It is reckless when you constantly get caught out though. He's supposed to be shielding the defense not getting lost behind the ball. The negatives easily outweigh the few positives. We look far better with Carrick in the team and that's not a coincidence imo.
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It is reckless when you constantly get caught out though. He's supposed to be shielding the defense not getting lost behind the ball. The negatives easily outweigh the few positives. We look far better with Carrick in the team and that's not a coincidence imo.
Gannicus
New Member
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Blind needs a second sitting midfielder to get the best out of him as a midfielder, so that he's free to push forward and not be entirely responsible for shielding the back line.
The more intersting question is whether Blind is better as a left back or in midfield.
The more intersting question is whether Blind is better as a left back or in midfield.
Rob Bowman
Full Member
Blind needs a second sitting midfielder to get the best out of him as a midfielder, so that he's free to push forward and not be entirely responsible for shielding the back line.
The more intersting question is whether Blind is better as a left back or in midfield.
My vote is left back although I would like to see him pushed forward where Fellaini plays. Try a mini Barca-like line-up. Would be interesting to see many smart technically gifted players sharing the ball.
Nighteyes
Another Muppet
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Blind needs a second sitting midfielder to get the best out of him as a midfielder, so that he's free to push forward and not be entirely responsible for shielding the back line.
The more intersting question is whether Blind is better as a left back or in midfield.
Left back for me.
Though I wonder how he'd do if he played instead of Fellaini.
Walrus
Oppressed White Male
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Blind needs a second sitting midfielder to get the best out of him as a midfielder, so that he's free to push forward and not be entirely responsible for shielding the back line.
The more intersting question is whether Blind is better as a left back or in midfield.
Agreed. He can play in a 4-2-3-1 sort of system next to another deep lying player (like Carrick) but at the moment he lacks the discipline to be THE holding player in a 4-3-3.
Still maybe it is something he will develop over time. As things stand though, I feel that finding a suitable Carrick replacement is a priority, which would relegate Blind to a backup LB/CM
Alock1
Wears XXXL shirts and can't type ellipses
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We look better with Carrick but I think there's a fair few factors involved which shouldn't be insurmountable to Blind. And with Carricks age and injury issues to disregard Blind would be silly, especially since he has done well as an understudy on the whole. He's still young, in a new team, in a new league, hit with injuries, playing multiple roles in multiple systems and is definitely looking tired which seems to have taken some toll. Why does this apply to Sanchez, Di Maria, Fabregas but not Blind? Remember, he played a lot in an incredibly demanding role at the WC equalling that of finalists.
He doesn't have the authority or presense of Carrick, he doesn't receive the same level of trust from team mates or respect from opposition. That's something that can come though, no one starts with it. Hell, Carrick lacked those just last season!
He's playing a high press game in a system with no cover for when they overrun. Sitting back, waiting and covering those channels is less risk averse, which is why Carrick has looked more comfortable and less dangerous. He just needs to pick his moments, or more, choose his teams better. He's got more interceptions in the oppositions half than any other player in Europe's top 5 league - that should tell you how good he is at it, along with his high tackling rate. It's just a case of finding the balance in our system (so there's a little more cover for it, else we just accept the natural risk) and doing it against the right opposition.
His more disciplined and cautious passing is far more a demonstration of his Ajax training than a question of quality. He's played some magnificent balls but looks to far less often. He chooses to rotate quickly through one touch passing because that's how it's always been for him, and likely what Van Gaal wants from him (he can ask Blind for different things than Carrick, despite playing the same position). Similarly on the high pressing - it's his natural habit to do so, there's no reason to think he couldn't sit a bit deeper and cover channels when required.
His footballing intelligence is massive. The German team who won last years World Cup used him as a case study for their defending through the knockout stages and into the final. A handful of poor games aside he has been one of a very few constants in a United team struggling for any semblance of long term consistency - and he's done it against the odds (new team, league, systems etc. mentioned earlier). His capacity to learn seems huge when you consider it all. Take away that new league naivety, give him a proper rest and with time I expect to see more freedom of expression in his passing and a more pragmatic approach in his defending choices (high press/deep sit).
No, he's not Carrick. But 24 year old Carrick is a far different animal to the beast we have seen lately. All the same stuff was thrown at Carrick before.. infact, Carrick was essentially the Tom Cleverley before Tom Cleverley in that regard. He was the personification that United fans had for 'not good enough' and 'passenger'.
Footballs a thinking mans game. Don't discount Blind. He could be absolutely massive for us yet.
He doesn't have the authority or presense of Carrick, he doesn't receive the same level of trust from team mates or respect from opposition. That's something that can come though, no one starts with it. Hell, Carrick lacked those just last season!
He's playing a high press game in a system with no cover for when they overrun. Sitting back, waiting and covering those channels is less risk averse, which is why Carrick has looked more comfortable and less dangerous. He just needs to pick his moments, or more, choose his teams better. He's got more interceptions in the oppositions half than any other player in Europe's top 5 league - that should tell you how good he is at it, along with his high tackling rate. It's just a case of finding the balance in our system (so there's a little more cover for it, else we just accept the natural risk) and doing it against the right opposition.
His more disciplined and cautious passing is far more a demonstration of his Ajax training than a question of quality. He's played some magnificent balls but looks to far less often. He chooses to rotate quickly through one touch passing because that's how it's always been for him, and likely what Van Gaal wants from him (he can ask Blind for different things than Carrick, despite playing the same position). Similarly on the high pressing - it's his natural habit to do so, there's no reason to think he couldn't sit a bit deeper and cover channels when required.
His footballing intelligence is massive. The German team who won last years World Cup used him as a case study for their defending through the knockout stages and into the final. A handful of poor games aside he has been one of a very few constants in a United team struggling for any semblance of long term consistency - and he's done it against the odds (new team, league, systems etc. mentioned earlier). His capacity to learn seems huge when you consider it all. Take away that new league naivety, give him a proper rest and with time I expect to see more freedom of expression in his passing and a more pragmatic approach in his defending choices (high press/deep sit).
No, he's not Carrick. But 24 year old Carrick is a far different animal to the beast we have seen lately. All the same stuff was thrown at Carrick before.. infact, Carrick was essentially the Tom Cleverley before Tom Cleverley in that regard. He was the personification that United fans had for 'not good enough' and 'passenger'.
Footballs a thinking mans game. Don't discount Blind. He could be absolutely massive for us yet.
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Hernandez - BFA
The Way to Fly
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He's definitely better at left back.
Sean_RedDevil
Twitter bot
His roles for next season should be a fight with Shaw for the left-back spot and 3rd choice as defensive midfielder.
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ArmchairCritic
You got pets me too mines are dead
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He presses much more than Carrick which leaves us light at times, he was poor today, still prefer him at LB to Shaw mind.
togg
Full Member
Still think he's a great signing. Personally I don't think he was fully fit today and was also out of 'match rhythm' for want of a better phrase. He's bloody useful and people in the match thread before the game started where whooping he was back. Didn't play well...but then again a number of our players didn't. But with Blind, I never think it's lack of motivation.
limerickcitykid
There once was a kid from Toronto...
Agree with you here. People are writing him off way too early. He has had a couple poor games in midfield but he has also had some great ones. Sure Carrick has had some poor games himself.We look better with Carrick but I think there's a fair few factors involved which shouldn't be insurmountable to Blind. And with Carricks age and injury issues to disregard Blind would be silly, especially since he has done well as an understudy on the whole. He's still young, in a new team, in a new league, hit with injuries, playing multiple roles in multiple systems and is definitely looking tired which seems to have taken some toll. Why does this apply to Sanchez, Di Maria, Fabregas but not Blind? Remember, he played a lot in an incredibly demanding role at the WC equalling that of finalists.
He doesn't have the authority or presense of Carrick, he doesn't receive the same level of trust from team mates or respect from opposition. That's something that can come though, no one starts with it. Hell, Carrick lacked those just last season!
He's playing a high press game in a system with no cover for when they overrun. Sitting back, waiting and covering those channels is less risk averse, which is why Carrick has looked more comfortable and less dangerous. He just needs to pick his moments, or more, choose his teams better. He's got more interceptions in the oppositions half than any other player in Europe's top 5 league - that should tell you how good he is at it, along with his high tackling rate. It's just a case of finding the balance in our system (so there's a little more cover for it, else we just accept the natural risk) and doing it against the right opposition.
His more disciplined and cautious passing is far more a demonstration of his Ajax training than a question of quality. He's played some magnificent balls but looks to far less often. He chooses to rotate quickly through one touch passing because that's how it's always been for him, and likely what Van Gaal wants from him (he can ask Blind for different things than Carrick, despite playing the same position). Similarly on the high pressing - it's his natural habit to do so, there's no reason to think he couldn't sit a bit deeper and cover channels when required.
His footballing intelligence is massive. The German team who won last years World Cup used him as a case study for their defending through the knockout stages and into the final. A handful of poor games aside he has been one of a very few constants in a United team struggling for any semblance of long term consistency - and he's done it against the odds (new team, league, systems etc. mentioned earlier). His capacity to learn seems huge when you consider it all. Take away that new league naivety, give him a proper rest and with time I expect to see more freedom of expression in his passing and a more pragmatic approach in his defending choices (high press/deep sit).
No, he's not Carrick. But 24 year old Carrick is a far different animal to the beast we have seen lately. All the same stuff was thrown at Carrick before.. infact, Carrick was essentially the Tom Cleverley before Tom Cleverley in that regard. He was the personification that United fans had for 'not good enough' and 'passenger'.
Footballs a thinking mans game. Don't discount Blind. He could be absolutely massive for us yet.
Despite everything you say he's been pretty poor in a lot of our away games this season and it would be a big risk to go into next season with Carrick and Blind as the only two defensive midfielders. Our season should depend on whether Carrick will get injured or not.No, he's not Carrick. But 24 year old Carrick is a far different animal to the beast we have seen lately. All the same stuff was thrown at Carrick before.. infact, Carrick was essentially the Tom Cleverley before Tom Cleverley in that regard. He was the personification that United fans had for 'not good enough' and 'passenger'.
Footballs a thinking mans game. Don't discount Blind. He could be absolutely massive for us yet.
Also I'm not sure about that Carrick thing. I've read the Cafe since around the time he was signed and I remember the initial disappointment over how Chelsea got Ballack and we got some random player for Spurs but it didn't take him long to become a well respected player among the fans. The abuse only really started when he had that massive drop in form one year (not sure when...2011 or 2012?). Plus his struggles against Barcelona in the two finals but that was just frustration from getting outclassed.
I don't ever remember him being 'the personification that United fans had for 'not good enough' and 'passenger' apart from maybe a couple of idiots. He was never the Tom Cleverly, that guy inspired an astounding amount of hatred.
OnlyTwoDaSilvas
Gullible
Agree with you here. People are writing him off way too early. He has had a couple poor games in midfield but he has also had some great ones. Sure Carrick has had some poor games himself.
Agreed. He had some very good games in midfield earlier in the season, up until he got slotted in at LB.
Poor today, but on here as of late, it seems to be that a player is only as good as his most recent performance. Unfortunately, that means our entire squad is shit, De Gea included. Doomed.
Alock1
Wears XXXL shirts and can't type ellipses
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Despite everything you say he's been pretty poor in a lot of our away games this season and it would be a big risk to go into next season with Carrick and Blind as the only two defensive midfielders. Our season should depend on whether Carrick will get injured or not.
I never disagreed. I'm absolutely expecting us to get another midfielder in, one who can play a deeper role.
Also I'm not sure about that Carrick thing. I've read the Cafe since around the time he was signed and I remember the initial disappointment over how Chelsea got Ballack and we got some random player for Spurs but it didn't take him long to become a well respected player among the fans. The abuse only really started when he had that massive drop in form one year (not sure when...2011 or 2012?).
Well, I wasn't particularly referencing the Cafe but that was the general take on it I always had. It wasn't just the fans either, our 'no midfield' line was peddled around for a good few years and it was always seen as a weakness. That wasn't a 'excluding Carrick' thing either, but 'including' for sure. He just wasn't rated anywhere near as highly as now, and it never felt like he had many backers.
I'll openly admit to thinking he wasn't quite 'enough' and that we could do better, and I use to think of myself as somewhat of a Carrick fan in comparison to most. I think it's fair he wasn't either, I still don't think it was till Scholes left that he really started to show what he could do. Not that he didn't have some good spells alongside Scholes/Fletcher but not what we've come to expect now.
Most of the people in real life who didn't rate Carrick when we were winning the league every year were mostly opposition fans who never even watched us that much. The ones who now call Smalling a clumsy shit defender.Well, I wasn't particularly referencing the Cafe but that was the general take on it I always had. It wasn't just the fans either, our 'no midfield' line was peddled around for a good few years and it was always seen as a weakness. That wasn't a 'excluding Carrick' thing either, but 'including' for sure. He just wasn't rated anywhere near as highly as now, and it never felt like he had many backers.
I'll openly admit to thinking he wasn't quite 'enough' and that we could do better, and I use to think of myself as somewhat of a Carrick fan in comparison to most. I think it's fair he wasn't either, I still don't think it was till Scholes left that he really started to show what he could do. Not that he didn't have some good spells alongside Scholes/Fletcher but not what we've come to expect now.
The no midfield thing was more down to the fact that we had the likes of Carrick (with his one poor year around that time), Cleverly, Anderson, diseased fletcher, a brought back from retirement scholes and all sorts of nonsense for years as our midfield options. Carrick was our only real midfield option for a few years and I don't really think people really had Carrick as the biggest problem that needed to be addressed in that area of the team.
Carrick was well good in his first two years at United from what I remember. Although I think you are correct in how his passing wasn't appreciated as much until Scholes had gone. He was probably playing it more safe in the early years I guess.
Alock1
Wears XXXL shirts and can't type ellipses
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Most of the people in real life who didn't rate Carrick when we were winning the league every year were mostly opposition fans who never even watched us that much. The ones who now call Smalling a clumsy shit defender.
The no midfield thing was more down to the fact that we had the likes of Carrick (with his one poor year around that time), Cleverly, Anderson, diseased fletcher, a brought back from retirement scholes and all sorts of nonsense for years as our midfield options. Carrick was our only real midfield option for a few years and I don't really think people really had Carrick as the biggest problem that needed to be addressed in that area of the team.
Carrick was well good in his first two years at United from what I remember. Although I think you are correct in how his passing wasn't appreciated as much until Scholes had gone. He was probably playing it more safe in the early years I guess.
He most definitely was. His passing was far more cautious, and getting overrun and looking somewhat passive became a trait of his. He wasn't having anywhere near the influence on the team, he was leaving all that up to Scholes. And when Scholes wasn't around - we noticed. Look at the difference that was made when Scholes came back out of retirement for that push for the title (that City won I know)? The difference was huge and the thought process was similar to now 'Carrick clearly isn't the man to replace Scholes' etc.
And no, you're right, I'm not saying he was our biggest problem, but he was seen as replaceable and dispensable for the most part and there were definitely plenty of groans about him. I'm not sure even his biggest fans were convinced he could be nearly as integral as he has become to us.
The one big difference between Carrick and Blind is I think Carrick used to demonstrate his excellent passing range quite a lot at Tottenham. I'm sure I read somewhere that Blind wasn't that kind of player at Ajax and was more a pass and move kind of guy. I will be very surprised if he becomes a regular first team player at United. I see him more of a very good utility man right now.He most definitely was. His passing was far more cautious, and getting overrun and looking somewhat passive became a trait of his. He wasn't having anywhere near the influence on the team, he was leaving all that up to Scholes. And when Scholes wasn't around - we noticed. Look at the difference that was made when Scholes came back out of retirement for that push for the title (that City won I know)? The difference was huge and the thought process was similar to now 'Carrick clearly isn't the man to replace Scholes' etc.
And no, you're right, I'm not saying he was our biggest problem, but he was seen as replaceable and dispensable for the most part and there were definitely plenty of groans about him. I'm not sure even his biggest fans were convinced he could be nearly as integral as he has become to us.
SonnyTheHaloPro
"Van Gaal is David Moyes +£150million"
Who was it that said Blind would get into most teams? He wouldn't even get into Evertons if he's used as a midfielder, nowhere near good enough to replace Carrick which is why we need 2 midfielders in the summer because Carricks injury problems are concerning.
He's a really good left back and that is where he should be used. He can probably play midfield if Carrick is next to him but not on his own.
He's a really good left back and that is where he should be used. He can probably play midfield if Carrick is next to him but not on his own.
Roboc7
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Looks a better lb than dm, passes the ball sideways too much and doesn't have carrick's range of passing and has a negative impact on the whole team, it's not his fault he just isn't quite good enough to be a regular. He will be a very good squad player for us though and no shame in that.
togg
Full Member
Looks a better lb than dm, passes the ball sideways too much and doesn't have carrick's range of passing and has a negative impact on the whole team, it's not his fault he just isn't quite good enough to be a regular. He will be a very good squad player for us though and no shame in that.
To be honest, I think he was brought in as a reliable squad player, someone LVG knew and trusted to do certain things. And mainly he has delivered. He's not what we want as a regular, but he's bloody useful, rather like Butt was, or Phil Neville. Neither were the tops, but they were the foundation of a great team when it came to relying on someone asked to do a job they were told to.
Moriarty
Full Member
Who was it that said Blind would get into most teams? He wouldn't even get into Evertons if he's used as a midfielder, nowhere near good enough to replace Carrick which is why we need 2 midfielders in the summer because Carricks injury problems are concerning.
He's a really good left back and that is where he should be used. He can probably play midfield if Carrick is next to him but not on his own.
Can't say i disagree with any of this. I'd pick Shaw ahead of Blind at left back. As a midfielder, he doesn't have Carrick's range of passing; doesn't hold up play well enough; and doesn't have the pace to compensate for the other deficiencies
C'est Moi Cantona
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Against decent/half decent opposition him DM just worries the hell out of me, I would have rather LvG dropped Herrera back into that position , and put Di Maria in Herrera's position, I know if we'd have lost he would have been slated for it but it would have been a better bet.
I can only hope and pray that Carrick is back for the West Brom game, because if I see Blind as the DM I'd be concerned.
To come off the bench in that position fine, LB fine, but beyond that no.
I can only hope and pray that Carrick is back for the West Brom game, because if I see Blind as the DM I'd be concerned.
To come off the bench in that position fine, LB fine, but beyond that no.
BringNaniBack
Leaves a bullshit trail behind him
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Nowhere near good enough to be a DM for this club. He should be a squad player and back up for the LB position and nothing more.
soap
Directionless weirdo who like booze and ganja
Blind needs a second sitting midfielder to get the best out of him as a midfielder, so that he's free to push forward and not be entirely responsible for shielding the back line.
The more intersting question is whether Blind is better as a left back or in midfield.
Midfield easily for me
BringNaniBack
Leaves a bullshit trail behind him
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Blind needs a second sitting midfielder to get the best out of him as a midfielder, so that he's free to push forward and not be entirely responsible for shielding the back line.
The more intersting question is whether Blind is better as a left back or in midfield.
Blind plus another sitting midfielder, I couldn't think of anything worse.
LonelyFire
Full Member
Some very obvious weaknesses in us game (physicality etc), however, what was worrying today was he was badly out of position repeatedly - which is meant to be his strength.
Far too deep when the centre backs had the ball and far too high up the pitch when we lost the ball. Extremely poor today.
Far too deep when the centre backs had the ball and far too high up the pitch when we lost the ball. Extremely poor today.
Mali_Zeus
New Member
Why do people jump on his so hard every time he has a poor game?
amolbhatia50k
Sneaky bum time - Vaccination status: dozed off
He's had a fine season and simply needs to work on his positional sense. Hopefully he works with carrick on that and improves in this aspect.
MadDogg
Full Member
Yes, Carrick can lack pace and strength at times. Those, along with the occasional lack of balls, are pretty much his only weaknesses.Okay so lets say Blind lacks pace and strength.
Michael Carrick also lacks pace and strength. Its amazing we've put up with him isnt it?
So the fact that Blind is actually weaker than Carrick in Carrick's two biggest weaknesses, while not being as good as Carrick at pretty much anything else, is not a good sign.
I do like Blind and he did surprise me with just how well he did at leftback. But I really can't see him ever being more than a squad player for us.
Sam
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His lack of mobility and physically was sorely exposed today.
He's fantastic in home games, with plenty of time and space to dictate play, but in these kind of hustle and bustle away games, he's got a lot to learn.
He's fantastic in home games, with plenty of time and space to dictate play, but in these kind of hustle and bustle away games, he's got a lot to learn.
Stobzilla
Adores babies
I don't think I would be opposed to him playing where Fellaini does on occasion, feel he might be better suited there.
izec
Full Member
My word this thread is som
They are jealous of his looks.
Agree
Agree
Why do people jump on his so hard every time he has a poor game?
They are jealous of his looks.
He's had a fine season and simply needs to work on his positional sense. Hopefully he works with carrick on that and improves in this aspect.
Agree
His lack of mobility and physically was sorely exposed today.
He's fantastic in home games, with plenty of time and space to dictate play, but in these kind of hustle and bustle away games, he's got a lot to learn.
Agree
Nickosaur
Full Member
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- 12,019
The knees, they are a jerkin'.
I agree with Herrera, he's simply more talented and better almost in every aspect of the game, he could be playing that really good if we asked him to do, problem is whether there is a player who could replace him as no8. Di Maria in poor form could imbalance midfield as no one, I'd want Blind in midfield next week again to prove himself (we have no other option imo) if Carrick's out. He also might not have been 100% fit. Long term he's squad player, that was sure from the day one but just because we didn't have a competent midfielder for years everyone thought he's Pirlo/Modric. And I think he as a squad player would still be better as DLP than LB, He just had a good run of games there as he had in midfield before.Against decent/half decent opposition him DM just worries the hell out of me, I would have rather LvG dropped Herrera back into that position , and put Di Maria in Herrera's position, I know if we'd have lost he would have been slated for it but it would have been a better bet.
I can only hope and pray that Carrick is back for the West Brom game, because if I see Blind as the DM I'd be concerned.
To come off the bench in that position fine, LB fine, but beyond that no.
BTW I love this place how people change opinions, when Carrick played shit for some time it was all, Carrick for squad played and Blind for the starter, now it's opposite and it will change again I guess until we buy world class DM who will kick their ass, For me personally it was never between the two, both players capable of good performances, Carrick's been little better this season as he used his intelligence and experience but none of them should be a starting option as no6 next season.
We are defensively exposed with Carrick as well, he's just a little better passer than Blind. I not being really fan of Blind still think he could emulate Carrick to some extent to be a kind of consistent squad player who can do the job if we need this player in the future. But we should really aim higher
Rykker_4united
Full Member
Great player who had a bad game today. He isn't a quick player, of course. Nevertheless, he's quite skilled and I think he should be important for us in the years to come.
Ballache
Full Member
Why do people jump on his so hard every time he has a poor game?
Watch the same people praising him when he has a good game and calling him our best signing. I've stopped paying attention to a lot of things on this place.
pseudo_canadian
Full Member
I thought he was just OK today. Doesn't help when the players in front of you are garbage on the ball and aren't making your job any easier. He was under a lot of pressure today.
bpet15
Full Member
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- Apr 30, 2013
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Have like him this season - but was an absolute disaster today.
pseudo_canadian
Full Member
This. Way too much overreaction in here.Great player who had a bad game today. He isn't a quick player, of course. Nevertheless, he's quite skilled and I think he should be important for us in the years to come.
Hit It
Full Member
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- Nov 24, 2013
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- 389
Nowhere near good enough to be a DM for this club. He should be a squad player and back up for the LB position and nothing more.
Back up for LB. I don't think so mate, just because Shaw has bit of pace doesn't make him a better player in that position. Blind is much more at home with that role and anticipates danger far more quicker than Shaw ever does. If it wasn't for the injuries, he would still be playing at LB.
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