He fits the profile
English
Huge price tag
Young
Go get him Glazers.
English
Huge price tag
Young
Go get him Glazers.
Declan Rice
- Thread starter roonster09
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I guess the problem is we'd want to do more than one signing. I also think we have a major upcoming problem with our striking situation. We have two pensioners one of which will probably be on his way!
Would we be better off with Neves plus Haidara (I'm not actually a big Neves fan but we can insert other names here) or one Declan Rice? That has to be a question in terms of finding value and getting this squad up to scratch efficiently.
I think there are probably less and less people that can sustain an argument that Rice isn't good enough. He clearly is, he's exceptional in some areas and pretty good in others too but I think signing him is very much an "in an ideal world" scenario.
With respect I think that’s bollox and a lazy narrative
Sirigu (the backup Italy gk) has said that the Italy squad were delighted when Rice got substituted off against them, as they rated him that highly.
He’s class.
Thats pure bollox. I'm Irish and would happily see United sign Rice. Couldn't give a feck that he opted for England, and I don't give a feck if he's English or Irish. The issue previously was he didn't necessarily represent an improvement on what we have, but its clear now that he does. Sign him up.
Never even seen this Irish thing come up before. I don't think it's anything to do with why some people doubted him. That clearly came from the narrative that he's not good enough on the ball. But more and more people are starting to concede on that point when his improvement and the statistics come into the equation.
Zola in an interview said the Italian players thought it was madness Rice was substituted in the finals. Below is a quote from Zola
He was on the bench and he said to me – because we had a chat about the final – ‘We couldn’t believe when he (Rice) came off because we thought he was the best player they had, immediately we thought he was injured or a problem like that’.
Yep.
Anyone with a working set of eyes can see what he offers the National team and how good he was in the euros. He was pretty good v Germany too.
It sells newspapers!
I think the reason people doubted him was the fact he's English and all young English talents get over-hyped
it was kinda similar when Kane broke through, people doubted him for a long time even after back-to-back 20 goal seasons
I mean he's obviously class at this point, but some are still reticent to give him credit
it was kinda similar when Kane broke through, people doubted him for a long time even after back-to-back 20 goal seasons
I mean he's obviously class at this point, but some are still reticent to give him credit
And overhyped.
That's nonsense. You'd swear some Irish posters dislike him cos he had a great grand aunt who had a dog that she bought in Ireland and we're pissed cos he should be playing for Ireland.
If he's hardcore English, why did he play don the green shirt at all.
The annoyance is that he used the Irish system growing up to just jump ship when he saw the opportunity with England. If he claims to be as fully English as you say he is. That makes the fact that he played underage for Ireland even worse.
Personally, I was not a fan of him cos of that but as the years go on, it doesn't bother me as much.
However, to flippantly make the claim you just did, is simply wrong.
Surprised people still want him to come after today where he provided less than our current midfield. Standard overrated English player. Maguire MK2.
Edit: Most responses, reasonably, have seen he is a prototypical overrated product of English media. Delighted to see it. Well done caf.
Edit: Most responses, reasonably, have seen he is a prototypical overrated product of English media. Delighted to see it. Well done caf.
You think the “no value in transfer market” Fergie would have signed a 100m DM? The man who won PL with cleverley in midfield. There is more chance of Jones becoming a stalwart of our midfield under Fergie than him going anywhere near this kind of transfer.
don't mind the Irish factor myself and I'm irish
would love him at United
would love him at United
Bullshit. He paid when he believed he was getting the best, Keano, Rio etc. I agree with Andersonsonsonson. Fergie would have been in for this guy.
i reckon he’d have tried but failed due to the price tag, I’m sure he’d have loved to have him
the no value thing was never the real Fergie talking it was just a manager with a limited budget doing the best he could
he spent loads on Rio and loads of other players before him but replaced Ronaldo with Valencia
And he walked away from far more talented players like Modric, Hazard, Ozil etc. when he thought he was not getting good value. We played with Gibson, Cleverley, Anderson etc. in midfield instead of buying an expensive midfielder. There are far more cases of Fergie not spending big than the opposite. And as for Keane, we paid the transfer fee that Blackburn would have paid for him. That was his actual market value. No other club will go near Rice at 100m valuation and yet fans want us to “just pay whatever it takes”.
Spot on. Irish fan here who would have preferred Grealish over Sancho but Rice just ain't it.
Is he better than McTominay?
Genuine question.
Genuine question.
Didn't we walk away from hazard due to agent fees? Your post is not entirely honest.
yeah definitely, but different types of players
When West Ham are playing bottom type teams and are pushing for a goal Rice drives their whole team.
When defending or playing against the top 6 Rice is holding shit down.
The amount of responsibilities he takes on is immense. For a 23 year old it is basically unheard of.
Really should have offered Jesse plus 60 million before the Euros. Now it will be well over 100 million and isn't he also a Chelsea fan?
He is very good and in a better team he might just well be excellent.
When defending or playing against the top 6 Rice is holding shit down.
The amount of responsibilities he takes on is immense. For a 23 year old it is basically unheard of.
Really should have offered Jesse plus 60 million before the Euros. Now it will be well over 100 million and isn't he also a Chelsea fan?
He is very good and in a better team he might just well be excellent.
Yes he definitely is and I like McT a lot.
But Rice isn’t the best. There are better players or same level and cost less.
Wow Maguire, Grealish, Wan Bissaka, Sancho(still needs time) all over again. Every transfer window there’s one English player that needs to be hype too the moon and back and we realize after their move they were average at best.
If Rice is keen to come here, I'm sure we can do a deal in the summer.
But there are other players that will be cheaper and can do the job for us.
We have Garner and Galbraith coming back next season so our midfield will not be as barren as it is now.
But there are other players that will be cheaper and can do the job for us.
We have Garner and Galbraith coming back next season so our midfield will not be as barren as it is now.
all young England players are over-hyped, but that doesn't mean they are all average
Rice is a very good player, just not worth the fee
Why exactly do I have to do this? He isn't a player from my club. And when did I do it in that post? I rated him to be like Kante.
I don't rate him personally anyway and find him to be an overrated French player that has Fifa players excited just like Ndombele did.
He would be good for our squad if we lacked the defensive CM but to me he isn't a shielding CDM which is two different things.
I just picked this random video up :
Just look at how many times the opposition has gotten past Tchouameni and he is making great slide tackles to perfectly get the ball back.
It's happening nearly all the time because to me he isn't a shielding CDM, he is a defensive CM who is able to get forward and attack too. He is pressing all over the pitch, not shielding the CB's.
Yesterday Rice was always in the right position at the right time, I think I remember just once in the whole match he was caught out of position and had to make a run back and it wasn't even that deep.
Anyway, this is nothing to do with you but how i just detest the fans that says English players are overrated during a generation where they are being bought from the top PL club to German, Dutch, Spanish, Italian and so many more clubs. Left right and centre.
French players are overrated too, especially the ones we have bought in recent years like Schneiderlin and Pogba. Just as much as people weirdly say Rice is the same as Maguire and Wan Bissaka - I will say that Tchouaméni will be the same as Schneiderlin, Pogba, Bellion, Obertan or Silvestre.
I don't know why everyone is so impressed with him. He's a good DM of course, but you have to consider the fact that West Ham were constantly getting overrun yesterday by our work-in-progress pressing game. They needed a player or two with quality on the ball who can pass it out without losing possession easily and beat the press. He shields the defence but United need someone who is technically great on the ball as well who can aid our game when we have possession as well.
I just find it hard to judge him under moyes. He throws so many defensive players on the pitch and they sit so deep that defending against most stuff should be pretty trivial for the most limited of players.
Seeing him trying to hold the fort with a couple of cb's and nothing else in his own half would be interesting, it might be a challenge. Seeing him have someone to pass to other than Antonio 40 yards ahead with 2 - 3 defenders to keep busy might give you some indication to his passing range. Its hard to criticise when theres just nothing on 90% of the time. He was pretty good in a set up we should never use, i still haven't the first clue how he'd perform or function in a set up that might have relevance to us.
Southgate isn't much better.
It hardly matters anyway, 100m is way too high a fee and he's got a couple of years of contract so it'll be a while before he's at all attainable.
Seeing him trying to hold the fort with a couple of cb's and nothing else in his own half would be interesting, it might be a challenge. Seeing him have someone to pass to other than Antonio 40 yards ahead with 2 - 3 defenders to keep busy might give you some indication to his passing range. Its hard to criticise when theres just nothing on 90% of the time. He was pretty good in a set up we should never use, i still haven't the first clue how he'd perform or function in a set up that might have relevance to us.
Southgate isn't much better.
It hardly matters anyway, 100m is way too high a fee and he's got a couple of years of contract so it'll be a while before he's at all attainable.
I told all my friends England would get dominated by Italy in the euros with Rice and Phillips im the middle. They can dominate the Ukraine’s of this world but can’t cope with the world’s elite. We need a Spanish/ Portuguese or Italian CM. Rueben Neves would fit us perfectly.
Better at holding a midfield yes 100%. Better at driving runs through midfield and shooting, then no. I’d say they’d make a good duo in midfield. Really need either him or someone with a very similar style and physicality.
Exactly… I would much rather we get Neves over him. He need a deep lying playmaker. We could get both Neves and Haidara around 65, 70 m while I don’t think we’d get Rice for anything less than 80,90m.
“(Zola laughs sheepishly) Look, this summer I was talking to (Salvatore) Sirigu who was the (Italian national team’s) second goalkeeper (for the Euros).
“He was on the bench and he said to me – because we had a chat about the final – ‘We couldn’t believe when he (Rice) came off because we thought he was the best player they had, immediately we thought he was injured or a problem like that’.
“They were very pleased when he came off.”
Everyone with half of an understanding of football saw that Southgate made England sit back to guard a Shaw goal that was scored in the first 2 mins. He let Italy control the match, why that has anything to do with Rice is just confusing.
What about Phillips? A player with better passing ability than Rice? Why didn't he control? Because ultimately England let Italy control the match whilst they tried to control a 1-0 league.
“He was on the bench and he said to me – because we had a chat about the final – ‘We couldn’t believe when he (Rice) came off because we thought he was the best player they had, immediately we thought he was injured or a problem like that’.
“They were very pleased when he came off.”
Everyone with half of an understanding of football saw that Southgate made England sit back to guard a Shaw goal that was scored in the first 2 mins. He let Italy control the match, why that has anything to do with Rice is just confusing.
What about Phillips? A player with better passing ability than Rice? Why didn't he control? Because ultimately England let Italy control the match whilst they tried to control a 1-0 league.
Rice is a good player but overrated. Our midfield outplayed theirs yesterday even when we switched to 4-2-2-2. It’s good to shield the defence but we need someone who can contribute a bit more in attack. I mean we even the same from centerbacks and GK. £100m should buy a prime Modric or Verratti.
Yeah. I already explained my reasoning. Maybe it's a little on the too much side, but not by much. Footballers get bought for these sums all the time these days. I don't approve, but it is what it is. You want the best, you have to pay for it.
Besides, we already bought Sancho for 70M without knowing how he would fair in the PL. Now we know the answer - not good.
What are the alternatives to Rice? Kessie, who fails to convince in Seria A, let alone the PL? Or Tchouameni - big hero... in Farmers League. Palninha? Our record with Sporting players is pretty good, but he will be 27 next year. Who knows how each of them will turn out in the PL? "Cheap comes expensive" in this case. A risk Rice doesn't bring. He consistently shows up for West Ham. I'd pay the 100M without thinking too much. There is no one available that's even close to Rice. Time we actually bought a top player for once, instead of the constant second-raters and hand-me-downs.
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He really is the closest thing to Roy Keane in football. His attacking play is underrated and constantly improving and he’s always brilliant defensively. He’s too good for West Ham and deserves to play for one of the elite sides, but he’d have to force the move and I can’t see him doing that, although he’s not from WH academy so maybe his loyalty to them isn’t that strong.
One of Fergie's last major signings post Glazers was RVP. He just didn't spend big money on player at that time.
Plus, when you are winning league title after league title, it becomes easier to attract players...and we just not doing that at the moment.
Rice is a good player. I'd have him. But not for th quoted £100m+ it would take.
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