He has probably the most pressured job in the league. One loss and shouts of sacking him arise every time. No manager in the league and probably across the top five leagues faces such pressure. Nobody.
Criticism is fine (and encouraged) but there are some criticisms thrown at Ole that don't make any sense
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He has probably the most pressured job in the league. One loss and shouts of sacking him arise every time. No manager in the league and probably across the top five leagues faces such pressure. Nobody.
Worse than our rivals is a glass half empty. They are better than him due to proving it at the highest level. Saying he’s worse makes it sound like they aren’t very good in the first place.
Whatever the upgrade is out there, let’s back him this season first eh? You aren’t going to get Rose, Ten Haag or whomever this season
Totally agree. We had winners and all time great coaches prior to him and they failed to deliver. This club as SAF once said is a huge job.
The knee jerkers forget that it was the first defeat in a competitive match since the EL final. A bit of perspective is needed
How about getting results that are worse than we have good reason to expect? If that starts happening, I'll consider the notion that he isn't a good manager. It hasn't so far.
I mean I'm discussing his job security and my opinion of it on a Manchester united forum, I'm not buying an airplane or screaming at Twitter for him to be fired. I'd argue that having an opinion that he is a poor manager doesn't have any affect on him unless he's an even worse manager than I imagine. Do you think he and the players are affected by this sort of discussion? Because they would be pretty sad if they were.
He earned the season by finishing second last year even with the disgusting display we had in the El final. But he shouldn't get the whole year if he can't learn from his consistent mistakes, especially when there are multiple winners available to replace him. Our squad is good enough to win a trophy and finish top 4 at the same time. If ole can't qualify to the knockout stages of the ucl, he should be fired immediately when we are eliminated
Which multiple winners are you referring to? I’d like to see the list.
Bet they’ll be trashed within a few posts. That’s how this place operates
Notoriously not a huge fan of Rashford but last year when he refused to take him off even when someone’s grandmother walking by the TV could see he wasn’t playing at all well was another sign, for me, that he’s shackled by the past and the idea it’s the “United way” for homegrown players to play. When you think of how utterly ruthless Ferguson was with players and staff in search of success the whole “United way” meaning these days is quite odd
I said earlier -- Ole is re-building a club and not just the team. Post Fergie, the club structure was in shambles. The team itself consisted of an ensalada of players from different philosophies and managers.
Whether Ole wins us any silverware, time will tell. But he can be proud of that achievement -- like Ronaldo's presence is supposed to affect the next generation of players, Ole has been building towards that.
Zidane and Conte. Also that's all you reply to in the post?
Of course they aren't a guarantee but if ole fails yet again, in an easy group at that, I don't see how anyone can defend him. Unless we are arsenal where the only thing that matters is top 4. That's an insult to the club
How long and how much money does it take to rebuild a club when you see tuchel immediately win a UCL with the same squad a manager was struggling with? Like I don't get it. If a better player was a free agent and willing to come would you guys not want to sign him to replace a weaker player? Why is it different for the manager? Does it need to be as bad as moyes to replace him?
I respect and even somewhat agree with the argument he isn’t elite and won’t bring us back to the top but to suggest he isn’t a good manager at this stage is such bollocks. It’s really up there with the “he won’t get any other job” nonsense - so when he was at Molde Cardiff and Villa wanted him but now he’s led a team to 3rd and 2nd with countless semi-finals and a European final he lost 11-10 on pens he isn’t going to get jobs ahead of Patrick sodding Vieira. Do some of you actually hear yourselves? Oh and news flash: there isn’t a single active manager better than the two currently at our rivals on the planet. So if “manager better than our rivals” is the criteria then we’re a bit fecked.
Watching liverpool yesterday, as much as it pains me to say, was actually enjoyable! Quick, fast flowing football. Reminds me of United under Fergie at times.
Christ we really dropped the ball by not getting Klopp didnt we
Christ we really dropped the ball by not getting Klopp didnt we
You actually think a club not in relegation or looking for something desperate would sign him?I completely believe his next job will be about the same size as molde or a club battleing relegation. Are you actually saying we shouldn't try to get a better manager just because our rivals have two elite ones? "we can't have the best so we may as well stick with mediocrity". What a set of supporters man. We are arsenal
What have I taken for granted exactly? Not arguing, legitimately interested in why you think differently. You have said my take is perhaps wrong without giving rationale.
That's right keep the expectations low, that's what the Glazers want. Do you think it's acceptable that Manchester United don't have a manager who is anywhere close to the level of our rivals' managers?
Exactly and now we have those things we still don't look like being truly competitive and winning. We have had one good performance this season so far and that was Leeds, a team that we are absolutely built to destroy.
Also managers such as Jose and Conte, prove you don't need all of those things. They are just ideal milestones along the path to success. Fundamentally however you still need a manager with the skill to win things. Just like how you can't have the best manager in the world win the Champions League with a league 2 squad.
I agree he has had better league campaigns although in very different circumstances which I think have favoured him and the team (covid).
Happy to disagree amicably.
When it comes down to it we all here want the same thing. I think different fans just have variable patience lengths.
Zidane seems to have the same kind of style as Ole just with a better squad when he was at Madrid and obviously has the success.
Conte would be awful. I know he’s a winner but I can’t go back to watching that kind of negative awful football. Not to mention it would cost a fortune to build out the squad to play his wing back system.
Well there's the thing. Which two are you on about? Assuming you mean Guardiola and Klopp, that leaves Tuchel. Who wasn't rated to their extent before arriving at Chelsea (and probably still isn't) but was still good enough to win the CL and (in a way more tellingly) immediately improve them both defensively and offensively through better organisation and coaching.
Is it really impossible for us to find a manager on par with Tuchel given the profile he had before arriving at Chelsea? Or one that could have a similar impact by improving obvious areas of weakness when it comes to our coaching and set-up? I'd be pretty surprised if it was. It's not like he's a once in a generation manager. It's certainly a level we'd expect any Manchester United manager to be at.
I mean if Chelsea had taken the view that there was nobody they could get better than Pep/Klopp then they'd still have Lampard and wouldn't have that CL or currently be favourites for the league.
What makes me laugh about the competing with the richest clubs in the world argument is that those you spew it ignore the fact we pretty much match them on spend so it's irrelevant.
It is just a narrative spread by the corporate machine to limit expectation and some fall for it.
The situation is no different now to when SAF had to compete with Chelsea. If anything out spend to theirs is closer than ever in our favour.
Just accept you cannot take any criticism of Ole, do not use few extreme views, and try to paint it as a group hounding Ole and his poor little supporters.
It all depends on what we want, do we want to be the new Arsenal of the later Wenger eras where the aim was to finish top 4, getting the CL money. Than Ole is fine.
If we want to be champions regularly competing for the PL and CL, than we need Ole to improve his mentality and approach.
It all depends on what we want, do we want to be the new Arsenal of the later Wenger eras where the aim was to finish top 4, getting the CL money. Than Ole is fine.
If we want to be champions regularly competing for the PL and CL, than we need Ole to improve his mentality and approach.
He would have to have built a terrible squad of players, wasted tonnes of money, not finished 2nd last season after a record breaking away form and outscoring the entire league for the majority of the season.
Am I happy with the above as the net result of a league campaign for Manchester United? No, of course I'm not. Do I think any manager will guarantee more than that right now? No I definitely don't.
I admit he's a worse manager than Pep or Klopp, but isn't that obvious? Who is better than those? Tuchel? The manager we finished ahead of last season. Edit: that doesn’t mean he’s a bad manager either, it’s all relative.
People need to stop stamping their feet and realise the position we are in and take the slow and steady progression until a guaranteed upgrade on Ole becomes available. Until that person does materialise changing the manager and philosophy and team spirit etc will do nothing but hinder our progression, a lesson we haven't learned from the past 'great managers' we put in before Ole.
You want Ole sacked because 'he isn't a good manager' right? Who should we hire bud? C'mon because, personally, before I let myself open my mouth on a subject I at least make sure I have a solution to suggest.
Well I’m only defeating my point if there is a guaranteed improvement available.
So, like I said, who’s getting the job Conte or Zizou?
Or better still who is the flavour of the month German manager?
In support of you argument, it's not like Ole is even in the camp of managers directly below Klopp and Pep either. Since when has inaction lead to positive-action in football?
Even if managerial we can't surpass them we should still be looking at closing the gap as small as possible.
I don't think Ole would get a job at and other top 10 BPL club.
I don’t know if it’s that binary though. By most measures David Moyes had earned his chance at a ‘big’ job but was horribly suited to it. Sean Dyche deserves to move to a bigger team in the league but he’d probably be a horrible fit.
For me, no matter how you rank Ole amongst European coaches he is a better fit for us than many other coaches. Personally, I would keep him over having Conte, Tuchel, Allegri and any other defensive first coaches out there (despite Ole’s tendency to go too defensive when holding a lead he does encourage attacking play first).
If we were talking about Nagelsmann, Rose or Ten Hag then the conversation is slightly different. Even then Nagelsmann and Rose have won little or nothing last time I checked. All three of those guys could end up being the completely wrong coach for our club and the group of players.
There doesn’t seem to be a particularly obvious replacement that I can think of right now.
We need to stop bickering about our manager and fully back him for this season.
I understand the frustration with the manager, he does make mistakes and his in game management will drive us all nuts but constantly complaining about it will just negatively affect you personally.
If Ole carries on being tentative with his approach then he's just going to slowly relinquish the best job he will ever have.
Its up to him to see this and make the changes necessary or he will regret his approach for years to come.
Everyone needs to calm down and see what happens this season, if the job is too big for him and he meekly goes down the path of finishing 3rd to 5th by being over cautious then he deserves everything he gets.
Hopefully he changes his approach and proves the doubters wrong. ( And im one of those doubters tbh )
I understand the frustration with the manager, he does make mistakes and his in game management will drive us all nuts but constantly complaining about it will just negatively affect you personally.
If Ole carries on being tentative with his approach then he's just going to slowly relinquish the best job he will ever have.
Its up to him to see this and make the changes necessary or he will regret his approach for years to come.
Everyone needs to calm down and see what happens this season, if the job is too big for him and he meekly goes down the path of finishing 3rd to 5th by being over cautious then he deserves everything he gets.
Hopefully he changes his approach and proves the doubters wrong. ( And im one of those doubters tbh )
I'm not suggesting that we replace him. I just think being on either side of the extreme is a bit rubbish.
The point that you originally replied to was that we decide whether to keep him on at the end of the season based on his performance this season, and I agree. He's got a star studded squad now and he should be able to achieve something with it. If we're way behind the league champions again, then it's likely he's taken us as far as he can. I frankly expect us to be 2nd again, or at the very least 3rd if it's a very close 3 horse race, with an improvement in the amount of draws and performances we had last season.
However, the CL result and the performances against Wolves and Southampton have created a little concern in what was a very excited fanbase.
Even then though, neither Zidane(who hates youth, mind some of you) or Conte are right for this club. I like the look of the Ajax manager, but that's a different conversation altogether.
Thats on the manager though for swapping the team so much. He also bought and brought in a lot of the players now. James as you mentioned being one. Ole will have been in charge 3 years December and we still dont have any resemblance of a style apart from counter or long ball when we get frustrated. We are still too slow in the build up. The thing with 'we researched hundred+ right backs before we spunked £50 mill on Wan B', who is completely the wrong sort of RB that Ole wants ( The equivalent of Shaw)
Well said. Ole could have us in 10th place and you would still have folks on here supporting him, because he was a legend as a player.
Rubbish post. The type of fictional nonsense that make this debate unbearable for most.
Absolute bollocks. I’d keep him if we finished 6th but anything below that is a no-no.
Bite
As opposed to your comment a few posts back about which German manager is ‘flavour of the month’. Maybe the ones who have been winning all the major trophies whilst we hyped up the EL and then went and lost that anyway. Don’t mock success, acknowledge it and accept that we need to dramatically improve.
Ole could win the league and we'd still have people calling him lucky and relying on squad brilliance.
See how equally daft that sounds?
Only thing Ole has going for him is he hasn't underperformed in the league relative to the squad he has since he's been here. Now he's built a team that should be challenging for the title so can he keep on performing relative to squads strength and challenge for the title? I'm patient and would wait to see how that plays out as it's too early to call. But he's not better than the coaches in the clubs we are competiting with so most will say he will fall short this season
I'm will remain a little optimistic Ole can challenge for the title this season as he's done well enough in the league since he's been here.
I'm will remain a little optimistic Ole can challenge for the title this season as he's done well enough in the league since he's been here.
He's not far off when the poster after you said he'd still keep Ole if we finished 6th
Top of the league. I´d sure like to continue with that. As none of us are tactical experts, what else can we judge him by.
Anything better than building an entire squad that’s not….*checks notes* terrible, will always be enough?
This top redism is as far away from the United we all grew up with than it’s possible to get.The standards set by the club need to be higher than: at least no one died.
Mocking others for their opinions when yours is literally that anything more than not building a squad full of terrible players is good enough is absurd
Yes. And along the way - if we follow in City´s footsteps from last season and lose 6 games (and draw 5) - we will after six games this season (or 11), see this forum floated with people calling for his head. Plus after losses in the cups, of course - unless we go on to win them all.
Really! Not the Chelsea job where the manager is sacked even after winning stuff. Only shouts of not being good enough suddenly makes it a more difficult one?
Well he has that going for him too then? He signed the players. I agree though. Apart from getting the best out of his squad, making the right signings to get the squad capable of challenging sustainably, improving every year, getting back-to-back CL finishes for the first time since SAF, breaking the undefeated away record, being the only side in PL history to win 4 games in a row by 4 goals, having the 3rd highest win percentage in our history, being a fantastic man manager who has completely changed the atmosphere at the club and currently being top of the league what has Ole done for us?
And you may want to look closer at that post where i said I’d be happy finishing 6th.
You are one that would back him whatever!