Dan Ashworth 2024/2025

OverratedOpinion said:
One is a 16 year old who I don't think has even played an U21 match let alone a senior game.

The two aren't even remotely connected.

I'd have personally gone for Guirassy before Osimhen anyway but you were asking as if there weren't better options than Zirkzee who were affordable.

I think a hell of a lot of people could have told you that going into this season relying on Rashford and Bruno to get the goals we need was a bad plan.
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Let's see how things pan out over the next couple of years
 
Drainy said:
PSR and the fact that the defense needed serious investment.

The assessment is likely that the squad needs time to develop with the mix of young players and unreliable senior pros so they focused on the back, signed a young striker who should get better and will help the wide players, as well one of the most promising young strikers in Europe for the future
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Did the defence need serious investment? And even if it did have we even done that correctly?

We haven't struggled for centrebacks this season and yet the one we blew a huge chunk of our transfer budget on is yet to kick a ball.

Meanwhile we also sold a right bsck to buy a right back despite having no fit left backs in the entire squad, which has caused issues in every game so far.

Even if you remove the obvious need for a reliable goalscorer, outside of replacing Varane with De ligt, the investment in the defence has been bizarre and completely counter productive.
 
Drainy said:
Where the squad is compared to what it looks like now.

Whether spunking a shit load of cash on a short term striker looks like the right call or patience paid off
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Who's a short term striker and what's a shit load of money?

Osimhen is 25 and by all accounts will be available for around 60m.

Guirassy is 28, maybe you get 4 good years out of him. He went for less than half of Zirkzee. Is that short term or long term?
 
I'm getting Yoro was signed because he's seen as a huge talent and it was a one-time opportunity.

Ultimately, we'd have been left with gaping holes in the squad no matter what we did last summer. It's a developing squad - both in terms of the players we've got, and others we will sign - so we'll have to evaluate it in a couple of years.
 
noodlehair said:
Did the defence need serious investment? And even if it did have we even done that correctly?

We haven't struggled for centrebacks this season and yet the one we blew a huge chunk of our transfer budget on is yet to kick a ball.

Meanwhile we also sold a right bsck to buy a right back despite having no fit left backs in the entire squad, which has caused issues in every game so far.

Even if you remove the obvious need for a reliable goalscorer, outside of replacing Varane with De ligt, the investment in the defence has been bizarre and completely counter productive.
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Maguire and Lindelof are out of contract in the summer and Evans is getting on so could hit a wall at some point.. moving on from Varane looks vindicated..
 
OverratedOpinion said:
Who's a short term striker and what's a shit load of money?

Osimhen is 25 and by all accounts will be available for around 60m.

Guirassy is 28, maybe you get 4 good years out of him. He went for less than half of Zirkzee. Is that short term or long term?
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Osimhen was going to Chelsea until he got greedy. I'm sure we could have enticed him for £400k on a 6 year deal or whatever he would ask for

Guissary I dunno, I guess we could have gotten him but maybe not if settled in Germany and wanted Champions League. Who knows
 
golden_blunder said:
You name Osimhen but in the same post you say that strikers from Serie A rarely work out in England
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Also said Osimhen was a FREE LOAN too so just paying his wages would have saved us around £40 million for Zirkzee, as a free loan Osimhen only scoring 10-15 goals over the whole season would have been perfectly acceptable and that £40 million could have gone towards or even fully paid for a left back and Rabiot’s wages on a free signing.
 
davidmichael said:
Also said Osimhen was a FREE LOAN too so just paying his wages would have saved us around £40 million for Zirkzee, as a free loan Osimhen only scoring 10-15 goals over the whole season would have been perfectly acceptable and that £40 million could have gone towards or even fully paid for a left back and Rabiot’s wages on a free signing.
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The problem with this thinking Osimhen was not a free loan until deadline day. He wasn’t even a player who considered a loan until the last few days of the window
 
Drainy said:
Maguire and Lindelof are out of contract in the summer and Evans is getting on so could hit a wall at some point.. moving on from Varane looks vindicated..
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We have 6 centrebacks and 0 left backs. Thats a bit bonkers however you want to dress it up.

Letting multiple players in the same position run their contracts into the final year isn't exactly an argument that we are managing or investing in the squad well either.

I'm not sure exactly how much of this is down to Ashworth. Certainly not all of it, but it's a massive mess
 
Don't trust Ashworth and his mediocre record. 14th is decent in his eyes. He's your typical FA, Southgate’s crack-licking wanker.
 
noodlehair said:
We have 6 centrebacks and 0 left backs. Thats a bit bonkers however you want to dress it up.

Letting multiple players in the same position run their contracts into the final year isn't exactly an argument that we are managing or investing in the squad well either.

I'm not sure exactly how much of this is down to Ashworth. Certainly not all of it, but it's a massive mess
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We have 2 senior leftbacks on the books and 2 right backs who can play left back, and a youth prospect who we want to integrate over the season.

Yeah, the squad age mix and contract situations is not Ineos' responsibility since they only took over this last 6 months, and they have to fix it while working within PSR.

They elected not to offer contracts to Varane, Lindelof and Maguire who will be expensive as it's their last big contract and not at the level, and sign a 25yo and 18yo who are ready for first team football and can improve, and will probably sign another central defender next year.

It's really not bonkers at all when looking at the bigger picture and the restrictions in place due to PSR and the mess they inherited.
 
People have to understand ashworth didn't even start his job when eth got an extension. Blaming him for eth not being sacked in the summer is silly. Not sacking him now is a collective call which I agree is stupid.
 
Drainy said:
We have 2 senior leftbacks on the books and 2 right backs who can play left back, and a youth prospect who we want to integrate over the season.

Yeah, the squad age mix and contract situations is not Ineos' responsibility since they only took over this last 6 months, and they have to fix it while working within PSR.

They elected not to offer contracts to Varane, Lindelof and Maguire who will be expensive as it's their last big contract and not at the level, and sign a 25yo and 18yo who are ready for first team football and can improve, and will probably sign another central defender next year.

It's really not bonkers at all when looking at the bigger picture and the restrictions in place due to PSR and the mess they inherited.
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That leaves out quite a lot of context. Especially the left back situation. Yes technically we ghave two left backs but the problems don't really need to be explained.

Not sure about us wanting to integrate Amass either. Seems like a guess. Hasn't had a kick so far either.
 
Also Lindeloff getting injured just in time didn't help with the budget.

Watch him get injured around Christmas time again
 
Marwood said:
That leaves out quite a lot of context. Especially the left back situation. Yes technically we ghave two left backs but the problems don't really need to be explained.

Not sure about us wanting to integrate Amass either. Seems like a guess. Hasn't had a kick so far either.
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In ETHs words Amass probably needs 6 months of work to potentially get the development needed.

We're paying two senior leftbacks and have two right backs who can play there. In the age of PSR you have to consider that costs and salaries beyond cashflow
 
davidmichael said:
Also said Osimhen was a FREE LOAN too so just paying his wages would have saved us around £40 million for Zirkzee, as a free loan Osimhen only scoring 10-15 goals over the whole season would have been perfectly acceptable and that £40 million could have gone towards or even fully paid for a left back and Rabiot’s wages on a free signing.
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But hey he played in Serie A

The loan idea only came about because at the last minute, they realized that no big club was going ti buy him and he’d already burnt his bridges.
 
Drainy said:
In ETHs words Amass probably needs 6 months of work to potentially get the development needed.

We're paying two senior leftbacks and have two right backs who can play there. In the age of PSR you have to consider that costs and salaries beyond cashflow
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Amass is 17 isn't he? He's years away from being a regular starter. Don't think it's feasible to say Amass is playing a role on our decision to not sign a left back.

The answer to PSR was to sign a left back not another right back. Every fan could see this. Malacia wasn't good enough pre injury and Shaw is completely finished as a player who will be the man for the next 4 or 5 years.

Just obvious stuff. If you need a midfielder don't sign a 10(Mount). If you need a left back don't sign a right back.
 
Marwood said:
Amass is 17 isn't he? He's years away from being a regular starter. Don't think it's feasible to say Amass is playing a role on our decision to not sign a left back.

The answer to PSR was to sign a left back not another right back. Every fan could see this. Malacia wasn't good enough pre injury and Shaw is completely finished as a player who will be the man for the next 4 or 5 years.

Just obvious stuff. If you need a midfielder don't sign a 10(Mount). If you need a left back don't sign a right back.
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So we sign a cheap left back instead of Mazraoui, have AWB for the season going into the last year of his contract and pay Shaw and Malacia to do nothing and not play even when they are fit..

Doesn't sound sensible to me
 
Drainy said:
So we sign a cheap left back instead of Mazraoui, have AWB for the season going into the last year of his contract and pay Shaw and Malacia to do nothing and not play even when they are fit..

Doesn't sound sensible to me
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Plus, Mazraoui himself was pretty cheap. If we hadn't sold AWB, how cheap would that new LB had to be?
 
Drainy said:
So we sign a cheap left back instead of Mazraoui, have AWB for the season going into the last year of his contract and pay Shaw and Malacia to do nothing and not play even when they are fit..

Doesn't sound sensible to me
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The big assumption here is knowing how much we can and cannot afford. Neither you or me do. Or that it was a binary choice between Mazraoui or an expensive left back. We've got a huge squad. It can be manoeuvred in various ways to generate money e.g. don't sign Zirkzee, just use Bruno as a false 9.

AWB in his last year and therefore has to be sold? What about Maguire, Lindelof and Eriksen? Last year and still here.

In terms of paying Shaw and Malcia to do nothing. Well that's happening anyway isn't it.

Even now with hindsight, watching us play a right back at left back for half a season, in fact not having an actual left back on the pitch since February, not getting a new one is deemed the correct decision. Crazy.
 
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Marwood said:
The big assumption here is knowing how much we can and cannot afford. Neither you or me do. Or that it was a binary choice between Mazraoui or an expensive left back. We've got a huge squad. It can be manoeuvred in various ways to generate money e.g. don't sign Zirkzee, just use Bruno as a false 9.

AWB in his last year and therefore has to be sold? What about Maguire, Lindelof and Eriksen? Last year and still here.

In terms of paying Shaw and Malcia to do nothing. Well that's happening anyway isn't it.

Even now with hindsight, watching us play a right back at left back for half a season, in fact not having an actual left back on the pitch since February, not getting a new one is deemed the correct decision.
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Pretty clear we wanted to sell Maguire and Lindelof but no market for Maguire and Lindelof was injured..

PSR encourages sale of players with little to no book value to create headroom for new purchases. Without sales we wouldn't have gotten close to £110m net spend.
 
Drainy said:
Pretty clear we wanted to sell Maguire and Lindelof but no market for Maguire and Lindelof was injured..

PSR encourages sale of players with little to no book value to create headroom for new purchases. Without sales we wouldn't have gotten close to £110m net spend.
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I'd say that's more guesswork. Not sure there was a real desire to sell Maguire or that it's impossible to sell an injured player. We don't know.

I just find it very unlikely that it was literally impossible for Manchester United to sign a left back.
 
golden_blunder said:
Hyperbolic nonsense
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There's as much evidence for me saying that as there is for you saying it's nonsense. Ashworth is an FA man, and he's got a record of going after Allardyce, Boothroyd, Sampson, and Southgate. You're welcome to point out where/when he's proven himself to be one of the best executives in European or even English football but you'd have to be stretching it.
 
In Absentia said:
There's as much evidence for me saying that as there is for you saying it's nonsense. Ashworth is an FA man, and he's got a record of going after Allardyce, Boothroyd, Sampson, and Southgate. You're welcome to point out where/when he's proven himself to be one of the best executives in European or even English football but you'd have to be stretching it.
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You stating that 14th at Man Utd is decent in his eyes is obviously nonsense.
 
In Absentia said:
If you want to pretend I meant it literally, have at it. It still doesn't mean Ashworth is all he cracks himself up to be.
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Wait didn't you take issue with being accused of hyperbole?

Hyperbole by definition is an exaggerated statement not meant to be taken literally.

Which way do you want it?
 
Cassidy said:
The problem with this thinking Osimhen was not a free loan until deadline day. He wasn’t even a player who considered a loan until the last few days of the window
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Moved on the 4th of Sept, so he would have been viable. But no way Napoli would allow him to go to an EPL club on the same terms, just wouldn't happen.
 
AshRK said:
People have to understand ashworth didn't even start his job when eth got an extension. Blaming him for eth not being sacked in the summer is silly. Not sacking him now is a collective call which I agree is stupid.
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They talked with him months before he arrived. Even if it was not official, surley he approved this.
 
Amir said:
I'm getting Yoro was signed because he's seen as a huge talent and it was a one-time opportunity.

Ultimately, we'd have been left with gaping holes in the squad no matter what we did last summer. It's a developing squad - both in terms of the players we've got, and others we will sign - so we'll have to evaluate it in a couple of years.
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I think the biggest issue we have is, like what Rangnick said, we basically need to instantly replace like 10 players in one go at any given moment over the past ten years. Signing Yoro to a squad that had Maguire, Lindelof, Martinez and an incoming De Ligt shouldn't be terminal to our short term goals.

However they display a variety of issues, as a defensive unit, that should Yoro had been fit at the start of the season he'd have been run into the ground by now. I also think we were a bit too optimistic in our planning and we had to be because how do you account for Shaw missing a quarter of the season after getting fit for the Euro finals? However we planned for that because Mazraoui plays both RB and LB.

In as much as Zirkzee was a disappointment he was brought in to help us play differently in a manner that would get the most out of Rashford and Garnacho. Hoijlund is our chief striker and his growing pains wouldn't hurt us much if Bruno and Rashford were pulling their weight. Which begs the question, are we playing in a manner that optimises our biggest goal scoring threats? Does our style of play take into account that Rashford and Bruno are or should be our biggest threats? Should we be moving on from depending on them so much?
 
If he's made Rudd caretaker manager with the view to appoint Southgate as the new full time manager then you have to seriously if he's up to this task at all.
 
I have a feeling Ashworth will be pushing for Potter having worked with him at Brighton. Hopefully Potters time at Chelsea shows he can't handle the bigger egos at big clubs which is going to be essential at United.
 
Red Royal said:
I have a feeling Ashworth will be pushing for Potter having worked with him at Brighton. Hopefully Potters time at Chelsea shows he can't handle the bigger egos at big clubs which is going to be essential at United.
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To manage United you need to be charismatic/have a big personality. Can't see it being him.
 
always_hoping said:
If he's made Rudd caretaker manager with the view to appoint Southgate as the new full time manager then you have to seriously if he's up to this task at all.
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Is there like anything to base this on?

Might as well say he wants to bring Moyes back.
 
noodlehair said:
Did the defence need serious investment? And even if it did have we even done that correctly?

We haven't struggled for centrebacks this season and yet the one we blew a huge chunk of our transfer budget on is yet to kick a ball.

Meanwhile we also sold a right bsck to buy a right back despite having no fit left backs in the entire squad, which has caused issues in every game so far.

Even if you remove the obvious need for a reliable goalscorer, outside of replacing Varane with De ligt, the investment in the defence has been bizarre and completely counter productive.
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40m for De Ligt was a no brainer and he is only 25.

Maguire is 31, Evans is 36, Lindelof is crap.

Yoro got injured in a pre season match, hardly the clubs fault.
 
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