Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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Anustart89 said:
It just takes one idiot with an inferiority complex to make someone miss two months of football even if you're cruising up until that point.
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And it takes one Phil Jones to injure one of our players in training. I get the sentiment but if we have high competitive standards in training (like the days under Sir Alex) then the chance of getting injured in a match vs getting injured in hard training is probably the same. I'd imagine the key thing is that in a game you are in that hard competitive mode for longer than training games. I'd also probably wager that our players have a higher chance of getting injured in training than in a match based on our injury record.
 
Sarni said:
Even more of a reason why they don't need to play every minute of all these games. Even your youngsters would be able to see those games off, and all it takes is one moment where Jonjo Shelvey decides he doesn't feel like watching Casemiro pass to Bruno and back. Games against any opponent are always far more competitive than trainings, regardless of score.

It has worked out very well so far and the team is improving so I don't mind it anyway, and people absolutely love that too but all it takes is a couple of moments and it could go from 'OMG this is so amazing, such a beautiful strategy LOL' to 'why the feck did we need to play them in every game'.

Then of course there's argument of letting your reserve players have some playing time so they can stay in form and rhythm. That is also quite important.
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But nobody is playing every minute of every game. It was 6 changes from the previous game that had 5/6 changes from the game previous to that. All the while the important players are coming off early as well.
a good 16/17 players got game time over the last week, it’s not a bad thing.
We could rest 2/3 players but training becomes redundant when the rest of the first team sets need rest days from the game previous then travel down night before games etc when there’s a game every three days.
As Ten Hag has said, games have replaced our training sessions now. Rashford wont be running or exerting himself this week any more than he did when we had a game per week.
 
flameinthesun said:
And it takes one Phil Jones to injure one of our players in training. I get the sentiment but if we have high competitive standards in training (like the days under Sir Alex) then the chance of getting injured in a match vs getting injured in hard training is probably the same. I'd imagine the key thing is that in a game you are in that hard competitive mode for longer than training games. I'd also probably wager that our players have a higher chance of getting injured in training than in a match based on our injury record.
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Martial got into a fight with a reserve player after the restart because he went too hard on him in a tackle. There’s a weird thought process that training is easier than a game when it really isn’t.
 
cyberman said:
Martial got into a fight with a reserve player after the restart because he went too hard on him in a tackle. There’s a weird thought process that training is easier than a game when it really isn’t.
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Yup, and based on anecdotes from under Fergie a lot players said training was harder and more intensive than matches. I'm sure there probably is some research out there showing whether you are more likely to get injured in training or in a match.
 
Ten Hag made a few important points in his Sky interview after the semi final win at OT.

He was asked about playing every third day or so, which he replied it's a 'luxury problem' and one which he is happy to have.

He also alluded to the players preferring playing every third day or so rather than training, as they get more into a rhythm.
This suggests to me that training is no where near as intense as it usually is between those game days, meaning they continue to maintain their sharpness and fitness.
 
flameinthesun said:
Yup, and based on anecdotes from under Fergie a lot players said training was harder and more intensive than matches. I'm sure there probably is some research out there showing whether you are more likely to get injured in training or in a match.
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There seem to be several studies on that. The number of injuries in trainings and games are similar but you are 3 times as likely to get injured in competitive sports than you are in practice but that's just one research I was able to quickly find (seems sample size was quite significant though but it was across multiple sports).
 
I just wish people would get off his back with the constant resting players bullshit and let him get on with the brilliant job he's doing. I'm so happy that he is taking EVERY game seriously and sending players out there to win and not just that but to win emphatically. His philosophy is to rest players during the game when we have the job done, which is all we need.

If it was left to half of these muppets, we'd be out of the cups by now. I'm already looking forward to next season and what magic he'll have worked on the club by that time. To get top 4 and a trophy (or two) would be absolutely mental.
 
Does having a run of mostly positive results mean you don't feel tiredness/need for rest so much. ?

I mean mental fatigue will be an added factor when results don't go your way. The professional players are fit anyway. So when you are on a high of winning run I guess that must aid in recovery to some extent.
 
Sarni said:
There seem to be several studies on that. The number of injuries in trainings and games are similar but you are 3 times as likely to get injured in competitive sports than you are in practice but that's just one research I was able to quickly find (seems sample size was quite significant though but it was across multiple sports).
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Mmhh interesting, the issue with it being done across multiple sports is that there would be discrepancies in how physical those sports are compared to football. Interesting nonetheless. Think the key take away is if Ten Hag and the medical department thinks its fine to keep playing them then we should probably trust them. Also bearing in mind Ten Hag has experience in doing this exact same thing whilst winning leagues and cups, so he knows what he's doing.
 
RedPed said:
I just wish people would get off his back with the constant resting players bullshit and let him get on with the brilliant job he's doing. I'm so happy that he is taking EVERY game seriously and sending players out there to win and not just that but to win emphatically. His philosophy is to rest players during the game when we have the job done, which is all we need.

If it was left to half of these muppets, we'd be out of the cups by now. I'm already looking forward to next season and what magic he'll have worked on the club by that time. To get top 4 and a trophy (or two) would be absolutely mental.
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Maybe slightly controversial but I would have happily played a very weakened side in the fa Cup and risked going out personally. But I agree that he is doing a great job and we should trust him. I guess a nagging doubt for many is that two years ago we lost a cup final because our players were just totally fecked come the end of the season.
 
It really does feel like moaning for the sake of moaning now.

On the one hand you have 'people on a forum' - who don't know these players, don't spend time with them & don't see them every day in training. If that's not enough they also don't have access to any of the data and analytics to inform any position they might take on it.

Then on the other hand you have a whole heap of highly qualified individuals who have ALL of those things listed above.

For the neutral it's not hard to pick a side here is it? Just let them get on with it
 
ETH got everyone who isn't a United fan shook, that got to count for something right? He's made everyone who didn't see us as a threat eat their words.

With him in charge we are going places and soon we'll be winning big trophies that wasn't the case 18 months back.

We've got to support and trust him and hope he's decision would get us to where we want to be, Let's back him in everyway possible.
 
Bilbo said:
It really does feel like moaning for the sake of moaning now.

On the one hand you have 'people on a forum' - who don't know these players, don't spend time with them & don't see them every day in training. If that's not enough they also don't have access to any of the data and analytics to inform any position they might take on it.

Then on the other hand you have a whole heap of highly qualified individuals who have ALL of those things listed above.

For the neutral it's not hard to pick a side here is it? Just let them get on with it
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I hate posts like this.

I love Ten Hag and don't think it is an issue that players are playing regularly but if the response to every post that disagrees with anything a football manager does is "well he knows more than you" then there isn't really any point to a football forum.
 
ColvaleGoa said:
Does having a run of mostly positive results mean you don't feel tiredness/need for rest so much. ?

I mean mental fatigue will be an added factor when results don't go your way. The professional players are fit anyway. So when you are on a high of winning run I guess that must aid in recovery to some extent.
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It's not just the results. When you can control matches you decide when to run fast or slow. That allows to stay much more in tune with your body than when you had to just run after opposition players.

Running 10km as you like when you like to break through defences should be less tiring for mind and body than running 10km to defend.
 
OverratedOpinion said:
I hate posts like this.

I love Ten Hag and don't think it is an issue that players are playing regularly but if the response to every post that disagrees with anything a football manager does is "well he knows more than you" then there isn't really any point to a football forum.
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Depends what kind of a football forum you want to see I suppose. For me, it just seems like a few familiar faces picking things to be annoyed about, from a position of very limited data.

Is that what you come here to read? Is it wrong to point out that perhaps we should trust the experts?
 
Champ said:
Ten Hag made a few important points in his Sky interview after the semi final win at OT.

He was asked about playing every third day or so, which he replied it's a 'luxury problem' and one which he is happy to have.

He also alluded to the players preferring playing every third day or so rather than training, as they get more into a rhythm.
This suggests to me that training is no where near as intense as it usually is between those game days, meaning they continue to maintain their sharpness and fitness.
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What does he now? I mean cafe experts know better when first teamers should play and when not.
 
He's had to deal with so many challenges already but he's done absolutely brilliantly so far. Good results against the other members of the top 6, routine wins against the smaller clubs and generally making us play on the front foot in most games. The biggest difference is how the squad seems a lot more united this season (some of the new signings have helped of course).

He obviously knows the physical state of the players better than any of us but I don't think there's anything wrong about disagreeing with him about resting some of the players more. Ole overplayed a lot of the players in the 2020-21 season and most of them looked knackered around April. Would really hate to see the same thing happen this season. Would have definitely liked to have seen someone like Bruno rested for the Forest 2nd leg game. Could have always brought him on in the 2nd half if things were not working well. Having said that, hopefully we have better luck with injuries and the squad and ETH are able to pull through and manage games across all competitions for the rest of the season.
 
royalewithcheese2006 said:
He's had to deal with so many challenges already but he's done absolutely brilliantly so far. Good results against the other members of the top 6, routine wins against the smaller clubs and generally making us play on the front foot in most games. The biggest difference is how the squad seems a lot more united this season (some of the new signings have helped of course).

He obviously knows the physical state of the players better than any of us but I don't think there's anything wrong about disagreeing with him about resting some of the players more. Ole overplayed a lot of the players in the 2020-21 season and most of them looked knackered around April. Would really hate to see the same thing happen this season. Would have definitely liked to have seen someone like Bruno rested for the Forest 2nd leg game. Could have always brought him on in the 2nd half if things were not working well. Having said that, hopefully we have better luck with injuries and the squad and ETH are able to pull through and manage games across all competitions for the rest of the season.
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ETH Says the reason he doesn't do that is if they score because we played a weak squad, they gain momentum and I guess he wanted to take 0 chances?
 
Eli Zee said:
ETH Says the reason he doesn't do that is if they score because we played a weak squad, they gain momentum and I guess he wanted to take 0 chances?
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I get that and I also agree that it's important to keep our good run going. I know that we don't really have a ready made replacement for Bruno but I just feel he could have played Pellistri there or Mainoo (and push Fred further up).

I just feel that this was one of those games where he could have taken a bit of a chance since we were 3 nil up vs Forest and we were at home and Bruno has played quite a bit without much of a break. The likes of rashford, casemiro, varane, martinez etc have had a rest or a suspension induced break recently. These are the type of games that we really should be able to see out if 1-2 of our players are rested. Hopefully Sancho playing as a 10 and Lindelof playing DM are signs that he's trying to manage minutes for some of our key players with the number of games we have coming up.
 
I get people saying we need to rest X,Y,Z but I feel that Ten Hag is using games to improve his team, you can do your drills in training but he wants to see it implemented in game.

He wants to build a style and with games every 3 days, he cant do that in training because the time off, regardless if the players played or not, its recovery and team meetings about the next game.

So if he starts Mainoo, Pellestri, he is not focusing on the 1st 11 improving. He wants the 1st 11 to play his style before getting the fringe players to play his style.
 
BlueHaze said:
I think if we got Guardiola in at that time would probably have been the one to just continue upon what Sir Alex left and won title after title but it's all pointless speculation. We now have what so far looks like a good fit and certainly the best appointment post Sir Alex.
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With that squad we couldn‘t have played Pep ball. It would have been the start of a multi-year rebuild.

He never did that anywhere, always goes to teams where the ground work is already done.
 
RedPed said:
I just wish people would get off his back with the constant resting players bullshit and let him get on with the brilliant job he's doing. I'm so happy that he is taking EVERY game seriously and sending players out there to win and not just that but to win emphatically. His philosophy is to rest players during the game when we have the job done, which is all we need.

If it was left to half of these muppets, we'd be out of the cups by now. I'm already looking forward to next season and what magic he'll have worked on the club by that time. To get top 4 and a trophy (or two) would be absolutely mental.
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Totally. And he's actually being smart in resting players imo, rather than make 10 changes and wondering why we struggle to beat smaller teams, he's rotating his squad aside from some key players. Couldn't be happier with what I have seen so far.
 
NLunited said:
With that squad we couldn‘t have played Pep ball. It would have been the start of a multi-year rebuild.

He never did that anywhere, always goes to teams where the ground work is already done.
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Exactly.

Pep is one of the best ever managers but he is there because he does extremely well under certain circumstances.

We have not seen him ever build from a bad place, Barca team was in semi final of CL, we beat them 1-0 and was still a good team.

Bayern team he took over won the treble season before

City team was winning PL titles.

He choses his projects where he has the money and the players already at the club.
 
Champ said:
Ten Hag made a few important points in his Sky interview after the semi final win at OT.

He was asked about playing every third day or so, which he replied it's a 'luxury problem' and one which he is happy to have.

He also alluded to the players preferring playing every third day or so rather than training, as they get more into a rhythm.
This suggests to me that training is no where near as intense as it usually is between those game days, meaning they continue to maintain their sharpness and fitness.
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Remember Ferguson saying something like this before. Think maybe Ferdinand alluded to it as well.

At this stage of the season, fitness has been built up. So the priority is to maintain the fitness levels not increase them even more. Playing every third day does just that and it shouldn't be a problem once the players are doing the right recovery and training in between.
 
Champ said:
Ten Hag made a few important points in his Sky interview after the semi final win at OT.

He was asked about playing every third day or so, which he replied it's a 'luxury problem' and one which he is happy to have.

He also alluded to the players preferring playing every third day or so rather than training, as they get more into a rhythm.
This suggests to me that training is no where near as intense as it usually is between those game days, meaning they continue to maintain their sharpness and fitness.
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Ye it also means you’re somewhat successful. Bit like Liverpool last season, had lots more games then everyone els due to reaching the finals of most of the tournaments. You won’t see ETH moaning about this though as you would with the likes of Klopp and Guardiola. We have such a class manager.
 
the best managers have always had their core of 7 or 8 players that play all the time and everyone else fits around it. Its not new. Fergie never picked the same team twice, but the changes were never wholesale and the main players pretty much always played when fit.
 
OverratedOpinion said:
I hate posts like this.

I love Ten Hag and don't think it is an issue that players are playing regularly but if the response to every post that disagrees with anything a football manager does is "well he knows more than you" then there isn't really any point to a football forum.
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It's the kind of posts from people that would tell you Boris did a good job given the circumstances. Just no logic or rational reasoning whatsoever
 
DJ_21 said:
Ye it also means you’re somewhat successful. Bit like Liverpool last season, had lots more games then everyone els due to reaching the finals of most of the tournaments. You won’t see ETH moaning about this though as you would with the likes of Klopp and Guardiola. We have such a class manager.
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Agree wholeheartedly, EtHs reaction to being asked that was class, said it was what the players and himself wanted, and as you said it means the team are on the right track.
 
royalewithcheese2006 said:
I get that and I also agree that it's important to keep our good run going. I know that we don't really have a ready made replacement for Bruno but I just feel he could have played Pellistri there or Mainoo (and push Fred further up).

I just feel that this was one of those games where he could have taken a bit of a chance since we were 3 nil up vs Forest and we were at home and Bruno has played quite a bit without much of a break. The likes of rashford, casemiro, varane, martinez etc have had a rest or a suspension induced break recently. These are the type of games that we really should be able to see out if 1-2 of our players are rested. Hopefully Sancho playing as a 10 and Lindelof playing DM are signs that he's trying to manage minutes for some of our key players with the number of games we have coming up.
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I agree but I won't really question his tactics as he knows the ins and outs of the team more than me and is a better judge of our players fitness since... he can talk to them and ask how they feel and interact with them daily.

also the momentum shift can be quick..1 goal then they have belief, 2 goals and they have huge momentum to go along with it, 3 goals to tie it and it's just a difficult fight to the death at that point
 
OverratedOpinion said:
I hate posts like this.

I love Ten Hag and don't think it is an issue that players are playing regularly but if the response to every post that disagrees with anything a football manager does is "well he knows more than you" then there isn't really any point to a football forum.
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I think when it comes to this topic, regarding his team, he is correct.


Strange seeing folks not even involved in the game, and armchairing like the rest of us, comment on the technical aspect of how he treating matches, and how intense our training is, like he hasn't a clue what he is at.


If a player looks tired then it's fair game, but posters are pretending he running players into the ground, when reality everyone getting moved about match to match or hauled off after half time, in games that aren't that intense. Not sure what the panic is about. He even getting blamed for manaic players running about trying to injury our players. It is most defo moaning for the sake of moaning.
 
horsechoker said:
Every 50 year old I know can't function without taking about 80 different tablets
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Flexdegea said:
I think when it comes to this topic, regarding his team, he is correct.


Strange seeing folks not even involved in the game, and armchairing like the rest of us, comment on the technical aspect of how he treating matches, and how intense our training is, like he hasn't a clue what he is at.


If a player looks tired then it's fair game, but posters are pretending he running players into the ground, when reality everyone getting moved about match to match or hauled off after half time, in games that aren't that intense. Not sure what the panic is about. He even getting blamed for manaic players running about trying to injury our players. It is most defo moaning for the sake of moaning.
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We have very smart posters here, who are experts about all aspects of football and know more than the managers.

Naturally, they know more about managing fitness levels than the coach who is controlling to the smallest details all aspects of football management at the club.

The idea that he might know what he is doing after 15+ years in football management at the highest levels, does not occur to these geniuses. Time and time again they have been proven right (wrong).
 
Does anyone have any links on training drills he does? From his time at Ajax.

He seems like a very smart guy who's spent 20 years building up his knowledge and philosophy.

We managed to get him just at the right time where he has mastered every aspect of management and wants to reach for the very top.
 
NLunited said:
We have very smart posters here, who are experts about all aspects of football and know more than the managers.

Naturally, they know more about managing fitness levels than the coach who is controlling to the smallest details all aspects of football management at the club.

The idea that he might know what he is doing after 15+ years in football management at the highest levels, does not occur to these geniuses. Time and time again they have been proven right (wrong).
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You quoted the wrong person here
 
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