England at World Cup 2014

sizzling sausages said:
:lol: Awful was a bit strong but it's playing players out of position again when there's no need. Johnson and Gerrard/Henderson in for Milner and Jones and it would be better simply because everyone is in their best position then. I actually think Johnson has been decent this tournament anyway.
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Playing players in their positions is overrated. Ask Van Gaal.

Truth is, I just wanted to take every player from today out of the team, bar Rooney, Cahil and Sterling.
 
Can only blame themselves.

Against Italy for some reason they came out and decided that they wouldn't press Italy at all. I get standing off high up the pitch but they were casually getting to our final third and everyone just backing off them. They hardly had any actual attackers on the pitch but we still just let them play.

In both games we showed we couldn't build from the back, players just not looking comfortable picking it up anywhere near an opposition player and in midfield we really struggled to dictate, the players not offering enough protection nor dictating play enough. They weren't helped with the attacking players often being too far away when trying to build. There are a lot of similarities between England and United at the moment it has to be said in terms of problems imo.

Attack is the most annoying. There was some promise there but ultimately we don't play to our strengths. Everyone bar Baines, even Johnson the goal aside are all coming inside. What's the point when so few players actually look to run behind. As with when England started trying to mimic a more possession based approach which constituted passing it in defence whilst moving steadily backwards, this is like they've seen how teams can set up with lots of interchange and flexibility and tried to mimic it without really knowing how.

Ultimately there's a lack of mental strength. We had chances but they were bottled and in defence players switched off.
 
Hell Raiser said:
I thought Cahill was our best player, the other 3 defenders were woeful.
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Was it not Cahill who went to sleep for the second goal? Maybe it was Jagielka, wasn't impressed with either tonight to be honest.
 
@ThaReaper01
I agree about the not wholly convinced bracket, but some of those youngsters are in that bracket too, youth level, with more to prove. Some of them need more first team football or play for sides that play better football. But I agree, next tournament the younger players now should be the older players then, plus Rooney.
 
Is the Caf more or less disappointed than 4 years ago? I'm less bothered I have to say. We attacked a bit vs Italy. We were standard crap England today. Slightly better?

I had much lower expectations this time around.
 
sizzling sausages said:
Terry retired, Hodgson can't be blamed for not taking him.
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Shit. Really? I'm sure Hodgson could've coaxed him out of retirement like Capello did for Carragher.
Mersault said:
@ThaReaper01
I agree about the not wholly convinced bracket, but some of those youngsters are in that bracket too, youth level, with more to prove. Some of them need more first team football or play for sides that play better football. But I agree, next tournament the younger players now should be the older players then, plus Rooney.
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There's no question that the younger players need more football. But they're young; they're not going to wholly convince right away. They need to play with each other, get comfortable playing internationally. They need their chance.
 
red_devil83 said:
Is the Caf more or less disappointed than 4 years ago? I'm less bothered I have to say. We attacked a bit vs Italy. We were standard crap England today. Slightly better?

I had much lower expectations this time around.
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Less bothered this time. As I had no faith in Hodgson anyway. We always make hard work of the group. This time around we got a tough one. It was inevitable, imo.
 
I don't know why people are blaming Cahill for Uruguay's second goal tonight. He didn't "let Suarez go"; Suarez was a mile offside and therefore no threat at all. The defenders couldn't reasonably predict that Gerrard would head the ball straight to Suarez.
 
On the positive side we will have 4 of our English players back, rested and ready for next season. Along with DDG and Mata. Kagawa should join too soon and maybe few more at end of round 3. Happy days.
 
Cloudface said:
I have a horrible feeling we are going to get tonked and get no points.

Or maybe that's just standard pre-tournament pessimism.
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Well, we're not getting tonked that much, but I'm two thirds of the way to my prediction. Which is some kind of positive I suppose...

Today was really dreadful though. We were very slow on the ball for most of the game and didn't even seem to have any kind of attacking strategy. Add that to our general defensive weaknesses and the result was hardly surprising. There is a grim air of inevitability about England actually. Hopefully we bring in a forward thinking attacking manager next, as our last four have been defensive all the way through.
 
David Moyes told Rio Ferdinand and Nemanja Vidic to defend more like Phil Jagielka. :lol:
 
Mersault said:
@ThaReaper01
I agree about the not wholly convinced bracket, but some of those youngsters are in that bracket too, youth level, with more to prove. Some of them need more first team football or play for sides that play better football. But I agree, next tournament the younger players now should be the older players then, plus Rooney.
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Nothing will change. They may reach the QF or something, but that's it. They don't have the winning mentality.
 
Woy should get the sack imo. Just like us england need to stop harping on british only managers. Its shit like that that pulls down teams even before they go onto the fiels.Moyes was a prime example of that. Get in a up to date manager and phase out gerrard and the past it players. Only then england can improve.
 
Count Orduck said:
I don't know why people are blaming Cahill for Uruguay's second goal tonight. He didn't "let Suarez go"; Suarez was a mile offside and therefore no threat at all. The defenders couldn't reasonably predict that Gerrard would head the ball straight to Suarez.
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Suárez was aware of the opportunity, Cahill wasn't. He didn't let him go but a top class defender doesn't just let him run free the way Cahill did. Gerrard was the main player at fault but Cahill could have stopped it too.
 
Bob Loblaw said:
Suárez was aware of the opportunity, Cahill wasn't. He didn't let him go but a top class defender doesn't just let him run free the way Cahill did. Gerrard was the main player at fault but Cahill could have stopped it too.
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How? What's Cahill supposed to do? Suarez had something like a ten meter headstart because he was offside. Cahill was doing exactly the right thing. If he runs after Suarez to track his run then he's playing him onside if the Uruguay player nods it on. By leaving him, he's nullifying Suarez's threat because he's offside, and therefore can't receive the ball from a header on.

Unless the header on comes from your own captain, continuing his streak of staggering shiteness in an England shirt.
 
ThaReaper01 said:
Shit. Really? I'm sure Hodgson could've coaxed him out of retirement like Capello did for Carragher.

There's no question that the younger players need more football. But they're young; they're not going to wholly convince right away. They need to play with each other, get comfortable playing internationally. They need their chance.
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Pretty sure he retired after the whole racism thing anyway.
 
Count Orduck said:
How? What's Cahill supposed to do? Suarez had something like a ten meter headstart because he was offside. Cahill was doing exactly the right thing. If he runs after Suarez to track his run then he's playing him onside if the Uruguay player nods it on. By leaving him, he's nullifying Suarez's threat because he's offside, and therefore can't receive the ball from a header on.

Unless the header on comes from your own captain, continuing his streak of staggering shiteness in an England shirt.
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Why does him have to play him on? Cahill can drop deeper so that he still has a chance of stopping Suárez's shot without dropping deep enough to play him on. It's poor awareness, which Suárez was smart enough to expose.
 
Bob Loblaw said:
Why does him have to play him on? Cahill can drop deeper so that he still has a chance of stopping Suárez's shot without dropping deep enough to play him on. It's poor awareness, which Suárez was smart enough to expose.
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But then he's no longer in line with the rest of his defenders. I really think blaming Cahill is unreasonable, when direct fault for the goal can be placed at Gerrard's feet. If you're looking beyond that, then Hart takes more blame than Cahill; he made a complete balls up of the save.
 
I've just noticed that England's final game is on the 24th, which is the same day as my 10 year Redcafe anniversary. God can't possibly let England lose on such an important date!
 
Count Orduck said:
But then he's no longer in line with the rest of his defenders. I really think blaming Cahill is unreasonable, when direct fault for the goal can be placed at Gerrard's feet. If you're looking beyond that, then Hart takes more blame than Cahill; he made a complete balls up of the save.
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So? Suárez was the only advanced Uruguay player, dropping deeper (while staying higher than Suárez) doesn't play anyone on and gives you a chance of catching him. No chance a world class defender makes the same mistake.

Gerrard was the main culprit but like with the first goal just because he made the main mistake doesn't mean Jagielka should escape blame. The entire defence was woeful tonight.
 
Bob Loblaw said:
So? Suárez was the only advanced Uruguay player, dropping deeper (while staying higher than Suárez) doesn't play anyone on and gives you a chance of catching him. No chance a world class defender makes the same mistake.

Gerrard was the main culprit but like with the first goal just because he made the main mistake doesn't mean Jagielka should escape blame. The entire defence was woeful tonight.
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just accept that Gerrard was shoite and the main reason why England have performed badly.
Useless as a player...even worse as a skipper. He has been a liability and should have never been in the starting 11. Unfortunately Woy built him up so much he was undroppable
 
TheMuffer said:
just accept that Gerrard was shoite and the main reason why England have performed badly.
Useless as a player...even worse as a skipper. He has been a liability and should have never been in the starting 11. Unfortunately Woy built him up so much he was undroppable
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Huh? I accept that he was shoite, and the main reason they lost. Not the only reason though, far from it.
 
Sounds like we could of gotten two draws without his shiteness then. Prob wouldn't get that with anyone else -_-
 
Usually, England was one of my favorite teams in every World / European Champ, so I didn't wanted to comment on England up until now, considering that there are mostly English / British people on forums, but I just had to.. I know someone will disagree with me, but I think England on this world cup, as on many others were simply over-hyped by supporters and media.. England has some fantastic players, like Rooney, Sturridge, Baines, but the thing is, almost none, or maybe none of them is best in the world in their position.. simply put, England thinks it has way better team than it has... I may be wrong, but I base this belief mainly on BBC, cause I watched almost all games on BBC's net stream, with English commentators, and guests, etc ... The proof for this is that a decent amount of Media outside UK, including one humors site in Serbian, that put out a decently serious analysis of groups for the world cup, predicted that England will not even pass the group stage.. There were even talk about England getting to the semis.. traditionally European teams don't play that well on South American soil, but you can't get anywhere near semi finals with players like Cahill, Johnsone, Jagielka, and Gerrard and Lampard at the age of 35 ... and Hodgson isn't really a world conquering manager either (come to think of it, can anyone explain why he was appointed in the first place.. he never really won anything...)
 
Telcontar said:
Usually, England was one of my favorite teams in every World / European Champ, so I didn't wanted to comment on England up until now, considering that there are mostly English / British people on forums, but I just had to.. I know someone will disagree with me, but I think England on this world cup, as on many others were simply over-hyped by supporters and media.. England has some fantastic players, like Rooney, Sturridge, Baines, but the thing is, almost none, or maybe none of them is best in the world in their position.. simply put, England thinks it has way better team than it has... I may be wrong, but I base this belief mainly on BBC, cause I watched almost all games on BBC's net stream, with English commentators, and guests, etc ... The proof for this is that a decent amount of Media outside UK, including one humors site in Serbian, that put out a decently serious analysis of groups for the world cup, predicted that England will not even pass the group stage.. There were even talk about England getting to the semis.. traditionally European teams don't play that well on South American soil, but you can't get anywhere near semi finals with players like Cahill, Johnsone, Jagielka, and Gerrard and Lampard at the age of 35 ... and Hodgson isn't really a world conquering manager either (come to think of it, can anyone explain why he was appointed in the first place.. he never really won anything...)
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Using paragraphs and not putting .. or ... at the end of each sentence makes the posts much more readable ;)
 
We knew going into the tournament that the defensive side to our game might be a problem, i just don't think that many of us quite envisaged clanger central. The Cahill-Jagielka combo was portrayed as vastly more superior to Jones and Smalling for instance, yet had they been similarly culpable the reaction would be much worse right now.

And would either Clyne or Chambers really have been a worse gamble than Johnson?

The less said about the protection in front of the defence, or lack thereof, the better.
 
On the up side at least we'll be getting Rooney, Jones, Smalling, (Shaw?), Mata, DDG and properly Kagawa all back for the beginning of pre-season.
 
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