Gaming Cyberpunk 2077 (PC, PS4/5, Xbox One)

I don't care how the sausage is made, to be honest.

These people are working on the most hyped game of the last few years. It's safe to say that they are the top of their field and could stroll into another programming/tech/art job if they wanted.
 
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"I don't care how the sausage is made, to be honest."
 
Shane88 said:
I don't care how the sausage is made, to be honest.

These people are working on the most hyped game of the last few years. It's safe to say that they are the top of their field and could stroll into another programming/tech/art job if they wanted.
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:rolleyes:
 
Shane88 said:
I don't care how the sausage is made, to be honest.

These people are working on the most hyped game of the last few years. It's safe to say that they are the top of their field and could stroll into another programming/tech/art job if they wanted.
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Bloody hell.
 
A limited amount of overtime that's adequately compensated should be acceptable in most businesses. It all depends on the context. Having to do a weekend day for four straight weekends is not great but not the end of the world either if it's planned well in advance and overtime in general is an exception. If you get forced into that situation on short notice and you have to cancel private plans because of it, I'd be fecking livid though.
 
Shane88 said:
Superb rebuttals.

It's a gaming company in Poland, not a sweatshop as some would portray. The people working there are probably the most skilled in their field, they wouldn't be there if they didn't want to be.

It's a fecking month of paid overtime.
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You clearly have no idea what you're on about and you're dismissing it very flippantly. It wouldn't be accepted in any other industry and more light has been shone on the crunch in recent years, with CDPR saying they would not make their devs do it. They lied.

Also as I've already explained to you once, it's not treated as overtime, its considered as an necessary evil. They may be paid, they may not. With the scrutiny on them for backtracking I'd imagine CDPR will pay them but that isn't the case everywhere.
 
It’s a toxic aspect of the industry that needs to be stamped out, like chefs being proud they work 70 hour weeks on a 45 hour salary rather than fight back because they’re being treated like mugs
 
Snowle Gunnar Solskjær said:
It’s a toxic aspect of the industry that needs to be stamped out, like chefs being proud they work 70 hour weeks on a 45 hour salary rather than fight back because they’re being treated like mugs
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Unpaid overtime is the biggest con. My last boss would constantly hint (more than hint) that it was expected. He’d know you were working at 10pm one day, but still have the gall to ask what time you left the office on x day the following week, because he got wind it was around 4.30 instead of 5. Cnut.
 
Shane88 said:
Superb rebuttals.

It's a gaming company in Poland, not a sweatshop as some would portray. The people working there are probably the most skilled in their field, they wouldn't be there if they didn't want to be.

It's a fecking month of paid overtime.
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You haven't a clue.
 
Snowle Gunnar Solskjær said:
It’s a toxic aspect of the industry that needs to be stamped out, like chefs being proud they work 70 hour weeks on a 45 hour salary rather than fight back because they’re being treated like mugs
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At least these guys will be paid for the overtime.

But I'd rather they just delayed the game by another couple of months again. We've waited this long, we can wait a little bit longer if it's the difference between some people having free weekends or not.
 
VeevaVee said:
Unpaid overtime is the biggest con. My last boss would constantly hint (more than hint) that it was expected. He’d know you were working at 10pm one day, but still have the gall to ask what time you left the office on x day the following week, because he got wind it was around 4.30 instead of 5. Cnut.
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It’s a joke, that’s why my work run a rolling flexi balance, sometimes I work 50 hours a week but it’s kept in the bank and when it’s quiet I piss off home at midday. I’ve no issue with doing extra but never for those bosses with short term memory who never give back.
 
Snowle Gunnar Solskjær said:
It’s a joke, that’s why my work run a rolling flexi balance, sometimes I work 50 hours a week but it’s kept in the bank and when it’s quiet I piss off home at midday. I’ve no issue with doing extra but never for those bosses with short term memory who never give back.
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Yeah flexi makes a lot of sense, for some jobs more than others. My job before that, I was on flexi and my boss was as sound as it gets. Difference is night and day in terms of quality of life and how you feel about giving more back.
 
VeevaVee said:
Unpaid overtime is the biggest con. My last boss would constantly hint (more than hint) that it was expected. He’d know you were working at 10pm one day, but still have the gall to ask what time you left the office on x day the following week, because he got wind it was around 4.30 instead of 5. Cnut.
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Even oilfield rats (I used to be one long time ago, I can call them that) get paid on their overtime. 80 hour weeks for a period of time are no big deal, people everywhere are working them, but they should get paid some multiple of their usual wage.
 
Redlambs said:
The game industry can be an incredibly shite place to work.

People who brush the increasing amount of issues off just because they think it must be wonderful working on games are morons.
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I’m not sure anyone thinks it must be wonderful. Looks shite. A lot of people must go into it because games are their pashun though, which seems counterintuitive as they’ll have no spare time to play games.
 


You should all watch this before joining the media witch hunt.
 
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evil_geko said:


You should all watch this before joining the media witch hunt.
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Yep, people don't understand this :lol:

I couldn't see the problem tbh, sucks that it's forced OT but some contracts have an "acceptable amount of overtime" clause, mine does. Dunno what they mean by acceptable in my instance, but in Poland it's obviously 150 hours over a year.

I'd think during these times a lot of the people will be happy to get that few extra quid banked from OT.
 
Bojan11 said:
I knew why you liked his videos before even watching that tosh.

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Yeah, right tosh, after he only stated facts and laws in that video, tosh indeed. But it's easier to ignore all that and post TLOU2 related video that has no relevance at all in this thread, ok.

There are lots of other similar videos, from Polish youtubers etc, but they all lie eh? You all know their laws better then them, pull out those pitchforks and join the blind media mob.

A polish friend of mine was laughing his ass off at the US "moral" media.
 
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evil_geko said:
Yeah, right tosh, after he only stated facts and laws in that video, tosh indeed. But it's easier to ignore all that and post TLOU2 related video that has no relevance at all in this thread, ok.

There are lots of other similar videos, from Polish youtubers etc, but they all lie eh? You all know their laws better then them, pull out those pitchforks and join the blind media mob.

A polish friend of mine was laughing his ass off at the US "moral" media.
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Once again missing the point. Not surprising. From 2019...
Cyberpunk 2077 developer CD Projekt Red says it's taking the issue of crunch more seriously than it has in the past, and hopes to treat its workers "more humanely" during the development of its futuristic RPG.

Speaking with Kotaku, CDPR co-founder Marcin Iwiński stated that, while the company is "known for treating gamers with respect,” they would also like to be known for doing the same with its employees and workers.

The company plans to do that by more actively pushing its "non-obligatory crunch policy," which includes the understanding that requests for workers to work through nights and weekends are not binding or mandatory, a policy Iwiński says they've already been working toward. “We’ve been communicating clearly to people that of course there are certain moments where we need to work harder – like I think the E3 demo is a pretty good example – but we want to be more humane and treat people with respect," he told Kotaku. "If they need to take time off, they can take time off. Nobody will be frowned upon if this will be requested.”
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Starting today, the entire (development) studio is in overdrive," Mr Badowski reportedly wrote in an email to staff, adding that the overtime would amount to one extra day each week.

"I take it upon myself to receive the full backlash for the decision. I know this is in direct opposition to what we've said about crunch.

"It's also in direct opposition to what I personally grew to believe a while back - that crunch should never be the answer. But we've extended all other possible means of navigating the situation."
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-54360182

Even the publisher knows it’s wrong to do. But once again Geko and his YouTube loonies know best.
 
Bojan11 said:
Once again missing the point. Not surprising. From 2019...




https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-54360182

Even the publisher knows it’s wrong to do. But once again Geko and his YouTube loonies know best.
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Yeah, ignore all polish sources and quote BBC, no one ever said overtime is good, it is just not even close to bad as US media is making it to be, but I guess you are too far gone. Suck on that sweet media juice.

I might show this thread to the friend in question, who is there and knows all from the source, he might need some more laughs.

Oh yeah, about that missing point, couldn't be more ironic even if you tried. :lol:

I can't get over the mentality: Oh, that dude has some negative video about TLOU2, it must be that is why he likes him because he hates that game so the video is probably lies, I will discard this other video and wont even watch it and just quote some random stuff. Seems good.

I am done on this topic, wanted to show some facts, people decide to discard it and keep on quoting bollocks, waste of my time really. Cheerio.
 
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Jesus Christ, turning into a car crash thread because people can't understand the concept of paid overtime to hit deadlines :lol:
 
One Night Only said:
Jesus Christ, turning into a car crash thread because people can't understand the concept of paid overtime to hit deadlines :lol:
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Yeah, they also love to use that "crunch" word to represent it as some kind of modern slavery where they whip them while they work. :lol:

Modern society.
 
evil_geko said:
Yeah, ignore all polish sources and quote BBC, no one ever said overtime is good, it is just not even close to bad as US media is making it to be, but I guess you are too far gone. Suck on that sweet media juice.

I might show this thread to the friend in question, who is there and knows all from the source, he might need some more laughs.

Oh yeah, about that missing point, couldn't be more ironic even if you tried. :lol:

I can't get over the mentality: Oh, that dude has some negative video about TLOU2, it must be that is why he likes him because he hates that game so the video is probably lies, I will discard this other video and wont even watch it and just quote some random stuff. Seems good.

I am done on this topic, wanted to show some facts, people decide to discard it and keep on quoting bollocks, waste of my time really. Cheerio.
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Yes, let’s ignore everything the publisher had to say on the matter.

They admitted they were wrong to do it. But hey ho, Geko once again knows best.
 
Bojan11 said:
Yes, let’s ignore everything the publisher had to say on the matter.

They admitted they were wrong to do it. But hey ho, Geko once again knows best.
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They apologized only because of big witch hunt going on, with todays "Cancel culture" they might as well calm the fools with apology, easier then trying to explain and convince them as that is fools errand, which can also be seen in this very thread. :lol:
 
evil_geko said:
They apologized only because of big witch hunt going on, with todays "Cancel culture" they might as well calm the fools with apology, easier then trying to explain and convince them as that is fools errand, which can also be seen in this very thread. :lol:
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So what about last year?
 
Bojan11 said:
Yes, let’s ignore everything the publisher had to say on the matter.

They admitted they were wrong to do it. But hey ho, Geko once again knows best.
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They admitted they were wrong to do it because it broke their promises. However it's not slave labour, and it has all came about due to the unforseen global pandemic going on, office hours have been lost, they want to meet deadlines still.

Delaying the game isn't always ideal, developers release games in certain windows for differing reasons.

Only allowed 150 hours overtime? That's a dream! Extra pennies in the run up to Christmas too, not many people would knock OT back at this time of year anyway. Especially with earnings losses due to lockdowns / isolating etc.

Have any of the actual people who have been directly affected (employees) by this came out and said anything?
 
One Night Only said:
Jesus Christ, turning into a car crash thread because people can't understand the concept of paid overtime to hit deadlines :lol:
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evil_geko said:
Yeah, they also love to use that "crunch" word to represent it as some kind of modern slavery where they whip them while they work. :lol:

Modern society.
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Do either of you work in the industry and know what you're talking about?
 
SuperiorXI said:
Do either of you work in the industry and know what you're talking about?
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You already know the answer to that.

I never considered it slave labour, that's just stupid, but it's a fecking rough time and it's made very clear that it is expected through fear of losing jobs and getting a bad name, at least to those poor sods in the lower ranks. Funny that you can always go look for other work, when everyone is at it and word spreads.

But people will always support the arseholes in charge over the talent if it means their precious game comes out sooner. And to laugh about it too says a lot about them and what their opinion means.
 
evil_geko said:
They apologized only because of big witch hunt going on, with todays "Cancel culture" they might as well calm the fools with apology, easier then trying to explain and convince them as that is fools errand, which can also be seen in this very thread. :lol:
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What on earth has this to do with cancel culture? It's almost like you have an agenda or something....

In terms of the overtime, I implement systems into businesses and it doesn't matter how hard you push people, there will always be a "crunch" when there is a realisation it's happening and it's only a few weeks away. It's almost impossible to remove due to the the relaxed attitude leading up to the release date unfortunately.

The issue here is that CDPR said this wouldn't happen but I think they've probably now realised it always will so will accept the flack. Again, there is nothing to do with cancel culture in anything anybody has said....
 
SuperiorXI said:
Do either of you work in the industry and know what you're talking about?
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Ah yes, forced overtime is only applicable to the gaming industry.

Why aren't you marching about for builders rights? Working manual labour, forced weekends to complete houses. Same thing.

Redlambs said:
You already know the answer to that.

I never considered it slave labour, that's just stupid, but it's a fecking rough time and it's made very clear that it is expected through fear of losing jobs and getting a bad name, at least to those poor sods in the lower ranks. Funny that you can always go look for other work, when everyone is at it and word spreads.

But people will always support the arseholes in charge over the talent if it means their precious game comes out sooner. And to laugh about it too says a lot about them and what their opinion means.
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Ah yes because this is the only industry people fear job loss if they don't do OT.

As for the last part, what the feck are you on about? I couldn't give a feck when the game comes out, but people being outraged by something that isn't directly affecting them says it all.

Find me one quote from one of the workers at this studio complaining anywhere near close to the hyperbole the media are making it?

Media picked up on shitty practices at another company, doesn't mean this company is the same.

Also, don't quote me on this as I can't check ATM but don't the employees here get a share of 10% of the profit from the game?

So a pre Xmas release is a win situation for them, when the game is still selling at full price?

So @Redlambs seeing as though you've been in the industry or still are, what makes this job so much more difficult and stressful compared to every other job on the planet?
 
One Night Only said:
Ah yes, forced overtime is only applicable to the gaming industry.

Why aren't you marching about for builders rights? Working manual labour, forced weekends to complete houses. Same thing.



Ah yes because this is the only industry people fear job loss if they don't do OT.

As for the last part, what the feck are you on about? I couldn't give a feck when the game comes out, but people being outraged by something that isn't directly affecting them says it all.

Find me one quote from one of the workers at this studio complaining anywhere near close to the hyperbole the media are making it?

Media picked up on shitty practices at another company, doesn't mean this company is the same.

Also, don't quote me on this as I can't check ATM but don't the employees here get a share of 10% of the profit from the game?

So a pre Xmas release is a win situation for them, when the game is still selling at full price?

So @Redlambs seeing as though you've been in the industry or still are, what makes this job so much more difficult and stressful compared to every other job on the planet?
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Media media media. You know what you sound like right?

And where exactly did I say it was so much more stressful than any other job?

But he's right, you don't have a clue what the feck you are talking about, and yet even though you seem to suggest this practice does go on you don't actually care because it doesn't affect you.

The shitty practices in the industry don't start nor end with forced overtime, but the story here is a company who publicly strive to be different are still exactly the same. People like you who not only just accept shit practices, but actually defend them are the worst. Because hey it's ok everyone does it, right?
 
Redlambs said:
Media media media. You know what you sound like right?

And where exactly did I say it was so much more stressful than any other job?

But he's right, you don't have a clue what the feck you are talking about, and yet even though you seem to suggest this practice does go on you don't actually care because it doesn't affect you.

The shitty practices in the industry don't start nor end with forced overtime, but the story here is a company who publicly strive to be different are still exactly the same. People like you who not only just accept shit practices, but actually defend them are the worst. Because hey it's ok everyone does it, right?
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Media, yeah I sound like I'm sick of everyone rolling with the popular opinion of outrage of everything.

Aye forced OT doesn't affect me in the slightest, well apart from the fact I'm on OT right now to meet a deadline. I'm not overly arsed about it, glad I've got a job during this period.

Am I talking about the other shitty practices? No. I'm talking about paid overtime, not unpaid overtime.

Also, see you breezed past the part of nobody complaining from within the company as hitting this deadline makes sense to them. That bonus thing I mentioned seems to be a real thing, so the extra holiday sales will boost their bonus I'd expect.

If I put myself in their position, I'd probably be agreeing to overtime no problem if there was a possibility it would be reflected in my pay packet. (I'm not really sure of figures how it will be calculated and worked out though).

I am intrigued by the other shitty practices now, but don't want to go into it in this thread so if you wanna pm me a quick overview or some links so I can have a mooch a bit deeper that'd be great. Never know, you may even change my stance on the overtime.
 
One Night Only said:
Media, yeah I sound like I'm sick of everyone rolling with the popular opinion of outrage of everything.

Aye forced OT doesn't affect me in the slightest, well apart from the fact I'm on OT right now to meet a deadline. I'm not overly arsed about it, glad I've got a job during this period.

Am I talking about the other shitty practices? No. I'm talking about paid overtime, not unpaid overtime.

Also, see you breezed past the part of nobody complaining from within the company as hitting this deadline makes sense to them. That bonus thing I mentioned seems to be a real thing, so the extra holiday sales will boost their bonus I'd expect.

If I put myself in their position, I'd probably be agreeing to overtime no problem if there was a possibility it would be reflected in my pay packet. (I'm not really sure of figures how it will be calculated and worked out though).

I am intrigued by the other shitty practices now, but don't want to go into it in this thread so if you wanna pm me a quick overview or some links so I can have a mooch a bit deeper that'd be great. Never know, you may even change my stance on the overtime.
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I didn't breeze over anything, they don't come out because it's their job on the line. And they know it. Hell, most probably aren't even bothered about coming forward as it's just accepted. No doubt you'll see that as a good thing.

You mistake me for some outraged fool, or someone who believes the "media" or all the other bullshit you want to spout. Marching :lol:

The fact is you simply do not know what you are talking about. You don't know the industry nor do you understand the specific pressures. You don't get why this is even a big deal, why everyone should speak up about unfair working practices. You are complicent, good for you, but that doesn't mean we all should be.

Oh and you won't be getting a PM. You can look into it if you really want, that way you can't claim I'm just following media bias or whatever other out of touch nonsense you want to spout.

Final word, as a courtesy, you are on the same moral right and wrong side as my old mucker geks. That's a big red flag right there..
 
Meh maybe I'm being a bit harsh. My apologies @One Night Only

But it's a subject close to my heart and an industry I've experienced the highs and lows of.

The issue here isn't the paid overtime, it's the acceptance working practices. People shouldn't be afraid of speaking out, yet they are. I can talk about it as I left the industry over certain aspects I didn't agree with (and no, not crunch times. Us nerds didn't have lives anyway :lol:) so I walked the walk and although I left my dream career, I have never once regretted it and that says a lot. However I still have many friends still plugging away in it who have been fecked over time and again, and although stuff like this looks like media hyperbole, it covers a lot of shady shit that actually goes on.
 
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