even the smallest clubs, sophisticated scouting and data analysis departments at most, if not all clubs. He had to deal with Mourinho and Wenger, but most of the other managers were no match. His training facilities and stadium were class of the league.

of course, our standards have fallen, but those standards were set at a different era, in a much less competitive league. If you magically transported a prime SAF to this era, I dare say he wouldn’t have won 13 leagues under Glazers and our current stadium and training grounds.
 
Scottynaldinho said:
Absolutely. Just don't try to paint us finishing 4th as a massive achievement/solid season while there hasn't been a real competition for the top 4 because of how poor the Pool, Spurs and Chelsea have been.

With a squad like ours we should be competing for the title from the position we were in 3 months back. Even if we stayed in slight contention that could be called a solid season, not the dross we've been served. Our football is horrible and this is a horror season once again.

Let's just agree to disagree. Some of us have just accepted mediocrity. Solid season my arse!!!!
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No, some of us are just alot more realistic and could see what was actually achievable this season considering all the circumstances, some fans just constantly expect way more than is actually possible because 'ooooo we spent 220 million or whatever it was, we should be in title challenge because of that'.
 
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