Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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I always come to back to a single question when thinking about ETH’s performance with us: what would Pep or Klopp have done with a squad as unmotivated, injury-prone and generally one-dimensional as ours?

And I can’t help but think that they would have tried to find a management and tactical solution that showed some purpose to our play with the players we have. ETH has tried and failed repeatedly to do that. And as the manager the buck stops with him.
 
Who do we think, given the status of United, the manager likes? I mean, who is he genuinely happy to have starting in a supposed top team pushing for the PL? I think its a short list:

Onana
Shaw
Martinez
Bruno

Maybe Dalot this season.

That's about it I'd imagine. And 2 of those have missed the season.

As good as the 3 youngsters have been, they should all be rotation options.

So I'm still Ten Hag in, but if we can't overhaul the team, then maybe we should bring in a more defensive manager who suits the players we have.
 
I'm pretty certain he'll stay given all the change elsewhere. I'll support him and hope he can make it work, but I've never been less confident in a manager.

One thing is for certain he'll have to hit the ground running next season otherwise the knives will be out incredibly quickly.
 
Ten Hag looked exhausted in the interview. I can see the sack coming but I would not mind if he stay for another season. One of his strongest suit is the willingness to play our youngsters and that is his strongest asset.
 
I'm not for either Potter or Southgate. I think all the people saying they're a downgrade on Eth who was supposed to be the next big thing should understand that the world doesn't always work as expected.

Either of those could come in and surprise everyone and perform way above expectations just like Eth has but in the negative sense. Or Nagelsmann, De Zerbi etc who you'd expect to do better than Potter or Southgate might turn out useless, nobody knows.
But whoever does come in needs be dealt with a lot quicker than all the previous managers including Erik if they underperform.

It's not a bad thing to change managers if it's clearly not working as is shown by numerous winning clubs. Erik may go on to be a great manager for someone but it's not going to be us. It simply hasn't worked and I think it's a lot to do with him underestimating the PL compared to the Eredivisie.

I don't like to see anyone under severe stress because I know it's a terrible thing to deal with so I wish we'd put him out of his misery because he must be suffering.
 
After the Liverpool drew he made a comment that we have been dominating football matches but unfortunately throwing away leads, which sounded like your typical manager trying to save his skin.

Then I saw the interview and realised that this was in response to a very clear and direct question asking him to clarify the style of play he’s trying to implement at United.

After his terrible comments in the summer about transitions, never playing like Ajax, playing to our strengths instead, he’s completely lost me as a tactician. Then he says we recruit well too. Just feels like he either hasn’t got a clue or is living on mount stubborn willing to die a lonely death there.

Cannot see a manager who loses our CL place staying anyway. And he doesn’t deserve too. We should be in the business of winning trophies and aiming to the the best rather than handing out one more chance.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
After the Liverpool drew he made a comment that we have been dominating football matches but unfortunately throwing away leads, which sounded like your typical manager trying to save his skin.

Then I saw the interview and realised that this was in response to a very clear and direct question asking him to clarify the style of play he’s trying to implement at United.

After his terrible comments in the summer about transitions, never playing like Ajax, playing to our strengths instead, he’s completely lost me as a tactician. Then he says we recruit well too. Just feels like he either hasn’t got a clue or is living on mount stubborn willing to die a lonely death there.

Cannot see a manager who loses our CL place staying anyway. And he doesn’t deserve too. We should be in the business of winning trophies and aiming to the the best rather than handing out one more chance.
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Can't fault a word of that.
 
Flying high said:
Who do we think, given the status of United, the manager likes? I mean, who is he genuinely happy to have starting in a supposed top team pushing for the PL? I think its a short list:

Onana
Shaw
Martinez
Bruno

Maybe Dalot this season.

That's about it I'd imagine. And 2 of those have missed the season.

As good as the 3 youngsters have been, they should all be rotation options.

So I'm still Ten Hag in, but if we can't overhaul the team, then maybe we should bring in a more defensive manager who suits the players we have.
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Why on earth should Hojlund Mainoo and Garnacho be classed as just rotation options to bolster a narrative that ETH doesn't have a squad he likes? :lol:

And if he's not happy starting Antony and Mount against a top team, why the feck did he push so hard to sign them both? Useless manager?

Also, he cant be happy with Casemiro and Rashford now, but the two of them carried him to that so-called "overachievement" of last season.


Exactly the same mindless shit Ole inners tried to pull. 'We cant judge him until he gets a whole new team. Oh and he also needs more signings to replace the duds he already spent hundreds of millions on.' ETH is making the team so much less than the sum of its parts because his tactics and game management fecking stink. Why does this need to keep being pointed out when it's so blindingly obvious?
 
hobbers said:
Why on earth should Hojlund Mainoo and Garnacho be classed as just rotation options to bolster a narrative that ETH doesn't have a squad he likes? :lol:

And if he's not happy starting Antony and Mount against a top team, why the feck did he push so hard to sign them both? Useless manager?

Also, he cant be happy with Casemiro and Rashford now, but the two of them carried him to that so-called "overachievement" of last season.


Exactly the same mindless shit Ole inners tried to pull. 'We cant judge him until he gets a whole new team. Oh and he also needs more signings to replace the duds he already spent hundreds of millions on.' ETH is making the team so much less than the sum of its parts because his tactics and game management fecking stink. Why does this need to keep being pointed out when it's so blindingly obvious?
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Both things can be right at the same time. We could have Pep managing us next season and we wouldn't win the league relying on those players either. That being said I've lost all confidence in ETH just for his stubbornness of sticking with the same midfield 3 through thick and thin. Well, mostly thick.
 
spwd said:
I'm not for either Potter or Southgate. I think all the people saying they're a downgrade on Eth who was supposed to be the next big thing should understand that the world doesn't always work as expected.

Either of those could come in and surprise everyone and perform way above expectations just like Eth has but in the negative sense. Or Nagelsmann, De Zerbi etc who you'd expect to do better than Potter or Southgate might turn out useless, nobody knows.
But whoever does come in needs be dealt with a lot quicker than all the previous managers including Erik if they underperform.

It's not a bad thing to change managers if it's clearly not working as is shown by numerous winning clubs. Erik may go on to be a great manager for someone but it's not going to be us. It simply hasn't worked and I think it's a lot to do with him underestimating the PL compared to the Eredivisie.

I don't like to see anyone under severe stress because I know it's a terrible thing to deal with so I wish we'd put him out of his misery because he must be suffering.
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Or we could sign 6 new players for ETH and finish on 90 points next year. Just like you said, nobody knows, so why do you still draw a conclusion about ETH in your next paragraph?
 
Flying high said:
Who do we think, given the status of United, the manager likes? I mean, who is he genuinely happy to have starting in a supposed top team pushing for the PL? I think its a short list:

Onana
Shaw
Martinez
Bruno

Maybe Dalot this season.

That's about it I'd imagine. And 2 of those have missed the season.

As good as the 3 youngsters have been, they should all be rotation options.

So I'm still Ten Hag in, but if we can't overhaul the team, then maybe we should bring in a more defensive manager who suits the players we have.
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That's one of the (many) reasons to sack ETH. He has spent 400 million, and you can only find two players, Onana and Bruno.

Actually, I don't think that Onana is good enough for a top team, which leaves us with Bruno, who was already here. Two years, 400 million, and we are at the same place where we started.
 
FootballAI said:
Ten Hag looked exhausted in the interview. I can see the sack coming but I would not mind if he stay for another season. One of his strongest suit is the willingness to play our youngsters and that is his strongest asset.
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Klopp, Guardiola and numerous other top level managers also do that. If the talent is there, they will play the kids. Heck, even PSG plays with two homegrown teenagers in their CL games.
 
FootballAI said:
Ten Hag looked exhausted in the interview. I can see the sack coming but I would not mind if he stay for another season. One of his strongest suit is the willingness to play our youngsters and that is his strongest asset.
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Who the feck wouldn't play a talented youngster if given the opportunity? That's the whole point of having an academy, to produce great players for the first team. Even Pep does that despite having an embarrassment of riches at his disposal. If I were managing United I'd put Mainoo and Gernacho in the team, but I'd still be a shit manager
 
lex talionis said:
Concerns about ETH are warranted but I'm not sure we have any better options this summer. Southgate and Potter would be a downgrade.
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There's nothing to support the opinion of Southgate and Potter being downgrades. They're just unfashionable names due to being British. It's the exact same attitude that led to Moyes being given no chance since day one, and frankly he's no worse than Ten Hag.
 
AndySmith1990 said:
There's nothing to support the opinion of Southgate and Potter being downgrades. They're just unfashionable names due to being British. It's the exact same attitude that led to Moyes being given no chance since day one, and frankly he's no worse than Ten Hag.
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Potter is a good manager, someone who sets up team to play proactive football but Southgate is miles below EtH. Poor 6-7 months doesn't mean somehow Southgate is at EtH level.

Same with Moyes, his terrible stint with ManUtd doesn't mean manager like Southgate is at Moyes level. He is miles below and if he has some sense then he should do everything in his power to stay as England manager for as much time as possible.
 
AaronRedDevil said:
Look I know he's not the best right now, but I'd say give him one more season. We will absolutely go nowhere with Southgate and Potter. We do beat Chelsea and Liverpool Id it wasn't for Dalot and Bissakas stupidity to give away an easy pen in the last moment of the games. He has no other options as everyone is injured. Let's beef up that midfield and the other postions, then we'll see if he's really good enough.
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Yea let's chuck another season away because Southgate and Potter are definitely the only two alternatives!
 
AaronRedDevil said:
Look I know he's not the best right now, but I'd say give him one more season. We will absolutely go nowhere with Southgate and Potter. We do beat Chelsea and Liverpool Id it wasn't for Dalot and Bissakas stupidity to give away an easy pen in the last moment of the games. He has no other options as everyone is injured. Let's beef up that midfield and the other postions, then we'll see if he's really good enough.
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So which number 10 should we sign?
 
Just seen some of his quotes from sky sports from his press conference yesterday.

I think he knows he is going, he is trying to put a postive spin on things and from his point of view.

Saying he knows it's a results business and not what we expected but we need to look underneath these results and he can see the progress.

Not sure I believe that.
 
Xaviboy said:
Just seen some of his quotes from sky sports from his press conference yesterday.

I think he knows he is going, he is trying to put a postive spin on things and from his point of view.

Saying he knows it's a results business and not what we expected but we need to look underneath these results and he can see the progress.

Not sure I believe that.
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He knows he is a goner, his demeanor has changed over the past couple of months, when the injuries first surfaced up until the conclusion of the buyout he was saying injuries are a part of the game but now he is pointing to them as the major reason behind our form. He seems more ready that before to use them as an excuse, I think tough questions are being asked by the new principals and he is on the defensive.
 
AndySmith1990 said:
There's nothing to support the opinion of Southgate and Potter being downgrades. They're just unfashionable names due to being British. It's the exact same attitude that led to Moyes being given no chance since day one, and frankly he's no worse than Ten Hag.
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Moyes had plenty of time to prove himself to be a shambolic disaster. Southgate’s whole for the England NT is less than the sum of its parts. Potter was magnificent at Brighton, but collapsed under the weight of Chelsea.

These three are all managers who can handle West Ham or Brighton. Thank you for making my point.
 
lex talionis said:
Moyes had plenty of time to prove himself to be a shambolic disaster. Southgate’s whole for the England NT is less than the sum of its parts. Potter was magnificent at Brighton, but collapsed under the weight of Chelsea.

These three are all managers who can handle West Ham or Brighton. Thank you for making my point.
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I think there's a huge grey area around Potter at Chelsea. They have spent a further £250m since he got sacked and hired a recognised good coach, and yet they still struggle. Chelsea are a team of young, inexperienced players that were literally thrown together by a guy that doesn't know football. Given everything that went on at Chelsea, including the forced take over by the UK government, I think it's to simplistic to deduce from all of that, that the manager 'collapsed under the weight'.

I think that job is the biggest poisoned chalice right now.
 
Bournemouth favourites to win today yet we'll only have two players missing from our 'strongest' line up (a LB and a CB).
 
hobbers said:
Why on earth should Hojlund Mainoo and Garnacho be classed as just rotation options to bolster a narrative that ETH doesn't have a squad he likes? :lol:

And if he's not happy starting Antony and Mount against a top team, why the feck did he push so hard to sign them both? Useless manager?

Also, he cant be happy with Casemiro and Rashford now, but the two of them carried him to that so-called "overachievement" of last season.


Exactly the same mindless shit Ole inners tried to pull. 'We cant judge him until he gets a whole new team. Oh and he also needs more signings to replace the duds he already spent hundreds of millions on.' ETH is making the team so much less than the sum of its parts because his tactics and game management fecking stink. Why does this need to keep being pointed out when it's so blindingly obvious?
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Every player in the squad should be a rotation option. That has been the problem for years. You should be able to rotate and the standard not drop disastrously. Because the squad has been so weak for years, some players get overplayed and end up exhausted physically and mentally and others play all the time when they really are not good enough. The makeup of his squad is all over the place. I was just listening to Talksport and they mentioned the fact he is not bothered about all the shots conceded, problem with that is it means we are defending all the time. Then we wonder why our defenders are picking up so many injuries. They are being run ragged. Someone mentioned about him going into his last year and they were worried about us keeping him on and being backed into a corner. That does worry me as well. So a slight upturn in form he gets a new contract. We cannot even guarantee which European competition we may land in next season. This squad might have a shot of winning the ECL. So does that mean a new contract and we have a David Moyes on our hands?
 
Flying high said:
Who do we think, given the status of United, the manager likes? I mean, who is he genuinely happy to have starting in a supposed top team pushing for the PL? I think its a short list:

Onana
Shaw
Martinez
Bruno

Maybe Dalot this season.

That's about it I'd imagine. And 2 of those have missed the season.

As good as the 3 youngsters have been, they should all be rotation options.

So I'm still Ten Hag in, but if we can't overhaul the team, then maybe we should bring in a more defensive manager who suits the players we have.
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And how will this work in the long run? It’s clear INEOS want us to play attractive football so that would just be going back on there word. It’s down to the manager to get players playing the way they want and if they can’t adapt and don’t fit into that system then you sell them. When Guardiola went to city he always implemented his philosophy even with his first squad he inherited, he slowly sold a lot of players and brought in players and that’s how there consistently playing the way Guardiola wants. ETH made mistakes with his signings… he signed players that don’t fit into how he wants to play… and you could tell that straight away after he signed Casemiro instead of FDJ who are both completely different players.
 
Leftback99 said:
Bournemouth favourites to win today yet we'll only have two players missing from our 'strongest' line up (a LB and a CB).
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Funny but it is true, Shaw is still a big miss but otherwise we are at near full strength now.

If we get dominated the way we were by Brentford, I guess there is no more excuse that can protect Ten Hag from the ongoing firing squad of the new owner.
 
RedSky said:
They're on a 14 game unbeaten streak despite starting a 16 and 17 year old each game.

Personally I think Xavi has worked miracles at Barcelona.
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He's done well but hardly anything miraculous. Barcelona have a better squad than almost any team in La Liga.
 
AndySmith1990 said:
There's nothing to support the opinion of Southgate and Potter being downgrades. They're just unfashionable names due to being British. It's the exact same attitude that led to Moyes being given no chance since day one, and frankly he's no worse than Ten Hag.
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I'm no fan of Ten Hag by this point, but come on man, Southgate and Potter!? Of course they are downgrades and it has nothing to do with being British! Potter failed miserably at Chelsea, and Southgate is just... the less said the better. And both of them posses about the same level of charisma as Ten Hag, but at least he has a hint of derpiness about him. I'd rather keep him than have either of those. And at least he will be in the last year of his contract.

But my preference is none of them.
 
pocco said:
I think there's a huge grey area around Potter at Chelsea. They have spent a further £250m since he got sacked and hired a recognised good coach, and yet they still struggle. Chelsea are a team of young, inexperienced players that were literally thrown together by a guy that doesn't know football. Given everything that went on at Chelsea, including the forced take over by the UK government, I think it's to simplistic to deduce from all of that, that the manager 'collapsed under the weight'.

I think that job is the biggest poisoned chalice right now.
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I’ve felt the United job has been a poisoned chalice for very similar reasons.

Many people say the glazers running of United plays little to no role in uniteds results/performances. An owner putting the wrong people in charge of running the club can be just as disruptive as an owner who acts like a clown.

Potter would have done no better with us. We spend less then chelsea did when he managed them and had a decade of our own circus clown owners. Like making Woodward the CEO because he made the glazers rich, nothing to do with his competency in the role.

Some fans can only see “glazers have undermined our managers/squads” as something like “therefore our managers did not fail”. I think it’s because they can only focus on the manager position.

United owners have been sh*t. Like Boehly, who threw more money than the glazers at it, spending money doesn’t mean you are properly supporting a manager or getting the squad what it needs.

INEOs will hopefully correct that , but if you excuse Potter for Chelsea’s dysfunction, then people can’t really have a higher bar for ETH that had more issues to handle. Potter had to handle ridiculous amount of spending, not all managers would hate that. ETH has had players dramas , injury issues and the club future all on top of the club dysfunction.

I’m gonna caveat it by saying , I’m not saying that ETH gets a pass. I’m saying if you give Potter a pass, you need to apply the same understanding to ETH.

Potter and Southgate are not clear upgrades. I won’t get into the rabbit hole debates some of the less objective posters try to drag me into.
 
giggs-beckham said:
Yea let's chuck another season away because Southgate and Potter are definitely the only two alternatives!
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The alternatives aren't much better either. Xabi Alonso maybe he will never come here due to his Liverpool past. There seems to be a severe lack of quatility managers these days. Tuchel is a hell no
 
AaronRedDevil said:
The alternatives aren't much better either. Xabi Alonso maybe he will never come here due to his Liverpool past. There seems to be a severe lack of quatility managers these days. Tuchel is a hell no
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There are other managers and we make them available if we want them see Ashworth. The point is that keeping ETH because he's better than the aforementioned is an argument built on poor foundations
 
He seems to be talking about "luck" a fair bit lately. That's completely ignoring the fact that by every metric of "luck" it's us who have benefited from it greatly on the pitch this season. It's a classic bad argument that fans always make ignoring the times when the opponent was unlucky as well.

It's mad to me that people seems to be saying all potential options are a "downgrade" on Ten Hag when we're literally having the worst season in our modern history. We've appointed people for this new structure that is supposed to fix the club but somehow they are not going to be able to find a manager who is better than Ten Hag, really?
 
Flying high said:
Who do we think, given the status of United, the manager likes? I mean, who is he genuinely happy to have starting in a supposed top team pushing for the PL? I think its a short list:

Onana
Shaw
Martinez
Bruno

Maybe Dalot this season.

That's about it I'd imagine. And 2 of those have missed the season.

As good as the 3 youngsters have been, they should all be rotation options.

So I'm still Ten Hag in, but if we can't overhaul the team, then maybe we should bring in a more defensive manager who suits the players we have.
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We can't go back now, that is exactly what we've been moving away from.

Do you think EtH doesn't know how to setup a defensive counter attacking team? We have the players for it 100% percent.

But yet they've gone full 2015/6 we are united, attack, attack.

If we make it to the final, it'll be really interesting to see how we play, if he switches to a countering system.
 
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