Eduardo Camavinga / signs for Real Madrid

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Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
My point is simply this. The second deep midfield does not have to be defensive oriented. Let alone very exceptional defensively. Jorginho is no different from a Pogba defensively in my book. The one thing that improved at Chelsea was the defence, not the midfield. That took them from what they looked like under lampard to UCL Champs. Our biggest issue has been being forced to use 2 more defensive oriented players in Midfield because of our defence. No amount of importing better midfielders will change that till the defence issue is solved.
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Seriously? :eek:

I mean, just by the eye test I don't know how you can say that. Jorginho does a shitload of defensive work. And then when you look at the stats Jorginho is miles ahead of him. When I did my big midfield stat thread midway through last season Jorginho had the 4th most successful defensive stats out of the 27 midfielders I checked in the league, behind only Ndidi, Kante and Fred. Meanwhile Pogba was 22nd out of those 27 midfielders. Looking at the stats from the end of the season Jorginho is above the 70th percentile in pretty much every aspect, with some as high as 95th (successful pressures and interceptions). Meanwhile Pogba is significantly below average, sitting from 16th-40th percentile with all his defensive stats (although that's not perfect as it includes the games he played on the wing).

Improving our defence is one aspect which will obviously make a big difference, but it won't allow us to suddenly play a defensively poor central midfielder as well as two defensively lazy wingers. Both central midfielders need to be solid defensively. That doesn't mean they are defensive midfielders. But they have to do their fair share.
 


Sounds about right when Bellingham cost 30m while he was still uncapped and straight out of The Championship
 
MadDogg said:
Seriously? :eek:
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Im not kidding. If you left Jorginho on his own. He isnt quick. He isn't strong in the tackle. He isn't a good marker. His only saving grace is his ability to pass and his postional sense. But in a 2 with the right partner and right defence behind them. Just like Pogba alongside a Kante or Prime Matic. He is very good.


MadDogg said:
Improving our defence is one aspect which will obviously make a big difference, but it won't allow us to suddenly play a defensively poor central midfielder as well as two defensively lazy wingers. Both central midfielders need to be solid defensively. That doesn't mean they are defensive midfielders. But they have to do their fair share.
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The idea ANY of our current cms is defensively poor is over blown. Our defensive issues are all center defence related. We don't even employ defensively lazy wingers.
 
Come on let’s get this lad. He fits perfectly in our new recruitment style, young and super talented.

He’s built for the PL.
 
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
Im not kidding. If you left Jorginho on his own. He isnt quick. He isn't strong in the tackle. He isn't a good marker. His only saving grace is his ability to pass and his postional sense. But in a 2 with the right partner and right defence behind them. Just like Pogba alongside a Kante or Prime Matic. He is very good.


The idea ANY of our current cms is defensively poor is over blown. Our defensive issues are all center defence related. We don't even employ defensively lazy wingers.
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Pogba is poor defensively, Fred and McTominay are decent, but they've got plenty of flaws.
 
Ali Dia said:
He’s a northern Irish guy who lives in L.A and knows Robbie Keane and a few people at United (I think). I think he got a lot of followers on the back of the Pogba transfer. He’s just a fan as far as I can see. Doubt he knows anything much.
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Used to do a SiriusXM radio show. Has done some player interviews.
 
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
Im not kidding. If you left Jorginho on his own. He isnt quick. He isn't strong in the tackle. He isn't a good marker. His only saving grace is his ability to pass and his postional sense. But in a 2 with the right partner and right defence behind them. Just like Pogba alongside a Kante or Prime Matic. He is very good.


The idea ANY of our current cms is defensively poor is over blown. Our defensive issues are all center defence related. We don't even employ defensively lazy wingers.
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He’s just after telling you Pogba doesn’t defend and told you he’s near the bottom for defensive actions out of all the PL central midfielders Jorginho is near the top and has Kante who is also near the top in beside him. It’s an actual fact about PL midfielders. Completely separate to any defenders behind them or anything else. just the midfield players. Every good team plays with a solid 2 who can go both ways consistently, not just sometimes when they feel like it. No team can cover for that through the middle. You can’t get robbed that often in the middle and not admit it’s a problem. He’s been turned over more than Bruno in about 15 less games and in far more dangerous positions to lose it.

And the bolded? Rashford is supposedly one of the lowest pressing and tackling forward players in the all the top leagues. You think he’s an intense defender? Can you remember Greenwood tracking back putting in many tackles? It doesn’t really happen. Our wingers stand off and stay up. Bruno Cavani Fred and McT press.

We get it, you want Pogba to stay and you think we will miss his creativity and a new defender might let him stay forward a small bit more but you’re moving the goalposts all over the place. No other one midfielder on his own can cover for Pogbas defensive lapses and that’s what he’s trying to say. It’s been done to death. Varane and Kante couldn’t cover for him for France. Rice and Varane or whoever wouldn’t be able to cover for him for United. He can’t be trusted to defend and keep the ball in a two and we plan on playing with a two. That’s why he got moved out to the left wing
 
Chairman Steve said:
UK Sky Sports are about as reliable as any UK tabloid journos. Infact anything they speculate usually has the reverse effect.

All the rumours with substance come from the journos who work for the broadsheets.
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Yeah apparently Cooper has left so will be interesting to see who is the new Utd correspondent oh no it could be Sheth
 
Rennais said:
@ Jim Beam :
I think he wishes to be a number 8 and he has the qualities to do it very well.
once thrown with the ball at the feet, it is very hard to stop, it is lively and runs quickly with the ball. He got a lot of fouls and cautions for the opponent which is always valuable

But if I were his coach I would put him number 6 because I have never seen such a young player occupy this position of high responsibility so well. He is excellent at defense, pressing and recovering the ball from the opponent's feet. He can still progress on his placement however


One last thing to remember to have an opinion on him. Last year our team was much less efficient than two years ago. More difficult for Cama to express himself, the expectations were out of proportion to him, and he was being watched. The departure of Raphinha and Edouard Mendy at the end of the transfer window were two hard knocks. He discovers his 1st Champions League and national selections. That's a lot for a 17 year old guy. I'm sure he will have digested it all and will confirm.
Thank you for your welcome, great forum, it made me want to watch Looking for Eric;)
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Thank you very much for your insight on him it has definitely helped to give us all a better idea of the kind of player he is, so who is the reliable journalist to look out for when it comes to Rennes transfer news then just out of interest. I know that Bouhafsi is generally a very reliable source when it comes to French Football but outside of him I don't know much about the other ones outside of him.
 
Well looks like we may have to beat PSG, Real, Bayern for his signature. Let's move quick!
 
Powderfinger said:
Adding a player of Camavinga's talent is a no-brainer for any club in the abstract. But I don't think he is going to step in and play regularly in the PL at a high level for a club like United and a player at his age really should be playing regularly somewhere. The move to the PL can be a really hard league adjustment for CMs, as the pace of the game and half second less time on the ball can require almost an entire mental rewiring. Midfielders like Rodri, Fred, Fabinho, Partey, Jorginho, N'Dombele have all needed a substantial period of adjustment coming into the PL. Camavinga might have more natural talent than any of them but he is also far less developed at this stage in his career.
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Yes but take a look at his would be competition at United: Fred, McT, Matic, & VDB. If he cant fancy himself against those names, then i'd be worried about his mentality to play for a top team.
 
Those that doubt the player, even if these linked clubs are media conjured, the fact it's only giants been mentioned should give an indication of how highly regarded the kid is.

Whether for now or the future, he's just not the kind of player you turn down. At the very worst, he's sold on for what he cost, but the potential upside is a world class player, that even in 7 years' time, is only 25 years of age, which is too much to pass over.
 
Would be a great signing, i love his style of play, is versatile too having played majority in CM but slotting into the Rennes CDM position several times and even as the advanced midfielder a few times. I hope people are not expecting the world of him straight away, if we do sign him. I still think he is a bit raw and will take some time to adjust to the pace of the prem as well as the physicality. That said, he is only 18 and by time he is 21, i can see him being a full first team player. Imagine our team in about 5 years.

Hendo
Laird (I have hopes for him in a few years) Mengi Varan Shaw

Garner Cammavinga
Hannibal

Sancho Greenwood Amad
 
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
Im not kidding. If you left Jorginho on his own. He isnt quick. He isn't strong in the tackle. He isn't a good marker. His only saving grace is his ability to pass and his postional sense. But in a 2 with the right partner and right defence behind them. Just like Pogba alongside a Kante or Prime Matic. He is very good.


The idea ANY of our current cms is defensively poor is over blown. Our defensive issues are all center defence related. We don't even employ defensively lazy wingers.
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Te thing is for me, you could be describing Carrick there. Though I dont agree with your assessment of him fully, agree with some parts. The key point for me though is "ability to pass and positional sense".......Of course Pogba can pass, but his positional sense, ability to track runners etc is lacking, McFred are lacking in both but are good at breaking up play. I think we lack an intelligent defensive midfielder. The only one we have is Matic who is ageing and also I think he slows down play a bit too much.
 
RedRonaldo said:
Well looks like we may have to beat PSG, Real, Bayern for his signature. Let's move quick!
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Or more like the usual pattern -- whenever a club has put in a bid but the selling club wants more; then low & behold, leaks like other clubs are interested in him.
 
sglowrider said:
Or more like the usual pattern -- whenever a club has put in a bid but the selling club wants more; then low & behold, leaks like other clubs are interested in him.
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Well it’s not hard to see why other top clubs are interest in him though, especially at that price. We simply need to act quick, top young talents like him don’t usually go for much cheaper.
 
I don’t think very many clubs will have the appetite to get into a bidding war with us this summer. PSG are dangerous if they retain their interest. I know Bayern could afford it but they have a few current players they need to tie down to big deals. We can offer the biggest wages and the clear path into the team. He’s ours if we push the boat out and we don’t mess around all summer on the deal.
 
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ehsanul said:


Bayern in for Camavinga.
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pascell said:
We're gonna have to move fast if Bayern are enquiring. Think teams will have bid for him by the weekend.
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Rolaholic said:
He'd be such a typical Bayern signing that I'd very enviously hate them for when he becomes a star :lol:
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L'Équipe are typically unreliable, and if they're the only ones saying that Bayern are after Camavinga, then I wouldn't take it too seriously. Let's wait and see if Falk stamps a big "TRUE" to this before we start to worry.
 
Ali Dia said:
I don’t think very man clubs will have the appetite to get into a bidding war with us this summer. PSG are dangerous if they retain their interest. I know Bayern could afford it but they have a few current players they need to tie down to big deals. We can offer the biggest wages and the clear path into the team. He’s ours if we push the boat out financially
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Yeh with every big clubs showing their interest it won’t be easy for us.

PSG - they could afford anyone, but I guess Pogba would be top of their list so it really depends. If they decide not to go for Pogba, then they might have high chance to get Camavinga. Actually, on 2nd thought Camavinga would be good buy for them, they need better DM.

Real - Dont think they would go for him at a cost as they need to reserve funds for Mbappe, unless of course they cool down their interest to sign Mbappe this summer. They are also going to loss their 2 main CB, so maybe they would for CB replacement first.

Bayern - already have Kimmich, Gotetzka, Tolisoo, don’t really see the need to add more to that, unless the price is too good to miss.
 
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atkar83 said:
Can't rush the preperation of bids ok. There's a process. You have to prepare them and all that
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Technically speaking, we could rush like like we always did during last day of transfer window.
 
We should act fast on this one given that unlike Sancho many clubs can afford Camavinga and may get involved.
 
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
Im not kidding. If you left Jorginho on his own. He isnt quick. He isn't strong in the tackle. He isn't a good marker. His only saving grace is his ability to pass and his postional sense. But in a 2 with the right partner and right defence behind them. Just like Pogba alongside a Kante or Prime Matic. He is very good.


The idea ANY of our current cms is defensively poor is over blown. Our defensive issues are all center defence related. We don't even employ defensively lazy wingers.
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You get players in midfield who can retain the ball and progress the play, you take pressure off the defence. Anyone thinking a single defender is going to solve the teams issues in midfield and defence is crazy.
 
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