English cricket thread

KM said:
Very weird that Aussies dropped Jhye Richardson. Looked a lot better than Boland.
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Seems like he picked up a minor foot injury from Adelaide and Australia are in a position where they don't need to risk him.

Nice touch to give Boland his first cap anyway.
 
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zing said:
Is the ‘less investment in red ball cricket’ thing actually true? Relative to past years, I would assume England red ball teams are competitively funded if you compare red ball to red ball.

i know white ball cricket has more money flowing in with some of the new tournaments, but the ‘red ball cricket under funded’ seems a bit of a misleading argument given how rich ECB are compared to teams around the world.
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I think the issue with red ball cricket is more to do with the standard and when it’s played. The pitches the batsmen play on and the standard of pace and spin they play against are not preparing them for test cricket. Ollie Pope has a brilliant first-class record and looks completely frazzled out in the middle. I do think there needs to be a more radical change to how county cricket is structured to enable more high quality cricket in smaller segments at the right times of the year, it does not have to be a binary choice between red ball and white ball cricket. However the optics of the ECB getting rid of counties after already pushing counties to the margins are bad.

On a broader note I do not subscribe to the idea that the ECB prioritising white ball cricket is the cause of all of England’s batting ills. I know they are a fair bit better than what England have but watching Rohit Sharma and KL Rahul, who play all three formats for India and play no red ball cricket whatsoever outside of tests, in England was revealing. They are 2 players who are generally more renowned for their shorter format exploits but the way they approached their batting here was spot on from the very start, they were compact and watchful early on and then cashed in when the bowlers got tired and erred. England are in their 3rd test here and they’ve only just realised they can largely leave the ball purely on length in Australia. The way England prepare, the game plans the batsmen develop and the discipline of the batsmen in application are just not good enough.
 
The batting was always likely to turn out this way it was expected - but what the hell has happened to the bowling?
 
The Cat said:
The batting was always likely to turn out this way it was expected - but what the hell has happened to the bowling?
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The English lack pace to hit the decks hard here in Australia.

120-130 kph bowlers are not going to get it done here.
 
Can’t recall a team where i expect one player to reach at least 50 more often than not but also know that nobody else will reach 30.

They’re lucky Root is in that team or they’d be getting beat by an innings every test.
 
ArmchairCritic said:
I think the issue with red ball cricket is more to do with the standard and when it’s played. The pitches the batsmen play on and the standard of pace and spin they play against are not preparing them for test cricket. Ollie Pope has a brilliant first-class record and looks completely frazzled out in the middle. I do think there needs to be a more radical change to how county cricket is structured to enable more high quality cricket in smaller segments at the right times of the year, it does not have to be a binary choice between red ball and white ball cricket. However the optics of the ECB getting rid of counties after already pushing counties to the margins are bad.

On a broader note I do not subscribe to the idea that the ECB prioritising white ball cricket is the cause of all of England’s batting ills. I know they are a fair bit better than what England have but watching Rohit Sharma and KL Rahul, who play all three formats for India and play no red ball cricket whatsoever outside of tests, in England was revealing. They are 2 players who are generally more renowned for their shorter format exploits but the way they approached their batting here was spot on from the very start, they were compact and watchful early on and then cashed in when the bowlers got tired and erred. England are in their 3rd test here and they’ve only just realised they can largely leave the ball purely on length in Australia. The way England prepare, the game plans the batsmen develop and the discipline of the batsmen in application are just not good enough.
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Agree. As well as a new head coach, we need a new batting coach. Preferably a nails-hard South African who won't take any shit.

Personally am not that worried about the batting long-term. Pope and Crawley will both be good players, they just need a serious coach to mould them a bit.

Going forward we definitely need to make changes to the domestic game though. Changing the ball to reflect the Kookabura, playing 4-day cricket in mid-summer and introducing neutral groundsmen would all be worthwhile.
 
JohnnyKills said:
Agree, bowling is the bigger worry. We massively overrate our bowlers in England.
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I do agree to a degree. But as an ex fast bowler you need the batsmen to give you something to work with.

Also doesn't help if you have the same same at both ends . Need to mix it up.

Just to add that England have a habit of destroying the decent players one way or another.
 
JohnnyKills said:
Agree. As well as a new head coach, we need a new batting coach. Preferably a nails-hard South African who won't take any shit.

Personally am not that worried about the batting long-term. Pope and Crawley will both be good players, they just need a serious coach to mould them a bit.

Going forward we definitely need to make changes to the domestic game though. Changing the ball to reflect the Kookabura, playing 4-day cricket in mid-summer and introducing neutral groundsmen would all be worthwhile.
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Yeah everything you are saying is absolutely bang on, however the ECB are too cowardly to appoint the right people
 
JohnnyKills said:
Agree. As well as a new head coach, we need a new batting coach. Preferably a nails-hard South African who won't take any shit.

Personally am not that worried about the batting long-term. Pope and Crawley will both be good players, they just need a serious coach to mould them a bit.

Going forward we definitely need to make changes to the domestic game though. Changing the ball to reflect the Kookabura, playing 4-day cricket in mid-summer and introducing neutral groundsmen would all be worthwhile.
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No, ta. I'm not saying I don't get why but I'd prefer to stubbornly keep it, even though I'm sure it does contribute to our miserable away performances. It's so much better than the kookaburra.
 
the only fair thing to do from here would be to share the series (england regaining the ashes due to sharing the series away from home.)
 
rimaldo said:
the only fair thing to do from here would be to share the series (england regaining the ashes due to sharing the series away from home.)
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True - that’s the fairest thing to do now they’ve been given the all clear.
 
Just to say David Gower was well beyond his sell-by date as a presenter for Sky, however as a stand alone commentator on Aussie TV, and thus BT Sport he’s growing on me again.

Good start to day 2 for England with the early wicket.
 
ChrisNelson said:
Just to say David Gower was well beyond his sell-by date as a presenter for Sky, however as a stand alone commentator on Aussie TV, and thus BT Sport he’s growing on me again.

Good start to day 2 for England with the early wicket.
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Think he's being allowed more freedom he's veering off tangent often but when his stories are good he's decent and he talks a lot of sense about tactics and technique.

I read Bumble has gone as well recently - really won't be too keen on the people they have left.
 
JohnnyKills said:
Agree. As well as a new head coach, we need a new batting coach. Preferably a nails-hard South African who won't take any shit.

Personally am not that worried about the batting long-term. Pope and Crawley will both be good players, they just need a serious coach to mould them a bit.

Going forward we definitely need to make changes to the domestic game though. Changing the ball to reflect the Kookabura, playing 4-day cricket in mid-summer and introducing neutral groundsmen would all be worthwhile.
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Crawley is pretty crap I think. New Joe Denly perhaps. Pope is class but if he doesn't get well coached and work out what the feck his game is at the international level then he'll never get there. He's basically what would have happened to Bell if the coaches and players around him at Test level were completely hopeless.

I'd love KP to be the batting coach or perhaps even the head coach. Bit of character and courage added to Test experience and class is what these players need, and I couldn't think of anyone around with more of those things than KP. Buttler, Pope, even Stokes could all benefit from his guidance in my uneducated opinion.
 
The Bumble thing is unfortunate because he was effectively bang to rights and at his age he had no chance of surviving what happened.

In 2021 if you’re within breathing space of someone who makes a potentially misconstrued racist comment then your life is over so he was game over when associated with it.

It was refreshing to hear Michael Vaughan again recently, an innocent man we must remember.
 
ChrisNelson said:
The Bumble thing is unfortunate because he was effectively bang to rights and at his age he had no chance of surviving what happened.

In 2021 if you’re within breathing space of someone who makes a potentially misconstrued racist comment then your life is over so he was game over when associated with it.

It was refreshing to hear Michael Vaughan again recently, an innocent man we must remember.
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Carnt even say your English wivout being arrested
 
ChrisNelson said:
The Bumble thing is unfortunate because he was effectively bang to rights and at his age he had no chance of surviving what happened.

In 2021 if you’re within breathing space of someone who makes a potentially misconstrued racist comment then your life is over so he was game over when associated with it.

It was refreshing to hear Michael Vaughan again recently, an innocent man we must remember.
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Go to bed mate.
 
Anderson’s bowled some beauties but not getting the luck.

The BT commentary is so dull.
 
ha_rooney said:
Anderson’s bowled some beauties but not getting the luck.
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If he plays the next test he becomes the 2nd most capped Test player of all time I think I read.

He averages 30 abroad which isn't bad for someone with over 200 wickets abroad and relies on movement.

He will be missed when he finishes.
 
Deserved that, bowled really well. Another one before lunch would make things really interesting.
 
England are just an embarrassment at this stage. Hopefully they can at least fight in this test but overall..dear me

Did someone seriously suggest Malan Captain? He averages 30! That's about to get dropped in the near future unless he does something territory not reward him with a pivotal role in the side.

He's part of the problem, most of the side are. The issue is we have two proven test players that aren't ancient in Joe Root and Stokes. That's why he's the one of only two men that can be captain regardless of whether he's uninspired.

So then we get into the quality of the side. Anderson and Broad, still probably the best bowlers, especially at home, but they're 50. Robinson looks okay as a steady Eddie. The rest of the stocks are dry and nothing obvious coming through. No spinners either. No test batsman apart from Root and Stokes and the latter is a tad overrated. If this lot is the best we've got, and there is reason to think they probably are, we are in massive trouble, particularly with batting. None of them are going to average 40 in test cricket and that means you've got a modern Windies style lineup with one or two men expected to do it all.
 
As I was saying after the previous test, Anderson is not the problem.

A batting line up with only one batsman is.
 
Utd heap said:
What do you expect? No point bowling him with that field, basically saying you are shit to him.
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And bowling that line he's not going to ever be trusted. Easy runs for any opposition.

Unless they told him to bowl that line with that field and try and contain and if so captain and coach are useless.
 
Abraxas said:
England are just an embarrassment at this stage. Hopefully they can at least fight in this test but overall..dear me

Did someone seriously suggest Malan Captain? He averages 30! That's about to get dropped in the near future unless he does something territory not reward him with a pivotal role in the side.

He's part of the problem, most of the side are. The issue is we have two proven test players that aren't ancient in Joe Root and Stokes. That's why he's the one of only two men that can be captain regardless of whether he's uninspired.

So then we get into the quality of the side. Anderson and Broad, still probably the best bowlers, especially at home, but they're 50. Robinson looks okay as a steady Eddie. The rest of the stocks are dry and nothing obvious coming through. No spinners either. No test batsman apart from Root and Stokes and the latter is a tad overrated. If this lot is the best we've got, and there is reason to think they probably are, we are in massive trouble, particularly with batting.
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Might have to get used to those 30 averages in the test team to be fair.... Root's been the last generational talent to come through for like 10 years? It could get worse than the 90's set up, which Thorpe aside, were all around the mid 30's averages Thorpe aside.

Actually, maybe I didn't realise just how bad it was... but yeah, we already are there, 2 openers officially averaging in the 20's is actually laughably bad.
 
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