Cristiano Ronaldo - Much Ado About Al Nassr

[Kwabs]

Oh people care about playmaking. They don't care about the 'World's Best Playmaking' award, though. I had to look up what the feck that even was. Apparently Modric and Kroos have won it.

Yes, and the likes of Xavi, Iniesta, and Zidane. Messi is the only player to win it whilst also scoring hundreds of goals, and he's won it more than anyone else. Alien stuff.

It's facts like this that prove that he is comfortably a better footballer than CR, but a lot of people don't get this, or choose to ignore it.

 

[Ish]

I don't think so. Take it from a portuguese, the Ronaldo vs Messi debate (that I avoid at all cost) was definitely settled after he won the world cup. I'm portuguese, Sporting fan and I admit this. It was an incredible era in football and it was a privilege to watch both players career and prime.

Now do I prefer Messi to Ronaldo? Of course not but I have to put my bias aside being portuguese and Sporting fan and admit Messi is the superior player. I'll always be grateful everything he did for us, leading us, being a spectacular player, representing the country at the highest level, flawless in his professionalism and availability but I try to be objective.

I did sour a bit in the end (and I'm not the only one) because I sincerely think that his and Mendes influence has been detrimental to our National team in the last years. Call ups of players that don't deserve it but get in the national team because of Mendes, the way Ronaldo behaved in the WC disrespecting his teammates and the manager. I believe the circus after Santos dropped him had a very negative effect in our National team.

He doesn't own the national team, it's not his, it's the country team. We have to do what's best to the team and not to accommodate Ronaldo's ego. Ronaldo doesn't understand his current limitations and that's detrimental for the team. Impact sub is what he should be at this time of his career. I think he would actually get the numbers he craves if he accepted that. Just because we are not yes men towards him, doesn't mean we don't appreciate what he did for us. He needs to understand that.

You’re always a massive credit to this forum sly

 

[Joel Miller]

This is an extraordinary time to waste on someone you do not like.

The only action the thread normally sees is you bumping it up on your own with his latest numbers. You’re hardly one to talk about wasting time, it’s not as if you get lots of people replying and taking an interest in his latest Saudi goal.

 

[Ish]

I saw a game of two Kante's, first half, all over the place and didn't do much right, and picked it up and had an excellent 2nd half.

I'm not so say who deserves MOTM or not, but he was not actually flawless.

Agreed. Was very shoddy for much of the first half then went up a couple of levels as the game progressed and ended up bossing it, prime Kante style.

 

[SirAF]

The only action the thread normally sees is you bumping it up on your own with his latest numbers. You’re hardly one to talk about wasting time, it’s not as if you get lots of people replying and taking an interest in his latest Saudi goal.

I would hope that the point is quite clear and obvious. My interest in Ronaldo is from a positive perspective - however, we have people here (you included) who spend an extraordinary amount of time on an athlete you strongly dislike. Why? In my book that is a helluva lot weirder than being fan of a footballer. That said, each to their own...

 

[Joel Miller]

I don't think so. Take it from a portuguese, the Ronaldo vs Messi debate (that I avoid at all cost) was definitely settled after he won the world cup. I'm portuguese, Sporting fan and I admit this. It was an incredible era in football and it was a privilege to watch both players career and prime.

Now do I prefer Messi to Ronaldo? Of course not but I have to put my bias aside being portuguese and Sporting fan and admit Messi is the superior player. I'll always be grateful everything he did for us, leading us, being a spectacular player, representing the country at the highest level, flawless in his professionalism and availability but I try to be objective.

I did sour a bit in the end (and I'm not the only one) because I sincerely think that his and Mendes influence has been detrimental to our National team in the last years. Call ups of players that don't deserve it but get in the national team because of Mendes, the way Ronaldo behaved in the WC disrespecting his teammates and the manager. I believe the circus after Santos dropped him had a very negative effect in our National team.

He doesn't own the national team, it's not his, it's the country team. We have to do what's best to the team and not to accommodate Ronaldo's ego. Ronaldo doesn't understand his current limitations and that's detrimental for the team. Impact sub is what he should be at this time of his career. I think he would actually get the numbers he craves if he accepted that. Just because we are not yes men towards him, doesn't mean we don't appreciate what he did for us. He needs to understand that.

Excellent post by the way

 

[bakalhau]

I agree with this. I don't think it's the amazing performance that it's being made out to be. It was good overall, and he might get even better, but Rabiot was better than him in the first half, and overall they were about on par in terms of performance.

I think it was a good performance yeah, not world shattering, so agreed from my side as we. I just think someone saying Saudi Pro players are not being called up based on merit makes no sense, not even so much cause Kante got MOTM as I said, but when his teammates are talking about him on the locker room in such a positive way after the game, it's really, really hard for his argument to stand up.

Sorry for bringing him into this thread - but it's the same as saying Messi is being called up not on merit just because he's playing in the MLS.

@Sly Excellent post. Portuguese here as well. Man, Ronaldo is definitely my favorite player ever, he is my personal best, but I have absolutely no problem saying Messi edged him, specially after the WC. I just think Ronaldo has been good enough on several levels to be my personal choice, but I've always immensely enjoyed watching Messi play. Edit: and it's an absolute shame more people couldn't simply enjoy both, regardless of their own personal preference.

 

[Fobal]

I would hope that the point is quite clear and obvious. My interest in Ronaldo is from a positive perspective - however, we have people here (you included) who spend an extraordinary amount of time on an athlete you strongly dislike. Why? In my book that is a helluva lot weirder than being fan of a footballer. That said, each to their own...

Positive yeap, but with a little tendency to the over the top comment that backfires...sometimes I think that leaving aside some "journos" that profitt themselves from being ultra CR/Messi fans, some actually trully "amateur" fans generate more cringe than anything with the extreme fanboyism of any player.

 

[Fobal]

I think it was a good performance yeah, not world shattering, so agreed from my side as we. I just think someone saying Saudi Pro players are not being called up based on merit makes no sense, not even so much cause Kante got MOTM as I said, but when his teammates are talking about him on the locker room in such a positive way after the game, it's really, really hard for his argument to stand up.

Sorry for bringing him into this thread - but it's the same as saying Messi is being called up not on merit just because he's playing in the MLS.

@Sly Excellent post. Portuguese here as well. Man, Ronaldo is definitely my favorite player ever, he is my personal best, but I have absolutely no problem saying Messi edged him, specially after the WC. I just think Ronaldo has been good enough on several levels to be my personal choice, but I've always immensely enjoyed watching Messi play.

Do you really think that the WC was "necessary" for anyone to consider Messi a better player (or Cryuff, Di Stefano, etc)?.

I always felt that Cristiano navigates in a talent cathegory that depending on the moment, taste and even agenda behind, there is no middle ground. Some people talks about him like if he was Batistuta on steroids (or even worse Erling alike), pure determination and a couple of extraordinary assets, others talk about him like if he actually consistently pulled out Maradona alike plays and such. The "truth" for me relies more incline to the later, I mean the actually extremely talented fella (not just hard work) but at the same time not really "genius" or "all around football capability" alike (as silly as these invented label can sound for lack of better words)

BTW I trully think that the ultimate GOAT it's very very very silly affair.

 

[bakalhau]

Do you really think that the WC was "necessary" for anyone to consider Messi a better player (or Cryuff, Di Stefano, etc)?.

I always felt that Cristiano navigates in a talent cathegory that depending on the moment, taste and even agenda behind, there is no middle ground. Some people talks about him like if he was Batistuta on steroids (or even worse Erling alike), pure determination and a couple of extraordinary assets, others talk about him like if he actually consistently pulled out Maradona alike plays and such. The "truth" for me relies more incline to the later, I mean the actually extremely talented fella (not just hard work) but at the same time not really "genius" or "all around football capability" alike (as silly as these invented label can sound for lack of better words)

BTW I trully think that the ultimate GOAT it's very very very silly affair.

I think he's (was) a genius, yeah. Extremely good at whatever he was doing on the pitch, either creating, scoring, or something in between. Even today he's always been about the eye test for me - stats only confirmed what I always saw. Even at this age, his technique, anticipation, footwork, ability to ditch defenders off the ball easily, is easily on par if not better than most strikers out there. He's not as consistent today, surely. And the genius part is because he was definitely one of these players that would get you off your seat dozens and dozens of times throught the years. He was either erasing entire defenses on his own in Man United, pulling off extraordinary goals of all kinds, or showing an uncanny ability to be at his best at the most difficult times and games of the season, and he did it for at least an entire decade.

As for the WC being necessary for me or anyone - eh, it's an individual calculation for each of us, I suppose. Some people will never give in and will defend Ronaldo to death even after the WC. I don't think national cups matter that much when I'm personally ranking players. Messi was extraordinary for Argentina, and I've maintaned that well before he had won his WC. In my case the WC cemented Messi a bit on this special case, but also because I'm obviously a bit biased towards Cristiano. In the end, I have my individual calculation and views of both, but I'd rather maintain Ronaldo is my personal preference, while understanding Messi edged him a bit as a footballer. Football is to be a positive for my life, I'd never stop appreciating another player because I prefer someone else.


In the end I'm a fair guy. I've even found myself defending Messi against Ronaldo fans because even I don't see eye to eye with many of them.

I agree it's a silly affair. I think there should be a list of the greatest, and among those players, it's a personal preference between you, me, and each one of us.

Edit: This whole thing has a parallel with Federer, Nadal and Djokovic

 

[Fobal]

I think he's (was) a genius, yeah. Extremely good at whatever he was doing on the pitch, either creating, scoring, or something in between. Even today he's always been about the eye test for me - stats only confirmed what I always saw. Even at this age, his technique, anticipation, footwork, ability to ditch defenders off the ball easily, is easily on par if not better than most strikers out there. He's not as consistent today, surely. And the genius part is because he was definitely one of these players that would get you off your seat dozens and dozens of times throught the years. He was either erasing entire defenses on his own in Man United, pulling off extraordinary goals of all kinds, or showing an uncanny ability to be at his best at the most difficult times and games of the season, and he did it for at least an entire decade.

As for the WC being necessary for me or anyone - eh, it's an individual calculation for each of us, I suppose. Some people will never give in and will defend Ronaldo to death even after the WC. I don't think national cups matter that much when I'm personally ranking players. Messi was extraordinary for Argentina, and I've maintaned that well before he had won his WC. In my case the WC cemented Messi a bit on this special case, but also because I'm obviously a bit biased towards Cristiano. In the end, I have my individual calculation and views of both, but I'd rather maintain Ronaldo is my personal preference, while understanding Messi edged him a bit as a footballer. Football is to be a positive for my life, I'd never stop appreciating another player because I prefer someone else.


In the end I'm a fair guy. I've even found myself defending Messi against Ronaldo fans because even I don't see eye to eye with many of them.

I agree it's a silly affair. I think there should be a list of the greatest, and among those players, it's a personal preference between you, me, and each one of us.

Edit: This whole thing has a parallel with Federer, Nadal and Djokovic

I never felt that way with him, I'm more in the Extraordinary player, even Phenom with this subjective merely colorful tags and it's not because I'm argie, it's just my view, my feel regarding the game and the players I'm more fond.
BTW I still love Futre above anyone regarding Portuguese players and the marvellous Figo just behind him, even if CLEARLY CR edges both with his carreer and output.
At the same time I always felt it was and is ridiculous to put him in the "pure effort" bracket, the guy it's talented as fvck, even if I do not endorse the ubber dribbler Man Utd days and such (thought I get the point and see why it's told in those terms).

Regarding the WC, I get the romanticism and that it actually has weight for people regarding someone among the best ever, but I never felt neither of the two needed the Cup to cement their status or to be the "thing" to put them one above the other, or any other player in history, we all already have enough "info" to preffer one or another.
At the same time I know that if timing is everything in life, more it is in WCs so I get too that extra weight and the essence it carries since its earlier editions when it was the competition "the world met and we all get acknowledge".

PD: Regarding Nadal and CR, some people does not get that some of the plays Nadal does are extremely technical and almost impossible to do, that reminds me of the "pure will" of CR as almost his only asset, BOLLOCKS

 

[Sly]

You’re always a massive credit to this forum sly

Thanks mate. I appreciate it. Just being honest tbf. This is really what I think.

 

[Ish]

Thanks mate. I appreciate it. Just being honest tbf. This is really what I think.

We’ve been truly blessed to have witness their entire careers basically. And also at the same time as rivals. Not sure when we’ll get one, let alone two GOAT level footballers come around again.

 

[Raoul]

We’ve been truly blessed to have witness their entire careers basically. And also at the same time as rivals. Not sure when we’ll get one, let alone two GOAT level footballers come around again.

This is often overlooked amidst all the binary squabbling about who is better. We are extremely fortunate to have witnessed a once in a lifetime situation to be alive when both of them pushed themselves to unprecedented levels.

 

[Marvin look out]

The fact that geriatric Modric isn't getting run over by the hate train after his feckless performance so far against Albania proves that the Ronaldo criticism is mostly down to the fact that he's a dick and not his performances.

No, this only proves that Ronaldo hasn't actually been criticized for having a poor performance here and there, but for having put on far more poor performances than good ones and for his overall negative impact on his teams.

Modric still plays for Madrid, was still a starter last season and has performed well overall in his mid-thirties, while Ronaldo has stunk up the joint everywhere he's been in the past 4-5 years and had to go to Saudi because no top club wanted to go near him.

 

[MrEleson]

No, this only proves that Ronaldo hasn't actually been criticized for having a poor performance here and there, but for having put on far more poor performances than good ones and for his overall negative impact on his teams.

Modric still plays for Madrid, was still a starter last season and has performed well overall in his mid-thirties, while Ronaldo has stunk up the joint everywhere he's been in the past 4-5 years and had to go to Saudi because no top club wanted to go near him.

Correct me if I’m wrong but you used to post on another now defunct forum years ago. Your writing style and general opinion regarding Ronaldo is uncanny. Im pretty sure we interacted on there quite often.

 

[Sly]

One thing that I find amazing in Ronaldo is that he was top scorer in England, Spain and Italy. All competitive leagues with different characteristics. He proven himself in every context. His scoring record in the Champions League and in the Clasicos against Barcelona are also truly remarkable achievements. No one can achieve that without talent and ability.

Some use the hardworking and determination elements to detract his quality. His goal scoring, shooting ability, can do it at any range, with any feet, heading and positioning are unique. No one can compare, except Messi. Messi technical ability, vision and passing are obviously better. Even if Ronaldo is the consummate professional, I don't think he would reach these heights if he didn't have Messi pushing him to the limit of his abilities.

 

[Ish]

This is often overlooked amidst all the binary squabbling about who is better. We are extremely fortunate to have witnessed a once in a lifetime situation to be alive when both of them pushed themselves to unprecedented levels.

Yeah, absolutely. We’ve been very fortunate (& unfortunate in a sense as well). I say unfortunate because the bar these two raised is so high, all the current potential Balon d’Or winners seem a little ‘meh’ when they’re compared to these two

 

[90 + 5min]

We’ve been truly blessed to have witness their entire careers basically. And also at the same time as rivals. Not sure when we’ll get one, let alone two GOAT level footballers come around again.

Every generation have its own legends and so called GOAT's.

Football in late 80's and 90's was just amazing to be around. So many legends that played then. Same can be said about first decade of this millenium.

 

[Joel Miller]

I would hope that the point is quite clear and obvious. My interest in Ronaldo is from a positive perspective - however, we have people here (you included) who spend an extraordinary amount of time on an athlete you strongly dislike. Why? In my book that is a helluva lot weirder than being fan of a footballer. That said, each to their own...

And yet the general consensus on the forum is that it’s your behaviour that is extremely odd. He’s playing in the Euros just now, people will talk about that, and every now and then he’ll be discussed for other things, that’s natural since he’s still a very famous and active player. Not myself or anyone else is interested is discussing the guys Saudi exploits, that’s really just you.

Most of the guys on the forum spend a lot of time speaking negativity about City, or Liverpool, or Pep and Klopp in various threads. Tell me, do you think they’re all just weirdos too?

 

[SirAF]

Most of the guys on the forum spend a lot of time speaking negativity about City, or Liverpool, or Pep and Klopp in various threads. Tell me, do you think they’re all just weirdos too?

Those are direct rivals, it's clearly quite different.

 

[Fobal]

Every generation have its own legends and so called GOAT's.

Football in late 80's and 90's was just amazing to be around. So many legends that played then. Same can be said about first decade of this millenium.

Exactly

If football more or less manteins the same game, others will come, older generations of fans will complain (rightfully many times too) and so on...

What really has changed, it's social media and its effects and the possibility of football changing quite a lot in the future

 

[Kwabs]

One thing that I find amazing in Ronaldo is that he was top scorer in England, Spain and Italy. All competitive leagues with different characteristics. He proven himself in every context. His scoring record in the Champions League and in the Clasicos against Barcelona are also truly remarkable achievements. No one can achieve that without talent and ability.

Some use the hardworking and determination elements to detract his quality. His goal scoring, shooting ability, can do it at any range, with any feet, heading and positioning are unique. No one can compare, except Messi. Messi technical ability, vision and passing are obviously better. Even if Ronaldo is the consummate professional, I don't think he would reach these heights if he didn't have Messi pushing him to the limit of his abilities.

Did you miss the part where it was pointed out that he has 3 goals in the knockout rounds of the Euros/WC? Three goals.

130 International goals, and only 3 in the games that matter the most.....

I've always maintained and will always maintain, even in this age of club superteams, that major international tournaments (especially the World Cup) are the true test. Not the Champions League and not the Premier League/other top leagues.

People can quibble as much as they like about the quality, but the pressure is 10 times greater in those competitions.

 

[Fobal]

Did you miss the part where it was pointed out that he has 3 goals in the knockout rounds of the Euros/WC? Three goals.

130 International goals, and only 3 in the games that matter the most.....

I've always maintained and will always maintain, even in this age of club superteams, that major international tournaments (especially the World Cup) are the true test. Not the Champions League and not the Premier League/other top leagues.

People can quibble as much as they like about the quality, but the pressure is 10 times greater in those competitions.

Not really, we all tend to try to simplify stuff.

WCs are the ones when timing+emotion+romaticism converge to create a great cocktail.
The combination of being every 4 years, the lack of "proper" preparation, the timing with injuries (and in general anything that can affect form, from the player itself or even his team) plus the emotional and tradition aspect (that even includes the "amateur" side of it) creates its aura, but it's not the ONLY true test by any means.

PD: as a side note, In any case 130 goals at international level it's an amazing feature.

 

[Joel Miller]

Those are direct rivals, it's clearly quite different.

I can name others who aren’t direct rivals if you want? And is it different in the same way that persistently cheerleading a player who doesn’t play for United and in fact, completely disrespected United, is different? And doing it on a United forum no less. You can call other people weird but when you break it down it’s not really a weird as what you do friend.

 

[TheGame]

 

[horsechoker]

@Rinaldo

 

[Marvin look out]

Correct me if I’m wrong but you used to post on another now defunct forum years ago. Your writing style and general opinion regarding Ronaldo is uncanny. Im pretty sure we interacted on there quite often.

No, that wasn't me.

This is a strange intuition you have here to be honest, considering my writing style is not particularly distinctive, and second that my general opinion on post-Madrid Ronaldo is shared by quite a few people, as you can see, not to say the predominant opinion amongst knowledgeable football fans.

 

[Kwabs]

Not really, we all tend to try to simplify stuff.

WCs are the ones when timing+emotion+romaticism converge to create a great cocktail.
The combination of being every 4 years, the lack of "proper" preparation, the timing with injuries (and in general anything that can affect form, from the player itself or even his team) plus the emotional and tradition aspect (that even includes the "amateur" side of it) creates its aura, but it's not the ONLY true test by any means.

PD: as a side note, In any case 130 goals at international level it's an amazing feature.

I mean, it is, but he has played like 210 games to get that number. Which is impressive in and of itself, but his ratio is not exceptional.

I think you accurately summarise the World Cup here. To me it is the truest test. Which is not to say that the other competitions are meaningless or anything, but they don't compare, because the stakes are not that high. Take Vini Jr for example, do you think his fellow Brazilians (the people he no doubt wants to impress the most) care that much about what he has done for Madrid?

 

[MrEleson]

No, that wasn't me.

This is a strange intuition you have here to be honest, considering my writing style is not particularly distinctive, and second that my general opinion on post-Madrid Ronaldo is shared by quite a few people, as you can see, not to say the predominant opinion amongst knowledgeable football fans.

Fair enough. It’s just the choice of words that guy used were almost exactly the same as yours as well as the way he described Ronaldo in relation to past greats. He never liked Messi either but at least acknowledged he actually belonged to the upper echelons of footballing greats due to the playmaking component. Also, the long essay-style posts going into depth about celebrity worship and how sickening it is. It’s almost like for like. He even used to talk about being older than Ronaldo and playing football in the 80s just like you so I thought it being a football forum, there’s a good chance it’s the same person. My bad then, i got it wrong and it’s just a coincidence.

 

[Fobal]

I mean, it is, but he has played like 210 games to get that number. Which is impressive in and of itself, but his ratio is not exceptional.

I think you accurately summarise the World Cup here. To me it is the truest test. Which is not to say that the other competitions are meaningless or anything, but they don't compare, because the stakes are not that high. Take Vini Jr for example, do you think his fellow Brazilians (the people he no doubt wants to impress the most) care that much about what he has done for Madrid?

Every 4 years sthg. can go wrong that are not intrinsecally associated with the player himself, or even if so, it might be more due to the timing of the event and sometimes it's just sthg that happens in single match.
Messi would not have been less Messi if Dibu didn't stop some of his penalties or if Molina failed to score against Holland...yet indeed the WC has a lot of "magic" and elements that makes it a very hard thing to obtain or on the other side of the coin sometimes the timing it's perfect for some players and they have better "luck" in those than in their everyday job. So as much it can be one of the HARDEST titles to obtain, but I would not call it the TRUEST.

The TRUEST mark a player can show is his everyday job at his club.

 

[Sly]

Did you miss the part where it was pointed out that he has 3 goals in the knockout rounds of the Euros/WC? Three goals.

130 International goals, and only 3 in the games that matter the most.....

I've always maintained and will always maintain, even in this age of club superteams, that major international tournaments (especially the World Cup) are the true test. Not the Champions League and not the Premier League/other top leagues.

People can quibble as much as they like about the quality, but the pressure is 10 times greater in those competitions.

No, I didn't miss anything and I've criticized Ronaldo in my posts. Never said he was perfect or the goat. I was talking about some positives and his achievements that impressed me. I'm portuguese and have my bias as you have yours trying to downplay the fact that he was top scorer in Europe's top leagues and his Clasico record.

 

[Marvin look out]

Fair enough. It’s just the choice of words that guy used were almost exactly the same as yours as well as the way he described Ronaldo in relation to past greats. He never liked Messi either but at least acknowledged he actually belonged to the upper echelons of footballing greats due to the playmaking component. Also, the long essay-style posts going into depth about celebrity worship and how sickening it is. It’s almost like for like. He even used to talk about being older than Ronaldo and playing football in the 80s just like you so I thought it being a football forum, there’s a good chance it’s the same person. My bad then, i got it wrong and it’s just a coincidence.

You seem to be confusing me with another poster from here. I haven't talked about Ronaldo in relation to past greats, given my opinion on celebrity worship and I'm not older than Ronaldo and therefore have never played football in the 80's.

 

[Ish]

Every generation have its own legends and so called GOAT's.

Football in late 80's and 90's was just amazing to be around. So many legends that played then. Same can be said about first decade of this millenium.

Yep, one will come along but I’m not sure we’ll see 2 at this level at the same time so easily.

 

[90 + 5min]

Exactly

If football more or less manteins the same game, others will come, older generations of fans will complain (rightfully many times too) and so on...

What really has changed, it's social media and its effects and the possibility of football changing quite a lot in the future

Exactly. We got some really average to poor players being talked about like stars just because social media and so.

I wonder how players like Baggio, Ronaldo (Nr9), Totti and so on would have been portrayed if they played now. Ronaldinho, Henry, Raul or why not vanBasten, Stojkovic, Platini, Zidane. We got some absolute legends from German football but many of them were teamplayers and not individuals like Mattheus. Social media and PR have changed whole landscape about being celebrity.

Yep, one will come along but I’m not sure we’ll see 2 at this level at the same time so easily.

Ronaldo and Messi are unique players and for the history. I do wonder if they would be this big without social media? Nobody can take away what they have done and still doing but we had lot of quality players doing if not same but close previous decades and not get praise they deserved.

 

[MrEleson]

You seem to be confusing me with another poster from here. I haven't talked about Ronaldo in relation to past greats, given my opinion on celebrity worship and I'm not older than Ronaldo and therefore have never played football in the 80's.

Yeah sorry I had a mare. I was meant to be quoting that Davey fella. I’ll take me leave…

 

[Isotope]

I would hope that the point is quite clear and obvious. My interest in Ronaldo is from a positive perspective - however, we have people here (you included) who spend an extraordinary amount of time on an athlete you strongly dislike. Why? In my book that is a helluva lot weirder than being fan of a footballer. That said, each to their own...

100% agreed. And showing vast interest on footballer who brought glories to your team is at least explainable. On the other hand...

 

[Ish]

Ronaldo and Messi are unique players and for the history. I do wonder if they would be this big without social media? Nobody can take away what they have done and still doing but we had lot of quality players doing if not same but close previous decades and not get praise they deserved.

Yeah there's definitely been an explosion of sorts in social medial - heightened exposure and also the advent/growth of the "fans of the player" - & not necessarily loyalty to clubs etc. But the heights they've reached have only really been reached by a handful of others, so it's not like there's been tons and tons of other cases to compare it to either.

 

[Kwabs]

Every 4 years sthg. can go wrong that are not intrinsecally associated with the player himself, or even if so, it might be more due to the timing of the event and sometimes it's just sthg that happens in single match.
Messi would not have been less Messi if Dibu didn't stop some of his penalties or if Molina failed to score against Holland...yet indeed the WC has a lot of "magic" and elements that makes it a very hard thing to obtain or on the other side of the coin sometimes the timing it's perfect for some players and they have better "luck" in those than in their everyday job. So as much it can be one of the HARDEST titles to obtain, but I would not call it the TRUEST.

The TRUEST mark a player can show is his everyday job at his club.

I disagree. I take your point about the luck element, and this explains why generally mediocre players can have exceptional World Cups. But for those players, it usually only happens once.

If you're a great player, you're going to have at least 3 or 4 chances to play at a World Cup. This lessens the luck element because you get a few shots at it.

The majority of the greats were good in at least 2 (unlike the Scillacis of this world for whom the stars aligned in one competition). Zidane in 1998 and 2006, R9 in 98 and 2002, Messi in 2014 and 2022, Pele in 1958 and 1970, Maradona in 1986 and 1990 etc.

CR has played in 5 World Cups now and I don't think he's been good in any of them. You could argue 2018, but it was really just the Spain game. And he still didn't score or assist in the KO rounds.

In the Euros he has been better, but 3 goals in the KO stages is hardly anything to write home about. Even when they won it, he wasn't outstanding. He played quite well, but nowhere near what you'd expect.

I think that these tournaments give an indication of his true level. Just my opinion, I know others will disagree.

 

[DarkLord1984]

I find it nauseating that the social media team are constantly posting clips of his goals these days. He hasn't been our player since November 2022, and he left under a cloud. Why can't whoever is running the United Facebook page just move on?