Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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Blood Mage said:
The worst thing is ETH doesn't see an issue with it and thinks we're dominating games. The man has lost his mind.
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I think the worst thing is it's gotten to the stage national publications intended for a global audience are comfortable enough to openly deride us for public consumption and clicks with even us as a fanbase knowing it's dead on. That's sickening.

The higher ups at the club get to read this stuff too. I wonder how it's received.

Ten Hag can have his view and it's not particularly important if he's so entrenched he won't change; it's up to others to put him out of his misery.
 
Sarni said:
I think his stock is very high here and it will actually be INEOS trying to convince him to stay and sign a new contract by making certain commitments over squad building etc rather than him striving to keep his job in the Summer. There’s very little indication that his position is even in danger and I honestly think he’s as safe as it gets. This man knows how to talk the talk and will have got INEOS to believe in his vision and trust the process.
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His stock definitely isn’t high and I don’t think there will be a lot of convincing to get him to stay, the only way is downhill for him.

INEOS are just going to be doing what anyone competent would do and play both sides. ETH will feel like his job is safe, they’ll also be sounding out replacements and narrowing down who they want.
 
Loool, who sat next to Sir Dave and Sir Jim vs Liverpool? Peter Schmeichel.

The next day he is saying this…

 
It seems crazy to keep him for next season. If we were playing well consistently but results were the same as they have been, then yes I would lean more into keeping him.

But reality is we play chaotic, volatile football where 20 shots at goal against us is the norm, whether you’re Man City or Newport County.

Even if you did this huge player purge and replace them with younger and more suitable players, you are then gambling on ETH getting a tune out of them and the pressure will be on him from the first league game of the season.

I don’t think I’ve seen it work where a manager has a bad season, stays on for another chance and rises back to the top. They’re doomed to fail early on. Remember Rodgers getting a whole new coaching team put on him with McAllister and O’Driscoll at Liverpool and then he’s gone after two months, or Dalglish at Newcastle back in 1998 where he was gone after two games after spending some money on players.
 
DJ_21 said:
All the injuries this season as actually made a bit of positivity come out of it… without the injuries we wouldn’t have seen Mainoo play and stake a claim in the first team, we wouldn’t have seen the young CB who played against Liverpool, and he looks a baller aswell. So the injuries as opened the door for young players to step up which they have. Once we improve this team blended in with the youth players we’ll be sorted.
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Actually Mainoo was playing in pre-season as a starter and got injured. But I agree that it is nice Kambwala is getting games and looking solid. I‘m all for throwing on the kids like Van Gaal did when he had tons of injuries.
 
JPRouve said:
It's not old fashioned, it's just removed from reality especially if you think that it's old fashioned. Defenders are very rarely faster than attackers and they will rarely match their acceleration because they don't even start from a similar stance.
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Fortitude said:
That has never existed, so it's not old-fashioned.
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Des Walker?
 
JPRouve said:
Was he the norm?
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He's an extreme example but very fast defenders include his son, Kyle Walker and Rio. Speed and acceleration are obviously very important parts of a world class defender's skillset and saying otherwise seems ridiculous. Yes, not every world class defender has it but saying it's not important seems pretty weird. Of course anticipation and positioning and skill on the ball and in the tackle are vital as well.

But we digress. None of our central defenders are that good at pushing up except Martinez. That's the issue. That's why we defend too deep and leave space in front. Fixing that will require a new partner for him.
 
Berbaclass said:
Interesting insight, don't think it's been posted.

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It hasn't clicked, it's only gotten worse. Typical nonsense of blaming the players when it's obviously his instructions, they do the same thing every game and concede the exact same goals every game.
 
Sarni said:
I think his stock is very high here and it will actually be INEOS trying to convince him to stay and sign a new contract by making certain commitments over squad building etc rather than him striving to keep his job in the Summer. There’s very little indication that his position is even in danger and I honestly think he’s as safe as it gets. This man knows how to talk the talk and will have got INEOS to believe in his vision and trust the process.
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If this is true, INEOS do not deserve support.
 
glazed said:
Des Walker?
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Ivan Cordoba, Jorge Andrade, Lucas Hernandez and very probably a bunch of no names, all of whom are extreme outliers noted in their time or any other for outlandish speed, but not the norm, not even close to it; these are the freaks and you can’t just scour the market and purchase or even reliably pursue them.
 
Berbaclass said:
Interesting insight, don't think it's been posted.

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It's not really interesting in the sense that we know that he can change things, we have seen it in the past. The issue is that he hasn't really tried to change things in any meaningful way, for Ajax and Twente he has used very different systems to accommodate different profile of players and tactical issues.
 
CM said:
The amount of waffle from Ten Hag here is staggering, Gullit is bang on.
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Yeah he still sounds delusional as the other pundits pick him apart. Honestly think he fell onto a golden generation in addition to some PL level signings they made for him (Tadic, Blind)
 
JPRouve said:
It's not really interesting in the sense that we know that he can change things, we have seen it in the past. The issue is that he hasn't really tried to change things in any meaningful way, for Ajax and Twente he has used very different systems to accommodate different profile of players and tactical issues.
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Of course it's interesting.
 
glazed said:
He's an extreme example but very fast defenders include his son, Kyle Walker and Rio. Speed and acceleration are obviously very important parts of a world class defender's skillset and saying otherwise seems ridiculous. Yes, not every world class defender has it but saying it's not important seems pretty weird. Of course anticipation and positioning and skill on the ball and in the tackle are vital as well.

But we digress. None of our central defenders are that good at pushing up except Martinez. That's the issue. That's why we defend too deep and leave space in front. Fixing that will require a new partner for him.
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Exactly they are extreme examples and not representative of most top level defenders. And no it's not weird to suggest that a system isn't based on the top speed of the CBs, not when most top CBs aren't particularly fast. Speed is a nice addition but it's not the foundation for a defense or defender.
 
Berbaclass said:
Of course it's interesting.
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It's not because it's for obvious for anyone that watched his teams and secondly it's not interesting because the issue is the lack of adjustment at United.

Edit: But maybe you thought that it was a new thing, in which case it could be interesting since some think that it's the players who made up that system.
 
The Mitcher said:
Has it gotten better? Have the players adapted to the style? No, it's been the same crap since the first game of the season. But you're a WUM so I should probably stop replying.
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I don;t even know what you're replying to pal.

I posted a video and your response was seeming totally random. Literally no idea what you're talking about.
 
Berbaclass said:
Interesting insight, don't think it's been posted.

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Weird conclusion from the tweeter but his name is “Erik Ten Shelby” :lol:

I think Gullit is spot on in this discussion and I don’t think ten Hag provides apt answers at all, really. What we’re seeing there is the same as here.
 
DWelbz19 said:
Weird conclusion from the tweeter but his name is “Erik Ten Shelby” :lol:

I think Gullit is spot on in this discussion and I don’t think ten Hag provides apt answers at all, really. What we’re seeing there is the same as here.
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Also, how can anyone conclude that this team plays anything like his earlier teams? Everyone is wondering why he DOESN'T play like Ajax and he himself has said he doesn't want to anyway.
 
JPRouve said:
I see, It's not new to me so I don't find it interesting. But I see where you are coming from.
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I've just never seen the clip before and found it interesting given the parallels to present day, even including ETH being stubborn in the face of criticism :lol:

I always enjoy coaches and football people discussing tactics and being candid like they are in the video.
 
Berbaclass said:
I've just never seen the clip before and found it interesting given the parallels to present day, even including ETH being stubborn in the face of criticism :lol:

I always enjoy coaches and football people discussing tactics and being candid like they are in the video.
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In that sense it's interesting. But to me it's infuriating because I know that he is the source of our problem unlike what some seem to believe and I'm also convinced that if he wasn't that stubborn he could fix it but apparently you need to twist his arm in order to make him adjust his boneheaded system.
 
JPRouve said:
In that sense it's interesting. But to me it's infuriating because I know that he is the source of our problem unlike what some seem to believe and I'm also convinced that if he wasn't that stubborn he could fix it but apparently you need to twist his arm in order to make him adjust his boneheaded system.
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I agree, it's baffling me as to why he doesn't just change it. It can't just be stubbornness /arrogance surely? He knows he will be sacked if it keeps going this way. I just really don't understand. Something is just not right.
 
Berbaclass said:
I don;t even know what you're replying to pal.

I posted a video and your response was seeming totally random. Literally no idea what you're talking about.
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What do you think of the video? I’ve seen you post a few things and just write this is interesting without explain why you think it’s interesting or your thoughts on it
 
Sarni said:
I think his stock is very high here and it will actually be INEOS trying to convince him to stay and sign a new contract by making certain commitments over squad building etc rather than him striving to keep his job in the Summer. There’s very little indication that his position is even in danger and I honestly think he’s as safe as it gets. This man knows how to talk the talk and will have got INEOS to believe in his vision and trust the process.
Click to expand...
Sarni said:
I think his stock is very high here and it will actually be INEOS trying to convince him to stay and sign a new contract by making certain commitments over squad building etc rather than him striving to keep his job in the Summer. There’s very little indication that his position is even in danger and I honestly think he’s as safe as it gets. This man knows how to talk the talk and will have got INEOS to believe in his vision and trust the process.
Click to expand...
 
Zumbi said:
This take is honestly just lauaghable when you consider the fact that this “defensive structure” is leaving us languishing in the league, and conceding record numbers of goal attempts against us.

Even if you could attribute this to a defensive structure and not just an errant pass, there is an absolute mountain of evidence that shows this same defensive structure is leaving us wide open in all the other key areas of the pitch, and we keep losing and drawing games because if it.

If we’re looking at this like a game of chess, Ten Hag’s playing style is regularly resulting in key pieces being in the wrong board positions, and we’re suffering an awful league campaign because of it. We’re certainly not check mating anyone - even many of our wins have been fortuitous.
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He basically sacks a knight or bishop every game in a desperate attacking attempt to create a brilliant opening and when it doesn't work we just play the game from a disadvantage. 600 elo level tactics.
 
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