Danny Welbeck 2015/16

Walters_19_MuFc said:
That's not the point. Prior to signing Martial, he had only scored something like 9 goals for Monaco. After offloading Hernadez and Welbeck, Van Gaal ended up with Rooney - a player he hardly played up top last season, and Martial - someone who was unproven in the Premier League and scored a few goals for Monaco. Van Gaal contradicted himself big time.
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Should be worth mentioning that Welbeck was offloaded 2 seasons ago, because he had no place with RVP/Rooney/Di Maria etc.
Where LVG screwed up was last season, when he offloaded RVP, Di Maria and also sold Hernandez and only got unproven Martial and Depay.
Thankfully Rashford decided to step up in the 2nd half of the season.
 
Perrick Dubois said:
I saw some highlights of his game, glad he is playing well he is a very good player still.


I think he just meant in his own special way that Welbeck was low in the pecking order. That he couldn't "get rid" of Rooney (not taking into account that he wouldn't want to) and that Welbeck was last choice in the order. Since Van Gaal doesn't do rotation at all that is the way he explained it. He is a helmet, but I think this justification was sound because Welbeck wasn't going to get games.

You are correct though.
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Why would you be glad he's playing well when we are trying to get top 4 from them
 
Attila said:
Why would you be glad he's playing well when we are trying to get top 4 from them
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Ah to be fair he grew up here, it's not unreasonable to wish the boy well while hoping the rest of arsenal get food poisoning or a gypsy curse. Or a less specific form wrecking ailment.
 
Parry Gallister said:
Ah to be fair he grew up here, it's not unreasonable to wish the boy well while hoping the rest of arsenal get food poisoning or a gypsy curse. Or some other less specific form wrecking ailment.
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I don't get it. I was pissed off when he scored today as it's bad for us. I would be happy if he got the food poisoning too
 
Perrick Dubois said:
Because he is Mancunican and I want all Mancunian players who have played for us to do well. Why else?
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Because we're in direct competition with his current team for top 4? Him doing well hurts our chances for CL football next season; so I'd be happy to see him crash and burn.

I never understood the fascination with Welbeck, was never a great player for United besides from a great performance against Madrid where he ran his socks off.

Recall him playing large majority of the season City won the title on goal difference up top and being very wasteful. Never understood why Fergie benched Hernandez for him.
 
Attila said:
So you were happy when he scored today?
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No, I was at work when he scored. Nobody at work is ever happy. When I got home and checked the score and watched some of the highlights I was happy for him.

PepsiCola said:
Because we're in direct competition with his current team for top 4? Him doing well hurts our chances for CL football next season; so I'd be happy to see him crash and burn.

I never understood the fascination with Welbeck, was never a great player for United besides from a great performance against Madrid where he ran his socks off.

Recall him playing large majority of the season City won the title on goal difference up top and being very wasteful. Never understood why Fergie benched Hernandez for him.
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And? If we aren't good enough to shape our own destiny then why should I be upset about other people doing well? Football is very linear to me. When we used to win titles it was because we aspired to and were the best. I don't really get that upset if we as a team can't shape our own destiny and win, over other people who I admire as footballers playing well.

If we rely on putting the nix on other teams and hoping they do us a favor then that isn't really all that upsetting to me. I guess I am wired a bit differently as a fan.
 
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Walters_19_MuFc said:
That's not the point. Prior to signing Martial, he had only scored something like 9 goals for Monaco. After offloading Hernadez and Welbeck, Van Gaal ended up with Rooney - a player he hardly played up top last season, and Martial - someone who was unproven in the Premier League and scored a few goals for Monaco. Van Gaal contradicted himself big time.
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Nah it's like this. Welbeck isn't technique wise a great forward and doesn't have the scoring record that warrants him to suddenly bench van Persie or Rooney for him. Like, Peter crouch (though Welbeck is better than him), had a decent goalscoring prowess that made up for his lack of talent.

Martial on the other hand may not have the goalscoring record yet but is talentwise one of the best in his age group.

There is no contradiction.
 
JustAFan said:
Did we get rid of Pique or did he choose to leave (back to his original club) to get more playing time considering he was stuck behind Rio and vidic?


Pogba, we did not get rid of either, we probably should have played him more to try and convince him to stay. But we did not get rid of him.
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Welbeck the same way wanted to leave because we had better players in his position.
 
Eila said:
Should be worth mentioning that Welbeck was offloaded 2 seasons ago, because he had no place with RVP/Rooney/Di Maria etc.
Where LVG screwed up was last season, when he offloaded RVP, Di Maria and also sold Hernandez and only got unproven Martial and Depay.
Thankfully Rashford decided to step up in the 2nd half of the season.
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Exactly.

Cracking goal for him last night, though he's still a massive underachiever and the management was right in letting him go.
 
Perrick Dubois said:
No, I was at work when he scored. Nobody at work is ever happy. When I got home and checked the score and watched some of the highlights I was happy for him.


And? If we aren't good enough to shape our own destiny then why should I be upset about other people doing well? Football is very linear to me. When we used to win titles it was because we aspired to and were the best. I don't really get that upset if we as a team can't shape our own destiny and win, over other people who I admire as footballers playing well.

If we rely on putting the nix on other teams and hoping they do us a favor then that isn't really all that upsetting to me. I guess I am wired a bit differently as a fan.
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We have won plenty of titles because of other clubs doing us favours.

It hasn't changed now simply because we are fighting for a smaller prize (4th). Logically this makes no sense.
 
The Purist said:
I was very pleased with his contribution yet again today. He's keeping you lot out of the top 4 almost single handedly recently. (Okay, Alexis and Iwobi have been doing their bit too.)
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Good for you guys. Good luck having Welbeck with Wenger and top 4 trophy for a long long time.

Many here would be happy for not getting top 4 and rid of LVG. Top 4 this season is only a bonus now, already a failure not launching a title challenge in a season like this, just saying.
 
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K2K said:
We have won plenty of titles because of other clubs doing us favours.

It hasn't changed now simply because we are fighting for a smaller prize (4th). Logically this makes no sense.
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This has no correlation to why I don't get excessively upset at opposition players being individually successful if they have had a large affiliation with our club.
 
Welbeck is a very good player and should still be at the club. He's a useful addition to any squad, albeit it's increasingly clear that he doesn't have the cutting edge needed to be one of the main men at a side fighting for top honours.
 
Kag said:
Welbeck is a very good player and should still be at the club. He's a useful addition to any squad, albeit it's increasingly clear that he doesn't have the cutting edge needed to be one of the main men at a side fighting for top honours.
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Problem is Welbeck saw himself wanting the starting place. The rumor was he wanted out going back to new year 2014 under Moyes. Now with Giroud back to being average, on this form Welbeck would pretty much get his wish. Knowing Wenger, Welbeck 's future is secured even if he never becomes prolific goal scorer.
 
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prath92 said:
Nah it's like this. Welbeck isn't technique wise a great forward and doesn't have the scoring record that warrants him to suddenly bench van Persie or Rooney for him. Like, Peter crouch (though Welbeck is better than him), had a decent goalscoring prowess that made up for his lack of talent.

Martial on the other hand may not have the goalscoring record yet but is talentwise one of the best in his age group.

There is no contradiction.
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With hindsight, Martial has turned out to be a fantastic player, but we are talking about goals here. Martial wasn't exactly a prolific goalscorer when he come here, was he? That's the point I am making, and something Van Gaal certainly ended up contradicting himself on.

It's a big part of why people, including myself, wanted another striker to come in with Martial this season - someone a bit more proven, which would have left us with Rooney, Striker and Martial, in that pecking order.

As it happens, Rashford has come and and has been brilliant, but that was hardly planned by Van Gaal.

There's no way Van Gaal would have wanted to rely on a 20 and 18 year old to get the team goals this season.
 
ti vu said:
Problem is Welbeck saw himself wanting the starting place. The rumor was he wanted out going back to new year 2014 under Moyes. Now with Giroud back to being average, on this form Welbeck would pretty much get his wish. Knowing Wenger, Welbeck 's future is secured even if he never becomes prolific goal scorer.
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He left because he was told he wouldn't get any games under Van Gaal. We had Rooney and Van Persie plus Falcao and an emerging Wilson. He would have stayed here in a squad capacity if he was wanted.

I think he wanted out under Moyes - there's no love lost between the pair. But under Van Gaal he was happy to stay until he was told otherwise.
 
kouroux said:
Welbeck isn't a very good player. He's an ok player who can have good performances here and there but not really consistent.
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Agreed. I guess he's an alright squadplayer, but that's it. He's always been a bit clumsy with the ball at his feet and is just not efficient enough in front of the goal. He's hella strong though, works hard for the team and got good pace.
 
Kag said:
He left because he was told he wouldn't get any games under Van Gaal. We had Rooney and Van Persie plus Falcao and an emerging Wilson. He would have stayed here in a squad capacity if he was wanted.

I think he wanted out under Moyes - there's no love lost between the pair. But under Van Gaal he was happy to stay until he was told otherwise.
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I am gonna take your word for that. The point is the ship has sailed and Welbedk got what he once looked for. There is no if here for us since LVG did what he did. If Welbeck will be available this summer, I would bet my house we won't buy him unless SAF came out of retirement and Rooney go to China.
 
Kag said:
He left because he was told he wouldn't get any games under Van Gaal. We had Rooney and Van Persie plus Falcao and an emerging Wilson. He would have stayed here in a squad capacity if he was wanted.

I think he wanted out under Moyes - there's no love lost between the pair. But under Van Gaal he was happy to stay until he was told otherwise.
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Na he demanded to start as the main striker... As he and many pundits pointed out for a few months but suddenly died down.. For some reason!
 
cyberman said:
Na he demanded to start as the main striker... As he and many pundits pointed out for a few months but suddenly died down.. For some reason!
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No he didn't. He did a high profile interview before the World Cup that summer stating how much he enjoyed playing as wide forward in a 433 as opposed to being a winger in a flat midfield four. He prefers playing centrally, but he wasn't dictating that he had to start there every game for us.

If he truly wanted to leave then he'd have bolted a lot earlier than twenty to 12 on September 1st. We brought in Falcao and Van Gaal told all of Welbeck, Kagawa and Hernandez that they wouldn't get many games. They duly left in the space of a couple of days. We even briefed to the media how highly we rated Wilson and that he'd play a major role throughout the season to compensate.
 
I like how people always compare him with our most attractive striker at the moment and say he is not good enough. Last year it was about Falcao(when everyone thought he will be good), then everyone realised he is shit so started saying Wilson has more potential, then Wilson proved he is
Kag said:
No he didn't. He did a high profile interview before the World Cup that summer stating how much he enjoyed playing as wide forward in a 433 as opposed to being a winger in a flat midfield four. He prefers playing centrally, but he wasn't dictating that he had to start there every game for us.
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That's right. He said that many times, but for some reason people insist he said he wanted to be main striker.
 
Walters_19_MuFc said:
With hindsight, Martial has turned out to be a fantastic player, but we are talking about goals here. Martial wasn't exactly a prolific goalscorer when he come here, was he? That's the point I am making, and something Van Gaal certainly ended up contradicting himself on.

It's a big part of why people, including myself, wanted another striker to come in with Martial this season - someone a bit more proven, which would have left us with Rooney, Striker and Martial, in that pecking order.

As it happens, Rashford has come and and has been brilliant, but that was hardly planned by Van Gaal.

There's no way Van Gaal would have wanted to rely on a 20 and 18 year old to get the team goals this season.
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Martial scored 9 league goals playing as a winger in his first full season. That's good enough for a beginner. Martial in his first full season scored more goals than Welbeck in any of his seasons here and at Arsenal.

Plus as I said he had lots more talent than Welbeck. Welbeck was 25 martial was 19. I'm willing to bet that martial is going to outscore Welbeck by 25. Clearly our scouts knew he was a top striker/winger and bought him. Welbeck wasn't worth the trouble of being forced to be kept at United.

Anyway He left at a time when we had 3 other strikers all of whom matched him in the league. RvP had arguably one of his worst seasons with him injured for a long time, benched, losing pace and yet scored more than Welbeck who is in his prime. Van gaal didn't care that he wasn't prolific. It's that he wasn't prolific and wasn't that talented either. To be first choice at a top club anyway.
 
LVG doesn't understand that in England you need at least some pace and athleticism. He literally got rid of all of our pace and power (Welbeck, Nani, Chicharito). Huge, huge mistake whether you rate those players or not.
 
Walters_19_MuFc said:
http://www.thesportreview.com/tsr/2...senal-man-to-be-first-man-utd-signing-report/

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/foot...ck-Jose-Mourinho-Transfer-News-Rumours-Gossip

Doubt it will happen, but I feel if Welbz was still at United, Mourinho would have really liked him. Typical Mourinho player. Hard working, quick, powerful, good on counter, tracks back, etc.

He'd also remember the two legs in the CL against Madrid, where Welbeck was arguably the best player on the pitch in both games.
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If it wasn't for the injuries he's suffered, I'd consider taking him back but only playing out wide.

Martial - Rashford - Welbeck front three would of been nice.
 
Walters_19_MuFc said:
http://www.thesportreview.com/tsr/2...senal-man-to-be-first-man-utd-signing-report/

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/foot...ck-Jose-Mourinho-Transfer-News-Rumours-Gossip

Doubt it will happen, but I feel if Welbz was still at United, Mourinho would have really liked him. Typical Mourinho player. Hard working, quick, powerful, good on counter, tracks back, etc.

He'd also remember the two legs in the CL against Madrid, where Welbeck was arguably the best player on the pitch in both games.
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Yep and he played at 10 that night.
 
Why go for Welbeck now and waste opportunities that could be used for Rashford, Fletcher or Wilson? Rashford is already the better player and has supplanted Welbeck in the England side as well.
 
Wednesday at Stoke said:
Why go for Welbeck now and waste opportunities that could be used for Rashford, Fletcher or Wilson? Rashford is already the better player and has supplanted Welbeck in the England side as well.
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Well he hasn't, Welbeck is just injured.

There's not a chance in hell Welbeck wouldn't be going to the Euro's and starting if he were fit... Hodgson loves the man.
 
Wednesday at Stoke said:
Why go for Welbeck now and waste opportunities that could be used for Rashford, Fletcher or Wilson? Rashford is already the better player and has supplanted Welbeck in the England side as well.
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Very much doubt Mourinho would play him up top if he was to come back anyway. Think we'd see him out wide or behind the forward.
 
Annihilate Now! said:
Well he hasn't, Welbeck is just injured.

There's not a chance in hell Welbeck wouldn't be going to the Euro's and starting if he were fit... Hodgson loves the man.
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Do you see him keeping Rashford out of the England squad in the future? I sure don't. He might have some value as a left winger because England lack wingers but if Sterling is fit, that spot is gone as well. At best he might tag along as a squad player for tactical situations.
 
Why is there a need to bring up former player for the new manager, 2 appointment away? There is so much hypothesis at play. We never know the result as, it's unlikely Welbeck would play for United again. The discussion would go both way under this hypothetic scenario.

For example, if Mourinho was appointed back in 2013, we could have signed Bale and Griezman as Mourinho could give us much better pulling power than Moyes. RVP was on high note after the previous season. Mourinho is a fan of then not too bad Rooney, so I may assume Mourinho would have decided to keep Rooney and revive him by the evidence that even a bad form Rooney back then had more productivity than Welbeck, and a motivated Rooney can be as industrious as Welbeck. Perhaps, even a back then top class Falcao transfer with Mendez connection. Can't see Welbeck displace those hypothetically. I can see Mourinho at this time went for a diamond system. Then we had Nani, Young, Valencia, Zaha and an emerging Januzaj for the wing options. Welbeck was not even better productive for us than Nani, Young at the time. Valencia and Young was more or less provide similar work rate. Most importantly, those understood their position as not guaranteed starters. Willian was available that season and was going to Tottenham until Chelsea hijacked the deal at last moment. Mourinho's personal requested transfer!? Welbeck wanted more game time and wanted to be more of a forwards/wing forward role...

Even if what I said above is complete off mark, there is no enough credible evidence to argue the case. I personally would be happy if Welbeck had stayed and able to prove himself thus promote the tradition of the club youth set up. However, he is now a rival player, I couldn't have cared less. No point of arguing on this type of scenario.

I wouldn't put my trust on the Express gossip or majority of English journalist on our transfer activity and now about Mourinho wanted Welbeck and Kasper Schmeichel (really?). Would welcome them if they really come but won't lose sleep waiting for it to materialize.

Shame he missed out due to injury though. Prefer Rashford to stay away from the NT as I see he has little chance to get involved. Rather see Rashford being rested and come back for full pre season under new manger Mourinho than potentially a Shaw situation 2 years ago. Welbeck fully deserved his call up too. Welbeck is guaranteed a role in the England set up. That's a miss there.
 
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